The Mystery of works with salvation: Those included vs those excluded

[gordon777]

Jesus endured the greatest test of His life, unto death.
Can't we endure the day to day living's test, unto life eternal ?

Matthew 16:25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.
33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

John 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.

John 15:12 THIS IS MY COMMANDMENT, That ye LOVE ONE ANOTHERl, AS I HAVE LOVED YOU.
13 GREATER LOVE hath no man than this, that A MAN LAY DOWN HIS LIFE FOR HIS FRIENDSa.
14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

Acts 20:24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

Acts 21:13 Then Paul answered, What mean ye to weep and to break mine heart? for I am ready not to be bound only, but also to die at Jerusalem for the name of the Lord Jesus.

1 John 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

Revelation 2:10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Matthew 16:25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.

Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.
33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

John 12:24 Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except a corn of wheat fall into the ground and die, it abideth alone: but if it die, it bringeth forth much fruit.
25 He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.

John 15:12 THIS IS MY COMMANDMENT, That ye LOVE ONE ANOTHERl, AS I HAVE LOVED YOU.
13 GREATER LOVE hath no man than this, that A MAN LAY DOWN HIS LIFE FOR HIS FRIENDSa.
14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

Acts 20:24 But none of these things move me, neither count I my life dear unto myself, so that I might finish my course with joy, and the ministry, which I have received of the Lord Jesus, to testify the gospel of the grace of God.

Acts 21:13 Then Paul answered, What mean ye to weep and to break mine heart? for I am ready not to be bound only, but also to die at Jerusalem for the name of the Lord Jesus.

1 John 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.

Revelation 2:10 Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life.

Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. But he who endures to the end shall be saved. (Matt. 23:9-13)

 

[gordon777]

John didn't write the Corianthian or Timothy letters, Paul did.

If so, you'd have boasted about Jesus's perfect obedience to the father, not your own.

Jesus is perfect obedience to the Father, love, faith, fear of God, and it would be really very silly would it not, if we do not have the same love, same faith, and same fear of God, because we are given the same Spirit to walk with.



Matthew 20:23 And he saith unto them, Ye shall drink indeed of my cup, and be baptized with the baptism that I am baptized with: but to sit on my right hand, and on my left, is not mine to give, but it shall be given to them for whom it is prepared of my Father.

Philippians 1:27 Only let your conversation be as it becometh the gospel of Christ: that whether I come and see you, or else be absent, I may hear of your affairs, that ye stand fast in one spirit, with one mind striving together for the faith of the gospel;


Ephesians 4:5 One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

Romans 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Romans 6:4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.


Colossians 2:13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

1 John 2:6 He that saith he abideth in him ought himself also so to walk, even as he walked.

1 John 2:28 And now, little children, abide in him; that, when he shall appear, we may have confidence, and not be ashamed before him at his coming.
29 If ye know that he is righteous, ye know that every one that doeth righteousness is born of him.

1 John 3:3 And every man that hath this hope in him purifieth himself, even as he is pure.

1 John 3:7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.

 

[gordon777]

Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake. And then many will be offended, will betray one another, and will hate one another. Then many false prophets will rise up and deceive many. And because lawlessness will abound, the love of many will grow cold. But he who endures to the end shall be saved. (Matt. 23:9-13)

Matthew 10:38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not WORTHY of me.

Luke 14:26 IF ANY MAN COME TO ME, AND HATE NOT his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and HIS OWN LIFE ALSO, he CANNOT BE MY DISCIPLE
27 And WHOSOEVER DOTH NOT BEAR HIS CROSS, AND COME AFTER ME, CANNOT BE MY DISCIPLE

Luke 14:33 So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsaketh not all that he hath, he cannot be my disciple.

Luke 21:34 And TAKE HEED to yourselves, LEST YOUR HEARTS BE OVERCHARGED with surfeiting, and drunkenness, and CARES OF THIS LIFE, and so THAT DAY COME UPON YOU UNAWARES.
35 For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.
36 Watch ye therefore, and PRAY ALWAYS, that YE MAY BE ACCOUNTED WORTHY T ESCAPE all these things that shall come to pass, and TO STAND BEFORE THE SON OF MAN.

 

[gordon777]

Sorry guys, you do years and years of teaching in forums, ( who knows who anyone really is) and we can only follow the ones who suffered for the name of Christ, you know, who lost all they had, died for the name of Christ, walked in love, longsuffering, ensamples to follow, how does anyone follow text, that is not the word in power and reality.

 

[brightfame52]

Works is only profitable for men Titus 3:8

This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.
But remember good works shouldn't be the primary gauge of who is a True Christian, for many false religions with their followers can perform good works in the eyes of men. The primary gauge is the Doctrine of Christ, what does the persons believe about the Christ, who He is, what He has done, and for whom.
John wrote 2 Jn 1:9
Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
Even if we consider James, look who he uses # Abraham James 2:21-23
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

What Doctrine did Abraham believe ? What did he believe about God ? Did he believe God was Sovereign in Salvation ? Did he believe God had chosen a special people for Himself.

Would he agree with todays freewill of man views of today ? Vs 23 says Abraham believed God, what did he believe God about ?

So we need to be careful about gauging spiritual matters of Salvation on works.

 

[Hopeful 2]

John didn't write the Corianthian or Timothy letters, Paul did.

It was John who wrote of walking in the light-God. (1 John 1:5,7,9)

If so, you'd have boasted about Jesus's perfect obedience to the father, not your own.

Didn't I just do that ?
Because of Jesus' obedience, and his conquest of the flesh, we too can live in obedience and conquest over the "flesh".
It is written..."By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God, and keep his commandments.
3 For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous." (1 John 5:2-3)

 

[Hopeful 2]

Sorry guys, you do years and years of teaching in forums, ( who knows who anyone really is) and we can only follow the ones who suffered for the name of Christ, you know, who lost all they had, died for the name of Christ, walked in love, longsuffering, ensamples to follow, how does anyone follow text, that is not the word in power and reality.

The obedient are good role models.
But Jesus is the ultimate role model.
His words and His Spirit come through perfectly, in the texts proclaiming freedom from sin.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

It was John who wrote of walking in the light-God. (1 John 1:5,7,9)

I was talking about the Corinthian letters, those were wrote by Paul.

Didn't I just do that ?

No you didn't. You blasphemously boasted of your own "perfect obedience", which you don't have, only Jesus does.

 

[Hopeful 2]

I was talking about the Corinthian letters, those were wrote by Paul.

You should have looked back at what I was writing about.

No you didn't. You blasphemously boasted of your own "perfect obedience"

Where is my "boasting" in..."If I had anything to do with making me free from sin, besides repenting and getting baptized, I don't know what it is.
I am only proud of Jesus for obeying God unto the death that freed me.
It is available to everyone of us, still."
That was in post #79.

which you don't have, only Jesus does.

BTW, it is written..."He that saith he abideth in Him ought himself also so to walk, even as He walked." (1 John 2:6)
Are you implying that you don't abide in Him ?

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

You should have looked back at what I was writing about.

You should've respected the OP, don't derail their thread with your blasphemous heresy.

 

[gordon777]

The obedient are good role models.
But Jesus is the ultimate role model.
His words and His Spirit come through perfectly, in the texts proclaiming freedom from sin.

Sin is talk, as it is not love, Christ overcome this world ( of sin) by doing more than words, and a love that does not lay its life down is not love.

Words are in circles for years and yeas on forums, as words before Christ all lead us into death, but the word of Christ is living, as He layed HIs life down so we follow Him in the same love, not the old words of vanity. ( death)

Only the simple continue to hear talks on these forums, or they can leave that behind and follow Christ together. ( without vain words/a tongue set on fire of hell they do not bridle on forums)


John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.
15 Henceforth I call you not servants; for the servant knoweth not what his lord doeth: but I have called you friends; for all things that I have heard of my Father I have made known unto you.

1 John 3:16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, because he laid down his life for us: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.


James 3:6 And the tongue is a fire, a world of iniquity: so is the tongue among our members, that it defileth the whole body, and setteth on fire the course of nature; and it is set on fire of hell.




James 3:3 Behold, we put bits in the horses' mouths, that they may obey us; and we turn about their whole body.


James 3:8 But the tongue can no man tame; it is an unruly evil, full of deadly poison.


James 1:26 If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.

 

[gordon777]

You should have looked back at what I was writing about.

Where is my "boasting" in..."If I had anything to do with making me free from sin, besides repenting and getting baptized, I don't know what it is.
I am only proud of Jesus for obeying God unto the death that freed me.
It is available to everyone of us, still."
That was in post #79.

BTW, it is written..."He that saith he abideth in Him ought himself also so to walk, even as He walked." (1 John 2:6)
Are you implying that you don't abide in Him ?

Talk and no walking in love by laying your life down, will not show anyone we are following Christ.


The time of the forum deception is done.

 

[gordon777]

You should've respected the OP, don't derail their thread with your blasphemous heresy.

no, we should all stop, and do as Christ did, if we want to be above words, or all is blasphemy.


Here is what we should begin to do...



Mark 10:21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.

Mark 10:28 Then Peter began to say unto him, Lo, we have left all, and have followed thee.
29 And Jesus answered and said, Verily I say unto you, There is no man that hath left house, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my sake, and the gospel's,
30 But he shall receive an hundredfold now in this time, houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions; and in the world to come eternal life.
31 But many that are first shall be last; and the last first.

1 Thessalonians 1:6 And ye became followers of us, and of the Lord, having received the word in much affliction, with joy of the Holy Ghost.

1 Thessalonians 2:9 For ye remember, brethren, our labour and travail: for labouring night and day, because we would not be chargeable unto any of you, we preached unto you the gospel of God.

Galatians 5:13 For, brethren, ye have been called unto liberty; only use not liberty for an occasion to the flesh, but by love serve one another.

Philippians 2:2 Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind.
3 Let nothing be done through strife or vainglory; but in lowliness of mind let each esteem other better than themselves.
4 Look not every man on his own things, but every man also on the things of others.
5 Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus:

 

[gordon777]

Everybody knows the people of the forums sit on them for years and years, like a hobby, to entertain themselves, to show their great knowledge and understanding, but there is NO UNDERSTANDING WITHUT WALKING N CHARITY, love is not something we talk, it is what we do when we believe in only love.

If it continues, if forums continue as if they were not reproved, it is OK, it only means it was unwanted advice, as their advice was preferred. ( to continue the talk at all costs and after all reproof, and to just not agree.)...




1 Corinthians 8:1 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.

1 Corinthians 13:2 And though I have the gift of prophecy, and understand all mysteries, and all knowledge; and though I have all faith, so that I could remove mountains, and have not charity, I am nothing.
3 And though I bestow all my goods to feed the poor, and though I give my body to be burned, and have not charity, it profiteth me nothing.
4 Charity suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up,

 

[Hopeful 2]

You should've respected the OP, don't derail their thread with your blasphemous heresy.

It's not my fault you can't keep track of what you are responding to.
BTW, perfect obedience to God isn't a heresy.
It is a command from God and also from Jesus Christ.
If God's commands offend you, why are you here ?

 

[Hopeful 2]

Sin is talk, as it is not love,

I agree, that sin is not love.
Do you think God would let His Son suffer and die just to leave us in bondage to sin ?
Or do you suppose He loved us enough to keep us free from sinning ?

Christ overcome this world ( of sin) by doing more than words, and a love that does not lay its life down is not love.

So too can we, as long as we are "in Christ".

 

[Hopeful 2]

Talk and no walking in love by laying your life down, will not show anyone we are following Christ.

Living without sin will show we are following Christ.
Do you live without sin ?

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

It's not my fault you can't keep track of what you are responding to.
BTW, perfect obedience to God isn't a heresy.
It is a command from God and also from Jesus Christ.
If God's commands offend you, why are you here ?

It is your fault when you derail the thread with your heresy, I'm here to discuss the OP's topic. I'm not offended by God's command, I'm offended by your sinful pride, moral superiority and pompous heresy.

 

[Hopeful 2]

It is your fault when you derail the thread with your heresy, I'm here to discuss the OP's topic. I'm not offended by God's command, I'm offended by your sinful pride, moral superiority and pompous heresy.

If perfect obedience to God is a heresy, then men are counting on their own works for their salvation.
We can be perfectly obedient, in Christ, so only those outside of Christ are not perfectly obedient.