because you said something does not mean you were right
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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join Hidden in Him and For His Glory for discussions on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/become-a-vessel-of-honor-part-2.112306/
The Jehovah’s Witnesses Teach Jesus is Mighty God
- Thread starter SolaScriptura
- Start date
- Apr 2, 2003
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And if you were to say I am not right doesn't mean I'm wrong. You need to learn to actually engage critically with what others post and give evidence for why you believe something is incorrect. I can guarantee you that the NWT is wrong on John 1:1, as it is elsewhere.
when the world says its one way of which Satan is known to have influence, then its time to wonder, what way would satan want things to go . and sorry but the trinity is a big one for misleading the peoples of the earth . if the bible came right out and said it that would be a different thing . but it does not do that which means its guessed at . please consider 1 Corinthians 15:24
New King James Version
''Then comes the end, when He delivers the kingdom to God the Father, when He puts an end to all rule and all authority and power.''
why would he do that unless his God is greater than himself?
Luke 4:8
King James Bible
''And Jesus answered and said unto him, Get thee behind me, Satan: for it is written, Thou shalt worship the Lord thy God, and him only shalt thou serve.''
then we have to wonder why would Jesus direct all worship to THE God but secretly keeping some of it for himself . that spells description. of which is not even possible. sooo then next thing is to realize is that there is a problem with the understanding of who really is Jesus is . its been stated many ,many times ,Jesus is the SON of God, nothing more nothing less.
- Apr 2, 2003
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Proof-texting will almost always lead to error, as it does here. There is a vast amount that must be taken into account, not just a couple of verses. As I have pointed out time and again, John 1:1-3, 14, 5:18, 8:58, 10:33, 20:28, 1 Cor. 8:6, Phil. 2:5-8, Col. 1:15-17, and Heb. 1:2-3, 10-12 are key.
ah but what happens when the same set of scriptures are used to prove the opposite to the point you are trying to make . John 1:1-3 John 1:1-3 introduces the concept of the Word (Logos) and its relationship to God and creation. It establishes that the Word was with God from the beginning of creation and that through the Word, all things were made.
john 5:18'' For this reason the Jews tried all the more to kill him, because he not only broke the sabbath but he also called God his own father, making himself equal to God.''
it's not that he was/is equal .
it was in their ''perception '', even ignorance of who he proved to be .
- Apr 2, 2003
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No, it establishes that before the beginning began, the Word was already in existence. That is timeless existence; that is why John can confidently say, “without him was not any thing made that was made” (John 1:3b, ESV). If the Word had been made, then that claim is false.
It wasn’t their perception, it is John’s claim. John is the one who is saying that Jesus’s claim to be the Son of the Father was to make himself equal with God. And that is perfectly consistent with all that he has stated in 1:1-18, and is consistent through to the end of his gospel.
please don't put the cart before the horse . it obvious in the reading that the son was something God did cause into being by his own self , completely by him self. after that came the things God wanted done . that's where the son of God steps in to make the things happen the father wanted done .
its the chicken or the egg thing ,ya cant get an egg till you have a chicken . God could not start creating until he had a work force .which by the way is the WORD/Jesus . Shalom
its the chicken or the egg thing ,ya cant get an egg till you have a chicken . God could not start creating until he had a work force .which by the way is the WORD/Jesus . Shalom
- Apr 2, 2003
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You have a very weak god, if he "could not start creating until he had a work force." That means he is not omnipotent and he cannot be the God of the Bible.
Perhaps you should learn to read the Bible more thoroughly:
Job 9:8 who alone stretched out the heavens and trampled the waves of the sea; (ESV)
Psa 33:6 By the word of the LORD the heavens were made, and by the breath of his mouth all their host. (ESV)
Isa 43:10 "You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me. (ESV)
Isa 44:24 Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, who formed you from the womb: "I am the LORD, who made all things, who alone stretched out the heavens, who spread out the earth by myself, (ESV)
It cannot be more clear that God alone created everything that ever came into being. It also cannot be more clear that he is the only God, and that there never would be a god.
You even stated: "God could not start creating until he had a work force .which by the way is the WORD/Jesus." But, what does the NWT say, in Isaiah 44:24?
This is what Jehovah says, your Repurchaser,
Who formed you since you were in the womb:
“I am Jehovah, who made everything.
I stretched out the heavens by myself,
And I spread out the earth.
Who was with me? (NWT)
So, there is a contradiction with what you believe and what the NWT states. But, more than that, we see yet another contradiction in the NWT, which also says in John 1:3:
All things came into existence through him, and apart from him not even one thing came into existence. (NWT)
Not only does that preclude the Word from having ever been created, it totally contradicts what Yahweh himself says. And, as I have pointed out previously, both of those passages contradict the NWT in Col. 1:16-17, where they have purposely and deceptively inserted "other" four times into the English text to change the meaning of what Paul wrote:
because by means of him all other things were created in the heavens and on the earth, the things visible and the things invisible, whether they are thrones or lordships or governments or authorities. All other things have been created through him and for him. 17 Also, he is before all other things, and by means of him all other things were made to exist, (NWT)
But, as I pointed out before, "other" is not in the Greek, as even The Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures proves.
The Watchtower has changed things so much, they don't even realize when they're contradicting themselves. The sooner you start to realize just how much The Watchtower has led you astray, the better. Your salvation is at stake here.
