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Is believing/faith a work ?

If we say that we are Justified before God or saved by Him because of our act of Faith or believing, then we are saying God saved or justifies us because of our works. Its a work because its acting obedience to a command just as much as its a command to love, notice 1 Jn 3:23

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

To obey a command, injunction is a work ! 30
 
If we say that we are Justified before God or saved by Him because of our act of Faith or believing, then we are saying God saved or justifies us because of our works. Its a work because its acting obedience to a command just as much as its a command to love, notice 1 Jn 3:23

23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

To obey a command, injunction is a work ! 30
Loving your dog isn't work, but taking it for a walk is.
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The word “believe” in the Greek text is “pisteuo” which is a verb denoting a work. If a person could believe in Christ before they are born again by the Spirit, it would mean they have done a work and that would mean they have worked for their salvation which is totally against what the scriptures teach. Ephesians 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Why are you working sir? Why did every Christian recorded in the Bible work? Jesus' brother James explained it rather well don't you think?: Jas 2:18 Yea, a man will say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: show me thy faith apart from [thy] works, and I by my works will show thee [my] faith.
 
Lol, funny, but if you condition your salvation on that activity of yours, it becomes a meritorious work towards your salvation.
Walking the dog is the evidence of my love for him, and good works are the evidence of my faith. But walking the dog is not the cause of my love, but rather it is the evidence of my love, and doing someone's shopping, i.e. works, does not save me, but is the evidence of a changed heart.
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Lol, funny, but if you condition your salvation on that activity of yours, it becomes a meritorious work towards your salvation.
The HUGE mistake Calvinism makes is saying that if there is any conceivable thing that you 'do' to be justified that makes Christianity a works gospel, therefore, justification has to be by nothing at all. But that's not Paul's argument at all! As we see, Paul clearly delineates faith from work in regard to that which justifies, and that which does not. Faith is contrasted and set apart from that which can not justify, not equated with it as Calvinism does. It removes the clear difference between faith and works and moves faith over to the side of the works that can not justify.
 
Why are you working sir? Why did every Christian recorded in the Bible work? Jesus' brother James explained it rather well don't you think?: Jas 2:18 Yea, a man will say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: show me thy faith apart from [thy] works, and I by my works will show thee [my] faith.
Rabbit trail, Read the thread and get in sync please
 
Walking the dog is the evidence of my love for him, and good works are the evidence of my faith. But walking the dog is not the cause of my love, but rather it is the evidence of my love, and doing someone's shopping, i.e. works, does not save me, but is the evidence of a changed heart.
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You apparently dont understand what this thread is about, please begin with the op
 
jethro

, justification has to be by nothing at all.

Nothing at all man does !

Faith is contrasted and set apart from that which can not justify, not equated with it as Calvinism does. It removes the clear difference between faith and works and moves faith over to the side of the works that can not justify.

Already explained, so if you make your faith/believing act the bases/condition as to why God justifies you, then thats works. Scripture doesnt support that, sorry
 
jethro



Nothing at all man does !



Already explained, so if you make your faith/believing act the bases/condition as to why God justifies you, then thats works. Scripture doesnt support that, sorry
No it's not. Believing is EXACTLY the thing you do to be justified. Calvinism calls it a byproduct of justification.
 
The word “believe” in the Greek text is “pisteuo” which is a verb denoting a work. If a person could believe in Christ before they are born again by the Spirit, it would mean they have done a work and that would mean they have worked for their salvation which is totally against what the scriptures teach. Ephesians 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 NOT OF WORKS, LEST ANY MAN SHOULD BOAST.
So. Faith is a gift of God, and not of anything we do.

In other words, we are NOT saved by works.

What is the argument?
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Why are you working sir? Why did every Christian recorded in the Bible work? Jesus' brother James explained it rather well don't you think?: Jas 2:18 Yea, a man will say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: show me thy faith apart from [thy] works, and I by my works will show thee [my] faith.
If you think that KJV noun "works" and the modern English verb "work" are the same, you need a new Bible.
 
You apparently dont understand what this thread is about, please begin with the op
After 2000+ posts and 100+ pages is there really any chance that either:
  1. This TOPIC is still on Topic
  2. There is anything to say about the OP that has not already been said ... more than once ... probably a LOT more than once.
 

Is believing/faith a work ?


Yes, and having Faith is a damnable sin. So if you have faith, you are damned for all eternity ... reprobate ... beyond even the power of the Cross to save.

Are there any other silly questions that need ridicule? :cool
 
The word “believe” in the Greek text is “pisteuo” which is a verb denoting a work. If a person could believe in Christ before they are born again by the Spirit, it would mean they have done a work and that would mean they have worked for their salvation which is totally against what the scriptures teach. Ephesians 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Mark 1:14-15
  • [ESV] Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, proclaiming the gospel of God, and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."
  • [NKJV] Now after John was put in prison, Jesus came to Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel."
  • [NLT] Later on, after John was arrested, Jesus went into Galilee, where he preached God's Good News. "The time promised by God has come at last!" he announced. "The Kingdom of God is near! Repent of your sins and believe the Good News!"
believe = πιστεύετε = verb : present tense : active voice : imperative mood : 2nd person : plural

Thayer's Greek Lexicon:

πιστεύω; imperfect ἐπίστευον; future πιστεύσω; 1 aorist ἐπίστευσα; perfect πεπίστευκα; pluperfect (without augment, cf. Winers Grammar, § 12, 9; (Buttmann, 33 (29))) πεπιστεύκειν (Acts 14:23); passive perfect πεπίστευμαι; 1 aorist ἐπιστεύθην; (πιστός); the Sept. for הֶאֱמִין; in classical Greek from Aeschyl, Sophocles, Euripides, Thucydides down; to believe, i. e.
1. intransitive, to think to be true; to be persuaded of; to credit, place confidence in;​
a. universally: the thing believed being evident from the preceding context, Matthew 24:23,(26); Mark 13:21; 1 Corinthians 11:18; with an accusative of the thing, Acts 13:41 (L T Tr WH ὁ for Rec. ᾧ), to credit, have confidence, followed by ὅτι, Acts 9:26; τίνι, to believe one's words, Mark 16:13; 1 John 4:1; τίνι ὅτι, John 4:21; τῷ ψεύδει, 2 Thessalonians 2:11; περί τίνος, ὅτι, John 9:18.​
b. specifically, in a moral and religious reference, πιστεύειν is used in the N. T. of "the conviction and trust to which a man is impelled by a certain inner and higher prerogative and law of his soul"; thus it stands​

α. absolutely to trust in Jesus or in God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something: Matthew 8:13; Matthew 21:22; Mark 5:36; Mark 9:23; Luke 8:50; John 11:40; followed by ὅτι, Matthew 9:28; Mark 11:23; (Hebrews 11:6); τῷ λόγῳ, ᾧ (ὅν) εἶπεν ὁ Ἰησοῦς, John 4:50.​
β. of the credence given to God's messengers and their words, with a dative of the person or thing: Μωϋσεῖ John 5:46. to the prophets, John 12:38; Acts 24:14; Acts 26:27; Romans 10:16; ἐπί πᾶσιν οἷς ἐλάλησαν οἱ προφῆται, to place reliance on etc. Luke 24:25. to an angel, Luke 1:20; followed by ὅτι, Luke 1:45. to John the Baptist, Matthew 21:25 (26),32; Mark 11:31; Luke 20:5. to Christ's words, John 3:12; John 5:38, 46; John 6:30; John 8:45; John 10:sad37),38{a}; τοῖς ἔργοις of Christ, John 10:38{b}. to the teachings of evangelists and apostles, Acts 8:12; τῇ ἀλήθεια, 2 Thessalonians 2:12; ἐπιστεύθη τό μαρτύριον, the testimony was believed, 2 Thessalonians 1:10 (cf. Winers Grammar, § 39,1 a.; Buttmann, 175 (152)); τῇ γραφή, John 2:22. ἐν τῷ εὐαγγελίῳ, to put faith in the gospel, Mark 1:15 (Buttmann, 174 (151f); cf. Winers Grammar, 213 (200f)) (Ignatius ad Philad. 8, 2 [ET] ((but see Zahn's note); cf. John 3:15 in γ. below)).​

I see nothing to indicate "a work".
 
I just find it interesting that somehow 'faith' snuck over to the works side of the argument of what can and what can not justify.
"Interesting" is one word ... "sad", "pathetic", just plain "wrong" and "lamentable" ... come to mind as some other words to describe it. Can't have people with TOO MUCH faith, now can we? :nonono
 
Mark 1:14-15
  • [ESV] Now after John was arrested, Jesus came into Galilee, proclaiming the gospel of God, and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."
  • [NKJV] Now after John was put in prison, Jesus came to Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe in the gospel."
  • [NLT] Later on, after John was arrested, Jesus went into Galilee, where he preached God's Good News. "The time promised by God has come at last!" he announced. "The Kingdom of God is near! Repent of your sins and believe the Good News!"
believe = πιστεύετε = verb : present tense : active voice : imperative mood : 2nd person : plural

Thayer's Greek Lexicon:

πιστεύω; imperfect ἐπίστευον; future πιστεύσω; 1 aorist ἐπίστευσα; perfect πεπίστευκα; pluperfect (without augment, cf. Winers Grammar, § 12, 9; (Buttmann, 33 (29))) πεπιστεύκειν (Acts 14:23); passive perfect πεπίστευμαι; 1 aorist ἐπιστεύθην; (πιστός); the Sept. for הֶאֱמִין; in classical Greek from Aeschyl, Sophocles, Euripides, Thucydides down; to believe, i. e.
1. intransitive, to think to be true; to be persuaded of; to credit, place confidence in;​
a. universally: the thing believed being evident from the preceding context, Matthew 24:23,(26); Mark 13:21; 1 Corinthians 11:18; with an accusative of the thing, Acts 13:41 (L T Tr WH ὁ for Rec. ᾧ), to credit, have confidence, followed by ὅτι, Acts 9:26; τίνι, to believe one's words, Mark 16:13; 1 John 4:1; τίνι ὅτι, John 4:21; τῷ ψεύδει, 2 Thessalonians 2:11; περί τίνος, ὅτι, John 9:18.​
b. specifically, in a moral and religious reference, πιστεύειν is used in the N. T. of "the conviction and trust to which a man is impelled by a certain inner and higher prerogative and law of his soul"; thus it stands​

α. absolutely to trust in Jesus or in God as able to aid either in obtaining or in doing something: Matthew 8:13; Matthew 21:22; Mark 5:36; Mark 9:23; Luke 8:50; John 11:40; followed by ὅτι, Matthew 9:28; Mark 11:23; (Hebrews 11:6); τῷ λόγῳ, ᾧ (ὅν) εἶπεν ὁ Ἰησοῦς, John 4:50.​
β. of the credence given to God's messengers and their words, with a dative of the person or thing: Μωϋσεῖ John 5:46. to the prophets, John 12:38; Acts 24:14; Acts 26:27; Romans 10:16; ἐπί πᾶσιν οἷς ἐλάλησαν οἱ προφῆται, to place reliance on etc. Luke 24:25. to an angel, Luke 1:20; followed by ὅτι, Luke 1:45. to John the Baptist, Matthew 21:25 (26),32; Mark 11:31; Luke 20:5. to Christ's words, John 3:12; John 5:38, 46; John 6:30; John 8:45; John 10:sad37),38{a}; τοῖς ἔργοις of Christ, John 10:38{b}. to the teachings of evangelists and apostles, Acts 8:12; τῇ ἀλήθεια, 2 Thessalonians 2:12; ἐπιστεύθη τό μαρτύριον, the testimony was believed, 2 Thessalonians 1:10 (cf. Winers Grammar, § 39,1 a.; Buttmann, 175 (152)); τῇ γραφή, John 2:22. ἐν τῷ εὐαγγελίῳ, to put faith in the gospel, Mark 1:15 (Buttmann, 174 (151f); cf. Winers Grammar, 213 (200f)) (Ignatius ad Philad. 8, 2 [ET] ((but see Zahn's note); cf. John 3:15 in γ. below)).​

I see nothing to indicate "a work".
A work is something done, you do, an act or action.
 
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