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The Charismatic Church movement

Jesse said:
Yes, but now the Holy Spirit enters every believer and we can operate in the supernatural gifts, just maybe not all of them, except maybe Jesus had them all, and as Willy brought up, there is no record of Jesus speaking in tongues.
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because jesus didn't have to. How could he need the spirit when prayer was there for him. remember what he said about him leaving and the Holy Ghost coming.

one can argue that jesus was in unison with the Spirit and the Father but do they dwell in each other as we say with ourselves.
 
jasonc said:
because jesus didn't have to. How could he need the spirit when prayer was there for him. remember what he said about him leaving and the Holy Ghost coming.

one can argue that jesus was in unison with the Spirit and the Father but do they dwell in each other as we say with ourselves.
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Well, they are One.

You have never really answered my question, I don't speak in tongues, would you say I don't have the Holy Spirit? Therefore not saved?

This is what it seems you are teaching, I want it clarified.
 
Jesse said:
Well, they are One.

You have never really answered my question, I don't speak in tongues, would you say I don't have the Holy Spirit? Therefore not saved?

This is what it seems you are teaching, I want it clarified.
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no, epi is on, en is in. you have the indwelling but not the baptism. that's the difference.

reread my post on what I said happens at salvation. the Spirit comes in, but its not the same as the baptism of the Holy Ghost. you have to have the Holy Spirit to be saved in that He dwells in you, that occurs at salvation not baptism.
 
jasonc said:
no, epi is on, en is in. you have the indwelling but not the baptism. that's the difference.

reread my post on what I said happens at salvation. the Spirit comes in, but its not the same as the baptism of the Holy Ghost. you have to have the Holy Spirit to be saved in that He dwells in you, that occurs at salvation not baptism.
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This is what I was referring to though.

Those who think they are baptized in the Holy Spirit, while they see others are not, have divided the church. It is "them" and "us", when we are supposed to be ONE and this is impossible if one groups has something that others do not.
 
reba said:
http://www.gotquestions.org/miraculous-gifts.html
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Yes I agree with this.
Question: "Are the miraculous gifts of the Spirit for today?"

Answer:First, it is important to recognize that this is not a question of whether God still performs miracles today. It would be foolish and unbiblical to claim God does not heal people, speak to people, and perform miraculous signs and wonders today. The question is whether the miraculous gifts of the Spirit, described primarily in1 Corinthians 12–14, are still active in the church today. This is also not a question of can the Holy Spirit give someone a miraculous gift. The question is whether the Holy Spirit still dispenses the miraculous gifts today. Above all else, we entirely recognize that the Holy Spirit is free to dispense gifts according to His will (1 Corinthians 12:7-11).

In the book of Acts and the Epistles, the vast majority of miracles are performed by the apostles and their close associates. Paul gives us the reason why: “The things that mark an apostle—signs, wonders and miracles—were done among you with great perseverance” (2 Corinthians 12:12). If every believer in Christ was equipped with the ability to perform signs, wonders, and miracles, then signs, wonders, and miracles could in no way be the identifying marks of an apostle.Acts 2:22tells us that Jesus was “accredited” by “miracles, wonders, and signs.” Similarly, the apostles were “marked” as genuine messengers from God by the miracles they performed.Acts 14:3describes the gospel message being “confirmed” by the miracles Paul and Barnabas performed.

Chapters 12–14 of 1 Corinthians deal primarily with the subject of the gifts of the Spirit. It seems from that text “ordinary” Christians were sometimes given miraculous gifts (12:8-10, 28-30). We are not told how commonplace this was. From what we learned above, that the apostles were “marked” by signs and wonders, it would seem that miraculous gifts being given to “ordinary” Christians was the exception, not the rule. Beside the apostles and their close associates, the New Testament nowhere specifically describes individuals exercising the miraculous gifts of the Spirit.

It is also important to realize that the early church did not have the completed Bible, as we do today (2 Timothy 3:16-17). Therefore, the gifts of prophecy, knowledge, wisdom, etc. were necessary in order for the early Christians to know what God would have them do. The gift of prophecy enabled believers to communicate new truth and revelation from God. Now that God’s revelation is complete in the Bible, the “revelatory” gifts are no longer needed, at least not in the same capacity as they were in the New Testament.

God miraculously heals people every day. God still does amazing miracles, signs, and wonders and sometimes performs those miracles through a Christian. However, these things are not necessarily the miraculous gifts of the Spirit. The primary purpose of the miraculous gifts was to prove that the gospel was true and that the apostles were truly God’s messengers. The Bible does not say outright that the miraculous gifts have ceased, but it does lay the foundation for why they might no longer occur to the same extent as they did as recorded in the New Testament.

Read more:http://www.gotquestions.org/miraculous-gifts.html#ixzz3Lugg1X7K
 
Jesse said:
This is what I was referring to though.

Those who think they are baptized in the Holy Spirit, while they see others are not, have divided the church. It is "them" and "us", when we are supposed to be ONE and this is impossible if one groups has something that others do not.
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Oh shucks...... that's just one of the hundreds of "us vs. them" dividers.
 
I do not think we should be divided among CF because someone has different belief as long as that belief is Biblical.
 
Jesse said:
So do you believe if a person does not have the gift of tongues, they do not have the Holy Spirit?
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Of course not.
But what one doesn't know about, one doesn't usually receive.
I got saved in a Baptist church.
No salvation message, no altar call, but I got saved anyway.
No one believed in the gifts, so I did the same mostly, until I learned Scripture and started believing on my own otherwise.
No one said you were healed, just saved.
So no one had healing at salvation.

So I go to a different church and it is different.
Everything is alive, not dead.
They talk about being prayed over to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, with evidence of speaking in tongues.
When that type of a person lays hands on you, it's different than that Baptist church I went to.

You will not have growth in your gifts if you do not believe they exist.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
Of course not.
But what one doesn't know about, one doesn't usually receive.
I got saved in a Baptist church.
No salvation message, no altar call, but I got saved anyway.
No one believed in the gifts, so I did the same mostly, until I learned Scripture and started believing on my own otherwise.
No one said you were healed, just saved.
So no one had healing at salvation.

So I go to a different church and it is different.
Everything is alive, not dead.
They talk about being prayed over to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, with evidence of speaking in tongues.
When that type of a person lays hands on you, it's different than that Baptist church I went to.

You will not have growth in your gifts if you do not believe they exist.
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I can say I don't disagree with that. one must exercise dem gifts. something I need to do.
 
Rollo Tamasi said:
Of course not.
But what one doesn't know about, one doesn't usually receive.
I got saved in a Baptist church.
No salvation message, no altar call, but I got saved anyway.
No one believed in the gifts, so I did the same mostly, until I learned Scripture and started believing on my own otherwise.
No one said you were healed, just saved.
So no one had healing at salvation.

So I go to a different church and it is different.
Everything is alive, not dead.
They talk about being prayed over to receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, with evidence of speaking in tongues.
When that type of a person lays hands on you, it's different than that Baptist church I went to.

You will not have growth in your gifts if you do not believe they exist.
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I have already stated that all the gifts are for today.

Corinthians tells me the Body is made up of many parts and all have different gifts, not all will receive the same gifts, some will have different gifts then others. It's what makes the Body work.

One of which is speaking in tongues.

If the Bible tells me there exists a gift of speaking in tongues, but not all will receive it, then I come on here and people tell me I must speak in tongues, every believer has this gift, which shall I believe?
 
Willie T said:
Oh shucks...... that's just one of the hundreds of "us vs. them" dividers.
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Most don't divide like this does.

People believe that if you do not have the gift of tongues then you are unable to have other supernatural gifts and that is not true. All believers will have supernatural gifts - just not the same ones.
 
Jesse said:
Most don't divide like this does.

People believe that if you do not have the gift of tongues then you are unable to have other supernatural gifts and that is not true. All believers will have supernatural gifts - just not the same ones.
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I have heard Baptist pastors call the speaking in tounges by pentecostals of the devil.i would say that is the most divisive. I have been to a non-charmistatic church that believe in healing promises and so forth . its called the Christian and missioniary alliance. it wasn't bad but yeah try that in there and see what happens. though many did have that gift and used it in secret.
 
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