Unique, Not Only-Begotten

[Carry_Your_Name]

Very important passage, but does not show that Jesus Christ is YHWH, as is clear in Psalm 110:1, 5

"When they heard these things they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed at him with their teeth. But he, being full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God, and said, “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!””

I can't imagine how God stands at his own right hand. This is exactly what is described in Ps. 110:1, the literal fulfillment.

 

[SolaScriptura]

"When they heard these things they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed at him with their teeth. But he, being full of the Holy Spirit, gazed into heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God, and said, “Look! I see the heavens opened and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God!””

I can't imagine how God stands at his own right hand. This is exactly what is described in Ps. 110:1, the literal fulfillment.

Excellent verse!

Also the fact, that Stephen sees the Father and Jesus Christ, and yet he invokes Jesus Christ and not the Father! WHY would he have done so, if he saw the uncreated Father, and the created Son, and not call on Almighty God, but a mere Created person?

Very conclusive of the equality of Jesus with the Father, and absolute Deity

 

[Randy]

Jesus Christ The Only Wise God

Jesus Christ The Only Wise God It is argued by some, that verses in the Bible, like John 17:3, where the Father is called, “The only True God”; and Romans 16:27, where the Father is called, “God only wise”; that Jesus Christ is not “God” (ὁ θεὸς), because in these passages, the Father is...

christianforums.net

The only true God has no God has not received from any other being and as shown is the source of all existence of life and every family in heaven and earth has derived their name from Him. It was He who has blessed us with every spiritual blessing in Christ. It was He who has reconciled things in heaven and earth to Himself through Christs blood on the cross. It was He who created all things through His Son.

Jesus has a God has a Father did receive the fullness, col 1:19 did receive authority. Inherited from the Father all things. Was given a name above all names from the Father. Sat down on His Fathers throne. The Son of Man lead into the Fathers presence and given Sovereign Authority, Glory and Honor from the Father on His throne.

Clearly Jesus is declaring that the Father His greater than Him in stating the Father is His God.

They shall all be taught by God.
It is written in the Prophets: ‘They will all be taught by God.’ Everyone who has heard the Father and learned from him comes to me.

“I have revealed you to those whom you gave me out of the world. They were yours; you gave them to me and they have obeyed your word.

 

[Randy]

Excellent verse!

Also the fact, that Stephen sees the Father and Jesus Christ, and yet he invokes Jesus Christ and not the Father! WHY would he have done so, if he saw the uncreated Father, and the created Son, and not call on Almighty God, but a mere Created person?

Very conclusive of the equality of Jesus with the Father, and absolute Deity

Why
“I have revealed you to those whom you gave me out of the world. They were yours; you gave them to me and they have obeyed your word.

He not speaking of life in the flesh as people not in the faith live in the flesh.
Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me

 

[SolaScriptura]

Why
“I have revealed you to those whom you gave me out of the world. They were yours; you gave them to me and they have obeyed your word.

He not speaking of life in the flesh as people not in the faith live in the flesh.
Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me

Neither verse shows WHY Stephen would call on someone who is LESS than God, when the Father was also there!

your reasoning is moot!

 

[Randy]

Neither verse shows WHY Stephen would call on someone who is LESS than God, when the Father was also there!

your reasoning is moot!

Sure it does we were given to Christ and we live through Him just as He lives by the Father as He stated.

The eternal life found in the Son is the Father. Col 1:19
And the Father has bound our lives in Christ by His authority and Will.

Its clear to me in that Jesus calling the Father His God is stating that they are not equal.

What makes Jesus a distinct person to you from the Father? Do you believe this distinction always was or began with the incarnation?

 

[GodsGrace]

Correct, because Isaiah 9:6 is not concerning YHWH.


Correct, because Isaiah 10:21 is concerning YHWH.


False. That's what you're doing. Isaiah 45:5 says there is not other God but YHWH whom you correctly identified as the Father.

5I am the LORD, and there is no other;
there is no God but Me.


ok?


Jesus wasn't called God in Titus 2:13. Great God and Savior Jesus are two different persons grammatically.


No they are not equal. God and Jesus are not the same person.

Revelation 21
22But I saw no temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.

Titus 2:13

Our great God and Savior is referring to the same Person.

It states that we look forward to His appearing.
No one has ever seen God.
John 1:18

But we have seen the Son,
Our great God and Savior.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

Excellent verse!

Also the fact, that Stephen sees the Father and Jesus Christ, and yet he invokes Jesus Christ and not the Father! WHY would he have done so, if he saw the uncreated Father, and the created Son, and not call on Almighty God, but a mere Created person?

Very conclusive of the equality of Jesus with the Father, and absolute Deity

Well, I think he saw the same glorified Jesus in priestly garment as described in Rev. 1, that's where he was truly revealed as God - "I am the alpha and the omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

 

[Runningman]

That name is Word of God, Rev. 19:13

It's not. This is talking about a person with a robe dipped in blood. That wouldn't be Jesus since he's never described that way. This is YHWH.

Isaiah 63
1Who is this coming from Edom,
from Bozrah with crimson-stained garments?
Who is this robed in splendor,
2Why are Your clothes red,
and Your garments like one who treads the winepress?
3“I have trodden the winepress alone,
and no one from the nations was with Me.
I trampled them in My anger
and trod them down in My fury;
their blood spattered My garments,
and all My clothes were stained.

the same Word in John 1:1. Scripture doesn't contradict itself.

Not related to Revelation 19. Jesus is not the word (logos). One is an it, the other is a person.

Revelation 1
9I, John, your brother and partner in the tribulation and kingdom and perseverance that are in Jesus, was on the island of Patmos because of the word of God and my testimony about Jesus.

So? The same is said to king Nebudchadnezzar: "You, O king, are a king of kings. For the God of heaven has given you a kingdom, power, strength, and glory;" (Dan. 2:37) This title is given to Nebudchadnezzar and Artaxerxes because they're antichrist figures who had stolen this title which only belongs to Christ - "The Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings." (Rev. 17:14)

No, it's referring to Christ and Christ only.

"remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you." (Rom. 11:18)

Regular humans share the same title so it isn't something that just plainly shows Jesus is God. The rest of the Bible's testimony regarding God and Jesus should be taken into account, especially where it's plain they are not the same person.

Revleation 21
22But I saw no temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.

 

[Runningman]

Titus 2:13

Our great God and Savior is referring to the same Person.

It states that we look forward to His appearing.
No one has ever seen God.
John 1:18

But we have seen the Son,
Our great God and Savior.

Person 1 = Great God
Person 2 = Savior Jesus

When Jesus appears, God brings Jesus. That's two different persons.

1 Thessalonians 4
14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

 

[GodsGrace]

Person 1 = Great God
Person 2 = Savior Jesus

When Jesus appears, God brings Jesus. That's two different persons.

1 Thessalonians 4
14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

So does scripture contradict itself?
No.

I gave you the verse that states that no one has ever seen God.
God is spirit. We cannot see the God, Father, that created the universe (through Jesus, the Word).

1 Thessalonians 4:14 is stating that God will bring back to life those that died in Christ.
ONLY Jesus is coming back to get those that are in Him at the end times.

1 Thessalonians 4:14-16
13And now, dear brothers and sisters, we want you to know what will happen to the believers who have died so you will not grieve like people who have no hope.
14For since we believe that Jesus died and was raised to life again, we also believe that when Jesus returns, God will bring back with him the believers who have died.
15We tell you this directly from the Lord: We who are still living when the Lord returns will not meet him ahead of those who have died.g
16For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the believers who have diedh will rise from their graves.


It's obvious from the above that Jesus, the Son, will be coming back to get His own,,,
as He promised the Apostles before the ascension.

John 14:2-3
. 2There is more than enough room in my Father’s home. If this were not so, would I have told you that I am going to prepare a place for you?
3When everything is ready, I will come and get you, so that you will always be with me where I am.

 

[GodsGrace]

It's not. This is talking about a person with a robe dipped in blood. That wouldn't be Jesus since he's never described that way. This is YHWH.

Isaiah 63
1Who is this coming from Edom,
from Bozrah with crimson-stained garments?
Who is this robed in splendor,
2Why are Your clothes red,
and Your garments like one who treads the winepress?
3“I have trodden the winepress alone,
and no one from the nations was with Me.
I trampled them in My anger
and trod them down in My fury;
their blood spattered My garments,
and all My clothes were stained.

Not related to Revelation 19. Jesus is not the word (logos). One is an it, the other is a person.

Revelation 1
9I, John, your brother and partner in the tribulation and kingdom and perseverance that are in Jesus, was on the island of Patmos because of the word of God and my testimony about Jesus.


Regular humans share the same title so it isn't something that just plainly shows Jesus is God. The rest of the Bible's testimony regarding God and Jesus should be taken into account, especially where it's plain they are not the same person.

Revleation 21
22But I saw no temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.

The Lamb of God takes away the sins of the world.
Only GOD can forgive sin.

And, Yahweh is Jesus.


JLB

 

[Hopeful 2]

The Lamb of God takes away the sins of the world.
Only GOD can forgive sin.

And, Yahweh is Jesus.


JLB

(Jesus did have power on earth to forgive sins...)
Even we can forgive sins committed against us.

 

[GodsGrace]

(Jesus did have power on earth to forgive sins...)
Even we can forgive sins committed against us.

This is true.
Jesus said to forgive 70X7,,,,that means forever and always.
However, yes, it's only for sins committed against us.
And I don't really understand fully well how our not forgiving someone
hampers God. It does hamper Him, but how I can't fathom.

 

[Hopeful 2]

This is true.
Jesus said to forgive 70X7,,,,that means forever and always.
However, yes, it's only for sins committed against us.
And I don't really understand fully well how our not forgiving someone
hampers God. It does hamper Him, but how I can't fathom.

We are to reflect the mercy of God with our forgiveness.
If we hold a grudge, it makes Him look bad.
If we can forgive, so can He: for the vilest of those who will repent of sin.

 

[GodsGrace]

We are to reflect the mercy of God with our forgiveness.
If we hold a grudge, it makes Him look bad.
If we can forgive, so can He: for the vilest of those who will repent of sin.

Thanks Hopeful.
If you have anything to add - please go ahead.

 

[Carry_Your_Name]

It's not. This is talking about a person with a robe dipped in blood. That wouldn't be Jesus since he's never described that way. This is YHWH.

Not related to Revelation 19. Jesus is not the word (logos). One is an it, the other is a person.

Jesus is the only way to YHWH, you don't know anything about YHWH unless through Jesus. If you think you can, then that's just an idol. Human mind is an idol factroy.

Regular humans share the same title so it isn't something that just plainly shows Jesus is God. The rest of the Bible's testimony regarding God and Jesus should be taken into account, especially where it's plain they are not the same person.

Then you're just living in denial. If your face is live on camera, is that image you or somebody else?

 

[Runningman]

The Lamb of God takes away the sins of the world.
Only GOD can forgive sin.

Only God can forgive sin or grant someone authority to do it. God granted men like Jesus and his disciples the authority to forgive sins. God doesn't need to be granted authority to do something only He can do, hence why Jesus required permission.

Matthew 9
6But so that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins...” Then He said to the paralytic, “Get up, pick up your mat, and go home.” 7And the man got up and went home.

8When the crowds saw this, they were filled with awe and glorified God, who had given such authority to men.

And, Yahweh is Jesus.

Not according to scripture.

 

[Runningman]

Jesus is the only way to YHWH, you don't know anything about YHWH unless through Jesus. If you think you can, then that's just an idol. Human mind is an idol factroy.

I agree completely.

Then you're just living in denial.

Someone sure is.

If your face is live on camera, is that image you or somebody else?

People were made in the image of God. It doesn't mean what you seem to think it does.

 

[Runningman]

So does scripture contradict itself?
No.

I gave you the verse that states that no one has ever seen God.
God is spirit. We cannot see the God, Father, that created the universe (through Jesus, the Word).

If no one has literally seen God then no one could see Jesus as God. It's by knowing God that one sees Him.

They had been with Jesus all this time and now, suddenly, they can see the Father? It refers to their understanding.

John 14
7If you had known Me, you would know My Father as well. From now on you do know Him and have seen Him.”

1 Thessalonians 4:14 is stating that God will bring back to life those that died in Christ.
ONLY Jesus is coming back to get those that are in Him at the end times.

1 Thessalonians 4:14-16
13And now, dear brothers and sisters, we want you to know what will happen to the believers who have died so you will not grieve like people who have no hope.
14For since we believe that Jesus died and was raised to life again, we also believe that when Jesus returns, God will bring back with him the believers who have died.
15We tell you this directly from the Lord: We who are still living when the Lord returns will not meet him ahead of those who have died.g
16For the Lord himself will come down from heaven with a commanding shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trumpet call of God. First, the believers who have diedh will rise from their graves.

According to 1 Thess 4:14 God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep. God does the bringing, the action, the carrying, etc.

The way Jesus ascended to heaven was not on his own power. He was carried up into the sky [By God] and he will return the same way he left, with God bringing him like Scripture states. That means Jesus isn't God.

Luke 24
51While He was blessing them, He left them and was carried up into heaven.

Acts 1
11“Men of Galilee,” they said, “why do you stand here looking into the sky? This same Jesus, who has been taken from you into heaven, will come back in the same way you have seen Him go into heaven.”

It's obvious from the above that Jesus, the Son, will be coming back to get His own,,,
as He promised the Apostles before the ascension.

John 14:2-3
. 2There is more than enough room in my Father’s home. If this were not so, would I have told you that I am going to prepare a place for you?
3When everything is ready, I will come and get you, so that you will always be with me where I am.

Isolated from other scriptures I could see how one would come to that misunderstanding, but I posted some verses above that should help clear it up.