Is preaching once saved always saved helpful..

[Orthodox Christian]

No Orthodoxy, "he" is not you. It's "he" or "she" or "whoever" rejects Christ. What in the world made you think I was refering to you? Don't be so sensitive, everything is not a direct remark to you. Believe me if I have something to say about or to someone they will know that it is meant for them. Relax.

Solo- Peter denied Christ 3 times and the Bible says IMMEDIATELY he was sorry. I am talking about completely walking away from God.

What do you think about the person that Paul said to deliver a fornicator over to satan so that his flesh would be destroyed but his spirit saved in the day of the Lord Jesus?

5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus. 1 Corinthians 5:5

Also, how is one who is born again and sealed by the Holy Spirit until the day of redemption, unborn again. How is a born again individual who now is a new creature in Christ, unborn again because he walks in the flesh and rejects Jesus? Either that person was born again or not. If that person was born again by the Spirit of God, he can not unborn himself, and God is not going to judge him for salvation on his merits but on the merits of the Lord Jesus Christ.

But the scripture not only declares, it cries out that we are to become, individually and corporately, a mature man, growing up into the fulness and stature of Christ. Eph 4:15-16

That which is born and does not mature eventually will die. Jesus spoke of this in the parable of the seeds quite clearly:
The seeds that never take root (unbelievers)
The seeds that germinate, but do not take root (unchurched 'Christians')
The seeds that take root, but are established in good soil, and choke(believe, but are overcome by the world, and death overtakes them)
The seeds that are germinated and come to fruit, one hundredfold (Luke 8:4-8)

Pray then to the Lord of the Harvest. The harvest does not take place when the seeds germinate, now does it??
When does the harvest take place?
When the mature plants bring forth one hundred fold.

Let us understand then, the parable of the Sower, who is also the Harvester. We are they who tend the Garden...after all, who planted a garden in Eden, and who cared for it?

Regards
James

 

[Orthodoxy]

von,

No Orthodoxy, "he" is not you. It's "he" or "she" or "whoever" rejects Christ. What in the world made you think I was refering to you? Don't be so sensitive, everything is not a direct remark to you. Believe me if I have something to say about or to someone they will know that it is meant for them. Relax.

It appeared to me it was but thanks for clearing that up for I never denied Jesus Christ as you implied others have. I believe it is you that is hot under the collar, I just asked a question to clarify your statement.

Orthodoxy

 

[John the Baptist]

John here:
There is nothing created that Christ was not involved in [as God]. (other world's'!) The Gospel is Everlasting as with the Covenant. Everlasting in this context means 'Immortal' with no beginning or ending! Prov. talks about the 'future'! Christ playing as a lad. What was brought 'forth' was the 'plan of salvation'. The GodHead had for/ordained that Christ would become the Son. The PLAN CAME FORTH when it was pre/ordained to be brought forth. The plan could not have a O.S.A.S. way of saving the lost sinner!

In heaven itself the rebellion started. Lucifer was the covering cherub over the [MERCY SEAT.] (Everlasting Gospel) Under the Mercy Seat was the Ark of God, where in were the Everlasting Covenant. (10 Commandments) The GodHead was not in eternity taken by surprise. They knew that the PLAN OF SALVATION would be required to be BROUGHT FORTH!

Notice in Psalms 2:7 future tense.. "[I will make the decree]: the [Lord hath said unto *me], THOU ART *MY SON; [THIS *DAY HAVE I *BEGOTTEN THEE]." Surely that is clear? But what day in the future is it stated that Christ was begotten??

In Hebrews 1:2 we see that .. "Hath in the last days spoken unto us by His Son, (But notice this!) ... by whom also [He MADE THE WORLDS]: (plural)

and in verse 5?? We see Psalms 2:7 is now past/tense! "For unto which of the angels said He at any time, Thou art my Son, [THIS DAY HAVE I BEGOTTEN THEE?]"

So the GodHead were, & always will be the GODHEAD! God the Son as we know Him became God the Son at conception by the Holy Ghost! See Psalms 139:15-16. It was the PLAN that had its beginning on 'earth', yet never was 'eternity' with out the known plan.

And this plan by 'FAITH' saved man by the Godheads Required Condition of OBEDIENCE! Genesis 3:15 & Genesis 4:7. Pay attention to the Words of the verse!
"IF thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted?" How one answers this simple Truth, will answer ones question of O.S.A.S.
[IF thou doest well] is the key Word for the Eternal Gospel!

One last thought question to understand would be to ask yourself why when the 'Lamb offering' was killed in the court of the Sanctuary, the High Priest needed to follow on with the Lavor Washing, and then enter the Sanctuary itself for other ]'required duties'?? See Exodus 30:17-20.

No again! if accepting the Lamb offering was as accepting Christ by Faith alone, (Hebrews 11:13 ones all died [IN THE FAITH!]) then there was no need to further Obey the Godhead's requirements. See Acts 5:32 No one could ever be O.S.A.S. and have 'Free will'. Read all of James 2:14-26!!
---John

 

[von]

Orthodoxy- What is wrong with you? You are always stirring up trouble no matter where you go. I am not hot under the collar and I never said anyone denied Jesus. You will not start an argument with me because I don't need to bother with you. I wasn't talking to you I'm talking to the others. I answered you as nicely as possible. If you think I am going to kiss your rear end so you are not offended, SORRY FOR YA! Do me a favor, don't respond to me. I mean it, I want you to not talk to me and leave me alone. You have a real problem. I don't know if it's mental or spiritual but you are definitely whacked. There now maybe you can get that. You want something to be offended at? There you go. I am not shy and I am sick of you telling me I say things that I don't or I'm having an attitude when I'm not. You don't know me or anything about me.
Solo, Merry, or anyone else who fells like I'm "hot". That is not true at all. I don't feel any hostility from any of you and I hope that you don't feel any from me. I thought that we were actually having a fairly decent conversation about two different views. Do I think any less of you because you believe it differently than me, not at all. I don't think you are denying Jesus or any such thing. I guess if you all had a problem you would have told me so. You have accepted Christ, I have accepted Christ that makes us brothers and sisters in Him. No matter what subject I talk about or how nice I try to be, Ortho here, is offended about something. He about caused me to "lose my salvation" on the last forum that we were both on but he will not do it to me again. It seems like anyone else can say whatever they want and no matter how nice I be I end up apologizing over and over. I think we are just having a discussion, right? If you took it any different just say so.

 

[Merry Menagerie]

Orthodoxy- What is wrong with you? You are always stirring up trouble no matter where you go. I am not hot under the collar and I never said anyone denied Jesus. You will not start an argument with me because I don't need to bother with you. I wasn't talking to you I'm talking to the others. I answered you as nicely as possible. If you think I am going to kiss your rear end so you are not offended, SORRY FOR YA! Do me a favor, don't respond to me. I mean it, I want you to not talk to me and leave me alone. You have a real problem. I don't know if it's mental or spiritual but you are definitely whacked. There now maybe you can get that. You want something to be offended at? There you go. I am not shy and I am sick of you telling me I say things that I don't or I'm having an attitude when I'm not. You don't know me or anything about me.

I just want to say...before you have to edit this post, that that was a mighty fine post. It had to be said and I commend you for having the balls to do it! Some people seem to walk around all day looking for offenses that they can use against people. It's happened to you and it's happened to me on this board. To be honest, just because one is a Christian doesn't mean we have to be a door mat! Good on ya mate!!!!

Solo, Merry, or anyone else who fells like I'm "hot".

And no, I didn't think you were hot under the collar until this moment - but I like it!!! Good on ya!

That is not true at all. I don't feel any hostility from any of you and I hope that you don't feel any from me.

No no - I don't feel any hostility at all with you, in fact I like the way you debate. You don't lower yourself to cheap shots and I commend you for that.

I thought that we were actually having a fairly decent conversation about two different views.

And we were, don't let anyone tell you we weren't. I was actually enjoying the calm discussion.

Do I think any less of you because you believe it differently than me, not at all.

And, to be honest, I didn't get the feeling from you that you thought any differenly of me for having a differing opinion than you - so you're doing something right

I don't think you are denying Jesus or any such thing. I guess if you all had a problem you would have told me so.

Yep we would have, hon, don't worry about it. We both believe in Jesus

You have accepted Christ, I have accepted Christ that makes us brothers and sisters in Him.

Yes and I agree with you 100%

No matter what subject I talk about or how nice I try to be, Ortho here, is offended about something.

I don't expect it takes all that much.

He about caused me to "lose my salvation" on the last forum that we were both on but he will not do it to me again.

No no...You are Jesus' sheep - Jesus doesn't lose sheep. You will not 'lose' your salvation over anything or ANYONE. Keep hold of his promises.

It seems like anyone else can say whatever they want and no matter how nice I be I end up apologizing over and over. I think we are just having a discussion, right? If you took it any different just say so.

Nope - I'm fine! And I can hazard a guess that Solo is as well.

Try not to let it get to you huh? Christ is bigger than that and he resides in you...rest in him!

 

[von]

Thanks Merry- Now maybe we can continue our conversation on the subject at hand.

 

[Orthodoxy]

von,

Orthodoxy- What is wrong with you?

Nothing. I said thanks for clearing that issue up.

You are always stirring up trouble no matter where you go.

Me trouble? Why no.

I am not hot under the collar and I never said anyone denied Jesus.

You imply someone did or why were you talking about it? Calm down.

You will not start an argument with me because I don't need to bother with you.

Who is arguing? Calm down. You dont need to bother with me? What do I look like, a fly?

I wasn't talking to you I'm talking to the others.

So you were talking about others "rejecting Jesus Christ as savior" I thought I read that but was not sure so I asked for verification. Thanks again for that verification. I appreciate that.

I answered you as nicely as possible.

Yes you did, now why the tirade and tantrum?

If you think I am going to kiss your rear end so you are not offended, SORRY FOR YA!

ewwwe. How gross. Really think of me as a dead man, unforgiven, unoffendable.

Do me a favor, don't respond to me.

O sure now ya tell me.

I mean it, I want you to not talk to me and leave me alone.

You should have told me that in the beginning I would not have answered your public post.

You have a real problem.

Tell me Doctor, where does it hurt?

I don't know if it's mental or spiritual but you are definitely whacked.

Now now, why judge me so harshly. You know if you judge then you will be judged. Please calm down.

There now maybe you can get that. You want something to be offended at? There you go.

I am offended you dont like me and think I am a loony? Naw, I rejoice. A fool for Christ am I.

I am not shy and I am sick of you telling me I say things that I don't or I'm having an attitude when I'm not. You don't know me or anything about me.

I am good at reading between the lines. Frankly I think I have hit some sore spots and some nerves of truth that prick yer heart. I bet ol Saul was cussing before he fell off his high horse too.

Solo, Merry, or anyone else who fells like I'm "hot". That is not true at all.

You really need to relax a bit. Read John 20:21-23. Contimplate the implications of your own personal opinions.

I don't feel any hostility from any of you and I hope that you don't feel any from me.

'

A plea from the crowd for support?

I thought that we were actually having a fairly decent conversation about two different views. Do I think any less of you because you believe it differently than me, not at all. I don't think you are denying Jesus or any such thing. I guess if you all had a problem you would have told me so. You have accepted Christ, I have accepted Christ that makes us brothers and sisters in Him. No matter what subject I talk about or how nice I try to be, Ortho here, is offended about something. He about caused me to "lose my salvation" on the last forum that we were both on but he will not do it to me again. It seems like anyone else can say whatever they want and no matter how nice I be I end up apologizing over and over. I think we are just having a discussion, right? If you took it any different just say so.

Thats the ticket, Ortho did it.

Hey thanks for the verification you did not mean I rejected Jesus Christ as Lord and God of my life. Whew. For a minute there I thought you were calling me an unbeliever. Whew.

In the Joy of the Lord,

Orthodoxy

 

[John the Baptist]

Is preaching once saved always saved helpful..

OK: Back to the subject of Obedience, after one is Born Again!
John here: Surely God will tell us that this is the case, if it was, huh?

It seems to me that there is no way to be Born Again in the first place unless Acts 5:32 has found mankind 'submissive' to the Godhead's Eternal Covenant of OBEDIENCE!!

All Scripture of 2 Timothy 3:16?? All of these pages, and there is no place quoted from God where this is the case. All the way from Gen. to Rev. we see only a two party conditional promise for one to be saved. A tree of testing right in the 'midst' of God's Garden of Eden, [with a warning for the pair to not..]!!!They were created 'very good', not flawed! The free choice was theirs to make. As is the 'diet' of Matthew 4:4, huh?

Way on down to the closing book of the Godheads Revelation's last few verses we see once again perfect real Christians who have [their names in the Book of Life, Warned] that to add or remove anything from God's Word will find these same ones having their name removed from the [Book of Life]! Compare Ecclesiastes 3:14

"I know that, whatsoever God doeth, it shall be for ever: [nothing can be put to it, nor anything taken from it]: and God doeth it, that men should fear before Him."

And instead: We hear that mankind is O.S.A.S. The devil has a 'doctrine' that promises mankind 'liberty'! 2 Peter 2:19-22!! (K.J.) He even says that God is just giving 'empty' warning threats'. Yet, when a REAL BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN reads the WORD OF GOD there, they know that God does not use satans tactics of lies! See 2 Corinthians 4:2. God's Word even says that these ones 'were made Partakers of the Holy Ghost' in Hebrews 6:1-6!!!!

No: O.S.A.S. is the doctrine of the devil. It will be one of the doctrines that necessitate hell being filled with ministers. But of course, this is just one of their flawed teachings. See Luke 12:47-48 :

Having said that, you can still be sure that there are many of Christ's saints still there in ignorance, some have died in the faith as far as they knew of it, believing that it was truth, while other are hearing the WORD'S OF THEIR MASTER BEING READ OVER & OVER AGAIN IN REVELATION 18:4, in the Showers of the early part of 'Latter Rain' setting! You can read the verse to see if they will finally be saved or not? They are His Words!