How can the trinity be one God?

[MarkT]

"The Word was God" answers the question of who is the Word, and also the question of who is God. It does not address the question of who spoke the Word; rather, it tells us this particular Word exists eternally without beginning. "The word" here is logos, which was a highly developed concept before anything in the NT was ever written. Treating that whole concept the way you are, with nothing but a modern English vernacular usage of "the word," misses the entire point of what Scripture is telling us.

This is correctable! Here's a little linky to get you started, and I expect others here can point you to resources that go MUCH more in-depth:

https://www.britannica.com/topic/logos

It's understood that the Word came from the mouth of God. You can disagree. But it's my understanding that the Word was spoken.

 

[Essenaut]

We were made in the image of the trinity. Body, soul, and spirit.

I am my body, soul, and spirit, but my sprit is not my body, vice versa, and etc.

 

[Jim Parker]

It's understood that the Word came from the mouth of God. You can disagree. But it's my understanding that the Word was spoken.

OK - couple of things:
1. God is not a human being with a mouth out of which He speaks words.

2. The word translated "Word" in an English language Bible is the Greek word "Logos" which does NOT mean "a spoken word." It's meaning includes the concept of the wisdom and power by which all things are created and are sustained.

Unfortunately, we do not have a modern English word with an equivalent meaning and "Word" has been used for the past 500 years so it's not easy to change even if we had one.

I reiterate Razeontherock's direction: "Here's a little linky to get you started, and I expect others here can point you to resources that go MUCH more in-depth:
https://www.britannica.com/topic/logos "

 

[MarkT]

OK - couple of things:
1. God is not a human being with a mouth out of which He speaks words.

2. The word translated "Word" in an English language Bible is the Greek word "Logos" which does NOT mean "a spoken word." It's meaning includes the concept of the wisdom and power by which all things are created and are sustained.

Unfortunately, we do not have a modern English word with an equivalent meaning and "Word" has been used for the past 500 years so it's not easy to change even if we had one.

I reiterate Razeontherock's direction: "Here's a little linky to get you started, and I expect others here can point you to resources that go MUCH more in-depth:
https://www.britannica.com/topic/logos "

I know he is not a man, but we are made in his image.

3 And the tempter came and said to him, “If you are the Son of God, command these stones to become loaves of bread.” 4 But he answered, “It is written,

‘Man shall not live by bread alone,
but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’” Matthew 4:3-4 RSV

So apparently God does have a mouth.

By the word of the Lord the heavens were made,
and all their host by the breath of his mouth.
7 He gathered the waters of the sea as in a bottle;
he put the deeps in storehouses.
8 Let all the earth fear the Lord,
let all the inhabitants of the world stand in awe of him!
9 For he spoke, and it came to be;
he commanded, and it stood forth. Ps. 33:6-9

I'm using the RSV which says Word. I don't believe John is preaching an empty philosophy. To that Paul writes,
Colossians 2:8
See to it that no one makes a prey of you by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the universe, and not according to Christ.

The Encyclopaedia Britannica is not my authority.

 

[JLB]

I know he is not a man, but we are made in his image.

3 And the tempter came and said to him, “If you are the Son of God, command these stones to become loaves of bread.” 4 But he answered, “It is written,

‘Man shall not live by bread alone,
but by every word that proceeds from the mouth of God.’” Matthew 4:3-4 RSV

So apparently God does have a mouth.

By the word of the Lord the heavens were made,
and all their host by the breath of his mouth.
7 He gathered the waters of the sea as in a bottle;
he put the deeps in storehouses.
8 Let all the earth fear the Lord,
let all the inhabitants of the world stand in awe of him!
9 For he spoke, and it came to be;
he commanded, and it stood forth. Ps. 33:6-9

I'm using the RSV which says Word. I don't believe John is preaching an empty philosophy. To that Paul writes,
Colossians 2:8
See to it that no one makes a prey of you by philosophy and empty deceit, according to human tradition, according to the elemental spirits of the universe, and not according to Christ.

The Encyclopaedia Britannica is not my authority.

Do you confess Jesus Christ the only begotten Son of God the Father to be:

1. The Lord God
2. A man: a created being

JLB

 

[Jim Parker]

I know he is not a man, but we are made in his image.

And.......???

I'm using the RSV which says Word. I don't believe John is preaching an empty philosophy.

It has nothing to do with "empty philosophy."
It has to do with the meaning of words in the original language and in the context of the culture in which those words are used and understood.
[edited]

 

[MarkT]

And.......???

It has nothing to do with "empty philosophy."
It has to do with the meaning of words in the original language and in the context of the culture in which those words are used and understood.

You're joking, right?

Jim

Once you start retranslating the Bible, where does it end?

 

[chessman]

Once you start retranslating the Bible, where does it end?

Do you prefer the Revised Standard Version (RSV)?

re·vise
rəˈvīz/Submit
verb
past tense: revised; past participle: revised
1.
reconsider and alter (something) in the light of further evidence

 

[MarkT]

Do you prefer the Revised Standard Version (RSV)?

re·vise
rəˈvīz/Submit
verb
past tense: revised; past participle: revised
1.
reconsider and alter (something) in the light of further evidence

Good point. But the RSV is not a new translation. "The Word" is even used in the preface. If you have some new evidence that the Word was not spoken, you should take it up with the RSV Bible Committee.

The Revised Standard Version Bible seeks to preserve all that is best in the English Bible as it has been known and used through the years. It is intended for use in public and private worship, not merely for reading and instruction. We have resisted the temptation to use phrases that are merely current usage, and have sought to put the message of the Bible in simple, enduring words that are worthy to stand in the great Tyndale-King James tradition. We are glad to say, with the King James translators: “Truly (good Christian Reader) we never thought from the beginning, that we should need to make a new Translation, nor yet to make of a bad one a good one ... but to make a good one better.”

The Bible is more than a historical document to be preserved. And it is more than a classic of English literature to be cherished and admired. It is a record of God’s dealing with men, of God’s revelation of Himself and His will. It records the life and work of Him in whom the Word of God became flesh and dwelt among men. The Bible carries its full message, not to those who regard it simply as a heritage of the past or praise its literary style, but to those who read it that they may discern and understand God’s Word to men. That Word must not be disguised in phrases that are no longer clear, or hidden under words that have changed or lost their meaning. It must stand forth in language that is direct and plain and meaningful to people today. It is our hope and our earnest prayer that this Revised Standard Version of the Bible may be used by God to speak to men in these momentous times, and to help them to understand and believe and obey his Word.

 

[chessman]

But the RSV is not a new translation.

It’s publication came more than 1800 years after John’s Gospel was written. More than 300 years after the KJV was written.

The Word" is even used in the preface.

Yes, indeed calling Him “God’s Word”:

to those who read it that they may discern and understand God’s Word

As does John:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God;​

John 1:1-2 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=John 1:1-2&version=RSV

As does the Trinity doctrine.

 

[LovethroughDove]

Your words come from you, but I wouldn't say they are you. "The Word was God" answers the question, Who spoke the Word?

I agree with you on this. Your words aren't literally you, but they come from the deep recesses of your heart. And, you can see my heart from my words...........so they reflect myself. I do see Jesus as God, but not the Father, but they are One like you stated.

 

[Jim Parker]

Once you start retranslating the Bible, where does it end?

Specifically identify the "re-translation" please.

 

[stovebolts]

I agree with you on this. Your words aren't literally you, but they come from the deep recesses of your heart. And, you can see my heart from my words...........so they reflect myself. I do see Jesus as God, but not the Father, but they are One like you stated.

Yes, I agree.
The question really is, who is God? Isnt that what we are really talking about? Within Trinity, God is God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.
These three are one, in perfect unity and harmony.
Adam was not greater than Eve, they were one (echad). In the same way, the Trinity is also one ( echad). This word echad does not represent a numerical value, but rather part of a whole. To say one is greater, is also to say one is lesser. That is akin to saying one is over another and this always leads to rivelry.
God is Love, and where there is perfect love, there is perfect harmony. Within this love, there is no chance for rivalry because love drives out fear, and fear only occurs where one is above another, and that's not unity, instead, we call that uniformity. It's not harmony.

 

[MarkT]

Do you confess Jesus Christ the only begotten Son of God the Father to be:

1. The Lord God
2. A man: a created being

JLB

The Lord God gave him the throne.

Luke 1:32
He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David,

Jesus said he was the Son of the living God. Did he say he was the living God? No. Was he the Son of the Most High? Yes. Was he the Most High? No. He said, "the Father is greater than I". John 14:28

He said God was his Father. Did he say he was the Father? No. He said the Father sent him.

Who is John talking about when he says, "that God sent his only Son into the world, so that we might live through him? Then he says, "And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son as the Savior of the world."1 John 4:9 and 1 John 4:14

 

[chessman]

Luke 1:32
He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David

A fulfilling of ... you guessed it ... the name of God:

I will exalt you, my God, O king, and I will bless your name forever and ever. Every day I will bless you and praise your name forever and ever. Your kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, and your dominion endures throughout all generations.​

Psalm 145:1-2,13 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Psalm 145:1-2,13&version=LEB

 

[JLB]

The Lord God gave him the throne.

Luke 1:32
He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High; and the Lord God will give to him the throne of his father David,

Jesus said he was the Son of the living God. Did he say he was the living God? No. Was he the Son of the Most High? Yes. Was he the Most High? No. He said, "the Father is greater than I". John 14:28

He said God was his Father. Did he say he was the Father? No. He said the Father sent him.

Who is John talking about when he says, "that God sent his only Son into the world, so that we might live through him? Then he says, "And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son as the Savior of the world."1 John 4:9 and 1 John 4:14

Do you confess Jesus Christ the only begotten Son of God the Father to be:

• The Lord God
• A man: a created being

JLB

 

[MarkT]

Do you confess Jesus Christ the only begotten Son of God the Father to be:

• The Lord God
• A man: a created being

JLB

A man.
Acts 13:37-39 Revised Standard Version (RSV)
37 but he whom God raised up saw no corruption. 38 Let it be known to you therefore, brethren, that through this man forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you, 39 and by him every one that believes is freed from everything from which you could not be freed by the law of Moses.

He was also the Son of God.

 

[JLB]

A man.
Acts 13:37-39 Revised Standard Version (RSV)
37 but he whom God raised up saw no corruption. 38 Let it be known to you therefore, brethren, that through this man forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you, 39 and by him every one that believes is freed from everything from which you could not be freed by the law of Moses.

Of course Jesus Christ “became” flesh to take on our sins.

However He is the Lord God who became flesh.

The question asked if you believe He was a man: a created being

IOW is that all you believe He is, a man?


I believe He is the Lord God who became flesh.


Do you believe the Spirit of Christ is a human spirit or the Spirit of the Lord God?




JLB

 

[MarkT]

Of course Jesus Christ “became” flesh to take on our sins.

However He is the Lord God who became flesh.

The question asked if you believe He was a man: a created being

IOW is that all you believe He is, a man?


I believe He is the Lord God who became flesh.


Do you believe the Spirit of Christ is a human spirit or the Spirit of the Lord God?




JLB

Now you're trying to squirm out of it.

You gave me two choices that I had to confess one or the other. Who do you think you are? Are you running an Inquisition?

 

[JLB]

Now you're trying to squirm out of it.

You gave me two choices that I had to confess one or the other.

Again we all know Jesus Christ became a man, that He became flesh.

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we beheld His glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father, full of grace and truth. John 1:1,14


For Him to have blood to shed for our sins, He had to become flesh.

For Him and His Apostles to declare He is the Lord God our Savior, is serious and I would encourage you to continue to pray and study this doctrine.

Who do you think you are? Are you running an Inquisition?

You are not required to answer, you can just say, I don’t know, I’m still studying all the facts.

Everyone here is for you.

I have seen many here give you many scriptures to help you see the truth, and to be honest with you, It doesn’t seem to be getting through.

Believing Jesus was just a man that did some things is what many religions believe.



JLB