It is not in the Bible !?

[twinc]

I believe that Jesus is:
God the logos (John 1:1)
The logos made flesh (John 1:14)
The flesh God took on was that of a Jew, born under the Law.
So, as a Jew he honored His mother and Father as is holy and righteous.
As a Jew he was circumcised on the 8th day as is holy and righteous.
As a human being he ate and drank and had normal human functions. If He had not done so then He would have not been able to atone for the sins of man.

What denomination do you attend?
You dodged that question.
Please answer.

I believe that Jesus is:
God the logos (John 1:1)
The logos made flesh (John 1:14)
The flesh God took on was that of a Jew, born under the Law.
So, as a Jew he honored His mother and Father as is holy and righteous.
As a Jew he was circumcised on the 8th day as is holy and righteous.
As a human being he ate and drank and had normal human functions. If He had not done so then He would have not been able to atone for the sins of man.

What denomination do you attend?
You dodged that question.
Please answer.

what denomination do you attend - you dodged my question - please simply answer my question and not your question - ask yours as a post and it will be answered no doubt - twinc

 

[Papa Zoom]

yes it says Jesus Christ and of course this is so - but Jesus was human, like humans but without sin - twinc

The OP is this: "why is it believed or accepted if it is not in the bible that we must be born again"

Your argument twinc seems to be that the Bible says nothing about needing to be born again. But that's already been proven wrong. Do you still dispute this?

Also, no one here has argued that Jesus wasn't fully human. I'm looking for a larger point here from you and I'm not seeing it. Maybe you can clarify the purpose of the thread you started?

 

[twinc]

The OP is this: "why is it believed or accepted if it is not in the bible that we must be born again"

Your argument twinc seems to be that the Bible says nothing about needing to be born again. But that's already been proven wrong. Do you still dispute this?

Also, no one here has argued that Jesus wasn't fully human. I'm looking for a larger point here from you and I'm not seeing it. Maybe you can clarify the purpose of the thread you started?

all I ask is that my posts and scripture be not read in a slipshod manner - here what must not be missed is that I have clearly stated we = Christians - in defence I have stated that Jesus is/was fully human since it appears to be doubted by some - twinc

 

[civilwarbuff]

presumably you believe and have accepted and insist we accept that it was God who was circumcised and honoured His mother and father and as God did not need to eat and drink and have normal human functions etc - twinc

yes it says Jesus Christ and of course this is so - but Jesus was human, like humans but without sin - twinc

You seem to be edging closer and closer to saying Jesus was not God but simply a sinless man. If so, then just spit it out and people here can show you through scripture where you have been misled.

 

[joseph lentz]

A person "must" be Born Again to enter Heaven. However I have always wondered when the person is actually Born Again,immediately after conversion,or after a life of living for Christ. Jesus stated that "Only he that endures to the End will be saved". Could it be that Born Again is a work in progress.Take the Beatitudes,is each one describing a different person,or could they be stages,or steps we take to achieve Born Again.
2Peter 1:5-9 I think could also be steps in Christianity.

 

[GodsGrace]

Jesus as a Jew and human just like any other human/Jew had to be born again as a Christian via water and the spirit just as exactly as He said to Nicodemus etc - twinc

I believe what you're saying is that Jesus was born a Jew

But then had to become a Christian.

So, let's see, He was baptized, and He DID HAVE the Holy Spirit within Him.

So would this make Jesus a Christian??

He told Nicodemus one had to be born "from above".

Was Jesus born from above?

 

[GodsGrace]

A person "must" be Born Again to enter Heaven. However I have always wondered when the person is actually Born Again,immediately after conversion,or after a life of living for Christ. Jesus stated that "Only he that endures to the End will be saved". Could it be that Born Again is a work in progress.Take the Beatitudes,is each one describing a different person,or could they be stages,or steps we take to achieve Born Again.
2Peter 1:5-9 I think could also be steps in Christianity.

Hi,
I'm just going thru this now and this might have been answered already.

We are born again immediately. That is, we receive the spirit of God immediately upon our decision to love and serve Jesus, our Savior and our Lord. If He is our Lord that means that we must obey Him, or at least do our best to.

However, serving Jesus is a life-long journey. If we endure, and are STILL born again (serving God) at the end of our life, THEN we will receive our inheritance which is Heaven and an eternity with God.

The beatitudes:

It would be the ideal if we all had all the attributes of the beatitudes within our heart.
If you study each one, it would be very beneficial.
For instance, Blessed are the poor in spirit.
What does that mean exactly?
Just quick: It means those that understand how powerless they are and how much they need God.

We may or may not have all of them - we may or may not have all of them when we die, but we are on a journey and should have as many as possible for each individual.
Ditto for 2 Peter.

It would really help in answernig your questions to understand Justificiation and Sanctification.
I post this so many times, I fear some are growing tired of it.

Justification happens immediately. We are saved. It's a free gift of God. Only HE is doing the action of saving you.

Sanctification is a life-long process which is done in cooperation between you and God. The Holy Spirit empowers you to know sin, to sin as lilttle as possible, but YOU must cooperate since God never forces us to do anything against our will.

It's a spiritual journey...

 

[Douglas Summers]

Jesus as a Jew and human just like any other human/Jew had to be born again as a Christian via water and the spirit just as exactly as He said to Nicodemus etc - twinc

Jesus, as the Son of man is the human descendant of David. But He was also the Son of God according to the Spirit that he was born from and with. No Adamic nature, no human father. (Rom. 1:1-5) You will have to account for what you teach, but no born again believer will ever follow the teachings of LDS or JW or any other self willed belief

 

[joseph lentz]

Hi,
I'm just going thru this now and this might have been answered already.

We are born again immediately. That is, we receive the spirit of God immediately upon our decision to love and serve Jesus, our Savior and our Lord. If He is our Lord that means that we must obey Him, or at least do our best to.

However, serving Jesus is a life-long journey. If we endure, and are STILL born again (serving God) at the end of our life, THEN we will receive our inheritance which is Heaven and an eternity with God.

The beatitudes:

It would be the ideal if we all had all the attributes of the beatitudes within our heart.
If you study each one, it would be very beneficial.
For instance, Blessed are the poor in spirit.
What does that mean exactly?
Just quick: It means those that understand how powerless they are and how much they need God.

We may or may not have all of them - we may or may not have all of them when we die, but we are on a journey and should have as many as possible for each individual.
Ditto for 2 Peter.

It would really help in answernig your questions to understand Justificiation and Sanctification.
I post this so many times, I fear some are growing tired of it.

Justification happens immediately. We are saved. It's a free gift of God. Only HE is doing the action of saving you.

Sanctification is a life-long process which is done in cooperation between you and God. The Holy Spirit empowers you to know sin, to sin as lilttle as possible, but YOU must cooperate since God never forces us to do anything against our will.

It's a spiritual journey...

Thank you Wondering,that is the most clear reasoning and teaching I have heard in years.
Back to Beatitudes,the first realizing the need for God as a start,would the last one then be the ultimate goal?
I have heard a lot of people talk about how they are persecuted for Christ,but more often than not,it is just trouble they brought on themselves.

 

[twinc]

I believe what you're saying is that Jesus was born a Jew

But then had to become a Christian.

So, let's see, He was baptized, and He DID HAVE the Holy Spirit within Him.

So would this make Jesus a Christian??

He told Nicodemus one had to be born "from above".

Was Jesus born from above?

most keep missing out - because either they read/study scriptures in a slipshod manner or they just do not have ears to hear or eyes to see - so lets see where and whether it is stated Jesus was born from above and so are we if we have ears to hear and eyes to see Matt.3:17 - twinc

 

[civilwarbuff]

most keep missing out - because either they read/study scriptures in a slipshod manner or they just do not have ears to hear or eyes to see - so lets see where and whether it is stated Jesus was born from above and so are we if we have ears to hear and eyes to see Matt.3:17 - twinc

So, we get another 'non-answer'.......
The only 'slipshod manner' I have seen so far originates with you.....constantly dodging questions and giving non-answers.......I believe you are the one 'missing out'....

 

[joseph lentz]

most keep missing out - because either they read/study scriptures in a slipshod manner or they just do not have ears to hear or eyes to see - so lets see where and whether it is stated Jesus was born from above and so are we if we have ears to hear and eyes to see Matt.3:17 - twinc

Sure Jesus was Born from Above.......He was in Heaven and was Born by the Spirit through Mary.Everyone has heard the story of the Virgin Birth.He was conceived by the Spirit.Lol...that is truly being born from above.

 

[Not_Now.Soon]

A few things I've come across. Here ya go for anyone intreasted.

On Being Christian
Jesus said that He is the Way, and that no one comes to the Father except the Son. This can be found in the gospels. What I've also heard is that the early church called themselves "Followers of the Way," or something of that sort. The term Christian was applied to them as either in a mocking form or an insult, but that term stuck and now we call ourselves Christian because indeed we follow Jesus. (Or at the very least we believe in Jesus).

On Being Born Again
It's already been stated where Jesus explained we need to be born of the Spirit. That's no qualms with. (Or we shouldn't have any issues with it. Sorry twinc I don't know where you're coming from on that angle.) What can be questioned and wondered about is when we are born again.

The few parts that come to mind are:
A) when we are saved. Believe in Jesus and be saved. The thief on the cross who accepted Jesus was assured by Jesus that he would be in paradise.
B) When we are babitized. No one will see the Kingdom unless born of water and born of the spirit. (Though I've heard an interptation that born of water means the physical birth as the water breaks, instead of the example Jesus gave and was baptized Himself.)
C) When we show spiritual gifts/spiritual understanding/spiritual works. The Apstoles were baptized with the Spirit on Pentecost. But also Jesus sent out his followers to the towns in pairs to spread the gospel that the Kingdom of Heaven is near. When they returned from their journey they were excited by what had happened that they could heal and cast out demons. Jesus at that time told Them that they ahold rejoice not just because they can cast out demons, but because they were citizens of Heaven (or that their names were written in Heaven.) (Luke 10)
D) No one knows. In the same conversation with Nicodemus that Jesus said you must be born of the spirit (John 3), Jesus also explained concerning those born again to be like the wind. (John 3:8. The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”)

A, B, and D are taught in the conversation with Nicodemus in John 3. C is something that is evidenced in people's lives that is commonly assoicated with being born of the Spirit. It's something we should all look forward to, but hopefully hold onto hope even if we don't recieve those spiritual gifts.

On Jesus
Consider Jesus's life. He was born from a virgin, and thus it was a spirit conceived birth if nothing less. He was baptized and witnessed by John to have the Holy Spirit rest on Him like a dove. If Jesus was not Born of the Spirit before His birth as a child, He was baptized and baptized with the Holy Spirit as an adult to be an example for us as well.

 

[Papa Zoom]

Yeah! I get to put my mod hat on again! :nod
1. All posts are to be given "with gentleness and respect." Treat others as you wish to be treated, "so that, when you are slandered, those who revile your good behavior in Christ may be put to shame."

2. Focus on the issue being debated. Do not direct your comments toward the member and make the discussion personal if you disagree with what's been said.

So address issues only, not people (especially the over-generalizations - it's stealth for "everyone else but me") ;) Otherwise it's <----this is me.

Ok, Mod Hat Off 2

oh and please don't reply to this post

 

[Eugene]

.
Mt 5:3-11
http://www.gracegod.com/Study Books/Matthew - Biography of the King.pdf
NOTE: The Grace and Glory Study books are in PDF format and can be read with the free Adobe Reader

Characteristics of the Kingdom Chapters Five to Seven
In chapters five to seven, we have the constitution of the kingdom and its laws unfolded. The
character of those who shall possess the kingdom is first dwelt upon. Notice that it is "the earth"
which these "meek" shall inherit. "The Sermon on the mount" was not given to Christians. It is
simply the law of Moses intensely spiritualized by One who understands its every requirement,
and who knew what the holy law of God demanded. No honest heart who truly listens to the
Sermon on the mount will ever claim righteousness by the keeping of it. When the times of
"'restoration of all things" has come (Acts 3:21), then these requirements of Christ's kingdom will
be enforced in the earth, when all men are under the sway and rule of God. The Assembly
Gospel is that to which we should hearken today, not the Gospel of the Kingdom. But until Christ
died as our Substitute, bearing in His own body the guilt of our sins because of God's broken law,
the Gospel of grace was not possible. We have a different calling and are on a far different
footing than were Israel under law. To preach this sermon to the unsaved, unless for the purpose
of showing them the demands of law and thus convicting them of their lack of this righteousness,
is to wrongfully divide the Word of God. It is only Christians that know experimentally their
deliverance from law, who can enter by the power of the Holy Spirit into the precepts contained in
these wonderful utterances of the Messiah of Israel.

Yet this does not imply that there is no application to ourselves in this sermon by the King: but we
have received a fuller revelation which completes or unfolds this partial one, even as the higher
blessings transcend the lower. God is ever the same. His principles do not change. He has
blessed the Church with "all spiritual blessings in the heavenlies in Christ." Therefore to take from
Israel, what is distinctly her own, is but to impoverish her without enriching ourselves. We have
the better part, the higher destiny; let us go on to learn of it and thus rightfully divide the Word of
God.

 

[Jim Parker]

what denomination do you attend - you dodged my question - please simply answer my question and not your question - ask yours as a post and it will be answered no doubt - twinc

Hmmmmmm
Just curious - of offense meant... Is English a second language for you?

 

[th1b.taylor]

From the YLT: for God did so love the world, that His Son--the only begotten--He gave, that every one who is believing in him may not perish, but may have life age-during. For God did not send His Son to the world that he may judge the world, but that the world may be saved through him; he who is believing in him is not judged, but he who is not believing hath been judged already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (John 3:16-18 [YLT])

 

[th1b.taylor]

From the YLT: for God did so love the world, that His Son--the only begotten--He gave, that every one who is believing in him may not perish, but may have life age-during. For God did not send His Son to the world that he may judge the world, but that the world may be saved through him; he who is believing in him is not judged, but he who is not believing hath been judged already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God. (John 3:16-18 [YLT])

Jesus was telling Nicodemus he must be born again,

 

[Pegasus]

yes it says Jesus Christ and of course this is so - but Jesus was human, like humans but without sin - twinc

I think you said you were Catholic. Catholics believe Jesus Christ is One Person with two natures.

 

[civilwarbuff]

It appears twink has abandoned another thread.....