This is complete fantasy. God saves a multitude of unsaved sinners and draws them effectually.
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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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What About Those In Non-Christian Lands Who Have Never Heard The Gospel?
- Thread starter JAG ..
- Start date
Sad that you openly deny scripture.
Muslims deny Jesus is God. They do not worship the biblical God. What are you making up?
Here W denies Paul wrote the word of God ,as if he was not inspired bt the Spirit.
The true believers in the OT were the Sethian line, Noah, Enoch, and those in the Abrahamic Covenant, to name a few.
Without a Temple the God-fearers developed after the “Jews” returned from exile.
Being in the Mosaic Covenant and the Prophecy of a prophet like unto Moses those that trusted (had faith) in the promise were Christian and looked forward to their promise from their God.
The Syrophenecian woman, the Samaritan woman at the well, and the Roman centurion had great faith because they accepted Jesus as Israel’s promised Messiah/Christ and went to Him for their various needs. They were elect and Jesus healed/delivered/saved them. They walked by both sight and faith.
I think you're both right. Wondering's definition is from man's point of view and Jeremiah's definition is from God's point of view. I suppose from an individual's point a view a heretic is "anyone that disagrees with that person".
Wondering and I both think the other is a heretic ... *giggle*
wondering said:
A heretic is just someone that doesn't agree with what everyone else is in agreement.
This is not necessarily true.
"If 50 million people say a wrong thing, it's still a wrong thing." ---- Albert Einstein.
Truth does not rest on what the majority think. Truth rests on what God says is true and on what God says is false/lie. He is the final arbiter of what's true in His creation.
The statement is true but not relevant to the definition of 'heretic'.
Again, you're presenting a straw man argument. The question at hand is "what is a heretic" and not "what is truth".
Google search:
- A person who holds controversial opinions, especially one who publicly dissents from the officially accepted dogma of the Roman Catholic Church.
- One who holds and persistently maintains an opinion or a doctrine at variance with the accepted standards of any school or party, and rejected or condemned by it; one who rejects a generally accepted belief.
- Specifically, in theology, a professed believer who adopts and persistently maintains religious opinions contrary to the accepted standards of his church.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
You've seen much evil J, so it has affected you a lot.
Most persons don't experience what you have.
I firmly believe man should not have to see what he sees in war-time.
Jesus did say that the road that leads to destruction is broad.
I see people and it's difficult to believe that they prefer evil...
and yet this is what the sin nature brings to humanity.
So we need to believe what we would prefer not to believe.
I'd say, as I have all throughout, that a JW and a Mormon do not believe what mainline Christianity believes even though they like to call themselves Christians.
However, it is God that will make the final decision.
As I've said, I believe that anyone that honors Him and worships Him and obeys Him will probably see Him in heaven, no matter what religion they are.
Jesus has thrown down the wall between Jews and Gentiles.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
James was writing to the tribes scattered abroad.
Not all the writers were.
1 Cor 11:17-19
17But in giving this instruction, I do not praise you, because you come together not for the better but for the worse.
18For, in the first place, when you come together as a church, I hear that divisions exist among you; and in part I believe it.
19For there must also be factions among you, so that those who are approved may become evident among you.
I don't know what version you're using, but the NASB states the above.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
YOU'RE IN THE THEOLOGY FORUM.
PLEASE FOLLOW THE TOS RULES.
YOUR STATEMENTS REQUIRE BIBLICAL SUPPORT.
PLEASE REPLY ONLY TO THE TOPIC.
ALSO, YOU'RE VERY CLOSE TO TROLLING AND THAT COULD GET YOU BANNED
FROM THIS THREAD.
PLEASE DO NOT RESPONS TO THIS POST IN THIS THREAD.
USE TALK WITH THE STAFF IF NECESSARY.
Yet you claim literally if a person believes in a great spirit and does good somehow according to God .let alone nature doesn't tell us what sin is .
Animals even dogs will kill their pups .seen it .a pig will do it ,chickens will peck their own to death .
Yet a he and Mormon can do exactly as you say .
Marry and never divorce .worship God as they know him ,don't lie ,cheat or etc and yet you think that if they are that good .problem is history has no examples of man being so good that he doesn't kill his brother to get something he wants.not even the American Indians .
The Cherokee of which jaci my granddaughter has animal stories to teach moral lessons ..that tribe wasnt a chump ,they like the apache at times would invade and take land.they pushed the creek out of Georgia into Alabama and into Florida .
Okechobee .big lake ,a snake was bored living in the marsh and so he slithered south ,then it rained and he began to circle and kept circling as the ran didn't stop and was covered in water .we know the lake as lake Okeechobee and the river as the Kissimmee .they say he is still at the bottom of that lake just waiting for it to dry and he will move on.
The Cherokee have a pantheon like the Seminoles . The rabbit jitsu ,the trickster ,he can take any form .you ,your child and he does so to steal from you or take you .
The Seminoles have a similar myth. Perhaps you should attend a pow wow and listen to these.its educational but also pagan.they do rain dances if the tribe does it .they also mix Catholicism with their faith .they openly admit it. That's usually the south western tribe .try meeting the Aztecs and asking them about the great spirit .
Eden was not in Africa or in the bible but in about where Chicago is.but the Aztecs rebelled and were cast out and all man came from that split off ,all American Indians ,not the white man .
If God is the great spirit then why would he lie to them ? That's so off .
Yet there can be sincere diets there.
GodsGrace
CF Ambassador
You forget something I said way back at the beginning....
It must be GOD, the Almighty God, creator of the universe.
Not some weird pagan god.
Unless God reveals himself ,
Peter couldn't see Jesus as the son of man unless it Father revealed it to him.
Peter knew the tanach .he was fluent in the knowing the Torah and the prophets .how so would be a gentile who never heard ?
My point here is many Jews then knowing the tanach deny Jesus and are damned when they died .they had the signs and the season in their writing to guide them .yet God had to open their eyes.
God's Redeemer was prophesied in Genesis 3:15.
God knew this Redeemer would come from one of the tribes of Jacob (later named Israel.)
In a few hundred years God made Abraham the recipient of the Trinitarian Covenant and Abraham was the founding of the "Jewish" race. The Abrahamic Covenant was Hebrew/"Jewish." (The identification of "Jewish" comes from the later tribe of Judah.)
The nation of Israel consisted originally of twelve tribes and later their offspring.
Israel went into slavery in Egypt.
Moses was called to deliver Israel.
Deuteronomy 18:18 Moses prophesied that God would send Israel's Messiah and King from 'among their brethren.'
The Law of Moses/God was the beginning of the Nation of Israel.
God promised Israel and David that one from his seed would sit on the throne of David.
Do you see the "Jewishness" of Israel's Messiah and King and Redeemer?
Messiah was born in a little town of Bethlehem as prophesied in Micah.
Jesus comes from a long family line of "Jews."
Jesus came to Israel.
Jesus healed, delivered, and taught the members of the twelve tribes living in and around Old Testament Israel (of northern and southern kingdoms.)
There was still centuries-old animosity between the ten northern tribes and the two southern tribes and Jesus taught Israel to love Israel (Matt. 5.) He never taught Covenant Israel to love anyone NON-Covenant (Gentiles.)
Jesus came to save and deliver Israel as prophesied many times in the Old Testament.
Jesus was sent to the lost sheep of the house of Israel (NOT the lost sheep of the house of Gentiles.)
Moses wrote the Law TO and FOR Israel
The Psalms were written by those in Covenant with God TO and FOR Israel.
Prophets were sent by God TO and FOR Israel.
Messiah came and taught Israel.
The eleven apostles were sent to let the twelve tribes scattered abroad to let them know Messiah had come and God has kept His promises.
The gospels were written by believers in Covenant with God TO and FOR Covenant Israel.
The letters from Paul, Peter, James, Jude, John were written TO and FOR Israel but in time the Temple would be destroyed and the "ism" in "Judaism" would effectively come to an end and a new era would begin: The Times of the Gentiles in which God's promise to include Gentiles in His Covenant would begin.
The Lord's Prayer is a "Jewish" prayer for Israel for the Times of Jacob's Trouble when false prophet and antichrist would appear.
Revelation is an end-time prophecy TO and FOR Israel.
The Old Testament and the New Testament is "Jewish" in origin and is TO and FOR Israel.
Gentiles are being grafted in and need to be careful they don't think of themselves more highly than they ought, or God will cut them OFF!
Do you see the "Jewishness" of the Covenant God has made with His Chosen-apple of His eye-people called Israel?
The NASB is wishy-washy when it comes to authenticity and accuracy. The NASB (1952) derives from the Greek texts which Westcott and Hort and their team developed from which all modern-day, new-age English translations come from.
Now, can you tell me what Paul is explaining in 1 Corinthians 11:17-19?
setst777
Member
You are using the word "God-fearers" within a constricted definition of your making. I am using the term "God-fearers" as all those OT believers who truly believed God and walked with God by faith, from Abel onward. Not until Christ actually completed his mission on earth, being crucified for our sins, did the Apostles even understand the Gospel.
These OT God-fearers were not required to believe in the Messiah, nor did the OT prophets understand who the Messiah was, or what his mission actually was.
Many OT believers thought that the Christ only comes in victory, not as the dying servant, to save them from their oppressors. So, the OT believers, as well, did not have an accurate Gospel conception of who the Messiah was.
1 Peter 1:10-16 (NIV) 10 Concerning this salvation, the prophets, who spoke of the grace that was to come to {{{you,}}} searched intently and with the greatest care, 11 trying to find out the time and circumstances to which the Spirit of Christ in them was pointing when he predicted the sufferings of the Messiah and the glories that would follow. 12 It was revealed to them that they were not serving themselves {{{but you,}}} when they spoke of the things that have now been told {{{you}}} by those who have {{{preached the gospel to you}}} by the Holy Spirit sent from heaven. {{{Even angels long to look into these things.}}}
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Hey everyone, I thought we needed some simple explanations on your topic.
I noticed Romans 2, needed to be explained a little.
Romans 2 speaks of escaping, ( or non escaping) of the righteous judgement of God, which is the goodness of God leading all men to repentance.
Seeking eternal life is the truth, and where is that truth but in the Son of God.
1 John 5 concludes for us of the record God gave us of HIs Son, to know that the Son of God came, ( not antichrist spirit that denies the Son of God has come in the flesh.) and gave us an understanding, ( giving the Spirit to know the things of God.) to be in Him that is true, even in the Son of God Jesus Christ, who is the ONLY true God and eternal life.
Romans 2:3 And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?
4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Romans 2:7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
1 John 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
I noticed Romans 2, needed to be explained a little.
Romans 2 speaks of escaping, ( or non escaping) of the righteous judgement of God, which is the goodness of God leading all men to repentance.
Seeking eternal life is the truth, and where is that truth but in the Son of God.
1 John 5 concludes for us of the record God gave us of HIs Son, to know that the Son of God came, ( not antichrist spirit that denies the Son of God has come in the flesh.) and gave us an understanding, ( giving the Spirit to know the things of God.) to be in Him that is true, even in the Son of God Jesus Christ, who is the ONLY true God and eternal life.
Romans 2:3 And thinkest thou this, O man, that judgest them which do such things, and doest the same, that thou shalt escape the judgment of God?
4 Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance?
5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Romans 2:7 To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life:
8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath,
1 John 5:11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
1 John 5:20 And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.
Back on explaining Romans 2, a little more.
The Gentiles Romans 2 speaks of, are the ones who are led by the goodness of God to repentance.
Denying and not confessing/acknowledging this, is denying the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. ( that antichrist spirit)
It is told first in Acts 11, how the Spirit was given by gift to the Gentiles, as well as with the Jews, for believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, God had granted also to the Gentiles repentance unto life. (To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life. Romans 2:7. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 1 John 5:11.)
Then Romans 2 shows the nature of the Gentiles, with a conscience, to be judged by Jesus Christ according to the Gospel. ( Granted repentance to life/the goodness of God led them to repentance.)
Galatians 2 further explains, if they do not walk according to the truth of the Gospel, the Gentiles then cannot be compelled to live as the Jews, the Jews being by nature, to not be sinners of the Gentiles.
Those by nature, Jew or Gentile, as in Romans 2 first, then afterwards told about also in Galatians 2, know and confess that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, to believe in Jesus Christ ( granted repentance unto life/eternal life is in His Son.) to be justified by the faith of Jesus Christ, ( showing the works of the law written in their heart.) and not by works of the law or anything else in nature, which no flesh shall be jusified.
Acts 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?
18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
Romans 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
Galatians 214 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
The Gentiles Romans 2 speaks of, are the ones who are led by the goodness of God to repentance.
Denying and not confessing/acknowledging this, is denying the truth of the Gospel of Jesus Christ. ( that antichrist spirit)
It is told first in Acts 11, how the Spirit was given by gift to the Gentiles, as well as with the Jews, for believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, God had granted also to the Gentiles repentance unto life. (To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality, eternal life. Romans 2:7. And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son. 1 John 5:11.)
Then Romans 2 shows the nature of the Gentiles, with a conscience, to be judged by Jesus Christ according to the Gospel. ( Granted repentance to life/the goodness of God led them to repentance.)
Galatians 2 further explains, if they do not walk according to the truth of the Gospel, the Gentiles then cannot be compelled to live as the Jews, the Jews being by nature, to not be sinners of the Gentiles.
Those by nature, Jew or Gentile, as in Romans 2 first, then afterwards told about also in Galatians 2, know and confess that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, to believe in Jesus Christ ( granted repentance unto life/eternal life is in His Son.) to be justified by the faith of Jesus Christ, ( showing the works of the law written in their heart.) and not by works of the law or anything else in nature, which no flesh shall be jusified.
Acts 11:17 Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?
18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.
Romans 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
15 Which shew the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another;)
16 In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
Galatians 214 But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?
15 We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,
16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.