Do I have to be baptised and partake in the eucharist?

[SyrianMariam]

Interact... well there are different ways of interacting.

I'm assuming you regard Catholics as not being Christians, in which case, how do you think they will be converted by having their faith denigrated to no end, LoL?

My other question would be how long do you think you are going to be "interacting" around here if you keep posting like that?

Catholics worship the pagan 'goddess of heaven'...no, obviously they are not Christians.

They believe in 'works'...ritual, idolatry, blood drinking...this they believe will grant them salvation. It is no different from sacrificing oxen to deities.

 

[SyrianMariam]

Interact... well there are different ways of interacting.

I'm assuming you regard Catholics as not being Christians, in which case, how do you think they will be converted by having their faith denigrated to no end, lol?

My other question would be how long do you think you are going to be "interacting" around here if you keep posting like that?

Okay? I'm not going to LIE. I'm not going to be a coward and not speak out against those who pervert my faith.

 

[SyrianMariam]

Which important positions?
1. They believe God has a representative on Earth...the Pope. Christians believe the last 'representative' he had was His own Son.
2. Speaking of God, they believe God, whom is eternal and exists outside of space, time and matter...was Himself begotten. Don't believe me? Google the meaning of 'Theotokos'.
3. Speaking of Mary 'mother of god', they not only blaspheme by suggesting God has a mother, but they grant her the epithet 'Queen of Heaven' (!). Jeremiah 44:15-18 speaks of this Queen of Heaven...she's a pagan goddess. Are you feeling sick yet?
4. They remove the commandment forbiding the worship of idols in their Bibles. Why? Because like pagans, statues are central to their places of worship.
5. They have a pantheon of saints, whom they venerate with statues and other forms of idolatry. They pray to them and claim they 'intercede'. This contradicts John 14:6. Blasphemy.
6. Google 'which saint should I pray to if I am sick'. If these saints are solely to 'intercede' (blasphemy in itself), why are their specific saints to pray to for specific reasons? Why is this different from praying to Nike for victory?
7. Drinking human blood. Satanic.
8. Abusing children. Satanic.
9. Priests believe they have the power to 'forgive sins'. Blasphemy. ONLY Christ can forgive.
10. Indulgences. Not only is money solely material, it is the root of all evil.

But please, tell me why Christians should respect the Roman religion.

Feel free to refute my points.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Okay? I'm not going to LIE. I'm not going to be a coward and not speak out against those who pervert my faith.

Not about being a coward. It's about taking it to the real enemy. You won't convert anyone over to the truth like that, and that's presuming that you are right in everything you are saying.

You win people over by love. I have zero sympathy for demons or the doctrines I see them teaching through others, and I can be as ruthless as they come when it comes to dealing with that. And yes, sometimes people need to be corrected, but you have to do so in the right Spirit... but there is such a thing as correcting others in a Spirit of meekness, and I'm not sure deliberately getting in people's faces is quite the way to go here.

I need to go get something to eat. I'll be back. But my advice would be, if you feel led to "correct" others for their errors around here, you might wanna try doing so a little more tactfully. You are inching your way towards getting the hook, and when that happens you won't be interacting with anyone here anymore unless you start a new identity. And if they catch on, they will scratch you off the list every time they see you coming.

Just a word to the wise.
- H

 

[Hidden In Him]

Feel free to refute my points.

My point is you are heading for the exits, and you might wanna change course before it's too late.

 

[SyrianMariam]

Not about being a coward. It's about taking it to the real enemy. You won't convert anyone over to the truth like that, and that's presuming that you are right in everything you are saying.

You win people over by love. I have zero sympathy for demons or the doctrines I see them teaching through others, and I can be as ruthless as they come when it comes to dealing with that. And yes, sometimes people need to be corrected, but you have to do so in the right Spirit... but there is such a thing as correcting others in a Spirit of meekness, and I'm not sure deliberately getting in people's faces is quite the way to go here.

I need to go get something to eat. I'll be back. But my advice would be, if you feel led to "correct" others for their errors around here, you might wanna try doing so a little more tactfully. You are inching your way towards getting the hook, and when that happens you won't be interacting with anyone here anymore unless you start a new identity. And if they catch on, they will scratch you off the list every time they see you coming.

Just a word to the wise.
- H

Okay H, thank you for taking the time to write that. I will take it into consideration.

 

[Mungo]

Which important positions?
1. They believe God has a representative on Earth...the Pope. Christians believe the last 'representative' he had was His own Son.
2. Speaking of God, they believe God, whom is eternal and exists outside of space, time and matter...was Himself begotten. Don't believe me? Google the meaning of 'Theotokos'.
3. Speaking of Mary 'mother of god', they not only blaspheme by suggesting God has a mother, but they grant her the epithet 'Queen of Heaven' (!). Jeremiah 44:15-18 speaks of this Queen of Heaven...she's a pagan goddess. Are you feeling sick yet?
4. They remove the commandment forbiding the worship of idols in their Bibles. Why? Because like pagans, statues are central to their places of worship.
5. They have a pantheon of saints, whom they venerate with statues and other forms of idolatry. They pray to them and claim they 'intercede'. This contradicts John 14:6. Blasphemy.
6. Google 'which saint should I pray to if I am sick'. If these saints are solely to 'intercede' (blasphemy in itself), why are their specific saints to pray to for specific reasons? Why is this different from praying to Nike for victory?
7. Drinking human blood. Satanic.
8. Abusing children. Satanic.
9. Priests believe they have the power to 'forgive sins'. Blasphemy. ONLY Christ can forgive.
10. Indulgences. Not only is money solely material, it is the root of all evil.

But please, tell me why Christians should respect the Roman religion.

This post is an utter disgrace.
Every line breaks rule 1.4
It's just crude Catholic bashing.

 

[WIP]

I have moved this discussion to the Theology forum.

 

[SyrianMariam]

This post is an utter disgrace.
Every line breaks rule 1.4
It's just crude Catholic bashing.

Try and refute ONE point.

 

[Mungo]

Try and refute ONE point.

Many of your claims have already been answered in the Catholic Forum, and that would be the proper place to discuss them - one at a time.
However your attitude indicates to me that you have no interest in a rational discussion but just trolling.
So I won't waste my time responding here.

 

[GodsGrace]

'You must be initiated into drinking human blood...but this totally isn't a cult ritual, bro'

The blood Jesus speaks of in drinking the wine, which is His blood,
is never referred to as human blood in any of the bible verses, nor is it understood to be that
by those taught by the Apostles, or those that came after them.

Christianity is not a cult.
And if you call yourself a Christian, you should not make that claim.

 

[GodsGrace]

Many of your claims have already been answered in the Catholic Forum, and that would be the proper place to discuss them - one at a time.
However your attitude indicates to me that you have no interest in a rational discussion but just trolling.
So I won't waste my time responding here.

You should discuss it here Mungo.
More persons see it.

 

[Mungo]

You should discuss it here Mungo.
More persons see it.

Is anybody actually following this thread - apart from those that were in it from the beginning?

 

[GodsGrace]

Which important positions?

Your disdain for the CC is obvious.
Perhaps you could try to state what you don't like about it but with a different tone?

So this reply is for everyone reading along.
You've stated many incorrect doctrine...
I'd like to correct them for those that are interested in knowing them.
I'd also like to remind everyone that I'm not Catholic but happen to know Catholic theology.

So here we go...:

1. They believe God has a representative on Earth...the Pope. Christians believe the last 'representative' he had was His own Son.

Jesus was the last revelation from God.
He was not the last representative.
Even YOU are the representative of God.
The Pope is the head of the CC. There is a heirarchy.
As every Protestant church also has,,,even the non-denominational ones.
The Pope, along with the Bishops of the world, make sure that the CC maintains the doctrine it has believed in from the beginning, right after Jesus died and resurrected.

2. Speaking of God, they believe God, whom is eternal and exists outside of space, time and matter...was Himself begotten. Don't believe me? Google the meaning of 'Theotokos'.

Please try to speak in a more serious tone since these are serious topics.
Mary is said to be the Mother of God.
Of course, God Father comes to mind, but God does not have a mother.
So what does this mean?
It means this:
Is Jesus God?
Yes.
And who bore Him?
Mary.
Then Mary must be the mother of God.

If we deny this, we get into theological difficulties,,,,
such as: Who is Jesus anyway?

Better to avoid them.

3. Speaking of Mary 'mother of god', they not only blaspheme by suggesting God has a mother, but they grant her the epithet 'Queen of Heaven' (!). Jeremiah 44:15-18 speaks of this Queen of Heaven...she's a pagan goddess.

If Catholics want to call Mary the Queen of Heaven, it's no skin off anybody's back.
The Word of Faith movement has many weird ideas...maybe we could attack those one day??

And I do believe, as Protestants, that we should hold Mary on a pedestal.
She's the MOTHER OF OUR LORD AND SAVIOR.

Let's have some respect for her.

4. They remove the commandment forbiding the worship of idols in their Bibles. Why? Because like pagans, statues are central to their places of worship.

Maybe you could find out what an idol is. Your car could be your idol.
It's something you WORSHIP.
I don't believe a statue can be worshipped....
It's made of stone or marble or wood.
I think what it REPRESENTS is what is worshipped or venerated.
Saints are not worshipped but venerated.
If you don't care for this idea, you should not venerate them.
Any dead person of yours, however, is also a saint if they died a Christian.

5. They have a pantheon of saints, whom they venerate with statues and other forms of idolatry. They pray to them and claim they 'intercede'. This contradicts John 14:6. Blasphemy.

Are saints alive or dead?
You could pray to them or not for intercession.
And I don't really know what John 14:16 has to do with this....

6. Google 'which saint should I pray to if I am sick'. If these saints are solely to 'intercede' (blasphemy in itself), why are their specific saints to pray to for specific reasons? Why is this different from praying to Nike for victory?

Do you learn everything from google?
How about learning Catholicism from an informed Catholic?
I do believe that would be better.
The rest of your sentence is nonsense.
We try to avoid nonsense in the Theology Forum.

7. Drinking human blood. Satanic.

Does not merit a reply.

8. Abusing children. Satanic.

Yes. Although the church is spotless, those that inhabit it are not.
They are humans and humans make big mistakes, crimes, etc.
You'll get no argument from me.
Although, it must be said that every denomination has problems of this nature.

9. Priests believe they have the power to 'forgive sins'. Blasphemy. ONLY Christ can forgive.

Priests do not forgive sins.
As per John 20:23 they absolve sins. This means that they state that a sin is forgiven OR NOT.
When is a sin not forgiven, or stated as such?
For instance, if a person does not feel sorry.
If you're not sorry for a sin, neither will God forgive you.
Only GOD can forgive sins. Humans only proclaim it.

10. Indulgences. Not only is money solely material, it is the root of all evil.

Indulgences don't cost anything.
Maybe the church took money, criminally by humans, hundreds of years ago,
but this is absolutely not done today.
Apparently, you don't understand what an indulgence is.
(I also don't agree with them, BTW).

But please, tell me why Christians should respect the Roman religion.

You should respect the Catholic Church because if it weren't for the CC,
YOU would not be on this forum as a Christian.

I've spent time responding to your post,
I expect a serious answer.
Thanks.

 

[GodsGrace]

Is anybody actually following this thread - apart from those that were in it from the beginning?

Many persons read threads that don't post.
You could actually check this out.
I always (at least 95% of the time, not always) respond for those reading along,
and not for the actual poster.
However, I have responded to SM...I hope she replies.
She has many misconceptions about Catholicism.

 

[jaybo]

The Catholics do...every week. Else they go to Hell*

*or purgatory?

They eat bread and drink wine, as Jesus said to do. They are symbols of His body and blood. They believe in transubstantiation, but I do not.

 

[jaybo]

Your disdain for the CC is obvious.
Perhaps you could try to state what you don't like about it but with a different tone?

So this reply is for everyone reading along.
You've stated many incorrect doctrine...
I'd like to correct them for those that are interested in knowing them.
I'd also like to remind everyone that I'm not Catholic but happen to know Catholic theology.

So here we go...:


Jesus was the last revelation from God.
He was not the last representative.
Even YOU are the representative of God.
The Pope is the head of the CC. There is a heirarchy.
As every Protestant church also has,,,even the non-denominational ones.
The Pope, along with the Bishops of the world, make sure that the CC maintains the doctrine it has believed in from the beginning, right after Jesus died and resurrected.



Please try to speak in a more serious tone since these are serious topics.
Mary is said to be the Mother of God.
Of course, God Father comes to mind, but God does not have a mother.
So what does this mean?
It means this:
Is Jesus God?
Yes.
And who bore Him?
Mary.
Then Mary must be the mother of God.

If we deny this, we get into theological difficulties,,,,
such as: Who is Jesus anyway?

Better to avoid them.


If Catholics want to call Mary the Queen of Heaven, it's no skin off anybody's back.
The Word of Faith movement has many weird ideas...maybe we could attack those one day??

And I do believe, as Protestants, that we should hold Mary on a pedestal.
She's the MOTHER OF OUR LORD AND SAVIOR.

Let's have some respect for her.



Maybe you could find out what an idol is. Your car could be your idol.
It's something you WORSHIP.
I don't believe a statue can be worshipped....
It's made of stone or marble or wood.
I think what it REPRESENTS is what is worshipped or venerated.
Saints are not worshipped but venerated.
If you don't care for this idea, you should not venerate them.
Any dead person of yours, however, is also a saint if they died a Christian.



Are saints alive or dead?
You could pray to them or not for intercession.
And I don't really know what John 14:16 has to do with this....




Do you learn everything from google?
How about learning Catholicism from an informed Catholic?
I do believe that would be better.
The rest of your sentence is nonsense.
We try to avoid nonsense in the Theology Forum.


Does not merit a reply.


Yes. Although the church is spotless, those that inhabit it are not.
They are humans and humans make big mistakes, crimes, etc.
You'll get no argument from me.
Although, it must be said that every denomination has problems of this nature.


Priests do not forgive sins.
As per John 20:23 they absolve sins. This means that they state that a sin is forgiven OR NOT.
When is a sin not forgiven, or stated as such?
For instance, if a person does not feel sorry.
If you're not sorry for a sin, neither will God forgive you.
Only GOD can forgive sins. Humans only proclaim it.



Indulgences don't cost anything.
Maybe the church took money, criminally by humans, hundreds of years ago,
but this is absolutely not done today.
Apparently, you don't understand what an indulgence is.
(I also don't agree with them, BTW).


You should respect the Catholic Church because if it weren't for the CC,
YOU would not be on this forum as a Christian.

I've spent time responding to your post,
I expect a serious answer.
Thanks.

I think that SyrianMariam is correct in much of what she writes. To dispute her thoughts with Catholic doctrine doesn't mean much.

The Catholic denomination is just one of many. It has its own system of beliefs and rituals, but that doesn't make it more "Christian correct" than other denominations.

Now to address some specific points...

Calling Mary "the queen of heaven" is elevating her to a position that is not scriptural. (So it is "skin off someone's back" because it is heresy). She was chosen by God to give birth to Jesus, but she was a regular person in her behavior. Exalting her to some special status, including praying to her, is not biblical. We are told in the Bible, including by Jesus Himself, to pray to God only. Praying to Mary and "saints" -- all Christians are saints, i.e., sanctified -- is not Biblical.

And your logic that Mary is "the mother of God" is also faulty. You wrote this: "God does not have a mother...then Mary must be the mother of God." Self-contradictory

She was married to Joseph, so does that make Joseph divine? He was, after all, married to the "the mother of God" and was Jesus' father, so he must be "the father of God". Also, they lost track of Jesus for a few days, so what kind of parents were they anyway? And she told Jesus what to do at the wedding at Cana, so was he ordering God around?

Putting Mary "on a pedestal", raising her status above what the Bible says, should not be done. No person should be elevated to an unScriptural status. Why not elevate John the Baptizer, the Apostle Paul, James (Jesus' brother), Peter, a.k.a. Cephas, the "rock" who denied Jesus three times, Isaiah and the other prophets, and others? You can make statues of them, pray to them, invoke their protection, etc., none of which is biblical.

Saying that saints should be "venerated" but not worshiped but it's okay to pray to them for intercession is both unBiblical and unnecessary.

You also wrote, "You should respect the Catholic Church because if it weren't for the CC, YOU would not be on this forum as a Christian" makes no sense. If it weren't for Jesus Christ, nobody would be on this forum. The Catholic denomination is just one of many. There is no mention of the Catholic denomination anywhere in Scripture (nor is there any mention of the Orthodox denomination or the Coptic denomination or any others). The first churches were all Jews (and perhaps a few Gentiles), scattered throughout the Mediterranean region. Claiming anything to the contrary is self-justifying fables.

You can't apply Catholic thinking very far without contradicting Scripture. So which should be believed? Catholic teachings or God's word? To me the answer is obvious.

 

[Mungo]

They eat bread and drink wine, as Jesus said to do. They are symbols of His body and blood. They believe in transubstantiation, but I do not.

I started a thread on Transubstantiation - here: Transubstantiation

 

[jaybo]

Which important positions?
1. They believe God has a representative on Earth...the Pope. Christians believe the last 'representative' he had was His own Son.
2. Speaking of God, they believe God, whom is eternal and exists outside of space, time and matter...was Himself begotten. Don't believe me? Google the meaning of 'Theotokos'.
3. Speaking of Mary 'mother of god', they not only blaspheme by suggesting God has a mother, but they grant her the epithet 'Queen of Heaven' (!). Jeremiah 44:15-18 speaks of this Queen of Heaven...she's a pagan goddess. Are you feeling sick yet?
4. They remove the commandment forbiding the worship of idols in their Bibles. Why? Because like pagans, statues are central to their places of worship.
5. They have a pantheon of saints, whom they venerate with statues and other forms of idolatry. They pray to them and claim they 'intercede'. This contradicts John 14:6. Blasphemy.
6. Google 'which saint should I pray to if I am sick'. If these saints are solely to 'intercede' (blasphemy in itself), why are their specific saints to pray to for specific reasons? Why is this different from praying to Nike for victory?
7. Drinking human blood. Satanic.
8. Abusing children. Satanic.
9. Priests believe they have the power to 'forgive sins'. Blasphemy. ONLY Christ can forgive.
10. Indulgences. Not only is money solely material, it is the root of all evil.

But please, tell me why Christians should respect the Roman religion.

Great post! Thanks!

I agree with all that you wrote, except for #10. The Bible says that "the love of money is the root of all evil", not money itself.

 

[Mungo]

I think that SyrianMariam is correct in much of what she writes. To dispute her thoughts with Catholic doctrine doesn't mean much.

The Catholic denomination is just one of many. It has its own system of beliefs and rituals, but that doesn't make it more "Christian correct" than other denominations.

Now to address some specific points...

Calling Mary "the queen of heaven" is elevating her to a position that is not scriptural. (So it is "skin off someone's back" because it is heresy. She was chosen by God to give birth to Jesus, but she was a regular person in her behavior. Exalting her to some special status, including praying to her, is not biblical. We are told in the Bible, including by Jesus Himself, to pray to God only. Praying to Mary and "saints" -- all Christians are saints, i.e., sanctified -- is not Biblical.

And your logic that Mary is "the mother of God" is also faulty. You wrote this: "God does not have a mother...then Mary must be the mother of God." Self-contradictory

She was married to Joseph, so does that make Joseph divine? He was, after all, married to the "the mother of God" and was Jesus' father, so he must be "the father of God". Also, they lost track of Jesus for a few days, so what kind of parents were they anyway? And she told Jesus what to do at the wedding at Cana, so was he ordering God around?

Putting Mary "on a pedestal", raising her status above what the Bible says, should not be done. No person should be elevated to an unScriptural status. Why not elevate John the Baptizer, the Apostle Paul, James (Jesus' brother), Peter, a.k.a. Cephas, the "rock" who denied Jesus three times, Isaiah and the other prophets, and others? You can make statues of them, pray to them, invoke their protection, etc., none of which is biblical.

Saying that saints should be "venerated" but not worshiped but it's okay to pray to them for intercession is both unBiblical and unnecessary.

You also wrote, "You should respect the Catholic Church because if it weren't for the CC, YOU would not be on this forum as a Christian" makes no sense. If it weren't for Jesus Christ, nobody would be on this forum. The Catholic denomination is just one of many. There is no mention of the Catholic denomination anywhere in Scripture (nor is there any mention of the Orthodox denomination or the Coptic denomination or any others). The first churches were all Jews (and perhaps a few Gentiles), scattered throughout the Mediterranean region. Anything to the contrary is self-justifying fables.

You can't apply Catholic thinking very without contradicting Scripture. So which should be believed? Catholic teachings or God's word? To me the answer is obvious.

We all try to avoid nonsense in the Theology Forum.

There is a thread in the Catholicism Forum on Mary the Mother of God

There is a thread in the Catholicism Forum on Mary Queen of Heaven

There is a thread in the Catholicism Forum on Praying to the Saints in Heaven