Is believing/faith a work ?

[rogerg]

Ahhh yes Jesus stated "Anyone" Thats any person that "chooses" to do the Fathers will they are going to find the truth. That is Jesus's words are from God or where His teaching comes from. Jesus did not add any qualifiers. His word as He states is truth.

No, not quite: "make you perfect in every good work TO DO HIS WILL". (KJV)
Or, if you'd rather, to "equip you with everything good FOR DOING HIS WILL". (NIV)
In other words, they had first to be "made", or "equipped" for it by God, before they could do, or desire to "find" or "know" the will of God, from which, they learned the doctrine of God. It is only through/by/from the Holy Ghost in being born-again, that they so chose or found.

[Heb 13:20-21 NIV]
20 Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep,
21 equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 NIV]
17 Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.

[Heb 13:20-21 KJV]
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom [be] glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 KJV] 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or [whether] I speak of myself.

 

[GodsGrace]

No, not quite: "make you perfect in every good work TO DO HIS WILL". (KJV)
Or, if you'd rather, to "equip you with everything good FOR DOING HIS WILL". (NIV)
In other words, they had first to be "made", or "equipped" for it by God, before they could do, or desire to "find" or "know", the will of God, from which, they learned the doctrine of God. It is only through/by/from the Holy Ghost in being born-again, that they so chose or found.

[Heb 13:20-21 NIV]
20 Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep,
21 equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 NIV]
17 Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.

[Heb 13:20-21 KJV]
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom [be] glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 KJV] 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or [whether] I speak of myself.

What is the will of God?
Do you know?

Did Jesus teach the will of God?
Or does God force His will upon us?

Matthew 7:21-27
21“Not everyone who calls out to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter. 22On judgment day many will say to me, ‘Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.’ 23But I will reply, ‘I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God’s laws.’
24“Anyone who listens to my teaching and follows it is wise, like a person who builds a house on solid rock. 25Though the rain comes in torrents and the floodwaters rise and the winds beat against that house, it won’t collapse because it is built on bedrock. 26But anyone who hears my teaching and doesn’t obey it is foolish, like a person who builds a house on sand. 27When the rains and floods come and the winds beat against that house, it will collapse with a mighty crash.”

Once again, we see that Jesus tell us what is the will of God.
To obey His laws.
In order to do this, we must know what those laws are.
Also Jesus advises us that it is WE who are breaking God's laws.
He doesn't state that we are not responsible because it is God predetermining us to break them...which would make Him an unjust God indeed - to hold us responsible for what HE makes us do.

Jesus states again that we must hear His teaching and obey it.
HEAR HIS TEACHING
AND OBEY IT.
The obedience is an action we, the believer, take.



1. God let's His laws/rules be known to us. As a just God would do.

2. It is up to us to OBEY those laws. Obeying is an action WE take.

 

[Randy]

No, not quite: "make you perfect in every good work TO DO HIS WILL". (KJV)
Or, if you'd rather, to "equip you with everything good FOR DOING HIS WILL". (NIV)
In other words, they had first to be "made", or "equipped" for it by God, before they could do, or desire to "find" or "know" the will of God, from which, they learned the doctrine of God. It is only through/by/from the Holy Ghost in being born-again, that they so chose or found.

[Heb 13:20-21 NIV]
20 Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep,
21 equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 NIV]
17 Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.

[Heb 13:20-21 KJV]
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom [be] glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 KJV] 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or [whether] I speak of myself.

"Chooses to do the will of God" in order to find out. Oh sweet Jesus that's your defintion of works isn't it?

 

[rogerg]

Chooses to do the will of God" in order to find out. Oh sweet Jesus that's your defintion of works isn't it?

What does that mean?

 

[rogerg]

Oh sweet Jesus

Really? Very bad!

 

[brightfame52]

No, not quite: "make you perfect in every good work TO DO HIS WILL". (KJV)
Or, if you'd rather, to "equip you with everything good FOR DOING HIS WILL". (NIV)
In other words, they had first to be "made", or "equipped" for it by God, before they could do, or desire to "find" or "know" the will of God, from which, they learned the doctrine of God. It is only through/by/from the Holy Ghost in being born-again, that they so chose or found.

[Heb 13:20-21 NIV]
20 Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep,
21 equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 NIV]
17 Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.

[Heb 13:20-21 KJV]
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom [be] glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 KJV] 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or [whether] I speak of myself.

Or Phil 2:13

13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure

All of our spiritual willing and doing is resultant of Gods working in us

 

[rogerg]

Or Phil 2:13

13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of his good pleasure

All of our spiritual willing and doing is resultant of Gods working in us

Yeah, a very good one, I forgot about it but should have included it - thanks

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Hmmm. Okay then, what is it you believe?

That is a long story that would fill a book, but if we stick to what I believe about God's part and man's part in the salvation event in a man's life, that is shorter.

On God's part He wants all men to come to a knowledge of the truth and be saved. He works to that end in each life. The HS convicts people of sin among other activities barely perceptible to the man who thinks all of these inner workings are from himself. The man must respond from his always free will to receive what he is being made aware of. He must not refuse He who is calling although that accepting that most valuable realization will cost him. God does not do that part and man cannot do God's part. Man's part is necessary but not sufficient. God's part does not manipulate nor force the man to do his will. God does not force his will as that defeats the purpose which is a loving relationship. The whole of this is very very complex. Just as a person has a hard time pinpointing when they actually were in love with their spouse, so we cannot actually pinpoint the start of God wooing us. We are usually in the middle before we knew we had begun. I can supply scripture for the above if you do not recognize it the sentences written.

Now I know a number of people want it to be simple as that is less taxing on the mind. One can think it simple just as one can think eating breakfast makes you feel good and that is all they want to know. The whole of why eating a meal does you good is a very complex chemical interaction between your body and the food. How much one wants to understand a matter depends upon if one is willing to admit it is complex and set about understanding it nevertheless or one wants simple..."God did it and that is all I need to know." If one chooses the simple, they ought not try to teach others as they simply do not know enough about the matter.

 

[brightfame52]

DM

On God's part He wants all men to come to a knowledge of the truth and be saved.

False unless all the elect

The HS convicts people of sin among other activities barely perceptible to the man who thinks all of these inner workings are from himself

Only the elect, and Holy Spirit Conviction is inwardly and part of the new birth

The man must respond from his always free will to receive what he is being made aware of.

Now that a person is born again of the Spirit they believe with the Faith given them in the New birth. See the Holy Spirit was procured by Christs death for all the Sheep He died for, to ensure they believe. BTW men by nature our will is bound to sin, a servant to sin, its not free from sin. Thats why Jesus procured the work of the Spirit, to liberate them from the slavery of sin and unbelief. 2 Cor 3:17

Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.

That word liberty is the same word Paul uses in Gal 5:1 about the work of Christ

Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage.

Now since by Christs death the Sheep have been made free, correspondingly Christs sends His Spirit to them to give them Spiritual Life and true conviction of sin, repentance and faith.

 

[brightfame52]

DM

God does not do that part and man cannot do God's part. Man's part is necessary but not sufficient. God's part does not manipulate nor force the man to do his will.

Error man has no part to do in order to get saved, its 110% Gods Action to save a person. Man will be caused to repent and believe only after they were first made alive. Man plays no part in his being made alive, or being created anew. But your error is suggesting that Salvation is a partnership with God and spiritually dead man, God is alone 110% responsible for the Salvation of a person.

 

[PeterJens]

DM



Error man has no part to do in order to get saved, its 110% Gods Action to save a person. Man will be caused to repent and believe only after they were first made alive. Man plays no part in his being made alive, or being created anew. But your error is suggesting that Salvation is a partnership with God and spiritually dead man, God is alone 110% responsible for the Salvation of a person.

This statement seems to mean everything is just God choosing people, and the fruit of that choice is faith and the response. If man has no free will or agency, then this is the mechanistic view of life.

In a real sense like free will argument we could be beings who subconsciously initiated all action, or we could choose what we do. From childhood we learn we have to learn to choose, to take action, which is why fear is an important emotion to cause caution on actions that are dangerous. Literally everyday we know this reality, especially when driving a car and seeing some folk without the required skills.

The Lords argument with satan in Job is he is a righteous man who chooses his response to God.
God is valuing this response, and the whole book is a debate about the response to worship God no matter what or to accept ones fate and just die.

In all interplays of love, both parties have to participate. There is an aspect that their hearts drive them and also there is choice as to go deeper or withdraw. Jesus called his disciples to follow, to choose to respond. Jesus called them clean because of what they had heard. This is profound. Baptism was for the forgiveness of sins. Again, profound. Jesus also introduced without the Father revealing things to our hearts we would know nothing.

Jesus said to the apostles He chose them. He also chose Judas. The difference between Judas and Peter, was Peter loved Jesus, Judas was along for revolution and establishing the messiah in Israel and Romes overthrow. When Judas betrayed Jesus, he literally did not care, except an innocent man being killed was too far.

This closeness, acceptance and rejection reflects the complexity of our walk. Guarantees only have value if followed through with.

God bless you

 

[Dorothy Mae]

No, not quite: "make you perfect in every good work TO DO HIS WILL". (KJV)
Or, if you'd rather, to "equip you with everything good FOR DOING HIS WILL". (NIV)
In other words, they had first to be "made", or "equipped" for it by God, before they could do, or desire to "find" or "know" the will of God, from which, they learned the doctrine of God. It is only through/by/from the Holy Ghost in being born-again, that they so chose or found.

[Heb 13:20-21 NIV]
20 Now may the God of peace, who through the blood of the eternal covenant brought back from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep,
21 equip you with everything good for doing his will, and may he work in us what is pleasing to him, through Jesus Christ, to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 NIV]
17 Anyone who chooses to do the will of God will find out whether my teaching comes from God or whether I speak on my own.

[Heb 13:20-21 KJV]
20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,
21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom [be] glory for ever and ever. Amen.

[Jhn 7:17 KJV] 17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or [whether] I speak of myself.

Roger, I am pretty sure you have made up your mind but for those reading and wanting an answer to this, there isa problem in your post.

"In other words, they had first to be "made", or "equipped" for it by God, before they could do, or desire to "find" or "know" the will of God, from which, they learned the doctrine of God. It is only through/by/from the Holy Ghost in being born-again, that they so chose or found."

This is how a man might think it works on the outside never having made himself choose to do the will of God as opposed to his own will. One would think one would be already changed so that he no longer had any will but the will of God. So in that case, there is no choosing God's will instead of one's own will. That means there is no problem or wrestling against one's own desires. This is the easy way. That is not how it is described in the Bible and not how it is in real life.

We are not "FIRST made" to desire or find the will of God. What happens is there is a bit of desire to do the will of God but our own desires are very real and very strong. Against that will (ours) one must "die to self." We see in Jesus himself that he struggled to do the known will of God. That was because it was going to be very painful and costly. This does not come by learning the doctrine of God, a kind of legal position, but from loving the living God more than one loves comfort and the pleasure our own will affords. This is dying to self and it is very painful but beautiful in the end. "Not my will but thine be done" must be the decision of those who would do the known will of God.

Now please do not resort to saying I am not a Christian because I believe obeying God is costly, difficult and He does not make it easy. Please do not say I am doing "works to be saved" because I advocate obeying God. This is the usual retort and I am disarming it here and now. Loving God with all your being is disconnected from salvation, once a man has come that far. You would find it difficult to believe but there are those who love God for the kind of Being he is with one any regard as to what He gave them nor their eternal destiny. Doesn't mean that they are not Christians nor not "saved" as the definition goes among the immature.

 

[brightfame52]

peter

This statement seems to mean everything is just God choosing people, and the fruit of that choice is faith and the response. If man has no free will or agency, then this is the mechanistic view of life.

Man is dead to God my friend, so that necessitates a being made alive to God, only God can do that.

In a real sense like free will argument we could be beings who subconsciously initiated all action, or we could choose what we do. From childhood we learn we have to learn to choose, to take action, which is why fear is an important emotion to cause caution on actions that are dangerous. Literally everyday we know this reality, especially when driving a car and seeing some folk without the required skills.

You dont get it, man is spiritually dead to God, so all his actions in that condition are nothing but the flesh and profits nothing in the Spiritual realm, mans activity, like desiring/willing, thinking, hearing, seeing, tasting, only come into play after they have been made alive Spiritually by the New Birth Creation.

 

[Randy]

Really? Very bad!

Weak distracting reply. I am under Christ not you and He knows humor. I know this as I know Him.

Jonah
Nineveh
When God saw what they did and how they turned from their evil ways, he relented and did not bring on them the destruction he had threatened

But to Jonah this seemed very wrong, and he became angry.

God-should I not have concern for the great city of Nineveh, in which there are more than a hundred and twenty thousand people who cannot tell their right hand from their left—and also many animals?”

Many are invited. Few are chosen. However the sincere invitation goes out to all. All are invited to the wedding supper. Its up to the individual to choose who they will follow.

God sows love in the good seed and truth. Satan sows lies and hate that cause the weeds.

 

[rogerg]

This is how a man might think it works on the outside never having made himself choose to do the will of God as opposed to his own will. One would think one would be already changed so that he no longer had any will but the will of God. So in that case, there is no choosing God's will instead of one's own will. That means there is no problem or wrestling against one's own desires. This is the easy way. That is not how it is described in the Bible and not how it is in real life.

Are you saying that you believe you are saved by your works - that is, that salvation is based upon what
you do and don't do? Yes, or no?
I've posted these verses before, but you seem unable to fully grasp them.
They clearly tell us that man has to first be saved before he can perceive anything spiritual.
They are not Roger's words; they were taken directly from the Bible. Read them closely and think about them.

[1Co 2:5 KJV]
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

[1Co 2:7 KJV]
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, [even] the hidden [wisdom], which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

[1Co 2:10 KJV]
10 But God hath revealed [them] unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

[1Co 2:12-14 KJV]
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.

In other words, the unsaved CANNOT know the spiritual: one has to first become saved for that to happen, even though they may believe that they can and do. That is THE lie, and the trick of Satan - he blinds people to trust in their own works over Christ's works which is exactly how the natural man thinks. You are being led by what you'd
like to think is true and what in your core feel is true, but the Bible gives us a completely different message.

We are not "FIRST made" to desire or find the will of God. What happens is there is a bit of desire to do the will of God but our own desires are very real and very strong. Against that will (ours) one must "die to self." We see in Jesus himself that he struggled to do the known will of God. That was because it was going to be very painful and costly. This does not come by learning the doctrine of God, a kind of legal position, but from loving the living God more than one loves comfort and the pleasure our own will affords. This is dying to self and it is very painful but beautiful in the end. "Not my will but thine be done" must be the decision of those who would do the known will of God.

We are first saved, and from that, given the desire to be a servant of God. One cannot be a faithful and true
servant or even know the truth UNTIL being saved and given spiritual life. Until then everyone is DEAD in sin, and
a dead person does not know truth.

[Eph 2:1, 5 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins; ...
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

We are made alive by God WHEN we were dead in sin. How is it possible that anyone dead in sin can please God?
Do you see the "even when we were dead in sin, hath quickened us"? What do you think that means?

Now please do not resort to saying I am not a Christian because I believe obeying God is costly, difficult and He does not make it easy. Please do not say I am doing "works to be saved" because I advocate obeying God. This is the usual retort and I am disarming it here and now. Loving God with all your being is disconnected from salvation, once a man has come that far. You would find it difficult to believe but there are those who love God for the kind of Being he is with one any regard as to what He gave them nor their eternal destiny. Doesn't mean that they are not Christians nor not "saved" as the definition goes among the immature.

Should anyone trust in the wrong gospel, they are neither loving nor following God.

[1Co 15:57 KJV] 57 But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

God gives the victory though Christ, we don't/can't give it to ourselves

 

[brightfame52]

roger

They clearly tell us that man has to first be saved before he can perceive anything spiritual.
They are not Roger's words; they were taken directly from the Bible. Read them closely and think about them.

[1Co 2:5 KJV]
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

[1Co 2:7 KJV]
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, [even] the hidden [wisdom], which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

[1Co 2:10 KJV]
10 But God hath revealed [them] unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

[1Co 2:12-14 KJV]
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.

In other words, the unsaved CANNOT know the spiritual: one has to first become saved for that to happen, even though they may believe that they can and do. That is THE lie, and the trick of Satan - he blinds people to trust in their own works over Christ's works which is exactly how the natural man thinks. You are being led by what you'd
like to think is true and what in your core feel is true, but the Bible gives us a completely different message.

Yes a person must be already saved from the power of sin before they can believe the Gospel. Paul clearly informs us that the Gospel is being hid to THEM that are LOST 2 Cor 4:3

3 But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

This results in unbelief because the minds are blinded by the God of this world, who I believe to be satan the prince of this world Vs 4

4 In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them.

Even the elect while in a lost unregenerate state are victims to this blindness of mind,

The only remedy is to be saved out of a unregenerate state, signaling the defeat of satan on your behalf by the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

But the non elect or non Sheep of Christ will remain blinded by satan in unbelief because they arent saved.

 

[brightfame52]

By the way, the word hid in 2 Cor 4:3

But if our gospel be hid, it is hid to them that are lost:

Its the word kalyptō:

to hide, veil

1. to hinder the knowledge of a thing

Also its perfect passive in our text, so this is a completed condition, and the lost are being acted upon, their blindness is being caused by another, in this case the devil.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Are you saying that you believe you are saved by your works - that is, that salvation is based upon what
you do and don't do? Yes, or no?

No, how many things are going
to beat that dead horse? Why is it that when obeying God is mentioned, you jump to works salvation?

I've posted these verses before, but you seem unable to fully grasp them.
They clearly tell us that man has to first be saved before he can perceive anything spiritual.

Another dead horse you beat. Do you think there’s anything AFTER that?

They are not Roger's words; they were taken directly from the Bible. Read them closely and think about them.

[1Co 2:5 KJV]
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

And?

[1Co 2:7 KJV]
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, [even] the hidden [wisdom], which God ordained before the world unto our glory:

Roger, this does not describe many a Christian as much as you claim it’s automatic.

[1Co 2:10 KJV]
10 But God hath revealed [them] unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.

And?

[1Co 2:12-14 KJV]
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.

What do you think you’ve been freely given besides a guarantee of Heaven no matter how you treat others? What thingS?

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

That does not describe many. You can claim it does but it simply doesn’t.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know [them], because they are spiritually discerned.

Yawn! Can we move on? There aren’t atheists here in the discussion so that doesn’t apply.

In other words, the unsaved CANNOT know the spiritual: one has to first become saved for that to happen,

Yawn! Can you stop beating that dead horse please?

even though they may believe that they can and do. That is THE lie, and the trick of Satan - he blinds people to trust in their own works over Christ's works which is exactly how the natural man thinks.

Never met a single person out of Catholics and Muslims who think this way.

You are being led by what you'd

like to think is true and what in your core feel is true, but the Bible gives us a completely different message.

Not at all. But you do not understand what I think so you cannot judge it, I do understand you. Calvinism is very easy to understand. I understand the motive too.

We are first saved, and from that, given the desire to be a servant of God.

Do you have the desire to serve God? Your lack of even being civil to his offspring who aren’t calvinists belay a different motive. That’s the least of what should you do.

One cannot be a faithful and true
servant or even know the truth UNTIL being saved and given spiritual life.

Another dead horse

Until then everyone is DEAD in sin, and
a dead person does not know truth.

[Eph 2:1, 5 KJV]
1 And you [hath he quickened], who were dead in trespasses and sins; ...
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
[Col 2:13 KJV]
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

And? Is there nothing after that?

We are made alive by God WHEN we were dead in sin. How is it possible that anyone dead in sin can please God?
Do you see the "even when we were dead in sin, hath quickened us"? What do you think that means?

Is salvation the ONLY message you know? That’s baby stuff!!!

Should anyone trust in the wrong gospel, they are neither loving nor following God.

[1Co 15:57 KJV] 57 But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.

God gives the victory though Christ, we don't/can't give it to ourselves

Yawn! Your only message.

 

[rogerg]

Yawn! Your only message.

The gospel's only message. Okay, whatever, I'm done.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

The gospel's only message. Okay, whatever, I'm done.

No, it’s not the only message by a long shot. Acts and the Epistles show that. But it’s best we move on.