1 John 1: Against self-justifying doctrine

[Hopeful 2]

Waking in darkness refers to "not walking in love" or "walking in hate".

That pretty much sums up every sin.

It is a warning to born again Christians, so that we learn the priority of walking in love, which includes forgiveness.

Exhortations and admonitions are for our own good, and to be heeded.

Let's agree to draw our understanding from the scriptures and not the doctrine of man.

Good, as God's word won't accommodate more sin.

Here is the context of walking in the light and walking in darkness, that John the Apostle is teaching us by the Spirit -
I will highlight key words and phrases for us to examine and discuss. This way we are not making up definitions to suit our own doctrinal "belief".
But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

• So far we see the scriptures teach us that the blood of Jesus cleanses those who walk in the light, from all sin.

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

Well see now you are accommodating sin, so I now it is unscriptural...and unGodly.
If you would have truthfully said those words were directed at those walking in darkness, you would have been on the right track.

If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say that we have not sinned, we make Him a liar, and His word is not in us.
My little children, these things I write to you, so that you may not sin. And if anyone sins, we have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous. And He Himself is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the whole world. Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.
Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning. Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.
He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. 1 John 1:7 - 2:11
But he who hates his brother is in darkness

All sinners are in darkness, as "the way of the wicked is darkness". (Pro 4:19)

John plainly defines what he means by darkness; One brother in Christ who begins hating another brother in Christ.

More accommodation for sin. Tsk.
Brothers in Christ don't hate anybody.

Here are the first two points I have made in the passage of scripture:

• So far we see the scriptures teach us that the blood of Jesus cleanses those who walk in the light, from all sin.
• John plainly defines what he means by darkness; One brother in Christ who begins hating another brother in Christ.

Every doctrine that accommodates sin is of the devil.
If we walk in the light, we will walk as Christ walked.
If we are not walking as Christ walked, we are in darkness.

 

[Runningman]

If so, the only repentance that was real was the last one.

It is one extreme or the other.
There is no darkness in God.
There is no sin in Christ.
How can we walk in Christ with sin on us ?
We can't.

Your fight is against obedience to God.
There is no progressive sanctification.
It occurs instantly at the application of the Lord's atoning, sanctifying blood.

Paul's hope was that they could be drawn back into the truth.
Their fate if they disobey would be damnation.

No man can address the disobedient as spiritual.
You seem to be unable to detect the sleight from Paul.
If someone called me a babe in Christ, I would be aware of a need to change for the good.

I would rather be carnal, unspiritual, yet a babe "in Christ" than not in Christ.

However, in practice what tends to happen is that people will have new convictions. One of the kinds of prayers that I fully believe God is standing by to answer with an absolute yes is to "please put it in my heart to have the conviction to not sin" and "please send the spirit of Your son to abide in me" and I do believe He will do that.

What happens next? Maybe someone finally got the strength to stop boozing, or perhaps they stopped cussing, or something else. Sure, they didn't immediately repent of everything but they repented of something. I believe a person like that is on the right track as long as they posses the sincere desire to keep working on it and never give up.

I also believe that Jesus didn't teach about sin, repentance, and forgiveness merely as instructional, but also to demonstrate what the Father is like. If we repent when we sin against God He will forgive us even seven times in a day. (Luke 17:3-4)

 

[JLB]

That pretty much sums up every sin.

Walking in darkness is by definition when a Christian no longer walks in love; but allows hate to enter his heart for his brother.

That's the point.

What you try to promote is walking in hate is exclusive to those who are unsaved.

Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning. Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.
He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. 1 John 2:7-11


There is nothing in this passage that pertains to nor addresses the unsaved.

This passage is a warning to born again Christians, to not allow hate to overcome them.



JLB

 

[JLB]

Well see now you are accommodating sin, so I now it is unscriptural...and unGodly.

Please explain how me posting scripture is "accommodating sin" and is "ungodly"?


Makes no sense.

 

[Hopeful 2]

I would rather be carnal, unspiritual, yet a babe "in Christ" than not in Christ.

If you are in Christ, the carnal was destroyed at its immersion into Christ and His death and burial.
Romans 6 gives the details in verses 3-6.
Gal 5:24 gives more details.

However, in practice what tends to happen is that people will have new convictions. One of the kinds of prayers that I fully believe God is standing by to answer with an absolute yes is to "please put it in my heart to have the conviction to not sin" and "please send the spirit of Your son to abide in me" and I do believe He will do that.

If the repentance from sin is true, God will give the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Peter says that in Acts 2:38.

What happens next? Maybe someone finally got the strength to stop boozing, or perhaps they stopped cussing, or something else. Sure, they didn't immediately repent of everything but they repented of something. I believe a person like that is on the right track as long as they posses the sincere desire to keep working on it and never give up.

Our salvation is dependent on our submission to God.
Starting to submit is valueless without completion.

I also believe that Jesus didn't teach about sin, repentance, and forgiveness merely as instructional, but also to demonstrate what the Father is like. If we repent when we sin against God He will forgive us even seven times in a day. (Luke 17:3-4)

If we repent of sin, we won't keep sinning.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Walking in darkness is by definition when a Christian no longer walks in love; but allows hate to enter his heart for his brother.

As Christians don't walk in darkness, your point is moot.
Christians walk in the light, wherein is no sin.

That's the point.

What you try to promote is walking in hate is exclusive to those who are unsaved.

Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning. Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.
He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. 1 John 2:7-11


There is nothing in this passage that pertains to nor addresses the unsaved.

This passage is a warning to born again Christians, to not allow hate to overcome them.



JLB

 

[Hopeful 2]

Please explain how me posting scripture is "accommodating sin" and is "ungodly"?


Makes no sense.

Do you really want me to answer that here ?

 

[JLB]

As Christians don't walk in darkness, your point is moot.

It's not my point it's the Apostle John's point.

Please point out contextually in the passage below, the specific verse or phrase where you believe John has switched from addressing Christians to addressing the unsaved?

He plainly starts out by saying Brethren.

After he establishes that he is addressing Brethren, he continues by using the pronoun you.

Walking in darkness is by definition when a Christian no longer walks in love; but allows hate to enter his heart for his brother.

That's the point.

What you try to promote is walking in hate is exclusive to those who are unsaved.

Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning. Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.
He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. 1 John 2:7-11


There is nothing in this passage that pertains to nor addresses the unsaved.

This passage is a warning to born again Christians, to not allow hate to overcome them.



JLB

 

[JLB]

Do you really want me to answer that here ?

Yes please explain how posting scripture is ungodly.

 

[follower]

Yes please explain how posting scripture is ungodly.

Any time TORAH is used wrongly, to do anything not from God, to harm others, to deceive others, to gain power over others,
whether by publication, posting, or verbally,
it is ungodly use and is already judged.

 

[Hopeful 2]

It's not my point it's the Apostle John's point.

Please point out contextually in the passage below, the specific verse or phrase where you believe John has switched from addressing Christians to addressing the unsaved?

John is writing to the converted of the church...but it is about both saved and unsaved.
And how to tell them apart.
Verses 5, 7, and 9, deal with those who have, or will, start their walk in God.
Verses 6, 8, and 10, deal with those in darkness-sin.

He plainly starts out by saying Brethren.
After he establishes that he is addressing Brethren, he continues by using the pronoun you.

Why do you keep omitting the word IF ?
IF we walk in darkness "x" occurs.
IF we walk in the light "y" occurs.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Yes please explain how posting scripture is ungodly.

It is the misuse of scripture that is ungodly.
By using scrips' addressing those in darkness, and assigning them to those those in the light, you pollute the meaning.

 

[JLB]

John is writing to the converted of the church...but it is about both saved and unsaved.
And how to tell them apart.
Verses 5, 7, and 9, deal with those who have, or will, start their walk in God.
Verses 6, 8, and 10, deal with those in darkness-sin.

Why do you keep omitting the word IF ?
IF we walk in darkness "x" occurs.
IF we walk in the light "y" occurs.

I omit nothing.

Unlike you I posted actual scripture.

Please post the specific verses, actual verses from my post whereby John switches from addressing Christian's to addressing the unsaved.

Copy and paste from the scriptures I quoted.

Starting with the word Brethren, John addresses Christian brothers.

Example:

But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness,...

"He" refers to a Christian who hates his brother in Christ, is in darkness and walks in darkness.

This is a warning to Christians, obviously since unbelievers do not have the ability to walk in the light.

Walking in darkness refers to a Christian hating a brother in Christ (because he has done you wrong in some way)

Walking in darkness is by definition when a Christian no longer walks in love; but allows hate to enter his heart for his brother.

That's the point.

What you try to promote is walking in hate is exclusive to those who are unsaved.

Brethren, I write no new commandment to you, but an old commandment which you have had from the beginning. The old commandment is the word which you heard from the beginning. Again, a new commandment I write to you, which thing is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away, and the true light is already shining.
He who says he is in the light, and hates his brother, is in darkness until now. He who loves his brother abides in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness, and does not know where he is going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. 1 John 2:7-11


There is nothing in this passage that pertains to nor addresses the unsaved.

This passage is a warning to born again Christians, to not allow hate to overcome them.



JLB

 

[Hopeful 2]

I omit nothing.

Unlike you I posted actual scripture.

Please post the specific verses, actual verses from my post whereby John switches from addressing Christian's to addressing the unsaved.

Copy and paste from the scriptures I quoted.

Starting with the word Brethren, John addresses Christian brothers.

Example:

But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness,...

"He" refers to a Christian who hates his brother in Christ, is in darkness and walks in darkness.

This is a warning to Christians, obviously since unbelievers do not have the ability to walk in the light.

Walking in darkness refers to a Christian hating a brother in Christ (because he has done you wrong in some way)

I have supplied all you need.
Christians don't hate.
If they hate, they are not Christians.

 

[JLB]

It is the misuse of scripture that is ungodly.
By using scrips' addressing those in darkness, and assigning them to those those in the light, you pollute the meaning.

Walking in darkness refers, according to the text, is when a Christian begins to hate his brother in Christ for whatever reason.

But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness,...

By saying "His brother" the Holy Spirit through John is referring to two brothers in Christ.

 

[JLB]

I have supplied all you need.
Christians don't hate.
If they hate, they are not Christians.

Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15

Same thing here. The passage is referring to two brothers in Christ; born again Christians.

If they hate they no longer have eternal life remaining in them.

Big difference.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Walking in darkness refers, according to the text, is when a Christian begins to hate his brother in Christ for whatever reason.

But he who hates his brother is in darkness and walks in darkness,...

By saying "His brother" the Holy Spirit through John is referring to two brothers in Christ.

If he is walking in darkness, he isn't a Christian.
"Brother" has more than just one connotation.

 

[Hopeful 2]

Whoever hates his brother is a murderer, and you know that no murderer has eternal life abiding in him. 1 John 3:15

Same thing here. The passage is referring to two brothers in Christ; born again Christians.

If they hate they no longer have eternal life remaining in them.

Big difference.

Are Christians murderers ?
Had they actually been "in Christ", they wouldn't hate.

 

[Josef]

Hey All,
For everything there is a season and a time.

Ecclesiastes 3:1-8 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
A time to weep, and a time to laugh; a time to mourn, and a time to dance;
A time to cast away stones, and a time to gather stones together; a time to embrace, and a time to refrain from embracing;
A time to get, and a time to lose; a time to keep, and a time to cast away;
A time to rend, and a time to sew; a time to keep silence, and a time to speak;
A time to love, and a time to hate; a time of war, and a time of peace.

We all go through these emotions. If you say you don't, you are not being honest.

What is the most important reason we go through them?

Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz

 

[Runningman]

If you are in Christ, the carnal was destroyed at its immersion into Christ and His death and burial.
Romans 6 gives the details in verses 3-6.
Gal 5:24 gives more details.

Jesus didn't die and resurrect in the same way Paul is telling the Romans to die, resurrect, and walk in newness of life. So what Jesus had was a literal death and resurrection, so it doesn't transfer that Paul is telling them to literally die. In verse 10 he says "The death He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life He lives, He lives to God." So when Jesus died it wasn't that he stopped sinning in the same way Paul is telling the Romans they should stop sinning. Jesus wasn't a sinner in the first place so his death and resurrection had nothing to do with that.

The gist of what he's saying is have the mindset of being dead to sin and alive to God. Another way to take what Paul said is that water baptism is required to be resurrected.

If the repentance from sin is true, God will give the gift of the Holy Ghost.
Peter says that in Acts 2:38.

Amen.

Our salvation is dependent on our submission to God.
Starting to submit is valueless without completion.

If we repent of sin, we won't keep sinning.

Well, here's a question for demonstrative purposes. Have you stopped sinning? Even any bad thoughts?