I know what it means.
Do you understand this?
Matthew 25:46 (RSV)
46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
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How does C.I and E.C.T affect the Gospel?
- Thread starter jeff77
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I know what it means.
Do you understand this?
Matthew 25:46 (RSV)
46 And they will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.”
“The former things I declared of old,
they went forth from my mouth and I made them known;
then suddenly I did them and they came to pass.
4 Because I know that you are obstinate,
and your neck is an iron sinew
and your forehead brass,
5 I declared them to you from of old,
before they came to pass I announced them to you,
lest you should say, ‘My idol did them,
my graven image and my molten image commanded them.’
6 “You have heard; now see all this;
and will you not declare it?
From this time forth I make you hear new things,
hidden things which you have not known.
7 They are created now, not long ago;
before today you have never heard of them,
lest you should say, ‘Behold, I knew them.’
8 You have never heard, you have never known,
from of old your ear has not been opened.
For I knew that you would deal very treacherously,
and that from birth you were called a rebel.
9 “For my name’s sake I defer my anger,
for the sake of my praise I restrain it for you,
that I may not cut you off.
10 Behold, I have refined you, but not like silver;
I have tried you in the furnace of affliction.
11 For my own sake, for my own sake, I do it,
for how should my name be profaned?
My glory I will not give to another.
12 “Hearken to me, O Jacob,
and Israel, whom I called!
I am He, I am the first,
and I am the last.
13 My hand laid the foundation of the earth,
and my right hand spread out the heavens;
when I call to them,
they stand forth together.
14 “Assemble, all of you, and hear!
who among them has declared these things?
The Lord loves him;
he shall perform his purpose on Babylon,
and his arm shall be against the Chalde′ans.
15 I, even I, have spoken and called him,
I have brought him, and he will prosper in his way.
16 Draw near to me, hear this:
from the beginning I have not spoken in secret,
from the time it came to be I have been there.”
And now the Lord God has sent me and his Spirit.
17 Thus says the Lord,
your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel:
“I am the Lord your God,
who teaches you to profit,
who leads you in the way you should go.
18 O that you had hearkened to my commandments!
Then your peace would have been like a river,
and your righteousness like the waves of the sea;
19 your offspring would have been like the sand,
and your descendants like its grains;
their name would never be cut off
or destroyed from before me.”
20 Go forth from Babylon, flee from Chalde′a,
declare this with a shout of joy, proclaim it,
send it forth to the end of the earth;
say, “The Lord has redeemed his servant Jacob!”
I hope this is enlightening.
they went forth from my mouth and I made them known;
then suddenly I did them and they came to pass.
4 Because I know that you are obstinate,
and your neck is an iron sinew
and your forehead brass,
5 I declared them to you from of old,
before they came to pass I announced them to you,
lest you should say, ‘My idol did them,
my graven image and my molten image commanded them.’
6 “You have heard; now see all this;
and will you not declare it?
From this time forth I make you hear new things,
hidden things which you have not known.
7 They are created now, not long ago;
before today you have never heard of them,
lest you should say, ‘Behold, I knew them.’
8 You have never heard, you have never known,
from of old your ear has not been opened.
For I knew that you would deal very treacherously,
and that from birth you were called a rebel.
9 “For my name’s sake I defer my anger,
for the sake of my praise I restrain it for you,
that I may not cut you off.
10 Behold, I have refined you, but not like silver;
I have tried you in the furnace of affliction.
11 For my own sake, for my own sake, I do it,
for how should my name be profaned?
My glory I will not give to another.
12 “Hearken to me, O Jacob,
and Israel, whom I called!
I am He, I am the first,
and I am the last.
13 My hand laid the foundation of the earth,
and my right hand spread out the heavens;
when I call to them,
they stand forth together.
14 “Assemble, all of you, and hear!
who among them has declared these things?
The Lord loves him;
he shall perform his purpose on Babylon,
and his arm shall be against the Chalde′ans.
15 I, even I, have spoken and called him,
I have brought him, and he will prosper in his way.
16 Draw near to me, hear this:
from the beginning I have not spoken in secret,
from the time it came to be I have been there.”
And now the Lord God has sent me and his Spirit.
17 Thus says the Lord,
your Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel:
“I am the Lord your God,
who teaches you to profit,
who leads you in the way you should go.
18 O that you had hearkened to my commandments!
Then your peace would have been like a river,
and your righteousness like the waves of the sea;
19 your offspring would have been like the sand,
and your descendants like its grains;
their name would never be cut off
or destroyed from before me.”
20 Go forth from Babylon, flee from Chalde′a,
declare this with a shout of joy, proclaim it,
send it forth to the end of the earth;
say, “The Lord has redeemed his servant Jacob!”
I hope this is enlightening.
Last edited:
To get around the problem of the English Bibles translating Greek words into "eternal," "forever," and forevermore" when describing fire (Matt. 18:8) or torment (Rev. 20:10), we should always go to the Greek. The Greek word that is translated into eternal is greek aionion". It comes from the Greek root "aion" meaning "age." This fact combined with the various uses of Greek words derived from the root "aion" is to show that "aionion" does not always mean "eternal" but can refer to a finite period of time.
A
agua.
Guest
Have you ever noticed how full our jails are ? The godless don't care regardless.
Butch5
Member
Yes, as I pointed out "aionios" cannot mean eternal.
Butch5
Member
They are punished, they die.
Their punishment is the second death!
The second death is to be tormented day and night forever and ever in the lake of fire!
The person does not cease to exist in the first death.
The person does not cease to exist in the second death!
The second death is being cast into the lake of fire.
14 Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire. Revelation 20:14-15
JLB
Those are your words with your definition.
The rich man DIED and was buried. In hell he was in torment.
His body was buried.
He [his spirit man] was in torment.
Body was asleep.
Soul/spirit was in torment.
JLB
If destruction meant bring to and end then then why the phrase everlasting destruction.
If interrogators set out to extract information from a terrorist they use various methods of torture, in order to torment the subject to weaken his will.
One method is sleep deprivation together with loud music and LSD in order to destroy their mind and will and bring confusion until they are weaken by exhaustion and will answer the questions and give up information.
The human mind and will is not destroyed so that it ceases to exist, but rather destroyed to the point of submission.
Furthermore there are people in a mental institution whose minds are destroyed and can not hold a coherent thought or conversation, but rather babble on incoherently making no sense.
Their mind is destroyed but still functions in a useless way.
If frightened they still scream and react, by possibly crying.
Their mind is destroyed.
This is just one use of the word destroy as applied to a non-physical substance called the mind.
The brain is physical, the mind is spiritual.
JLB
Butch5
Member
Because the English translation is wrong
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22 And it came to pass , that the beggar died , and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died , and was buried ; 23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. 24 And he cried and said , Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame.
Luke 16:22-24
the rich man also died , and was buried... True or False?
in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments... True or False?
Scripture!
JLB
So which part of the bible do we believe to be true?
Is the bible written to only those who are "qualified" by there degree in Greek or Hebrew?
Who is it that declares a person is "qualified" to understand what is written.
JLB
No, the purpose is to understand Hebrew and Greek. We can better interpret scripture this way.
Hebrew and Greek.
Rev 20:10 does not mean for ever and ever. Go to the Greek translations. English translations added for ever and ever.
God used finite language for finite minds, and that's what human beings are.
Does Gen 1:1 go beyond the finite, no. He says in the beginning creation began. God only allows what he wants us to know.
Butch5
Member
What spirit? Scripture says when man dies the spirit returns to God
Do you understand Hebrew and Greek?
Or do you understand Hebrew and Greek when it's translated?
JLB