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What is the rule of faith for Christians?

Well I guess that some people being flogged and crucified in the middle eastern sun over several hours might not be thirsty .
I had not thought of that .
Do you think the penitent crucified thief is in heaven today ?
Where is the scripture I asked for so I can go read it.

Since Jesus told him he would be in paradise that day then yes he is.
 
The thief is no proof text of “faith alone”
Luke 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
Luke 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Was Jesus lying here? Seems like the thief had faith to believe Jesus was the Son of God.
 
Five Solas or Protestant dogmas!

Faith alone

Christ alone

Grace alone

Bible alone

Glory to God alone


Faith alone! That means faith alone! Period!
No sacraments ez 36:25-27 Mk 16:16 Jn 3:5 acts 2:38-39 acts 8:36-38 Titus 3:5 1 pet 3:20-21
No repentance Lk 3:3
No suffering Mk 8:34 Mk 10:21 Phil 1:29
No hope rom 8:24
No charity 1 cor 13:2 1 cor 13:13
No love of God duet. 6:5
No grace Jn 1:16-17
No nothing but faith alone!
Alone means alone!
It is by faith alone through Gods grace. What you have listed here are the works that follow after faith being first.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

The Catechism, the Pope, nor even Mary can save us. You, I nor any church can save another soul, but Christ only by the grace of god.
 
Not a word about naked, or fire either, is in the bible's accounts of the Lord's suffering.
In fact, it was cloudy that day.
"Now from the sixth hour there was darkness over all the land unto the ninth hour." Matt 27:45)
The baptism of fire will be the end of the world..."Whose fan is in his hand, and he will throughly purge his floor, and gather his wheat into the garner; but he will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire." (Matt 3:12)
The thief did literally what we did Spiritually.
He died with Christ and was raised with Him to walk in newness of life.
"Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life." (Rom 6:4)
Thanks be to God.
You created an interesting thought.
You say it was cloudy that day.
So the darkness that covered the land was just a cloud cover.
Nothing spiritual about that.
But a sky without sun, moon, planets, or stars.
That's a scary darkness.
That seems more appropriate to me for the King of Kings.
 
It's only your opinion as Roman Caesars are not mentioned in Daniel 2:44. Unless I am wrong there were no Roman Caesars that were kings as there is a different between the two.

Daniel 2:44 confirms the prophecy given by Isaiah in Isaiah 9:6-7 that Jesus will come to establish His kingdom which will never be destroyed.
Yep that’s the church

What other kings were there

Or are you still waiting for the kingdom?
 
Luke 23:42 And he said unto Jesus, Lord, remember me when thou comest into thy kingdom.
Luke 23:43 And Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto thee, To day shalt thou be with me in paradise.

Was Jesus lying here? Seems like the thief had faith to believe Jesus was the Son of God.
Baptism was not required till Christ died
Heb 9:16
 
It is by faith alone through Gods grace. What you have listed here are the works that follow after faith being first.

Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Eph 2:9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

The Catechism, the Pope, nor even Mary can save us. You, I nor any church can save another soul, but Christ only by the grace of god.
Eph 2 refers to redemption not justification

The church and Christ are one acts 9:4 and the church and the sacraments are necessary for salvation

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Sacraments instituted by Christ for the salvation of souls!

Not by “faith alone”
“Faith alone” not biblical
“Faith alone” never given in prophesy in the OT.
You may think “Accept Jesus Christ as you personal Lord and savior” is biblical but there is no such verse in your bible!

Faith and the sacraments in the church founded by the authority Christ on Peter and the apostles is biblical!

Faith and baptism is the biblical initiation into the new covenant and member is Christ and His holy church!
Ez 36:25-27 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38

You cannot enter a covenant by “faith alone” must be a ritual outward sign!
Faith and baptism! Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38

Merits of christ’s passion, death, and precious blood are applied in the sacraments! Jn 1:16

Colossians 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Matt 26:28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Rom 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

1 pet 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Heb 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

Acts 2:47
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Lk 1: 72 To perform the mercy promised to our fathers, and to remember his holy covenant;

73 The oath which he sware to our father Abraham,

74 That he would grant unto us, that we being delivered out of the hand of our enemies might serve him without fear,

There is only one true church founded by Christ on Peter and the apostles and their successors is the new covenant body of Christ! Matt 1:18 & Jn 10:16 one fold

1 Timothy 3:15
But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.

Christ and His church are one: acts 9 why persecute me?

Eph 1:13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,


Sacraments are the fruit of the sacrifice!
The holy sacrifice of Christ, His passion, blood, and death producing unlimited fruits of divine grace, actual and sanctifying grace! Jn 1:29 Jn 1:16-17 Jn 10:10


“This promise” (sacred oath of God or sacrament) of the Father acts 2:38-39 with reference to ez 36:25-27 Also a mystery Mk 4:11 Eph 5:32 eph 6:19 1 Tim 3:9 3:16 Col 1:27 2:2 4:3

Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Jn 3:5 born again by water and the spirit.

Heb 7:21 For those priests were made without an oath; but this with an oath by him that said unto him, The Lord sware and will not repent, Thou art a priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec
(Oath = sacrament)

Hebrews 8:6
But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. Based on Jer 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:


A promise is a sacred oath or sacrament!
Baptismal regeneration is the promise of the Father for union in the new covenant!

The church and the seven sacraments are necessary for salvation

Better covenant on better promises

2 Timothy 1:1
Paul, an apostle of Jesus Christ by the will of God, according to the promise of life which is in Christ Jesus,

Life of supernatural grace merited by Christ in His passion and death!

An oath to sacramental life in the new covenant in union with the mediator and communion with God, and the saints!

Promise of the Father acts 2:23-39
Promise is an oath and an oath is a sacrament! This promise of the sacrament of baptism refers to ez. 36:25-27

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.


1 Pet 3:20
Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark all died and outside the church there is no salvation!)

Jn 1:5-5 abide in Him, apart from Him you can do nothing.

Jn 10:10 life, (grace more abundantly)
Jn 1: 16 And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

17 For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
Thru the sacraments!
 
How do you even know what is and what is not scripture?
Ever read Daniel 13 and the great faith of Susana?
The books that were selected to be put into the book we call the Holy Bible are those of the most important that points us to Christ as there would be no book big enough to contain all the writings of the Prophets and Apostles. Many book chapters were left out, just like Daniel Chapter 13 and Psalms 151 as they had very little relevance, but yet we can still look them up and read them, just like the book of Enoch and the Maccabees and so many more. We could never exhaust that which we already have with all the teachings from Genesis to Revelation.

We believe everything that is written in the Bible is the infallible word of God as the Holy Spirit bears witness to its authenticity. It wasn't the Protestants nor the Roman Catholics, but the Prophets and Apostles that were inspired by God what to write for all of us to learn from. When you understand this then the Christ will be so very real to you in your walk with Him as it's a one on one personal relationship with Him.
 
All apostles are sent to baptize Matt 28:19
Paul is primarily sent to preach
You cannot be united to Christ in the new covenant by faith alone
Must be not again by baptism jn 3:5 Titus 3:5
Faith and baptism Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38
1 pet 3:20-21
Baptism is the initiation into the ark of salvation the church
Act 2:38
Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.(Baptism)

40 And with many other words did he testify and exhort, saying, Save yourselves from this untoward generation.

41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls.
(Saved by baptism)

Acts 8:36
And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized?

37 And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God.

Philip preached Jesus and the result is justification by baptism!

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Rom 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Romans 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Acts 2:47
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

1 Corinthians 1:2
Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's:

Acts 2:47
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Ephesians 4:5 
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

Colossians 2:12
Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

Gal 4:19
My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

Titus 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; (baptism)

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Heb 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

1 Jn 2:20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.

1 Jn 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

(Born of God) faith and baptism

Jn 1:12-13 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

1 Jn 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

Born of God by baptism

1 pet 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

1 Peter 1:22
Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: see Ez 36

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, (baptism rom 6:3-4)


1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)
First of all we come to Christ by faith alone as in believing in Him even though we have never seen Him. Ephesians 2:8-10; Hebrews 11:1-3. Most of those scriptures you posted have nothing to do with baptism.

Do you realize there is a different between the baptism of John the Baptist unto repentance as in prepare ye the way of the Lord and the Baptism of Christ which is the indwelling of the Holy Spirit which was not yet available in John's baptism. Those who came to John's baptism came by faith alone as Christ had not come yet. It was by faith alone in the OT that they believe in God.

Again, the church can not save anyone.
 
Nowhere can you find “faith alone” in scripture
In relation to Sola Fide, the place of works is found in Ephesians chapter 2. Justification is by grace through faith, not from yourself and not by works. It is by faith alone since all human efforts are excluded here, Ephesians 2:8, 9. Ephesians goes on to say that every person who has faith is to produce good works according to God's plan Ephesians 2:10. We know also that faith without works is dead faith

These works, however, are not a cause for forgiveness, but a result of forgiveness. Faith alone justifies, but faith is never alone as it is followed by good works. The works of love are the goal of the saving faith, 1 Timothy 1:5.

James 1:16-18 clearly teaches that the recipients of the letter have been justified by God through the saving gospel which is Christ Jesus who is our faith. James also taught in James 2:14-26 that faith is dead within us if not followed by good works as it takes faith and good works to justify us. It begins with faith alone when we first accept Jesus as Lord and Savior entering into a better covenant by God's grace and then we become his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
 
Eph 2 refers to redemption not justification

The church and Christ are one acts 9:4 and the church and the sacraments are necessary for salvation

Characteristics of Baptism

1. By water - Acts 10:47

2. Only one - Ephesians 4:5

3. Necessary - Acts 2:38, 41

4. Source of power - Acts 1:5, 8

5. Follows faith - Acts 18:8



Symbolism of Baptism

1. Forecast in prophecy - Joel 2:28, 29; Acts 2:16-21

2. Prefigured in types- 1 Corinthians 10:2; 1 Peter 3:20, 21

3. Visualized by the Spirit's descent - Acts 2:3, 4, 41; Acts 10:44-48

4. Expressive of Spiritual unity - 1 Corinthians 12:13; Galatians 3:27, 28

5. Figurative of regeneration - John 3:3, 5, 6; Romans 6:3, 4, 11

6. Illustrative of cleansing - Acts 22:16; Titus 3:5
 
WIP did post:
“ Maybe it would be better to stay with one topic per discussion. Baptism is another topic entirely.”

I agree. We have a lot of issues going on at once. It is hard for some to not get indigestion with all this at once.

eddif
 
You created an interesting thought.
You say it was cloudy that day.
So the darkness that covered the land was just a cloud cover.
Nothing spiritual about that.
But a sky without sun, moon, planets, or stars.
That's a scary darkness.
That seems more appropriate to me for the King of Kings.
It might make an interesting new thread.
If the darkness was something entirely different than the usual, why wasn't that fact mentioned?
 
How do you even know what is and what is not scripture?
Ever read Daniel 13 and the great faith of Susana?

That has already been decided by the people of God. Israel concerning the Old Testament. The Church, born-again believers, concerning the New Testament. Result is the 66 books of the Bible.

Why do I want to read Susana or Bel and the Dragon? It is not Scripture.

Quantrill
 
The books that were selected to be put into the book we call the Holy Bible are those of the most important that points us to Christ as there would be no book big enough to contain all the writings of the Prophets and Apostles. Many book chapters were left out, just like Daniel Chapter 13 and Psalms 151 as they had very little relevance, but yet we can still look them up and read them, just like the book of Enoch and the Maccabees and so many more. We could never exhaust that which we already have with all the teachings from Genesis to Revelation.

We believe everything that is written in the Bible is the infallible word of God as the Holy Spirit bears witness to its authenticity. It wasn't the Protestants nor the Roman Catholics, but the Prophets and Apostles that were inspired by God what to write for all of us to learn from. When you understand this then the Christ will be so very real to you in your walk with Him as it's a one on one personal relationship with Him.
No personal relationship no personal savior
The church is a covenant
All those united to the mediator by faith and baptism Mk 16:16 are in communion with each other in the communion of saints

The apostles were and still are wholly catholic

And books left out of scripture are the tradition of men

The story of Susana is very important for faith and trust in God
 
That has already been decided by the people of God. Israel concerning the Old Testament. The Church, born-again believers, concerning the New Testament. Result is the 66 books of the Bible.

Why do I want to read Susana or Bel and the Dragon? It is not Scripture.

Quantrill
According to the “tradition of men” under king james
 
Paul said a few other things too as did Christ Mk 16:16 for example acts 8:36-38
Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

Rom 3:24
Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

Romans 6:4
Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Acts 2:47
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

1 Corinthians 1:2
Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their's and our's:

Acts 2:47
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,

Ephesians 4:5 
One Lord, one faith, one baptism,

Colossians 2:12
Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

Gal 4:19
My little children, of whom I travail in birth again until Christ be formed in you,

Titus 3:5
Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; (baptism)

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

Heb 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

1 Jn 2:20 But ye have an unction from the Holy One, and ye know all things.

1 Jn 2:27 But the anointing which ye have received of him abideth in you, and ye need not that any man teach you: but as the same anointing teacheth you of all things, and is truth, and is no lie, and even as it hath taught you, ye shall abide in him.

(Born of God) faith and baptism

Jn 1:12-13 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

1 Jn 5:4 For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, even our faith.

5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God?

6 This is he that came by water and blood, even Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth.

7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.

Born of God by baptism

1 pet 1:2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

1 Peter 1:22
Seeing ye have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit unto unfeigned love of the brethren, see that ye love one another with a pure heart fervently: see Ez 36

Rev 1:5 And from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, and the first begotten of the dead, and the prince of the kings of the earth. Unto him that loved us, and washed us from our sins in his own blood, (baptism rom 6:3-4)


1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

God also said something acts 2:38-39 promise of God

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.


Nowhere can you find “faith alone” in scripture
Try 1 cor 13 for instance
Which of these verses you have quoted refer to Spiritual Baptism, rather than water Baptism ?
 
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