Three person God identified in the Bible?

[Paul E. Michael]

But when a person says "the Father IS NOT the Son IS NOT the Holy Ghost", that identifies them as being separate rather than distinct.

When a heretic says "the Father IS the Son IS the Holy Ghost", he/she is denying a plurality of persons.

 

[Randy]

That is a mormon doctrine once again.

If he has a head, a torso, hair on His head, a figure like that of a man what do you call that? A body?

also "if" the Father has a beginning it could not be by any other being. He is unbegotten

 

[justbyfaith]

Neither of those passages says that two persons are one person.

I didn't say that they did...what those passages denote, is that what seems impossible or illogical is possible and logical with God.

When a heretic says "the Father IS the Son IS the Holy Ghost", he/she is denying a plurality of persons.

Not necessarily. And I do not say that in particular. What I teach is that they are the same Spirit.

There is a sense in which the Father is not the Son because He is a Spirit without flesh and Jesus is come in flesh. Because He is not in flesh, He is not the same Person as the Son.

However, because they are the same Spirit, they are the same Person in that sense.

Kapiche?

 

[Paul E. Michael]

A "tritheist" is someone who believes in three Gods.

By "Gods" do you mean persons?

If God is three separate Persons, then He is three Gods

So by "Gods" you do mean persons.

 

[justbyfaith]

If he has a head, a torso, hair on His head, a figure like that of a man what do you call that? A body?

also "if" the Father has a beginning it could not be by any other being. He is unbegotten

It is called an anthropomorphism. You can look that word up.

 

[justbyfaith]

So by "Gods" you do mean persons.

Don't try to put words in my mouth. It is for reasons like these that I don't want to even talk to you.

 

[Randy]

The Bible teaches that the more accurate statement is that God is a Spirit.

You can go with your own idea on the matter if you want; but it would make you wrong.

Yes but God has been seen sitting on a throne. So a spiritual body then.
Their stated as Spirit as well yet we read of bodily form
In speaking of the angels he says, “He makes his angels spirits, and his servants flames of fire.”

Rev 10
Then I saw another mighty angel coming down from heaven. He was robed in a cloud, with a rainbow above his head; his face was like the sun, and his legs were like fiery pillars. 2 He was holding a little scroll, which lay open in his hand. He planted his right foot on the sea and his left foot on the land,

 

[Randy]

It is called an anthropomorphism. You can look that word up.

God was first therefore it is man in His likeness not the other way around.

Rev 7
Not just a formless Spirit

As I looked,

“thrones were set in place,
and the Ancient of Days took his seat.
His clothing was as white as snow;
the hair of his head was white like wool.
His throne was flaming with fire,
and its wheels were all ablaze.
10 A river of fire was flowing,
coming out from before him.
Thousands upon thousands attended him;
ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him.
The court was seated,
and the books were opened.

 

[Paul E. Michael]

I didn't say that they did...what those passages denote, is that what seems impossible or illogical is possible and logical with God.

Here, you're merely admitting that your heretical anti-Trinitarian ravings are illogical, and you're asininely, and in futility, trying to appeal to the Bible to excuse your admittedly irrational thinking; and you are simultaneously blaspheming God by claiming He thinks illogically. No rationally-thinking person is going to give you a free pass to do that.

Don't try to put words in my mouth.

That sounds like something a Mormon would say. What do you mean by it?

It is for reasons like these that I don't want to even talk to you.

LOL

If you did not want to talk to me, you'd not be talking to me.

 

[Paul E. Michael]

There is a sense in which the Father is not the Son

So, it's wrong for Trinitarians to say that the Father is not the Son, but somehow it's right for anti-Trinitarians such as yourself to say that the Father is not the Son? That's a neat double-standard you got going on, there, justbyfaith.

 

[Paul E. Michael]

If God is three separate Persons, then He is three Gods

That's your extra-Biblical, nay, contra-Biblical assumption of unitarianism on display. You have no hope of rationally accounting for why you are saying it, but (wholly reflexively) you are saying that to be a god is to be one, and only one, person. The Bible, of course, assigns no lower nor upper limit to the number of persons a god can be.

Saying

no other way to slice it

only serves to show that you have not put any serious thought into the question of why you say that to be a god is to be one, and only one, person.

 

[Paul E. Michael]

The Son was the Word when He made the worlds.

True. And according to Hebrews 1:2, which you shamelessly ignore and contradict, the Son was the Son when He made the worlds. And that was before the Son's Incarnation.

 

[justbyfaith]

Yes but God has been seen sitting on a throne. So a spiritual body then.

An anthropomorphism.

God was first therefore it is man in His likeness not the other way around.

Rev 7
Not just a formless Spirit

As I looked,

“thrones were set in place,
and the Ancient of Days took his seat.
His clothing was as white as snow;
the hair of his head was white like wool.
His throne was flaming with fire,
and its wheels were all ablaze.
10 A river of fire was flowing,
coming out from before him.
Thousands upon thousands attended him;
ten thousand times ten thousand stood before him.
The court was seated,
and the books were opened.

Another anthropomorphism.

Sound doctrine declares that God is Omnipresent outside of time as an eternal Spirit.

Here, you're merely admitting that your heretical anti-Trinitarian ravings are illogical, and you're asininely, and in futility, trying to appeal to the Bible to excuse your admittedly irrational thinking; and you are simultaneously blaspheming God by claiming He thinks illogically. No rationally-thinking person is going to give you a free pass to do that.

The preaching of the Cross is foolishness to those who are perishing (1 Corinthians 1:18); and since the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God to save those who believe through the "foolishness of preaching" (1 Corinthians 1:21). I infer from this that the truths of the gospel message may in fact seem illogical to the unbelieving mind. However, the foolishness of God is wiser than men (1 Corinthians 1:28).

It is also written,

1Co 2:14, But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

So, it's wrong for Trinitarians to say that the Father is not the Son, but somehow it's right for anti-Trinitarians such as yourself to say that the Father is not the Son? That's a neat double-standard you got going on, there, justbyfaith.

When Tritheists say that the Father is not the Son, they also mean that the Son is not the Father.

That would be untrue; since the Son is the same Spirit as the Father.

And I am not an anti-Trinitarian.

True. And according to Hebrews 1:2, which you shamelessly ignore and contradict, the Son was the Son when He made the worlds. And that was before the Son's Incarnation.

Not necessarily. It is saying that the Person of the Son made the worlds. It is entirely possible that the Son made the worlds while He was still the Word. For He was the same Person (the same Spirit) as the Word as He was after He became the Son.

 

[justbyfaith]

True. And according to Hebrews 1:2, which you shamelessly ignore and contradict, the Son was the Son when He made the worlds. And that was before the Son's Incarnation.

The Son is the Son in that He came in human flesh.

And you are right because the Father created the worlds through Jesus Christ (the Son); even as Jesus had ascended to exist outside of time.

You seem to have forgotten that in my theology, the risen Jesus exists outside of time; even into eternity past.

So, it is entirely possible that He created the worlds, as the Son.

But I will say that it is sound doctrine to believe that Jesus is the Son of God in that He is come in flesh.

 

[Paul E. Michael]

Just put on your thinking cap for a few seconds.

You've made it clear that by telling us to "put on your thinking cap" you are expecting us to stop thinking rationally, and to start participating in your avowed anti-intellectualism.

 

[justbyfaith]

You've made it clear that by telling us to "put on your thinking cap" you are expecting us to stop thinking rationally, and to start participating in your avowed anti-intellectualism.

Don't be ridiculous. I am telling you the opposite, that you need to start thinking about doctrine and its implications in everything.

 

[justbyfaith]

The Bible, of course, assigns no lower nor upper limit to the number of persons a god can be.

The Bible teaches that there is only one true God (John 17:3).

 

[justbyfaith]

LOL

If you did not want to talk to me, you'd not be talking to me.

Sometimes we have mixed motivations about things.

It is true that I don't want to talk to you; however I am compelled to talk to you in order to not leave things unanswered because if I did that, you would have an advantage.

 

[Paul E. Michael]

So, it is entirely possible that He created the worlds, as the Son.

You heretically claim that the Son was created. And now you want to tell me that not only was the Son created, but the Son created the Son.

Don't be ridiculous.

IOW, don't think like you.

I am telling you the opposite, that you need to start thinking about doctrine and its implications in everything.

You already made it clear that you are committed to warring against logic when you tried to make out Isaiah and Luke to be saying that God is illogical, hoping that by doing so you could somehow make your war against logic seem God-sanctified.

 

[Paul E. Michael]

The Bible teaches that there is only one true God (John 17:3).

True.

And the Bible nowhere teaches that only one person is the only true God.

Which one of the following, two things did Jesus say when addressing His Father, and which one of them did He not say?

1. "Thee, the only true God"
2. "Thee, the only person who is the only true God"

And, like I pointed out:

The Bible, of course, assigns no lower nor upper limit to the number of persons a god can be.

If you think otherwise, feel free to give us a verse in which you imagine it is said that a god must be one, and only one, person.