Faith and works are entirely separate things. Faith is being sure of what you hope for and certain of what you don't see. (Hebrews 11:1) Works are physical actions that you perform.
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Desire to be a vessel of honor unto the Lord Jesus Christ?
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
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Taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
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Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
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How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
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Is believing/faith a work ?
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
Agreed
Agreed no it doesn’t.
Our physical body is not in Christ.
Christ is seated at the right hand of God.
Our spirit is joined to Christ and is one spirit with Him, not our physical bodies.
Our physical body is on earth.
Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; nor does corruption inherit incorruption.
1 Corinthians 15:50
Our physical bodies will die because they are corrupt, and full of sin.
We will however, be raised incorruptible.
For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. 1 Corinthians 15:52
This of course didn’t happen at water baptism, but will happen when He raises us from the dead, at His coming.
JLB
Hebrews 4:10, "For the one who enters God’s rest has also rested from his works, just as God did from his own works." So much for the Bible talking about laziness. We are justified by faith, not by works.
Well said, jaybo.
See: What does it mean that good works are the result of salvation? | GotQuestions.org
Eph 2:8-9 (ESV) sets the seal on this faith-works view: "For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast."
The sequence is "saved through faith . . . not a result of works."
Oz
Edward
2024 Supporter
Water baptism is a one time thing but according to old Hebrew customs, a blood Covenant does need renewed daily.
Morning's a good time for that, to ask forgiveness for any stumbling and apply the blood of Jesus to your life anew, and connect with God's Holy Spirit. Don't leave the house without connecting with the Holy Spirit.
That man stands a decent chance of being sinless that day. But if the world distracts him and he sees the beautiful neighbor waving goodbye to her husband so steals from the man's cookie jar, and hubby comes home early so gotta murder him to cover up, best be up asking forgiveness even earlier tomorrow! And God's Love covers a multitude of sins! There would still be consequences in this natural realm though.
Get back up. Re-connect with the Holy Spirit. King David was able to do such sins and still be called a man after God's own heart because he came before the Lord with a seriously contrite heart. So he was forgiven.
A different guy wanted a nice bike so ws going to pray for one, but he remembered that, God don't work like that. So he went and stole a nice bike then prayed for forgiveness! This is the guy who crucifies Christ anew. He knows better, but does not obey. No contrition in his heart.
Edward
2024 Supporter
I don't think they are entirely separate. Faith is the substance of things unseen, which seems to indicate something in the spiritual realm happens when we have faith or act in faith. (Code talk for the power of God). And that's exactly where faith takes us, into good works. So that's where I will show you my faith by my works comes into light.
That's what God does. He responds to faith. Jesus spoke of different kinds of faith, little faith, great faith so the greater the faith, the greater God's response. One man standing in the crowd is quietly having faith within himself about whatever, while another man is laying hands on some sick person and praying for healing for the man. It's a good work (which is what God wants us to do) and it's also a greater faith than the man standing quietly.
So it's in this light that I don't think that we can separate faith and works. Otherwise, what good is faith if not to move mountains?
Show me your faith without any works and I will show you my faith by my works. (James 2:18)
He is in us. ..."But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you." (Rom 8:11)
We are one. ..."To whom God would make known what is the riches of the glory of this mystery among the Gentiles; which is Christ in you, the hope of glory:" (Col 1:27)
And we are seated with Him. "And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:" (Eph 2:6)
We are one. "And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one:" (John 17:22)
So is Christ, in us..."But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
Will He reside in a polluted temple?" (1 Cor 1:30)
Correct.
Thank God we won't need them after we get our glorified bodies.
Bodies that don't get old and feeble-corrupt.
They will die because they are not eternal.
Yes, if we remain faithful until the end.
I look forward to my new vessel.
Correct, as the old vessel, now washed by the blood of Christ, has been quickened by the Spirit of God... "But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you." (Rom 8:11)
Not a favor God will grant the unrepentant.
I am sure thankful that I have been raised from the grave, with Christ, so I too can walk in newness of life with Jesus..."Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life." (Rom 6:4)
Like Jesus says..."And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved." (Matt 10:22)
Those lazy concerning their faith will not endure.
...not by the works of the law.
It is written..."Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified." (Gal 2:16)
But then again, good works are the proof of our conversion..."For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them." (Eph 2:10)
I know that there are two different kinds of works being discussed here, one for salvation and one because of salvation.
The works of the law pertain to the first one.
Thank God we live in the New Covenant.
brightfame52
2024 Supporter
I dont think you do agree, you just think you do. So far you have been a proponent of salvation by works.
Yes, He is in us. Amen
This of course doesn’t mean that that our physical body is somehow in heaven in Christ.
Our physical body is here on earth.
JLB
Yes, again Christ is in us, and dwells in our spirit.
This does not mean our flesh, our corrupt mortal body is in Christ.
But he who is joined to the Lord is one spirit with Him.
1 Corinthians 6:17
JLB
Yes, because we are one spirit with Him, we are joined to the Lord where He is.
Remember the kingdom of God is within you.
This of course does not mean our corrupt mortal body is in heaven with Christ.
Not even dead people who are in heaven have their physical bodies there in Christ.
JLB
Yes, He will raise us up from the dead on the last day.
And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you. Romans 8:10-11
Please read these words —
- if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
Our body will die because of sin, but Christ dwells in us and will raise us from the dead.
JLB
Edward
2024 Supporter
Does God ever change? Is Jesus's Covenant that He instituted a blood covenant?
Salvation is a free gift not obtained by the works of the law. But salvation does require for us to make an action in order to be able to receive it. We ask God to come into our heart and say the sinners prayer. Participation with God is what He wants from us. So the new covenant was instituted with the catchphrase, ask and ye shall receive. (Genius!) He just wants the conversation! And to obey.
Some would construe bending the knee and praying to be a work. Others think even pushing a button on an elevator on the sabbath is works. But that's still not talking about the works of the law saving a man, it can't.
There's works of the flesh (which is anything the body does), and works of the spirit. (which is anything your spirit does). So technically having faith within oneself could be a work or laying hands on someone and praying for their healing is a work. But the funny thing is, once you lay hands on someone and do them a good work (which is God's will), suddenly there are 50 more wanting to have hands layed upon them also. Because that is God's heart for us. So good works sort of snowball when the Lord's around.
"Those lazy concerning their faith will not endure." is not from the Bible.