Is believing/faith a work ?

[WIP]

Don't your kindly provided verses counter "what you believe"?

In what way. I believe there is a difference between walking away and being lost or kicked out or taken out of the book of life. If not, then please show me how those verses I quoted can be reconciled with the idea that one can fall away or once again become entangled in the pollutions of the world.

 

[Hopeful]

In what way. I believe there is a difference between walking away and being lost or kicked out or taken out of the book of life. If not, then please show me how those verses I quoted can be reconciled with the idea that one can fall away or once again become entangled in the pollutions of the world.

OOOPs.
Sorry, I misread your post, and missed "I DO believe...".
Somehow I thought you didn't believe...

That being said, it seems obvious to me that those who SEEM to fall away were not ever "tasting" to begin with.
For had they actually "tasted", they would never leave.

 

[brightfame52]

Mans religion will tell you that Salvation/Justification is a recompense for mans act of believing or faith. Thats Salvation by works. They're telling us that Justification before God is premise on mans action or deed of faith/believing and not Christ alone in His Person and Work!

 

[brightfame52]

At least I'm not seeing things that are not there.

It appears you arent seeing things that are in the scripture, and unfortunately I cant help you with that, you at Gods Mercy on that.

 

[Fastfredy0]

Mans religion will tell you that Salvation/Justification is a recompense for mans act of believing or faith.

True. We believe (salvation/justification) and are thereby saved (recompense).

Thats Salvation by works.

Salvation is by work; we are saved by faith and as you pointed out, faith is a work. The question remains: "By whose work."

They're telling us that Justification before God is premise on mans action or deed of faith/believing

True. We are saved by our faith, said faith being our faith.

not Christ alone in His Person and Work!

We are saved by Christ alone as our faith in us is caused to exist by Him. Thus, we are saved by the work of faith; said work being accomplished by Christ alone. Similarly, the work of illuminating a room is done by man who installs electricity, the electric grind, power for the grid, flicking the on switch. The work of illuminating a room is done by man, yet it is the light bulb that illuminates the room.

In chapter 14, the confession lays out the key prerequisite for salvation. The title of the chapter is “Of Saving Faith,” and it begins with these words: “The grace of faith, whereby the elect are enabled to believe to the saving of their souls, is the work of the Spirit of Christ in their hearts. . . .” Sproul, R.C.. What Is Faith? (Crucial Questions) (p. 46). Reformation Trust Publishing. Kindle Edition.

 

[WIP]

OOOPs.
Sorry, I misread your post, and missed "I DO believe...".
Somehow I thought you didn't believe...

That being said, it seems obvious to me that those who SEEM to fall away were not ever "tasting" to begin with.
For had they actually "tasted", they would never leave.

To your last point. How can one fall away from something they never had (tasted) to begin with?

 

[Hopeful]

Mans religion will tell you that Salvation/Justification is a recompense for mans act of believing or faith. Thats Salvation by works. They're telling us that Justification before God is premise on mans action or deed of faith/believing and not Christ alone in His Person and Work!

You can't remove "man" from the equation.
He is not the one who will be judged on the last day.
God And His Son did so much for us, but it is dependent on us to accept and honor Him and His wishes thereafter.
How can we love Him but ignore His wishes?

 

[Hopeful]

To your last point. How can one fall away from something they never had (tasted) to begin with?

It only seems as though they fell away.
Had they remained, their faith would have been true.
But they broke faith somewhere on the road.
It is the "break" that manifested from whom they were born or reborn.
The faithful remain faithful, but the posers only last for a while.

 

[brightfame52]

Yes Faith is a work, its the act/deed of the man or women who has been #1 Made Righteous by the sole obedience of Jesus Christ Rom 5:19 and #2 who has been born again by the Spirit of God, for Faith is the fruit/work of the Spirit Gal 5:22

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

The word fruit karpos means:

(a) fruit, generally vegetable, sometimes animal, (b) met: fruit, deed, action, result, (c) profit, gain.

In fact the word also signifies:66

Metaphorically, that which originates or comes

from something; an effect, result;
a. equivalent to ἔργον, work, act, deed:

 

[brightfame52]

works equals merit !

Rom 4:4

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward [eternal inheritance or life] not reckoned of grace, but of debt.


Understand that Eternal Life, Salvation is an Inheritance, Paul when writing to the Galatians in chpt 3 writes Gal 3:18

18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Its an eternal inheritance Heb 9:15

And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Its a heavenly inheritance 1 Pet 1:4

To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,

Now if we receive this Salvation, Eternal Life, or Eternal inheritance because of a condition we performed, like faith, or repentance, then whatever that condition is constitutes a quality or qualification within us, which is a basis for merit which is:

something that deserves or justifies a reward or commendation; a commendable quality, act, etc.

That act or condition one performs to get eternal life/inheritance becomes a meritorious act or condition, and there's no way around it ! One may say that faith and or repentance are acts we must to get eternal life, but they are not meritorious , are deceived, because that's exactly what they are !

 

[Hopeful]

works equals merit !

Rom 4:4

4 Now to him that worketh is the reward [eternal inheritance or life] not reckoned of grace, but of debt.


Understand that Eternal Life, Salvation is an Inheritance, Paul when writing to the Galatians in chpt 3 writes Gal 3:18

18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

Its an eternal inheritance Heb 9:15

And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance.

Its a heavenly inheritance 1 Pet 1:4

To an inheritance incorruptible, and undefiled, and that fadeth not away, reserved in heaven for you,

Now if we receive this Salvation, Eternal Life, or Eternal inheritance because of a condition we performed, like faith, or repentance, then whatever that condition is constitutes a quality or qualification within us, which is a basis for merit which is:

something that deserves or justifies a reward or commendation; a commendable quality, act, etc.

That act or condition one performs to get eternal life/inheritance becomes a meritorious act or condition, and there's no way around it ! One may say that faith and or repentance are acts we must to get eternal life, but they are not meritorious , are deceived, because that's exactly what they are !

Please be aware that the "works" Paul was writing about were the works of the Law...ie. circumcision, dietary laws, feast keeping, tithing, etc.

Have you ever fasted?
If you have, why?

 

[rogerg]

The word “believe” in the Greek text is “pisteuo” which is a verb denoting a work. If a person could believe in Christ before they are born again by the Spirit, it would mean they have done a work and that would mean they have worked for their salvation which is totally against what the scriptures teach. Ephesians 2:8-9

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Anything not of a gift, is a work

 

[rogerg]

Yes Faith is a work, its the act/deed of the man or women who has been #1 Made Righteous by the sole obedience of Jesus Christ Rom 5:19 and #2 who has been born again by the Spirit of God, for Faith is the fruit/work of the Spirit Gal 5:22

This may be a bold a statement, brightfame52, but I would suggest that the faith of Christ (from which a true believer's faith originates,) has central to it, works. I believe we are informed of this in James 2:26 (among other verse):

[Jas 2:26 KJV] 26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

I understand this verse to mean that in order for faith to be true faith, it must have works central to it. However,
the faith mentioned within that verse is Christ's faith and not ours. Our faith comes to us solely a gift from Him - in which case no works were either required from, or expended by, its recipients - which satisfies the admonition against works in Romans and others. What it also informs us of, is that should anyone believe that their faith was a product of themselves to any degree, then it must also contain the same works that Christ's faith had (which no one can produce), or their faith is dead, meaningless and even worse - sin.

 

[brightfame52]

Please be aware that the "works" Paul was writing about were the works of the Law...ie. circumcision, dietary laws, feast keeping, tithing, etc.

Have you ever fasted?
If you have, why?

False Any condition classifies as a work.

 

[brightfame52]

This may be a bold a statement, brightfame52, but I would suggest that the faith of Christ (from which a true believer's faith originates,) has central to it, works. I believe we are informed of this in James 2:26 (among other verse):

[Jas 2:26 KJV] 26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

I understand this verse to mean that in order for faith to be true faith, it must have works central to it. However,
the faith mentioned within that verse is Christ's faith and not ours. Our faith comes to us solely a gift from Him - in which case no works were either required from, or expended by, its recipients - which satisfies the admonition against works in Romans and others. What it also informs us of, is that should anyone believe that their faith was a product of themselves to any degree, then it must also contain the same works that Christ's faith had (which no one can produce), or their faith is dead, meaningless and even worse - sin.

I understand what you saying, however Im dealing with something different here.

 

[Hopeful]

False Any condition classifies as a work.

They sure do.
And I am grateful to God for the grace and knowledge to accomplish those works.
And I am also grateful that the works of the Mosaic covenant are not necessary anymore.
Faith is all about works of love.

 

[brightfame52]

If we say we are saved because of our obedience to a law or command then consequently we are saved by our merit! Such a claim denies Justification by grace. Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

 

[brightfame52]

They sure do.
And I am grateful to God for the grace and knowledge to accomplish those works.
And I am also grateful that the works of the Mosaic covenant are not necessary anymore.
Faith is all about works of love.

You promoting work salvation which is in variance to Grace Salvation.

 

[Fastfredy0]

If we say we are saved because of our obedience to a law or command then consequently we are saved by our merit!

We are saved by the command to believe. You should know that.

Such a claim denies Justification by grace. Rom 3:24

It does not. Now, the question is, why?

 

[Hopeful]

If we say we are saved because of our obedience to a law or command then consequently we are saved by our merit! Such a claim denies Justification by grace. Rom 3:24

24 Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus:

One has to really bend the intent of Paul's words to come to that conclusion.

Question...
As the redemption is "in Christ Jesus", it begs the question...How do we get "in Christ Jesus" in order to partake of that redemption?