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https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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Yes, but Revelation 11:4 is a reference back to the vision of the Lampstand and olives/branches in Zechariah 4:1-14. Not only Zechariah 4:2-4, or Zechariah 4:12-14 but Zechariah 4 in its entirety. An understanding of Revelation 11:4 comes from Zechariah 4.A lamp stand is an assembly in revelation.
Revelation 1:20
The mystery of the seven stars that you saw in my right hand and of the seven golden lampstands is this: The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches, and the seven lampstands are the seven churches.
Do you explain the inner work inside the individual members of those churches?Yes, but Revelation 11:4 is a reference back to the vision of the Lampstand and olives/branches in Zechariah 4:1-14. Not only Zechariah 4:2-4, or Zechariah 4:12-14 but Zechariah 4 in its entirety. An understanding of Revelation 11:4 comes from Zechariah 4.
No, initially I was just responding to the original post on who the 2 witnesses were. Everything else relates to that. Identifying 1 of the 2 witnesses through scripture. By pointing out unfulfilled prophecies and events wherein we can see that these messages were given to Zerubbabel. Messages in Zechariah 4 and Haggai 2, with unfulfilled events back then, were not to the Zerubbabel of that time period. As Zechariah 3:8 says Joshua and his friends (Zerubbabel and others) represent a sign of others to come in the future. There will be another Zerubbabel who will do not physical but spiritual buildingDo you explain the inner work inside the individual members of those churches?
Revelation 3:20 - 22
eddif
But we already know,Christ builds the temple of God.That much has been clear for nearly 2000 years now.No, initially I was just responding to the original post on who the 2 witnesses were. Everything else relates to that. Identifying 1 of the 2 witnesses through scripture. By pointing out unfulfilled prophecies and events wherein we can see that these messages were given to Zerubbabel. Messages in Zechariah 4 and Haggai 2, with unfulfilled events back then, were not to the Zerubbabel of that time period. As Zechariah 3:8 says Joshua and his friends (Zerubbabel and others) represent a sign of others to come in the future. There will be another Zerubbabel who will do not physical but spiritual building
Ephesians 2:20-22
I really don't think anyone takes into consideration the armed forces of the king of the north will be occupying Jerusalem during those1260 days.No, initially I was just responding to the original post on who the 2 witnesses were. Everything else relates to that. Identifying 1 of the 2 witnesses through scripture. By pointing out unfulfilled prophecies and events wherein we can see that these messages were given to Zerubbabel. Messages in Zechariah 4 and Haggai 2, with unfulfilled events back then, were not to the Zerubbabel of that time period. As Zechariah 3:8 says Joshua and his friends (Zerubbabel and others) represent a sign of others to come in the future. There will be another Zerubbabel who will do not physical but spiritual building
Ephesians 2:20-22
ExactlyBut we already know,Christ builds the temple of God.That much has been clear for nearly 2000 years now.
exactly! But it’s not exclusive to Christ aloneBut we already know,Christ builds the temple of God.That much has been clear for nearly 2000 years now.
You lost me there. the hint to the identity of the 2 is found in Revelation 11:4. That is what the original post was about. Revelation 11:4 is a reference back to Zechariah 4I really don't think anyone takes into consideration the armed forces of the king of the north will be occupying Jerusalem during those1260 days.
These two verses should remain together at all times and never separated.
Revelation 11
2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
You lost me there. the hint to the identity of the 2 is found in Revelation 11:4. That is what the original post was about. Revelation 11:4 is a reference back to Zechariah 4
Zechariah 4:2-3
Zechariah 4:13-14
I lose everyone there.
What I try to point out to everyone is.
The armed forces of the north occupy Jerusalem for 42 months before its desolation.
The norths armed forces begin their occupation of Jerusalem in Daniel 11:31
His armed forces will rise up to desecrate the temple fortress and will abolish the daily sacrifice. Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation.
Now there are 1290 days from the time the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is placed which takes place on resurrection day.
The armed forces remain in Jerusalem untill the king of the south attacks them in Daniel 11:40.
The resurrection of the two witnesses takes place the same day as the resurrection in
Daniel 12:2
Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
So for the entire 1260 days the two witnesses occupy Jerusalem,the king of the norths armed forces are also occupying Jerusalem.
Military leaders give oral orders to destroy their enemies.
Fire commands are oral orders issued by leaders to focus and distribute fires as required achieving decisive effects against the enemy. They allow leaders to rapidly and concisely articulate their firing instructions using a standard format (Refer to TC 3-20.31-4 for more information).
This is what comes out of the two witnesses mouths.
Revelation 11
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
Just so you know.Some militaries have servicemen who come in Jesus name.Christians.
are you saying you believe 2 soldiers areI lose everyone there.
What I try to point out to everyone is.
The armed forces of the north occupy Jerusalem for 42 months before its desolation.
The norths armed forces begin their occupation of Jerusalem in Daniel 11:31
His armed forces will rise up to desecrate the temple fortress and will abolish the daily sacrifice. Then they will set up the abomination that causes desolation.
Now there are 1290 days from the time the daily sacrifice is abolished and the abomination of desolation is placed which takes place on resurrection day.
The armed forces remain in Jerusalem untill the king of the south attacks them in Daniel 11:40.
The resurrection of the two witnesses takes place the same day as the resurrection in
Daniel 12:2
Multitudes who sleep in the dust of the earth will awake: some to everlasting life, others to shame and everlasting contempt.
So for the entire 1260 days the two witnesses occupy Jerusalem,the king of the norths armed forces are also occupying Jerusalem.
Military leaders give oral orders to destroy their enemies.
Fire commands are oral orders issued by leaders to focus and distribute fires as required achieving decisive effects against the enemy. They allow leaders to rapidly and concisely articulate their firing instructions using a standard format (Refer to TC 3-20.31-4 for more information).
This is what comes out of the two witnesses mouths.
Revelation 11
5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
Just so you know.Some militaries have servicemen who come in Jesus name.Christians.
I said they occupy Jerusalem at the same time as the armed forces of the north.are you saying you believe 2 soldiers are
The 2 anointed olive branches who stand before the Lord of all the earth?
Zechariah 4:14
Do you agree or disagree that Revelation 11:4, which gives a symbolic description of them is a reference back to Zechariah 4?I said they occupy Jerusalem at the same time as the armed forces of the north.
And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
Fire commands are oral orders issued by leaders to focus and distribute fires as required achieving decisive effects against the enemy. They allow leaders to rapidly and concisely articulate their firing instructions using a standard format (Refer to TC 3-20.31-4 for more information).
Can they be in the millitary?
Yes they can.
70 percent of US military claim to be Christian.Though I'm not sure of all of NATO.
Could ,I've looked at it long ago but never settled on anything.I spent more time trying to understand Daniel 11 during that time.Do you agree or disagree that Revelation 11:4, which gives a symbolic description of them is a reference back to Zechariah 4?
Zechariah 4:2-3
Zechariah 4:12-14
I understandCould ,I've looked at it long ago but never settled on anything.I spent more time trying to understand Daniel 11 during that time.
I don't spend alot of indepth study these days
I agreeI understand
When you look at Zerubbabel you can find unfulfilled events around his messages from the Lord, in certain prophets writings, post exile prophets.
Do you agree that the Lord has not shaken both the heavens and the earth as it was described in Hebrews 12:25-27? which was written probably around 60-65 AD give or take
I agree and it’s very interesting because that is a quote of Haggai 2:6 (520 Bc) and it still hasn’t occurred yet. Then if that’s the case, neither has Haggai 2:20-23 because both mention the shaking of both the heavens and earth which is unfulfilled as mentioned in Hebrews 12:26
Who are the two witnesses?Enlighten me.
Who are the two witnesses?
1 Corinthians 2:7 and 11
11 What man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of GOD knoweth no man, but the Spirit of GOD.
7 But we speak the wisdom of GOD in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which GOD ordained before the world unto our glory:
THE TWO OLIVE TREES AND THE TWO CANDLESTICKS - ARE TWO WITNESSES
- TWO WITNESSES - Revelation 11:3-4
v.3 - I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they (both) shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.
v.4 - These are the two olive trees(1), and the two candlesticks(2) standing before the GOD of the earth.
TWO CANDLESTICKS - TWO CHURCHES
(1) The Gentile Church/ Gentile believers /true Christians; Body of Christ JESUS
(2) the Jewish Church - Hebrews 12:v.18-29 - Body of Christ JESUS
About this great mystery of GOD revealed in His Word, Paul Apostle gives us a perfect revelation in his marvelous epistle to the Church of Ephesians: Eph. 2:v.11 to 22, from which here goes 2 verses:
...
v.13 - But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off (Gentile peoples-check this revelation in John 10:v.16) are made nigh by the blood of Christ.
v.14 - For He is our peace, who hath made BOTH ONE, and hath broken down the middle wall of partition between us; - ALELUIA!!! -
...
- TWO OLIVE TREES -
The Two Olive Trees are a SOURCE of Oil for the 2 Churches as ab ove commented/ 2 Witnesses
We know that the two WITNESSES are not only 2 candlesticks - two Churches ; The two WITNESSES are ALSO the two OLIVE TREES; - They testify of the Word of GOD, and both Churches will Judge the World;
The two OLIVE TREES are the SOURCE OF OIL, yeah, the SOURCE OF OIL for the TWO candlesticks -the two Churches-, they ARE the Persons of JESUS and of the Holy Spirit, the Paraclete or the Counselor, they both are the TWO OLIVE TREES and the SOURCE of OIL for the two Churches/ two Candlesticks. Zechariah 4:v.12 - What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty (discharging) oil out of themselves? See, by ALLEGORY the two olive trees are the Old and New Testments-two golden pipes empty (discharging) oil out of themselves?
post 28Bible Study - What Makes Us Children Of God?
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Unfortunately your thinking is from a human perspective, not from GOD's perspective. By the way, the letter kills (very terrible-for exemple see Genesis 3), only the Spirit gives life. What matters and prevails is the Word of GOD.So the 2 witnesses 3144 which is translated (A 1 uno witness), that testify clothed in sackcloth for 1260 days. Are killed and their dead bodies 4430 literally corpse or carcass, (never translated any other way), lay in the street. And the people of the earth gaze at their corpses 4430 and make merry because these 2 prophets 4396 (a (1) prophet; a person gifted at expositing divine truth) tormented them so much are eventually caught up into the clouds.
Just doesn’t sound like the old and New Testament to me.
Furthermore, in Romans 11 there are not 2 Churches. There is one tree that is holy and one other that will be judged. As a Gentile, You are either a branch cut out of the “wild olive tree” (unsaved) and grafted into the natural (holy) olive tree upon belief. Or, you remain in the wild olive tree and will be judged accordingly for your unbelief. Only upon believing in the Lord Jesus are you cut out of the wild olive tree and grafted into the holy tree. Trust me, you don’t want to remain on that wild olive tree.
Additionally, 10 out of 13 times in the New Testament the word translated as olive trees in 11:4 is translated as simply “olive” 1636 . 10 out of 13 times, and one of those is not in rev 11:4. but the translators are obviously trying to make a connection to Zechariah 4. And Zechariah 4 is the same way, we don’t know if Zechariah saw only olives and branches, or olive trees with branches. It is translated at the translator’s discretion.
The Spanish Bible almost always translates these as “olives”.
11:4 reina Valera
Estas son las dos olivas, y los dos candeleros que están delante del Dios de la tierra.
And Zechariah 4:3 reina valera Bible
3 Y sobre él dos olivas, la una á la derecha del vaso, y la otra á su izquierda.
In Spanish bibles it is translated as the 2 olives in both revelation 11:4 and Zechariah 4:3
The clear thing is, that revelation 11:4 is a reference back to Zechariah 4.
Can you elaborate onUnfortunately your thinking is from a human perspective, not from GOD's perspective. By the way, the letter kills (very terrible-for exemple see Genesis 3), only the Spirit gives life. What matters and prevails is the Word of GOD.
According the Word of GOD-the Word is GOD-GOD is Spirit, the foolishness of GOD is wiser than men; and the weakness of GOD is stronger than men. In fact, GOD has chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; GOD has chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty; And base things of the world, and things which are despised, has GOD chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are -1 Corinthians 1:25-28.
In fact, in the human conception it is very difficult to understand this strange way of GOD doing His works, and how they are described is even more difficult to interpret them in His language, mainly in His FORMER sealed book of the Apocalypse, with the aggravating factor that the letter kills. Terrible.
What man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of GOD knoweth no man, but the Spirit of GOD. -1 Cor.2:11
The Word is