Is believing/faith a work ?

[Hopeful]

If it was a “one time” thing and done at water baptism, then why the admonition to walk according to the Spirit rather than then flesh.

So we don't grow lazy.

Water Baptism doesn’t crucify your flesh on a daily basis. That is accomplish by us sowing to the Spirit, being filled with the Spirit and walking by the power of the Spirit daily, because our body still contains sin.

Not daily: but if done once, there is no need for further crucifixions of Christ.
It is written..."If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame." (Heb 6:6)

I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. For the flesh lusts against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh; and these are contrary to one another, so that you do not do the things that you wish. Galatians 5:16-17

Walk in the Spirit, and you won't sin.

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts. Romans 6:12

Amen.
Obey and live forever !

It is written..."And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts." (Gal 5:24)
No flesh, no vile affections, no lusts = no sin.

 

[Hopeful]

Is your flesh “in Christ”?

But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.
1 Corinthians 6:17

Yes, it is.
Like Paul writes..."I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me." (Gal 2:20)

Christ will not live in a body with sin in it.

 

[Hopeful]

See the word Love is a noun strongs g26 however that doesnt negate that its also an action done by someone Gal 5:14. So when men argue over such semantics its like Paul says 1 Tim 6:4

He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,

So if a person says they are saved by God because of their act of believing, they are promoting salvation by works, which is condemned in scripture. See salvation is by grace alone apart from works.

Only salvation by the works of the Law was "condemned".

 

[Hopeful]

Hopeful,

How, then, do you answer Rom 8:5-6 (NIV)?

5 Those who live according to the flesh have their minds set on what the flesh desires; but those who live in accordance with the Spirit have their minds set on what the Spirit desires. 6 The mind governed by the flesh is death, but the mind governed by the Spirit is life and peace.​

Can a Christian "live according to the flesh"?
Oz

No, they cannot.

 

[OzSpen]

No, they cannot.

Hopeful,

Sorry to tell you but they DO and have to deal with their sinful behavior before the Lord.

Oz

 

[brightfame52]

Only salvation by the works of the Law was "condemned".

Salvation by any works is condemned, any condition the sinner must perform to get saved, is condemned as salvation by works, and a denial of salvation by grace. If you teach that your act of believing is what caused God to save you, thats condemned as salvation by your works.

 

[JLB]

I can't blame one's skin and bones for a sin, even before rebirth.

Paul says this to baptized born again believers...

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts.
Romans 6:12

 

[JLB]

So we don't grow lazy.

Paul says that we do not experience condemnation from God.

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
Romans 8:1

 

[JLB]

Yes, it is.
Like Paul writes..."I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me." (Gal 2:20)

This of course doesn't say our flesh, our physical body is in Christ.

It does however say that Christ lives in Paul as He does with all of us who are in Christ.

Again our spirit, our inner man is where Christ dwells, not our flesh.

Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day.
2 Corinthians 4:16



But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.
1 Corinthians 6:17




JLB

 

[Hopeful]

Hopeful,

Sorry to tell you but they DO and have to deal with their sinful behavior before the Lord.

Oz

As it is written..."Now we know that God heareth not sinners: but if any man be a worshipper of God, and doeth his will, him he heareth." (John 9:31)
Peter echoes the sentiment..."For the eyes of the Lord are over the righteous, and his ears are open unto their prayers: but the face of the Lord is against them that do evil." (1 Peter 3:12)

Those walking after the flesh, instead of after the Spirit, have no contact with the Lord.

 

[Hopeful]

Salvation by any works is condemned, any condition the sinner must perform to get saved, is condemned as salvation by works, and a denial of salvation by grace. If you teach that your act of believing is what caused God to save you, thats condemned as salvation by your works.

You will have to prove that with scripture, as I have already proven the opposite with Rom 3:27..."Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works?
Nay: but by the law of faith.",
Rom 9:32..."Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;"
Gal 2:16..."Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Gal 3:2..."This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?"
Gal 3:5..."He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?"
Gal 3:10..."For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them."

Find a scripture that denounces repentance from sin, or baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins, or enduring faithfully till the end.

 

[Hopeful]

Paul says this to baptized born again believers...

Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts.
Romans 6:12

Obey and live.
Disobey, and die a second death.

 

[Hopeful]

Paul says that we do not experience condemnation from God.

There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
Romans 8:1

Laziness will reap the condemnation of God.
As your kindly supplied scripture says...those in Christ do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

 

[Hopeful]

This of course doesn't say our flesh, our physical body is in Christ.

No, it doesn't.
It says He is in our "skin and bones".
"...but Christ liveth in me: ..." (Gal 2:20)

It does however say that Christ lives in Paul as He does with all of us who are in Christ.

Yep, in me.

Again our spirit, our inner man is where Christ dwells, not our flesh.

Which is in control?

Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day.
2 Corinthians 4:16

Yes, the vessel grows old and tires out.
But me, inside it, will live forever.

But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.
1 Corinthians 6:17

That makes it impossible to commit sin, doesn't it?
It sure does for me !
Thanks be to God the Almighty !

 

[brightfame52]

Now since believing, the result of God given Faith is a work, that is an act of the mind, the heart and will, if men teach they are saved or justified before God because of their act of believing, while yet unregenerate and in a state of nature, then in essence they're saying that they were saved or justified before God based upon a subjective characteristic that pleased God while yet in the flesh. However the scripture plainly teaches that they which are in the flesh [the unregenerate] cannot please God Rom 8:814

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Faith/Believing pleases God see Heb 11:6

 

[brightfame52]

You will have to prove that with scripture, as I have already proven the opposite with Rom 3:27..."Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works?
Nay: but by the law of faith.",
Rom 9:32..."Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;"
Gal 2:16..."Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Gal 3:2..."This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?"
Gal 3:5..."He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?"
Gal 3:10..."For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them."

Find a scripture that denounces repentance from sin, or baptism in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of past sins, or enduring faithfully till the end.

I already gave scripture for my position in stating, if you condition anything in salvation, that a person must do, you promote salvation by works, even if that condition is a persons act of believing.

 

[jaybo]

Obey and live.
Disobey, and die a second death.

Unless you rely on the shepherd! "Now this is the will of the one who sent me—that I should not lose one person of every one he has given me, but raise them all up at the last day." John 6:39

Live by faith and not by works.

 

[Hopeful]

Now since believing, the result of God given Faith is a work, that is an act of the mind, the heart and will, if men teach they are saved or justified before God because of their act of believing, while yet unregenerate and in a state of nature, then in essence they're saying that they were saved or justified before God based upon a subjective characteristic that pleased God while yet in the flesh. However the scripture plainly teaches that they which are in the flesh [the unregenerate] cannot please God Rom 8:814

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Faith/Believing pleases God see Heb 11:6

I agree.
It is those who walk in the Spirit, and not in the flesh, who will be counted worthy of eternal life.

I like how you included the bit about "...yet unregenerated...".

 

[Hopeful]

I already gave scripture for my position in stating, if you condition anything in salvation, that a person must do, you promote salvation by works, even if that condition is a persons act of believing.

So true, as the unregenerated can't just stand there and utter..."I am saved".
I have nothing against the works of faith.
I hope you don't either

 

[Hopeful]

Unless you rely on the shepherd! "Now this is the will of the one who sent me—that I should not lose one person of every one he has given me, but raise them all up at the last day." John 6:39

Live by faith and not by works.

The two are inseparable.