That is really coolactually because YHWH means this God is whom you see when you take your first breath and the last breath.
this lost me...im now forced in such a state.
Join For His Glory for a discussion on how
https://christianforums.net/threads/a-vessel-of-honor.110278/
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
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That is really coolactually because YHWH means this God is whom you see when you take your first breath and the last breath.
this lost me...im now forced in such a state.
I really don't know what you are saying here but it is clear enough that aren't following what I am saying and presume far too much about my position.The sovereign, independent and intrinsic nature of God does not depend on those who do or do not recognize Him! Your view (and that of others) makes the nature of God dependent upon those who worship Him and calls into question the veracity of the apostles who told us who God is!
The only contradiction I see here is that you - who claim to be Christian - do not recognize the uniqueness of the gospel as it relates to the oneness of the Father and Christ!
God's nature is not subject to the vagaries of human doctrine!
When I asked: "is the Christian God the same God of Judaism?"Stormcrow said:Please point me to the post where I wrote I believed that the Jews worship God.
Here is one significant error in reasoning that is continually being made by several in this thread. Regardless of "their own ideas" and what has been revealed through Christ, it does not logically follow that they worship a different God. Christianity came from Judaism; Jesus was a Jew who worshiped the same God as the rest of the Jews and taught his followers to do likewise. The God of Christianity is the God of Judaism, who is YHWH. Just because Jews reject the fuller revelation of Jesus as the Messiah, God in human flesh, God's Son, does not mean that they worship a different God.Stormcrow said:They have their own ideas about who God is (just as Muslims do), but Christ's coming showed us the true nature of God. It's what the books of John and Romans are all about, which is why most new Christians are told to start reading the Bible there!
Jesus and Paul clearly disagree with you. You have to deal with what Scripture states.Stormcrow said:The proper response - Christian or otherwise - to murderous dogs who would threaten to kill innocent men, women, and children is to take them down. Period. I stand by what I wrote then and now.
No one is making that argument.Stormcrow said:One more point on this issue:
It does not logically follow that just because Jews and Muslims deny the Son that the God one claims to worship is, therefore, the same God the other claims to worship. The intrinsic nature of God Himself is that which defines God - not those who deny His Son.
No, of course not.Stormcrow said:If Hindus said Shiva were the God of the Old Testament, on the grounds that they, too, deny the Son, should we believe them?
As I stated above, rejecting the Sonship of Jesus which results in rejecting the Father, does not mean that there are two different Gods being talked about. To say that the Christian God is not the God of Judaism, is to say that the God of the OT is not the God of the NT. But that clearly is not the case.No i do not agree.... God is Who He is... We are not going to change God into what we want...He has stated He is a jealous God...
The Christian God has a Son to reject the Son is to reject the Father (He says so) To then say we worship the same God is to deny Christ. It is simple and complex at the same time. One can not turn God away from the Son. Doing so in our minds changes Who He is, in only our minds.
Originally Posted by Stormcrow
If Hindus said Shiva were the God of the Old Testament, on the grounds that they, too, deny the Son, should we believe them?
No, of course not.
Oh come on, this isn't that difficult. Put some thought into it.And yet that's EXACTLY what you expect us to believe about Islam.
As I stated above, rejecting the Sonship of Jesus which results in rejecting the Father, does not mean that there are two different Gods being talked about. To say that the Christian God is not the God of Judaism, is to say that the God of the OT is not the God of the NT. But that clearly is not the case.
Oh come on, this isn't that difficult. Put some thought into it.
Firstly, I have not made it personal. Secondly, you know very little of my position since most of my time has been trying to show errors in reasoning. There does seem to be a lot of presumption regarding my position, which is unfortunate but not surprising.I have. We have reached an impasse. I have no desire to get banned by a moderator for suggesting what I really think of your position and the manner in which you have made this personal. Therefore, I leave the field to you.
I believe you see this as discussion of the words. I see it as a discussion of the essences of God.
This is a question that has begged answer for me. There are many superfluous parallels between the two. I have picked up the Koran to find the character of Allah and there are many good things said in it. I think I found my answer.
Just like the Jesus of the Mormons is NOT the same Jesus that the NT teaches us about, the God of the Muslims is NOT the same God as the God of the OT.
Of course that doesn't mean that Mormons have created another Jesus, but only that they have created a false idea of Jesus. They'll be standing before Jesus in fig leaf aprons and magic underwear with all their 'good works', yet not know who He is.
Islam is similar in that it teaches a false idea of God. Now consider Nineveh in the time of Jonah. Clearly Nineveh was not Israel/Jewish, yet they were witnessed to by God through Jonah despite and because of their wickedness. They believed the warning and repented even though they could not "discern between their right hand and their left hand"; which means they could not actually know what behavior God wanted of them. Why? Because just like those trapped in Islam, the people of Nineveh had a false idea of God. They did not know God, yet the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob knew them.
*Plus they had cows
Paul warns in 2 Cor 11:4; For if someone comes to you and preaches a Jesus other than the Jesus we preached, or if you receive a different spirit from the Spirit you received, or a different gospel from the one you accepted, you put up with it easily enough.
The Mormons preach ALL three things, as do the Muslims.
Yes, but should we smite them or witness to them the same gospel that Paul did?
As I stated above, rejecting the Sonship of Jesus which results in rejecting the Father, does not mean that there are two different Gods being talked about. To say that the Christian God is not the God of Judaism, is to say that the God of the OT is not the God of the NT. But that clearly is not the case.