Grailhunter's Classroom

[Josef]

Hey All,
There is no reason to be upset Grailhunter. You are a teacher. As a student, if you teach something that makes no sense to me, I have a right to call you on it. The text in John 2 says wedding. Strong's tells me this:

gamos: a wedding
Original Word: γάμος, ου, ὁ
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: gamos
Phonetic Spelling: (gam'-os)
Definition: a wedding
Usage: a marriage, wedding, wedding-ceremony; plur: a wedding-feast.

The word "gamos" occurs 16 times in Scripture.
9 times as marriage; 7 times as wedding. (Ya gotta love Strong's. All done without a computer. What a labor of love.)

So Strong's does not agree with your view.
The commentaries I used called the ceremony a wedding as well.
OK, what about something outside the Bible?
Have you ever heard of the Greek poet Homer? His primary works "The Iliad" and "The Odyssey" are epic poems, and the two oldest known works of Western literature. They were written sometime between 750-650 B.C.
Guess what they both contain. Wedding ceremonies. Peleus and Thetis in the Iliad. Odysseus and Penelope in the Odyssey. I don't have to use the Bible to prove that there were wedding ceremonies in ancient Greece.

So why would you tell me weddings didn't exist, and the book of john was purposely altered when nobody agrees with you? I have given you independent proof that your premise is not correct. You have given no proof that John is altered other than because you say so. It is a tactic of cults to manipulate Scripture: "What is there is not really there." Then the cult manipulates Scripture for their purposes. This is how Jehovah's Witnesses change " . . . The Word was God" to " . . . The Word was a God." That is manipulation that can cost a person their salvation. It all starts with, "It doesn't really say . . . " Am I passionate about the truth? Yeah I am.


"Is Satan a schemer? (Answer: Yes.)
Does Satan tempt us? (Answer: Yes.)
Can he put thoughts in our mind? (Answer: Not normally if the Holy Spirit indwells the believer. It would have to be allowed ala Job as a testing period. I know this first hand. I struggled with sin my whole life. It wasn't Satan. It was my own fleshly desires. I am not proud of it. But it was not Satan. It was me.)

So then how does he tempt us? I would probably need a list for that.
How did he tempt Eve? How did he tempt Adam?" Quote from Grailhunter

How indeed!

Genesis 3:4-5 And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.

A lie "Ye shall not surely die:" mixed with the truth "your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil."

"You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain….
What did Yahweh mean by this? " Quote from Grailhunter
Look up vain in the dictionary and you will have your answer. In short God's name was to be spoken reverently.

"Did He mean that He did not want His name ever pronounced or written in sacred texts? And then forgotten?
Well overall this is how the Jews took it. Does that make any sense? NO.
Did God or Satan remove His name from the scriptures? NO.
Men did it. No we cannot blame this one on the women." Quote from Grailhunter

Have you ever considered that the Jewish scholars took God's name out as an act of reverence? You cannot take God's name in vain if you do not know it.

"But I did say that the marriage in Cana was probably some form of a wedding as we understand it. " Quote from Grailhunter

You spend all this time arguing against it being a wedding. Yet here you concede it was probably a wedding. If we were on debate teams, you just lost. Your argument is not sustainable. By the way, we are not on debate teams. I am not trying to win. I just want you to see the inconsistency of your post.

"Now that you have accused me of manipulating you….Do not ever talk to me again. Because you are tempting me to respond to you in such away that would violate the rules of this forum." Quote from Grailhunter

Look back at my post. I did not accuse you of anything. I asked you a question.

"You are trying to manipulate Scripture to make it say what you need it to. Why? Are you trying to manipulate me?" Quote from me

A simple answer would be no. Your defensive attitude and over-reaction to a simple question is classic Freudian behavior.

I have answered the questions you posed, and did it with joy in my heart. I am not going to treat you the way you have treated me. I will offer you my other cheek should you feel the need.

Keep walking everybody.
May God bless,
Taz

 

[Grailhunter]

So Strong's does not agree with your view.

You are looking at the Greek and they had weddings all the time.
Do you think you can find a wedding ceremony in the scriptures, where a Jewish or Christian couple have a wedding ceremony?
Go for it.
I did not tell you that wedding ceremonies did not exist....Wedding ceremonies come from Pagan customs and Pagan weddings go back for thousands of years.
Today's Christian wedding ceremonies and receptions still have Pagan customs imbedded in them.
The reason for that, is that Christianity adopted them from the Gentile-Christians.
I am sure that the Gentile-Christians were having wedding but still the first documented Christian wedding occcured in the 9th century.
But it was not until the 16th century that the Protestants made a wedding ceremony a requirement to be married.
The Catholics followed suit shortly after that.

So why would you tell me weddings didn't exist, and the book of john was purposely altered when nobody agrees with you?

When did I tell you that John was altered?
Are talking about Cana?
In correct translation.
Again the event at Cana does not tell anything about a ceremony. The story starts at the reception.

In short God's name was to be spoken reverently.

Produce a scripture that says His name was to be spoken.
Today when the Jews write God they spell it G-d.

Look back at my post. I did not accuse you of anything. I asked you a question.

You said.....Are you trying to manipulate me?

You spend all this time arguing against it being a wedding. Yet here you concede it was probably a wedding. If we were on debate teams, you just lost. Your argument is not sustainable. By the way, we are not on debate teams. I am not trying to win. I just want you to see the inconsistency of your post.

We can assume a lot of things. And a lot of people assume a lot of things in their beliefs. And I have already explained the possibilty that it was a Jewish wedding....not that the scriptures say that a wedding ceremony occured. It is ok to speculate just don't say you can prove it.

 

[gordon777]

Hello I am Grailhunter, so says the sign on…LOL I will be conducting a lesson thread here that involves general information as well as addressing the false beliefs that have crept up in Christianity.

I will be addressing false beliefs first because in some ways they are more influential than the scriptures in that a person with a mind full of false beliefs cannot even read the scriptures and understand them because of the preconceived notions that are running around in their heads that act as overriding redirects back to the false beliefs. So I have to deal with false beliefs first before I can expect anyone to learn the truths of Christianity.

Most false beliefs are easy targets to identify because they are words and phrases that are not in the scriptures. And in fact most of the theological words and phrases that are not in the Bible are powerful false beliefs. The problem; These words and phrase are familiar and are near and dear to some. ….and to some….the most important part of Christianity. So unraveling these false beliefs can be shocking and painful to many.

I call my ministry the Johnny Appleseed of Truth. I am not a preacher….too much stress. I am a speaker and I fill in for Sunday school. I call my ministry the Johnny Appleseed of Truth. And that is how I do it….sharing the seeds of Christian truth. But I do it as Christ described…..seeds….
Matthew 13:1-9

My responsibility is to provide the truth so Christians at least have the opportunity to be shown the truth….that ends my responsibility. Unlike a preacher that is concerned with what people believe or if they believe him, I am not involved with that or concerned with that. The seeds do what they do and the acceptance of these truths are between the person(s) and God.

I have done the work and gave it to you for free….from there if Holy Spirit puts it in your heart to be interested you have all the information you need to go look it up yourselves.

If you do not believe me…..No harm no foul….If you do not check it out you simply miss your opportunity to know the Truth. I do not mind answering questions but I do not debate on this forum due to its restrictive rules so take the information and check it out….or don’t….not my concern. I will ignore any attempt to debate.

The first false belief I covered was the word Trinity. It is a pretty long essay and you can find it at….
https://christianforums.net/threads/how-to-defend-the-trinity.87711/page-43

Or go to Apologetics posts 663-667

Hey grailhunter, i just highlighted the thread you mention of defending the trinity, and now it has some answers for you to ponder.

 

[gordon777]

The purpose of faith is belief in the rising of Jesus Christ from the dead, that is the work of faith that God did, which draws us away from this world, of evil thoughts of death, of envy pride, deceit, to stop trusting in our own mind and own tongue, ( fingers on keyboards too) because the roof to the whole world is that the only thing of value ever was what Jesus Christ did for all, and all talkers before Him, or talkers after, show they do not want to save your life, but to take it away from you.

 

[gordon777]

Just the thread name alone is against Christianity, and the forum moderators are not quick to do their role to spot that, or to care maybe.

But, the law was the school master, now faith has come we are no longer under it, as we have one Master, even Jesus Christ.

Matthew 23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

Matthew 23:10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

1 Corinthians 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Galatians 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Hebrews 8:11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

 

[gordon777]

Is anyone on this forum going to show they have the least bit of faith, ( a little strength) or no faith is to be found while I have been posting here.


Revelation 3:8 I know thy works: behold, I have set before thee an open door, and no man can shut it: for thou hast a little strength, and hast kept my word, and hast not denied my name.

 

[Grailhunter]

Just the thread name alone is against Christianity,

How do you figure? I would hate to guess.

But, the law was the school master, now faith has come we are no longer under it, as we have one Master, even Jesus Christ.

Matthew 23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

Matthew 23:10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

1 Corinthians 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Galatians 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Hebrews 8:11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

The rest of the scriptures that you quoted are just out of context.
It can be an assortment of errors in beliefs and attitudes that cause this perspective.

1. The general concept that Christian education is bad.
2. The more general concept that education of any type is bad.
The beliefs that…
Only dumb and uneducated people believe in Christianity????
Only dumb and uneducated people understand Christianity????
What can I say to people that believe that Christian education is wrong or not necessary!?

The Christian Gods, Yahweh, Yeshua, and Holy Ghost are not stupid and do not expect their followers to be stupid. Then on the other hand it does not take a full education to be saved. The early Christians did not have Bibles and only knew so much but still were saved by faith.

The same thing goes for all these denominations. Educated theologians generally do not belong to one denomination because they know how many errors are in their beliefs, instead they focus on the sincere worship in these various denominations and churches. Yes it a responsibility and necessity for Christians to go to church.

You do not have to have perfect understanding to be saved. I fellowship and worship the Lord with several denominations....choosing churches by their spirit and sincere worship.

 

[gordon777]

Yes first answer, Christian education is bad, at this time of the ending of the world, come so any to educate the world.


Matthew 24:11 And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.




The Christian God is weak or foolish in this world, ( we are weak in Him) and the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and God has chosen the foolish things of this world to confound the wise, ( the weak things of the world to confound the mighty)


The natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. ( you have to make yourself a fool to be wise, for the wisdom of this world/its education and educators, are foolishness with God.)

For though Christ was crucified through weakness, yet he lives by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, ( foolish in Him, chosen the things that are weak to confound the mighty) but we shall live with him by the power of God toward you. ( the preaching of the cross is to them that PERISH foolishness, but to us that are saved it is the POWER OF GOD.)



1 Corinthians 1:18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.

1 Corinthians 1:21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.

1 Corinthians 1:23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;

1 Corinthians 1:25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.


1 Corinthians 1:27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

1 Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

1 Corinthians 3:18 Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.
19 For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.
20 And again, The Lord knoweth THE THOUGHTS OF THE WISE, THAT THEY ARE VAIN.

2 Corinthians 13:4 For though he was crucified through weakness, yet he liveth by the power of God. For we also are weak in him, but we shall live with him by the power of God toward you.





God takes the wise in their own craftiness. The Lord knows the thoughts of the WISE, THAT THEY ARE VAIN.



That reveals how in this end of the world those same "wise" ( many false prophet/teachers) come speaking those same great swelling words of vanity. These are murmurers, complainers, mockers in the last times who walk after their own ungodly lusts. ( the context is all the fulfilment of what is testified through the many FALSE "TEACHRS")


2 Peter 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.

2 Peter 2:10 But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.

2 Peter 2:18 For when they speak GREAT SWELLING WORDS OF VANITY, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.



Jude 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh GREAT SWELLING WORDS, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.
17 But, beloved, remember ye the words which were spoken before of the apostles of our Lord Jesus Christ;
18 How that they told you there should be mockers in the last time, who should walk after their own ungodly lusts.



Your other "teaching" that it is a responsibility to go to church, is an unstable explanation, that there are errors in the denominations, yet you claim they are sincere at the same time.

I will just give you scripture for stability. ( this explains also below where wisdom comes from, and it is true the early Christians did not have that bible available until one was printed for everybody, but that is why we have the bible now, to defend against the increase of the false prophet teachers who came into the world at the ending times now.)


James 1:5 If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.
6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
7 For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.
8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.

James 4:8 Draw nigh to God, and he will draw nigh to you. Cleanse your hands, ye sinners; and purify your hearts, ye double minded.

 

[gordon777]

Regarding perfect understanding.

Its a lot of scripture, but it addresses what you claimed, and is better for anyone reading, than your own words you preferred to use.



Luke 1:3 It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus,

1 Corinthians 1:10 Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

1 Corinthians 2:1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.
2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
3 And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.
4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

Ephesians 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:
13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
14 That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive;
15 But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ:
16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.
17 This I say therefore, and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth walk not as other Gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
18 Having the understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God through the ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness of their heart:
19 Who being past feeling have given themselves over unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanness with greediness.


Ephesians 4:20 But ye have not so learned Christ;
21 If so be that ye have heard him, and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus:
22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

 

[gordon777]

Does anyone on the forum expect those good and right words of the Lord God to be accepted, or rejected.

 

[gordon777]

Is the forum only a place for contention, not a place for being likeminded in Christ at all ?


Romans 15:5 Now the God of patience and consolation grant you to be likeminded one toward another according to Christ Jesus:

Philippians 2:2 Fulfil ye my joy, that ye be likeminded, having the same love, being of one accord, of one mind.

 

[Grailhunter]

Yes first answer, Christian education is bad, at this time of the ending of the world, come so any to educate the world.

Christian education is bad.....
Ya know that the Bible says that Solomon was the wisest of men.....and God gave him that wisdom. And the best wisdom comes from the Word of God. So this is what Solomon would bring into this debate.

Proverbs 4:5-10
Acquire wisdom! Acquire understanding!
Do not forget nor turn away from the words of my mouth.
Do not forsake her, and she will guard you;
Love her, and she will watch over you. “The beginning of wisdom is: Acquire wisdom;
And with all your acquiring, get understanding.
Prize her, and she will exalt you;
She will honor you if you embrace her.
She will place on your head a garland of grace;
She will present you with a crown of beauty.
Hear, my son, and accept my sayings
And the years of your life will be many.

What Does the Bible Say About Wisdom?

Bible verses about Wisdom

www.openbible.info

And Christians deserve to know the truth.
The Johnny Appleseed of Truth
Be good and do good

 

[Grailhunter]

Its a lot of scripture, but it addresses what you claimed, and is better for anyone reading, than your own words you preferred to use.

And what was it that you think I claimed?

 

[gordon777]

Christian education is bad.....
Ya know that the Bible says that Solomon was the wisest of men.....and God gave him that wisdom. And the best wisdom comes from the Word of God. So this is what Solomon would bring into this debate.

Proverbs 4:5-10
Acquire wisdom! Acquire understanding!
Do not forget nor turn away from the words of my mouth.
Do not forsake her, and she will guard you;
Love her, and she will watch over you. “The beginning of wisdom is: Acquire wisdom;
And with all your acquiring, get understanding.
Prize her, and she will exalt you;
She will honor you if you embrace her.
She will place on your head a garland of grace;
She will present you with a crown of beauty.
Hear, my son, and accept my sayings
And the years of your life will be many.

What Does the Bible Say About Wisdom?

Bible verses about Wisdom

www.openbible.info

And Christians deserve to know the truth.
The Johnny Appleseed of Truth
Be good and do good

This is the path to wisdom, seeing as you said to bring it.

( The fool speaks out all his mind.. Proverbs 29:11 A fool uttereth all his mind: but a wise man keepeth it in till afterwards.)

Job and his companions required correction, and is corrected by being told there is a spirit in man, and the inspiration of the Almighty gives them understanding, great men are NOT ALWAYS WISE, neither do the aged understand judgment.


Job 32:7 I said, Days should speak, and multitude of years should teach wisdom.
8 But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.
9 Great men are not always wise: neither do the aged understand judgment.





"is what Solomon would bring into this debate.

Proverbs 4:5-10
Acquire wisdom! Acquire understanding!"



Solomon is not Proverbs, but as told in Job 32, it is the inspiration of the Almighty that gives men ( Solomon) understanding.

Forward to chapter 8 if Proverbs, and we see better, that it is wisdom that is crying, understanding that is giving the voice to us, and that is what voice calls to the sons of men.



Proverbs 8:1 Doth not wisdom cry? and understanding put forth her voice?
2 She standeth in the top of high places, by the way in the places of the paths.
3 She crieth at the gates, at the entry of the city, at the coming in at the doors.
4 Unto you, O men, I call; and my voice is to the sons of man.




Now we are getting a little understanding of what Jesus Christ brings to this talk, with grailhunter, ( who is using this profile name for now) it is exactly what wisdom and understanding are, ( they are NOT SOLOMONS) but a branch grew out of the roots of Jesse, and the Spirit of the Lord rested on Him, the Spirit of wisdom and the spirit of understanding, the Spirit of knowledge and the Spirit of the fear of the Lord. ( as told in Job, the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.)



Job 28:28 And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.

Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:
2 And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord;
3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:




Now Solomon was a wise man, but in the end of the life rejected the word of the Lord.

THIS SAME testimony is for ISRAEL, of the wise men ashamed, dismayed, and taken, they have rejected the word of the Lord, AND WHAT WISDOM IS IN THEM ?




1 Kings 11:4 For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the Lord his God, as was the heart of David his father.

Jeremiah 8:9 The wise men are ashamed, they are dismayed and taken: lo, they have rejected the word of the Lord; and what wisdom is in them?





Jesus Christ is witnessed to have the Spirit ( of wisdom and understanding and of the fear of the Lord) descending and remaining on Him.

Jesus testifies what wisdom is, how they came from the other parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon, but to BEHOLD, a GREATER THAN SOLOMON WAS HERE.




John 1:33 And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.


Matthew 12:42 The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.

 

[Grailhunter]

This is the path to wisdom, seeing as you said to bring it.

( The fool speaks out all his mind.. Proverbs 29:11 A fool uttereth all his mind: but a wise man keepeth it in till afterwards.)

Job and his companions required correction, and is corrected by being told there is a spirit in man, and the inspiration of the Almighty gives them understanding, great men are NOT ALWAYS WISE, neither do the aged understand judgment.


Job 32:7 I said, Days should speak, and multitude of years should teach wisdom.
8 But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.
9 Great men are not always wise: neither do the aged understand judgment.





"is what Solomon would bring into this debate.

Proverbs 4:5-10
Acquire wisdom! Acquire understanding!"



Solomon is not Proverbs, but as told in Job 32, it is the inspiration of the Almighty that gives men ( Solomon) understanding.

Forward to chapter 8 if Proverbs, and we see better, that it is wisdom that is crying, understanding that is giving the voice to us, and that is what voice calls to the sons of men.



Proverbs 8:1 Doth not wisdom cry? and understanding put forth her voice?
2 She standeth in the top of high places, by the way in the places of the paths.
3 She crieth at the gates, at the entry of the city, at the coming in at the doors.
4 Unto you, O men, I call; and my voice is to the sons of man.




Now we are getting a little understanding of what Jesus Christ brings to this talk, with grailhunter, ( who is using this profile name for now) it is exactly what wisdom and understanding are, ( they are NOT SOLOMONS) but a branch grew out of the roots of Jesse, and the Spirit of the Lord rested on Him, the Spirit of wisdom and the spirit of understanding, the Spirit of knowledge and the Spirit of the fear of the Lord. ( as told in Job, the fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom.)



Job 28:28 And unto man he said, Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to depart from evil is understanding.

Isaiah 11:1 And there shall come forth a rod out of the stem of Jesse, and a Branch shall grow out of his roots:
2 And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, the spirit of wisdom and understanding, the spirit of counsel and might, the spirit of knowledge and of the fear of the Lord;
3 And shall make him of quick understanding in the fear of the Lord: and he shall not judge after the sight of his eyes, neither reprove after the hearing of his ears:




Now Solomon was a wise man, but in the end of the life rejected the word of the Lord.

THIS SAME testimony is for ISRAEL, of the wise men ashamed, dismayed, and taken, they have rejected the word of the Lord, AND WHAT WISDOM IS IN THEM ?




1 Kings 11:4 For it came to pass, when Solomon was old, that his wives turned away his heart after other gods: and his heart was not perfect with the Lord his God, as was the heart of David his father.

Jeremiah 8:9 The wise men are ashamed, they are dismayed and taken: lo, they have rejected the word of the Lord; and what wisdom is in them?





Jesus Christ is witnessed to have the Spirit ( of wisdom and understanding and of the fear of the Lord) descending and remaining on Him.

Jesus testifies what wisdom is, how they came from the other parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon, but to BEHOLD, a GREATER THAN SOLOMON WAS HERE.




John 1:33 And I knew him not: but he that sent me to baptize with water, the same said unto me, Upon whom thou shalt see the Spirit descending, and remaining on him, the same is he which baptizeth with the Holy Ghost.


Matthew 12:42 The queen of the south shall rise up in the judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: for she came from the uttermost parts of the earth to hear the wisdom of Solomon; and, behold, a greater than Solomon is here.

Good scriptures....again what is your point?

 

[GodsGrace]

WOW you say. Alrighty then!
What can we agree on?

Is Satan a schemer?
Does Satan tempt us?
Can he put thoughts in our mind?

So then how does he tempt us? I would probably need a list for that.
How did he tempt Eve? How did he tempt Adam?

Sometimes Satan will reason with us and make us think we should do something because it is good….when it is not.

As far as removing God’s name from the scriptures and hiding the name of Christ, the Jews were already in Satan’s wheelhouse. You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain, for the LORD will not leave him unpunished who takes His name in vain.
Exodus 20:7

The scriptures were originally written with God’s name in them over 6,000 times. As time went on the Hebrews/Israelites/Jews came to think that God’s name was to Holy to be pronounced out load or be written. (We do not know if they ever said his name out load.)
“came to think” The question is, did they have a little help with that? Did Satan reason that with them? Who knows for sure? But do you think Satan would want a book with God’s name in it over 6,000 times covering the earth? And that is not counting the New Testament…. Yahweh and Yeshua.

You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain….
What did Yahweh mean by this? Did He mean that He did not want His name ever pronounced or written in sacred texts? And then forgotten?
Well overall this is how the Jews took it. Does that make any sense? NO.
Did God or Satan remove His name from the scriptures? NO.
Men did it. No we cannot blame this one on the women.
Did Satan use their reverence of God to do away with God’s name? I do think that is a possibility.

It was men that put the ink to the paper and it was men that had custody of the scriptures and it was men that made changes to the scripture as they moved along in history. And as we see Yahweh did not stop them.

When it came time to write the New Testament….most of them were Jews.
So they already had this “God’s name is to Holy to be pronounce or be written in Holy texts” thing going on in their heads. So they did not use Christ’s name in the New Testament. Again is Satan working this? Maybe..maybe not. Was he doing a dance of joy!? Probably.

But I am afraid that as the serpent deceived Eve by his cunning, your thoughts will be led astray from a sincere and pure devotion to Christ.
2nd Corinthians 7:3

And no wonder, for even Satan disguises himself as an angel of light. So it is no surprise if his servants, also, disguise themselves as servants of righteousness. Their end will correspond to their deeds.
2nd Corinthians 11:14-15

But he turned and said to Peter, “Get behind me, Satan! You are a hindrance to me. For you are not setting your mind on the things of God, but on the things of man.”
Matthew 16:23

Put on the whole armor of God, that you may be able to stand against the schemes of the devil.
Ephesians 6:11

https://www.openbible.info/topics/tricks_of_the_devil

https://www.openbible.info/topics/schemes_of_the_devil




I’m thinking you can figure this out.

First off the event as Cana was not called a marriage ceremony or a wedding ceremony. No ceremony in the scriptures for Cana or any marriage.

Through all of the biblical era and most of history marriages were formed by a couple joining....

What is the difference between two people forming a marriage by having sex…and people gathering in a church and the couple standing in front of a preacher with their family and friends watching and saying vows of commitment and being pronounced husband and wife?…and I am thinking you know how the rest of this goes including the wedding reception.

And the requirement for this did not happen until 16th century when the Protestants made it a requirement to have a wedding ceremony to be married.

As far as the Marriage in Cana, the words wed or wedding do not appear in the scriptures and that includes the event of a ceremony and vows in the scriptures. No ceremonies in the scriptures.

But I did say that the marriage in Cana was probably some form of a wedding as we understand it. But still no actual representation of a wedding ceremony there.
The event in the scriptures for Cana was about the reception not the actual wedding ceremony.

Now that you have accused me of manipulating you….Do not ever talk to me again. Because you are tempting me to respond to you in such away that would violate the rules of this forum.

Great post and reply.
But you won't continue?


Your choice.

 

[Grailhunter]

Great post and reply.
But you won't continue?


Your choice.

More to come. Just giving them time to digest this.

 

[GodsGrace]

Just the thread name alone is against Christianity, and the forum moderators are not quick to do their role to spot that, or to care maybe.

But, the law was the school master, now faith has come we are no longer under it, as we have one Master, even Jesus Christ.

Matthew 23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, even Christ; and all ye are brethren.

Matthew 23:10 Neither be ye called masters: for one is your Master, even Christ.
11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.

1 Corinthians 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

Galatians 3:24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

Galatians 3:25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster.

Hebrews 8:11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

We noticed Gordon.
Be careful....

 

[donadams]

Mother of God!

False doctrine or the teaching of the apostles acts 2:42?

Thanks

 

[Grailhunter]

Mother of God!

False doctrine or the teaching of the apostles acts 2:42?

Thanks

Yeshua is a God and Miriam was His mother....sooo mother of a God or mother of our God….No matter how you say it some can find offense with it. But Mother of God? Miriam was not Yahweh’s mother….she conceived His child. By the contemporary terms of the culture, she could be called the consort of Yahweh.

The bigger question….Christ could have just appeared on a mountain top, so why was it important for a God to be born of a woman? In this case, Yeshua was to be of the blood line of David….even so it could not be through Joseph so it had to be through His mother. Depending on how you look at it…Miriam was the mother of our God and or the bloodline of David that produced a God.

The broader thought takes the Trinity to a quad and the reason for a quad. And this is a thought….a speculative quesion….when Yeshua ascended to His Father….did He bring His human side with Him to the Godhead? If so what affect did that have? The precise-ness of Christian understanding can only go to the point of the facts available….(Beliefs, Truths, Facts….which is another topic) Speculation is fine…. It is a good thing as long as you define it as such. Proposing unanswered questions is fine because it is good that people understand that some questions will have to wait until we get to Heaven to know.

Then again on the topic of the Virgin Mary. The Virgin Mary is a phrase that does not occur in the scriptures and there no reason to assume she remained a virgin after concieving Yeshua or after she delivered Yeshua or that she did not have children with Joesph. Of course she was a virgin before she conceived.

This whole keeping her a virgin thing was about the developing belief that sex and women were dirty, nasty, and sinful. So Yeshua could only touch her womb….no sex and no genitals involved. So ultimately they had Yeshua being “beamed” in to her womb and then “beamed” out of her womb and she remained a virgin. No scriptural reason to believe any of that.