The Destruction Of Jerusalem

[n2thelight]

there isnt any time frame i believe tis before the millenium. cant be sure as if its after then that would make more sense as its stated the new heavens and new earth.

It happens on the Day of the Lord,which is the 2nd coming of Christ....And for my preterist friends,this has yet to happen,much less in 70AD

II Peter 3:3 "Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,"

II Peter 3:4 "And saying, "Where is the promise of His coming? for since the father fell asleep, all thing continue as they were from the beginning of the creation."

II Peter 3:10 "But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up."

In other words,the earth will be put back exactly as it was,before God destroyed it,and Im not talking about the flood of Noah......

 

[Stormcrow]

Hey, I want to back up a couple of pages for a moment. It was mentioned that the the abomination of desolation referred to Antiochus. That can't be true because Jesus was referring to a future event. The desecration of the Temple by Antiochus happened WAY before Jesus. :yes

I figured someone might misread the post I wrote here, so I wrote a follow-up to it here.

In both posts I was trying to make the point that the allusion to Daniel in Matthew 24 ("let the reader understand") referred to events surrounding the actions of Antiochus IV Epiphanes and his Macedonian and Syrian armies.

In other words, Christ is using the events of 165BC to instruct His audience about the events that would unfold in their lifetimes regarding Jerusalem: events which were fulfilled by the Romans in 70AD.

The actions of Antiochus and Syria were the precedent for which Titus and Rome were the fulfillment.

Hope that helps.

 

[Stormcrow]

Don't know why you like too play dumb,or maybe it's not playing

If you're going to call me "dumb", it would reflect better on you to do so using proper grammar and punctuation.

Christ did defeat satan at the cross but he has yet to be cast into the lake of fire

If Satan has been defeated, as you correctly assert, tell me: why does it matter to us where Christ put him?

What part of Satan's head being crushed by Christ don't you understand?

 

[n2thelight]

If you're going to call me "dumb", it would reflect better on you to do so using proper grammar and punctuation.



If Satan has been defeated, as you correctly assert, tell me: why does it matter to us where Christ put him?

What part of Satan's head being crushed by Christ don't you understand?

My apologies on the name calling,not my style,so I will just say,blinded ,as to why you are,I already know the answer.......

It matters for the simple fact that,satan comes to this earth pretending to be Christ and if you don't no this,you shall be deceived......

 

[Stormcrow]

Until satan has been cast into the lake of fire, he rules but only what God allows him..Christ shall rule directly from Jerusalem....That has yet to happen.....

This is so patently and utterly contrary to what Christ and the apostles teach in the New Testament that it is heresy. I've already posted what the apostle Paul wrote in this regard. And I see Sinthesis has posted another verse that belies your position.

Again, for the sake of those who might be reading this and are confused by this heresy, please read the following and understand the truth of Christ's and Paul's very words on the subject:

{27} "All things have been handed over to Me by My Father; and no one knows the Son except the Father; nor does anyone know the Father except the Son, and anyone to whom the Son wills to reveal Him. Matthew 11:27 (NASB)

{18} And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Matthew 28:18 (NASB)

{22} And He [God] put all things in subjection under His [Christ's] feet, and gave Him [Christ] as head over all things to the church, Ephesians 1:22 (NASB)

{10} and in Him you have been made complete, and He [Christ] is the head over all rule and authority; Colossians 2:10 (NASB)

{1} Jesus spoke these things; and lifting up His eyes to heaven, He said, "Father, the hour has come; glorify Your Son, that the Son may glorify You, {2} even as You gave Him authority over all flesh, that to all whom You have given Him, He may give eternal life. John 17:1-2 (NASB)

{16}For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities—all things have been created through Him and for Him. Colossians 1:16 (NASB)

{9} For this reason also, God highly exalted Him, and bestowed on Him the name which is above every name, {10} so that at the name of Jesus EVERY KNEE WILL BOW, of those who are in heaven and on earth and under the earth, {11} and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. Philippians 2:9-11 (NASB)

See that last verse? See the words "exalted" and "bestowed"? See how they are past tense? Christ was exalted and bestowed the highest name in heaven and earth when He went to the cross for us and took our sin upon Himself to save all those who would call upon Him!

There is no authority higher. There is no name greater. There is no Satanic "ruler" of this world with whom Christ shares even the least bit of His power! None!

 

[Stormcrow]

It matters for the simple fact that,satan comes to this earth pretending to be Christ and if you don't no this,you shall be deceived......

The Bible I read teaches me that "greater is He that is in me than he who is in the world."

Satan is not coming, but even if he did, I'm sure the Holy Spirit is greater than anything he could throw at us.

 

[Stormcrow]

My apologies on the name calling,not my style,so I will just say,blinded ,as to why you are,I already know the answer.......

Don't presume to know me. You don't.

 

[n2thelight]

Don't presume to know me. You don't.

Didn't say I know you,said I know why you are blinded

 

[n2thelight]

The Bible I read teaches me that "greater is He that is in me than he who is in the world."

Satan is not coming, but even if he did, I'm sure the Holy Spirit is greater than anything he could throw at us.

And the below happened when???

Revelation 11:7 "And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them."

Revelation 11:11 "And after three days and an half the spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them."

Revelation 11:12 "And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them."


Revelation 11:13 "And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven."

Verse 13 is when Jerusalem shall be destroyed.......

The Bible that you read should also teach you that satan comes at the 6th trump,while Christ comes at the 7th,or do you believe all the trumps have sounded?

 

[Stormcrow]

said I know why you are blinded

LOL! And you consider that less insulting than calling me dumb???

 

[Stormcrow]

or do you believe all the trumps have sounded?

Doesn't matter what I believe. What matters is what the Word says, and the Word says He would return in their lifetimes to judge the generation that crucified Him.

Believe whatever you will. It doesn't change the truth of what He said.

 

[n2thelight]

Doesn't matter what I believe. What matters is what the Word says, and the Word says He would return in their lifetimes to judge the generation that crucified Him.

Believe whatever you will. It doesn't change the truth of what He said.

But it does matter,the Word says He returns at the 7th trump.Do you pick and choose parts of the bible to believe?

 

[Stormcrow]

the Word says He returns at the 7th trump.Do you pick and choose parts of the bible to believe?

And the 7th trump happened at the destruction of Jerusalem!!!

All we have to do to accept your position is believe Christ lied when He said this:

{36} "Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. Matthew 23:36 (NASB)

And this:

{38} "Behold, your house is being left to you desolate! Matthew 23:38 (NASB)

And this:

{34} "Truly I say to you, this generation will not pass away until all these things take place. Matthew 24:34 (NASB)

And this:

{28} "Truly I say to you, there are some of those who are standing here who will not taste death until they see the Son of Man coming in His kingdom." Matthew 16:28 (NASB)

And this:

{1} The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave Him to show to His bond-servants, the things which must soon take place; and He sent and communicated it by His angel to His bond-servant John, Revelation 1:1 (NASB)

And this:

{3} Blessed is he who reads and those who hear the words of the prophecy, and heed the things which are written in it; for the time is near. Revelation 1:3 (NASB)

And a number of other verses that all indicate the apostles expected His imminent return, which have previously been posted!

All we have to do to accept your point of view is call Christ and His apostles liars. Maybe you're good with that but I'm not.

 

[Stormcrow]

For what it's worth, I believe the church has been so corrupted with this futurist-dispensationalist teaching that MUST deny the veracity and Lordship of Christ, that this is why many churches are so ineffective in their witness today.

You've either got a lot of people parked in pews waiting for "the rapture" to solve all their problems, or others who are so "hellfire and brimstone" that they turn away the very people to whom they should be reaching out!

People need to start warming to the idea that the church is Christ on earth and WE need to start behaving that way! We are conquerors! We are victors! We are the salt and light the world is looking for, but they won't see it if people are huddled in their pews waiting to be "raptured" (saved!) from this wicked world!

Guess what?

{6} and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, Ephesians 2:6 (NASB)

WE ALREADY HAVE BEEN!!! START ACTING LIKE IT!!!

 

[jasoncran]

For what it's worth, I believe the church has been so corrupted with this futurist-dispensationalist teaching that MUST deny the veracity and Lordship of Christ, that this is why many churches are so ineffective in their witness today.

You've either got a lot of people parked in pews waiting for "the rapture" to solve all their problems, or others who are so "hellfire and brimstone" that they turn away the very people to whom they should be reaching out!

People need to start warming to the idea that the church is Christ on earth and WE need to start behaving that way! We are conquerors! We are victors! We are the salt and light the world is looking for, but they won't see it if people are huddled in their pews waiting to be "raptured" (saved!) from this wicked world!

Guess what?

{6} and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, Ephesians 2:6 (NASB)

WE ALREADY HAVE BEEN!!! START ACTING LIKE IT!!!

i do hope you are pentacostal and believe in the dead being raised up and doing greater miracles then christ did. because that is what my church and often the faith healers and prosperty gospel types believe.

i am charismatic, though i dont buy prosperty gospel as taught today. and yes i have heard of children who were brain dead and be totally healed,. i have met oneof them.

 

[reba]

For what it's worth, I believe the church has been so corrupted with this futurist-dispensationalist teaching that MUST deny the veracity and Lordship of Christ, that this is why many churches are so ineffective in their witness today.

You've either got a lot of people parked in pews waiting for "the rapture" to solve all their problems, or others who are so "hellfire and brimstone" that they turn away the very people to whom they should be reaching out!

People need to start warming to the idea that the church is Christ on earth and WE need to start behaving that way! We are conquerors! We are victors! We are the salt and light the world is looking for, but they won't see it if people are huddled in their pews waiting to be "raptured" (saved!) from this wicked world!

Guess what?

{6} and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus, Ephesians 2:6 (NASB)

WE ALREADY HAVE BEEN!!! START ACTING LIKE IT!!!

Post worth repeating !


Me too Jason...

 

[Drew]

the 144,000 isrealites arent gentile christians btw they are of isreal. since when do christians have tribes?

I am not talking about the 144,000. There may be a connection between the 144,000 and what I am talking about. The point being: it is clear that both Paul and Jesus (perhaps it is more clear for Paul) that the concept of "Israel" is being re-defined to include Gentiles. Do you dispute this?

....unless you dare say that being sealed by the holy spirit is a metaphor.

I would never say such a thing and do not see how anyone would conclude that I would hold such a view.

 

[Drew]

People need to start warming to the idea that the church is Christ on earth and WE need to start behaving that way! We are conquerors! We are victors! We are the salt and light the world is looking for, but they won't see it if people are huddled in their pews waiting to be "raptured" (saved!) from this wicked world!

Agreed. The mistaken idea that Jesus is not yet King, and that this present world is something that we will "escape" by being raptured, and that entire package of ideas that sees the kingdom as coming in the future only has devastating practical consequences.

Those who believe Jesus is not yet king (a strange notion indeed, since the Bible is so clear that He already rules) will, naturally enough, be inclined to "sit on their hands and wait" for that kingdom to come. Instead, armed with the Biblically correct knowledge that Jesus has already been enthroned, we (the church) should be about the business of implementing that kingship by shaping our world accordingly.

Second, the belief in a "rapture" subtly, but very dangerously, endorses a whole package of ideas that de-value the importance, and the redemption, of this present physical world. If one thinks that one is going to be rescued from this world, and then God will "burn the world away to cinders", one loses motivation to do the "kingdom" tasks of caring for, nurturing, preserving the good, but fallen, creation that God is in the process of redeeming.

In short, many of the ideas we see in this thread are not only matters of "abstract theology". Those who embrace the "rapture theology" and place Jesus' kingdom in the future, are, whether they realize it or not, working against God's real purposes, which are to transform and redeem this present world.

 

[reba]

Sadly the church of today sure resembles the Jewish church of yesteryear.

Too many Christians want to be mushrooms.

 

[Drew]

This post stills needs to be responded to:

Christ did defeat satan at the cross.....

Can you explain why, in light of this, you seem to believe that it is satan, not Jesus who presently rules the world?

1,Christ is not ruling the world,

satan rules until the below verse,which has yet to happen

How is it that the party that is defeated on the cross is king while the victor is not?[/quote]