Is it possible to be a born again Christian and a liberal

[moniker]

Liberal answer #2
Pretend you don't know the questions and answer the question with another question.

So you don't want to clarify anything and would prefer to simply go along with the 1 dimensional view of the political process rather than have a real discussion; gotcha.

Oh, and where did I respond to your question with a question?

 

[thessalonian]

Lovely,

I agree wholeheartedly with your post. God is not a republican and we should be careful to discern all issues on their own merritt. Republicans tend to be okay on the moral issues but in the past the democrats were fine and the republicans had some serious flaws in that they were overly catering to big business. Some of them still do. Right now the moral issues of abortion and homosexuality take precedence as they attack the family. The core of society. But this does not mean the republicans are right on everything. And some are even weak in these areas. Mr. Bush gave his support to the recent softening of plan B restictions. I was rather dissapointed to say the least.

Anyway, good post.

 

[lovely]

:-D Sorry, javier, about being confusing. I was following a train of thought after reading the posts, rather than clearly stating my opinion. It happens sometimes. :-D You are supposed to read my mind! :wink:

Thess, thank you for clearing it up for me....that is exactly what I meant. You, and your wife, must communicate very well. :-D You did a good job of reading between the lines, and understanding my meaning. In fact, I think you may even speak girl fluently. :o :-D

Sorry, in a silly mood today...lack of sleep. The Lord bless you all.

 

[ikester7579]

Lovely,

I agree wholeheartedly with your post. God is not a republican and we should be careful to discern all issues on their own merritt. Republicans tend to be okay on the moral issues but in the past the democrats were fine and the republicans had some serious flaws in that they were overly catering to big business. Some of them still do. Right now the moral issues of abortion and homosexuality take precedence as they attack the family. The core of society. But this does not mean the republicans are right on everything. And some are even weak in these areas. Mr. Bush gave his support to the recent softening of plan B restictions. I was rather dissapointed to say the least.

Anyway, good post.

I agree. We should stop categorizing as if one group is always wrong. Both groups are wrong on many things Just because one side likes to do it (categorize), and usually does when they get the chance. Does not mean we have to like wise. And we cannot witness to those we make put up a defensive wall even before they hear what we are going to say.

 

[Nocturnal_Principal_X]

“Is it possible to be a born again Christian, meaning that one accepts the whole counsel of God and be a liberal or even a moderate?â€Â

In truth it is difficult for me to answer that question. The reason I find it difficult is because it seems to be that the very definition of liberal is often ambiguous. With that being said it does seemed that when someone is talking about say, liberal theology it is quite clear that a true Christian cannot be a liberal. I make that statement because one of the tents of liberal theology is a lack of belief in the inerrancy of Scripture. It also seems like that far to often those in the liberal theology camp often even question such key beliefs as the literal virgin birth of Jesus Christ and/or the literal bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ. Such beliefs are troubling and according to what Scriptural calls us to believe, very unchristian.

Now when it comes to politics, to me it is not so clear. The reason I say that is because it is a wrong and a rather ignorant belief that all so-called liberals are the same. Another thing that comes into mind is that depending on the time in which someone asserts a particular belief changes whether or not it is in deed liberal. What I mean by that is quite simpleâ€â€let us say someone living during the year 1780, in America, says slavery is wrong. In that particular day age the statues quo was that slavery was in fact not wrong. So in effect having a view against slavery would in fact be liberal.

It is true to say that for the most part I am a conservative but from time to time I may assert that a particular thing, which goes against the status quo, is in fact better or correct. Does that make me a liberal?

In any event the main concern Christians should have for other people is not whether or not they are conservative or even republican, but whether they have a saving faith in Jesus Christ.

 

[Drew]

......a lack of belief in the irritancy of Scripture.

:-D

 

[moniker]

......a lack of belief in the irritancy of Scripture.

:-D

Freudian slip? :wink:

I'd have to agree with you, Nocturnal and Lovely, this issue is far too nuanced to be addressed in such a way. Particularly since 'liberal' and 'conservative' have no real (political) meaningful definitions or understandings that stay consistent throughout. Particularly when you get into details.

Everybody wants to help the poor, for instance, but there is a schism over what is the best way. Philanthropic donations and a more free market system being allowed to expand and provide opportunities or having the government construct a 'safety net' that will ensure that those in poverty get help. Which is the more christian or are they non-issues in that sense? I'm pretty sure God doesn't have a view on capital gains taxes either, and so on.

 

[jgredline]

“Is it possible to be a born again Christian, meaning that one accepts the whole counsel of God and be a liberal or even a moderate?â€Â

In truth it is difficult for me to answer that question. The reason I find it difficult is because it seems to be that the very definition of liberal is often ambiguous. With that being said it does seemed that when someone is talking about say, liberal theology it is quite clear that a true Christian cannot be a liberal. I make that statement because one of the tents of liberal theology is a lack of belief in the irritancy of Scripture. It also seems like that far to often those in the liberal theology camp often even question such key beliefs as the literal virgin birth of Jesus Christ and/or the literal bodily resurrection of Jesus Christ. Such beliefs are troubling and according to what Scriptural calls us to believe, very unchristian.

Nocturnal
This is exactly my point and what I was trying to get at. This is why I said the whole coundel of God. There are many people who call themselves Christians but don't accept the words of Paul for example. This question has nothing to do with democrat or republican, but about what the bible says.

 

[Drew]

I'd have to agree with you, Nocturnal and Lovely, this issue is far too nuanced to be addressed in such a way. Particularly since 'liberal' and 'conservative' have no real (political) meaningful definitions or understandings that stay consistent throughout. Particularly when you get into details.

Everybody wants to help the poor, for instance, but there is a schism over what is the best way. Philanthropic donations and a more free market system being allowed to expand and provide opportunities or having the government construct a 'safety net' that will ensure that those in poverty get help. Which is the more christian or are they non-issues in that sense? I'm pretty sure God doesn't have a view on capital gains taxes either, and so on.

Wise words, moniker. Because words like "liberal" and "conservative" are so ill-defined and because everyone maps these words to different values, the whole debate is muddled from the start.

Despite some of the silly rhetoric that you read in these forums, I think the reality is as you suggest - the majority of people (whether they self-identify with the left or the right) want the deserving poor to be cared for (for example). Determining the ideal solution is really more of a "technical" question than anything else. The sooner we all drop the hysterical rhetoric (you know who you are) and get down to the serious business of solving society's ills, the better off we all will be.

God wants us to create a just society and I doubt He has an opinion on "big government" vs "small government".

 

[Nocturnal_Principal_X]

......a lack of belief in the irritancy of Scripture.

:-D

Freudian slip? :wink:

Uh…I have since fixed it. My mistake, and no it was not a Freudian slip, I usually have Ellis slips.

(Albert Ellis was one of the pioneers of Cognitive Behavioral Theoryâ€â€Which to some extant I agree with, of course by the time I get my Masters of Divinity with Biblical Counseling I might just throw it out completely, in any event I put Scripture above men’s theories)

*I might add this post represents my independence post* :-D
Note the number being 1776

 

[Solo]

I'd have to agree with you, Nocturnal and Lovely, this issue is far too nuanced to be addressed in such a way. Particularly since 'liberal' and 'conservative' have no real (political) meaningful definitions or understandings that stay consistent throughout. Particularly when you get into details.

Everybody wants to help the poor, for instance, but there is a schism over what is the best way. Philanthropic donations and a more free market system being allowed to expand and provide opportunities or having the government construct a 'safety net' that will ensure that those in poverty get help. Which is the more christian or are they non-issues in that sense? I'm pretty sure God doesn't have a view on capital gains taxes either, and so on.

Wise words, moniker. Because words like "liberal" and "conservative" are so ill-defined and because everyone maps these words to different values, the whole debate is muddled from the start.

Despite some of the silly rhetoric that you read in these forums, I think the reality is as you suggest - the majority of people (whether they self-identify with the left or the right) want the deserving poor to be cared for (for example). Determining the ideal solution is really more of a "technical" question than anything else. The sooner we all drop the hysterical rhetoric (you know who you are) and get down to the serious business of solving society's ills, the better off we all will be.

God wants us to create a just society and I doubt He has an opinion on "big government" vs "small government".

It is my perception that the liberals have done nothing for the poor of this nation. Instead they have averted the flow of money to the poor and have created their own little world of power and influence. How much money has been spent on poverty since Lyndon B. Johnson? Remember what he said about the civil rights legislation:

Johnson reportedly made the following comment in explaining why the civil rights bill was so important to him. He said it was simple: "I'll have them n-word voting Democratic for two hundred years."

 

[golfjack]

reply

You have that right Solo.



May God bless, golfjack

 

[jgredline]

Save the whales.

 

[soma]

Conservatives do nothing but bad mouth, otherwise they would be harping on the good and joy of our Lord. I am sure there is some joy out there. It there anything positive a conservative can talk about.

 

[jgredline]

Conservatives do nothing but bad mouth, otherwise they would be harping on the good and joy of our Lord. I am sure there is some joy out there. It there anything positive a conservative can talk about.

Your a child of Satan, so your Lord is not the same as mine.

You believe in Christian Mysticsm. This is not of our Lord Jesus Christ.

Your a NewAger which is of the devil, So don't say we worship the same God.

 

[mutzrein]

Conservatives do nothing but bad mouth, otherwise they would be harping on the good and joy of our Lord. I am sure there is some joy out there. It there anything positive a conservative can talk about.

Yes - tomorrow we are going to have more of the same and it is good! :wink:

 

[Vic C.]

Conservatives do nothing but bad mouth, otherwise they would be harping on the good and joy of our Lord. I am sure there is some joy out there. It there anything positive a conservative can talk about.

This post iis a form of bad-mouthing too and opinions as such have to be kept off this Site! Please soma, lets get over it and lets move on.

Your a child of Satan, so your Lord is not the same as mine.

And this! ... Are you aiding in proving soma's point? This is unacceptable and does not look good to the outsiders looking in. Consider this a friendy warning, both of you. Make us smile, not frown. The tension has been too thick around here lately.

 

[soma]

I agree I pray and meditate everyday of my lord Jesus Christ and I feel he blesses us every minute of everyday with many joys that we can elaborate on. God Bless.

 

[jgredline]

Conservatives do nothing but bad mouth, otherwise they would be harping on the good and joy of our Lord. I am sure there is some joy out there. It there anything positive a conservative can talk about.

This post iis a form of bad-mouthing too and opinions as such have to be kept off this Site! Please soma, lets get over it and lets move on.

Your a child of Satan, so your Lord is not the same as mine.

And this! ... Are you aiding in proving soma's point? This is unacceptable and does not look good to the outsiders looking in. Consider this a friendy warning, both of you. Make us smile, not frown. The tension has been too thick around here lately.

Vic
With all due respect and I have a bunch of repect for you.
I don't regret what I said for I really mean it. I should have posted scripture.
Here is the scripture I was thinking of.

42 Jesus said to them, “If God were your Father, you would love Me, for I proceeded forth and came from God; nor have I come of Myself, but He sent Me. 43 Why do you not understand My speech? Because you are not able to listen to My word. 44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it. 45 But because I tell the truth, you do not believe Me. 46 Which of you convicts Me of sin? And if I tell the truth, why do you not believe Me? 47 He who is of God hears God’s words; therefore you do not hear, because you are not of God.â€Â
The New King James Version. 1982 (Jn 8:42-47). Nashville: Thomas Nelson.

 

[jgredline]

Vic
As far as Outsiders looking in, I pray that God will protect them. There are many false teachers on this board and many young lambs that can be lead astray.
I will do my best to defend the true Gospel Of Jesus Christ who is God.
I just can't sit back and do and say nothing. How often do these false teachers even visit the prayer and praise threads. 0 Why is that?
I have visited other forums in the past and none of them have the kind of madness that is allowed to go on here in complete violation of TOS.
Vic
If you want me to leave, I will respect that and leave. Just let me know.
Thanks javier