Bible Study Is Water Baptism Necessary for Salvation?

[Pass-A-Gospel-Tract]

1 Peter 3:21 KJV
20Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. 21The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

In Layman's term
Water saved Noah during Genesis when he and his family were in the ark, while the rest drowned to death, that is their Salvation during Genesis.

Moving to the New Testament, Water Baptism (like figure in Noah saved by Water) doesn't save us from Sin (Filth of the Flesh), but save us from disappointing God (the answer of a good conscience toward God)

But some may argue this contradicts Mark 16:16 !!!

Mark 16:16 KJV​

“He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”

The answer is simple, the bible states that there are 2 different Baptism, 1 is Physical (Water), the other is Spiritual (Holy Ghost), the first one is a command, the second one is for Salvation. Also the emphasis on "he that believeth not" in the 2nd half of the verse, why didn't it states: "he that believeth not and baptized not"? It means that Salvation is by Faith alone (Eph 2:8-9, Rom 10:9-10)

Acts 1:5 KJV​

“For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.”
Matthew 3:11 KJV
"I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:"

See 2 different Baptism mentioned

Acts 8:36-38 KJV​

36And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? 37And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 38And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.

Before you receive Water Baptism, you must first be Baptize by the Holy Ghost by believing on Jesus Christ which is your Salvation.

 

[Randy]

1 Peter 3:21 KJV
20Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. 21The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:

In Layman's term
Water saved Noah during Genesis when he and his family were in the ark, while the rest drowned to death, that is their Salvation during Genesis.

Moving to the New Testament, Water Baptism (like figure in Noah saved by Water) doesn't save us from Sin (Filth of the Flesh), but save us from disappointing God (the answer of a good conscience toward God)

But some may argue this contradicts Mark 16:16 !!!

Mark 16:16 KJV​

“He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.”

The answer is simple, the bible states that there are 2 different Baptism, 1 is Physical (Water), the other is Spiritual (Holy Ghost), the first one is a command, the second one is for Salvation. Also the emphasis on "he that believeth not" in the 2nd half of the verse, why didn't it states: "he that believeth not and baptized not"? It means that Salvation is by Faith alone (Eph 2:8-9, Rom 10:9-10)

Acts 1:5 KJV​

“For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.”
Matthew 3:11 KJV
"I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance: but he that cometh after me is mightier than I, whose shoes I am not worthy to bear: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost, and with fire:"

See 2 different Baptism mentioned

Acts 8:36-38 KJV​

36And as they went on their way, they came unto a certain water: and the eunuch said, See, here is water; what doth hinder me to be baptized? 37And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God. 38And he commanded the chariot to stand still: and they went down both into the water, both Philip and the eunuch; and he baptized him.

Before you receive Water Baptism, you must first be Baptize by the Holy Ghost by believing on Jesus Christ which is your Salvation.

Wrong - I was baptized as a infant. Then later received the "promised" Holy Spirit which I sought with great zeal in prayer through faith in Him.

Its like the Lord was patient with me then when I was ready to make the life long commitment to follow Him with word and deed He knew and stated "Come". That's how I envision it. So there's a bit more going on in the heart of a believer than just a ceremonial water baptism. "pledging a clear conscience before God"

If the question was asked should we baptize people in the name of the Lord with water then my answer would be "absolutely yes"

I was baptized then "later" came to believe. (as far back as my memory goes) Not quite the same as "He who believes and is baptized" As this new message of life was sent into the world and people received, believed and were baptized. How it was in the beginning.

 

[Pass-A-Gospel-Tract]

Wrong - I was baptized as a infant. Then later received the "promised" Holy Spirit which I sought with great zeal in prayer through faith in Him.

Its like the Lord was patient with me then when I was ready to make the life long commitment to follow Him with word and deed He knew and stated "Come". That's how I envision it. So there's a bit more going on in the heart of a believer than just a ceremonial water baptism. "pledging a clear conscience before God"

If the question was asked should we baptize people in the name of the Lord with water then my answer would be "absolutely yes"

I was baptized then "later" came to believe. (as far back as my memory goes) Not quite the same as "He who believes and is baptized" As this new message of life was sent into the world and people received, believed and were baptized. How it was in the beginning.

I appreciate sharing your experience and your faith in Christ, but an infant can't be baptize with water because it doesn't have any awareness or mental capacity on what to believe in, which is what the verse in Acts that I shared should be in sequence. You have to believe first and receive the baptism of the Holy Ghost (Spiritual) before you get water baptism (Physical). So you'll need to be baptize in water again so not to disappoint Jesus on His Judgement Seat of Christ.

 

[Randy]

I appreciate sharing your experience and your faith in Christ, but an infant can't be baptize with water because it doesn't have any awareness or mental capacity on what to believe in, which is what the verse in Acts that I shared should be in sequence. You have to believe first and receive the baptism of the Holy Ghost (Spiritual) before you get water baptism (Physical). So you'll need to be baptize in water again so not to disappoint Jesus on His Judgement Seat of Christ.

I have everything that I need. Its not my place to invalidate baptism's. Infant baptism is not something I want to debate.
I have the Spirit of Christ in me and I know He loves me. I know Him and He knows me. If I needed another baptism He would have told me.

 

[Pass-A-Gospel-Tract]

I have everything that I need. Its not my place to invalidate baptism's. Infant baptism is not something I want to debate.
I have the Spirit of Christ in me and I know He loves me. I know Him and He knows me. If I needed another baptism He would have told me.

He already told you based from His Words in the Bible

 

[Randy]

He already told you based from His Words in the Bible

He told me to be rebaptized again?
If you want to take up "your" problem with the Lutheran Church be my guest.

In my mind I have been baptized.

 

[Randy]

He already told you based from His Words in the Bible

Yes He has.
If you love me, keep my commands. 16And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another advocate to help you and be with you forever— 17the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be c in you. 18I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you. 19Before long, the world will not see me anymore, but you will see me. Because I live, you also will live. 20On that day you will realize that I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you. 21Whoever has my commands and keeps them is the one who loves me. The one who loves me will be loved by my Father, and I too will love them and show myself to them.”

Yet to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—
children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

As I have already testified I have the Spirit of Christ in me.

I am in the Faith Paul wrote of.
Examine yourselves to see whether you are in the faith; test yourselves. Do you not realize that Christ Jesus is in you—unless, of course, you fail the test?

I am a child of God by the will of God and one with Christ Jesus. He in me and I in Him just as He taught.

 

[Pass-A-Gospel-Tract]

He told me to be rebaptized again?
If you want to take up "your" problem with the Lutheran Church be my guest.

In my mind I have been baptized.

Yes, you have been baptized with the Holy Ghost (Spiritual), but your water baptism as an infant is null and void. I have no qualms since you're a saved brethren, but I'm only pointing out that if you don't get the water baptism after getting saved which is the correct sequence, then you'll be missing out your rewards in Heaven, if you don't want it then that's your choice to make.

 

[Randy]

Yes, you have been baptized with the Holy Ghost (Spiritual), but your water baptism as an infant is null and void. I have no qualms since you're a saved brethren, but I'm only pointing out that if you don't get the water baptism after getting saved which is the correct sequence, then you'll be missing out your rewards in Heaven, if you don't want it then that's your choice to make.

My sin has been not only been forgiven but removed. My name is written in heaven. You seem to put importance on the correct sequence for additional rewards. In the beginning people heard the new message of life, believed, were baptized and received the Spirit at that time. While that isn't my story I have that same Spirit which I asked for in prayer. Which means by the same grace I was forgiven of my sins. Its not about "correct sequence". Its about coming to know the Lord and being known by Him that is the importance.

Your opinion is noted on infant baptism.

So is theirs:
Branches of Christianity that practice infant baptism include Catholics, Eastern and Oriental Orthodox, and among Protestants, several denominations: Anglicans, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Congregationalists and other Reformed denominations, Methodists, Nazarenes, Moravians, and United Protestants.

 

[Randy]

The grace of God, not sequence or water baptism, is the victory of this discussion in my mind.
And as was shown by others God chose to reconcile to Himself whether things on earth or heaven by the "blood" of Christ which Jesus shed for the forgiveness of sins. And such is received through Faith in Christ Jesus to those who believe in Him.

And that's salvation, (the forgiveness of sins), as John the baptist's Father defined by the Spirit.

His father Zechariah was filled with the Holy Spirit and prophesied:
...
And you, my child, will be called a prophet of the Most High;
for you will go on before the Lord to prepare the way for him,
77to give his people the knowledge of salvation
through the forgiveness of their sins,
78because of the tender mercy of our God...

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, so that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.

 

[Pass-A-Gospel-Tract]

The grace of God, not sequence or water baptism, is the victory of this discussion in my mind.
And as was shown by others God chose to reconcile to Himself whether things on earth or heaven by the "blood" of Christ which Jesus shed for the forgiveness of sins. And such is received through Faith in Christ Jesus to those who believe in Him.

And that's salvation, (the forgiveness of sins), as John the baptist's Father defined by the Spirit.

His father Zechariah was filled with the Holy Spirit and prophesied:
...
And you, my child, will be called a prophet of the Most High;
for you will go on before the Lord to prepare the way for him,
77to give his people the knowledge of salvation
through the forgiveness of their sins,
78because of the tender mercy of our God...

When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, “Son, your sins are forgiven.”

to open their eyes and turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan to God, so that they may receive forgiveness of sins and a place among those who are sanctified by faith in me.

Again, I have to repeat and emphasize because you're probably jumping to conclusion, I don't have problem with your Salvation, you are a saved brethren or Paul called "Beloved" who received the Baptism of the Holy Ghost and who will go to Heaven based on your Testimony, but since you didn't "DO" the correct sequence of Baptism: Baptism of the Holy Ghost --> Water Baptism, your rewards in Heaven are on the line. You're not going to Hell, I Repeat, YOU are NOT going to Hell, but according to the scripture you will disappoint Jesus on His Judgement Seat for not doing His command.

 

[Randy]

Again, I have to repeat and emphasize because you're probably jumping to conclusion, I don't have problem with your Salvation, you are a saved brethren or Paul called "Beloved" who received the Baptism of the Holy Ghost and who will go to Heaven based on your Testimony, but since you didn't "DO" the correct sequence of Baptism: Baptism of the Holy Ghost --> Water Baptism, your rewards in Heaven are on the line. You're not going to Hell, I Repeat, YOU are NOT going to Hell, but according to the scripture you will disappoint Jesus on His Judgement Seat for not doing His command.

Any judgment given was in my favor as I have the Spirit of Christ in me which Jesus stated was given to those who "obey" Him. I have believed in and loved Jesus as far back as my memory goes. He "loves" me now. Its not going to change as I remain in Him.

I have read about storing up your treasure in heaven and in Hebrews those who are arrested and tortured refusing to be released seeking a better resurrection but I am not aware of a correct sequence of events in order to obtain a better resurrection. What extra rewards are you speaking of?

What God gives He gives freely. What you receive from man you may have to work hard to obtain.
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—


In my mind I have always considered myself baptized so I guess that speaks to my stance on infant baptism. Clearly that was just the start as I was steered to Christ from my beginning. That leading played a important role for me in believing and loving and praying to Jesus as far back as my memory goes. More so then any water baptism.

 

[Pass-A-Gospel-Tract]

Any judgment given was in my favor as I have the Spirit of Christ in me which Jesus stated was given to those who "obey" Him. I have believed in and loved Jesus as far back as my memory goes. He "loves" me now. Its not going to change as I remain in Him.

I have read about storing up your treasure in heaven and in Hebrews those who are arrested and tortured refusing to be released seeking a better resurrection but I am not aware of a correct sequence of events in order to obtain a better resurrection. What extra rewards are you speaking of?

What God gives He gives freely. What you receive from man you may have to work hard to obtain.
For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—


In my mind I have always considered myself baptized so I guess that speaks to my stance on infant baptism. Clearly that was just the start as I was steered to Christ from my beginning. That leading played a important role for me in believing and loving and praying to Jesus as far back as my memory goes. More so then any water baptism.

Ok then, at least I warned you about not getting parts of your rewards and treasures in Heaven

 

[Randy]

Ok then, at least I warned you about not getting parts of your rewards and treasures in Heaven

Whatever the Lord wants to give me He will give me.