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Jesus' DNA

  • Thread starter Thread starter paulo75
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Pogo said:
Uuuhh...Alabaster,

I'm afraid that I'm severely unimpressed with the Ron Wyatt site.

Oh boy. There's a name I was hoping not to see again (or atleast not used as a source for "absolute proof" of anything). Ron Wyatt has made many "intriguing" discoveries, including chariot wheels at the bottom of the Red Sea (covered in sea coral - as seen in the pictures he provided) - which I'm still stratling the fence on to be honest (I won't dismiss it off handedly as it *might* be a legitimate marine archeological discovery), but too many of his discoveries are uncorroborated and often are hyped, and thus one bad apple (or many in this case) ruins the whole bunch. His fringe scholarship has led to him not being taken seriously.

Although, he also has claimed to have found Noah's Ark in Turkey - so old the wood has turned to stone (fossilized), but in this case others actually partly agree with him (sceptical - but curious, though the location is about as hard to physically reach at Mt. Everest's peak [exaggerating a little]) that it is indeed some sort of boat or wooden structure because we have actual satelite photos of the "object" (see National Geographic's article on it). Pilots in military Air Craft flying over that site back around World War 2 (I believe) reported seeing it, and satelite images have been taken of it. But the problem is, none of this stuff hits main stream - and thus it is never sufficiently scrutinized, and then when people try to cite Wyatt for proof (as I once did) they shoot themselves in the foot because dissenters point out some of Wyatt's other not-so-convincing "finds" and/or theories. It's kinda playing with fire with Wyatt. He may not be completely off his rocker (the man got thrown in an Arabian prison for several months without hearing for "trespassing" just to find his artifacts that he says he has discovered - so I have no doubt the man is determined and sincere), but I just think in more than one thing he was mistaken - but it's hard to prove to other people some areas where his finds may (and I mean 'may' in the most ambiguous sense possible ;)) have been legitimate (like the chariot wheels, and the remains of the ark) because he has sort of sullied his reputation by claiming to have found one too many important things.

That's my take on Ron Wyatt. Interesting man? Certainly. The man will always fascinate me. Credible? Well like the tragic irony of the boy who cried wolf, when he actually hits something worth looking at, it's often too late. He also has found some interesting pillars on either side of the red sea, one matching the other which I have pictures of. It bugs me that no one other than him has looked at it (I wish they would - I think someone would find that he has found a few things genuine amidst his plenteous finds & theories) and taken interest in it, but it's difficult to make a credible statement on his finds. So though I find his "discoveries" intriguiging, I take them with a grain of salt.
 
Read here for a rather fair & balanced view on Ron Wyatt.

I agree with their summary up top:

Much of this eRumor is based on the findings of Ron Wyatt, a colorful and controversial amateur archeologist who claimed to have found Noah's ark...
...
He was a passionate and sincere man, according to his supporters,

And he truely was passionate and sincere, as I said above.

but his critics abound and scientists and archeologists regarded him as an untrained maverick at best and there are some who regarded his as a fraud. Wyatt died from cancer in 1999.

It is also true that some people straddle between just calling him "untrained" with only partial credibility, and those who called him an outright huckster.

But as I said, in so many words, I don't think all his discovereies were false, but certainly all were not true.

P.S. Watch this YouTube video here for interesting video taken from some of Wyatt's video documentaries he made. I still don't know what to make of Jabal al-Lawz's blackened peak. It's proabably just some mineral - but like many Archeological sites of great importance like, uh, even the Temple Mount itself, Arab's & Muslims control the site and will not allow archeologists on site (willingly - they could sneak in, at their own peril). But its all very facinating to me.

God Bless,

~Josh
 
This video is a little creepy the way the lady narrates it, but it has many peculiarities about it on site where Ron Wyatt once was. The glyphs I believe are really there (not made up and drawn recently), but I think it a great strech of the imagination to think that they actually were written by the Israelites. Many ancient tribes lived in the desert and many had contact with ancient Egypt. The Unites States' own Los Lunas inscriptions afford us a mystery of our own of how ancient glyphs were written on the rocks there. So glyphs on rocks in obscure places are not really unprecedented.

----------------------

Wow, sorry. One person had to go and mention Ron Wyatt, and now look at what you made me do! :P
 
I know how people feel about Ron Wyatt. i am not adamant about him, but I love his love of the Lord, and I really found it exciting that living blood was discovered with 24 chromosomes. I just something interesting to ponder, because I believe Jesus would have 24 chromosomes.
 
Alabaster, what reason beside this "discovery" do you have for believing that Jesus would have 24 chromosomes?
 
Blazin Bones said:
Alabaster, what reason beside this "discovery" do you have for believing that Jesus would have 24 chromosomes?

None, It just rang true to my spirit when I was first confronted with it. My soul said, "Aha!"
 
I don't mean to be rude Alabaster, but that's what many people say when they claim homosexuality isn't a sin, or that Evolution must be fact. They don't have rational ideas or facts that guide their beliefs, they just choose to believe the notion because,"aha, that sounds good to me."
 
Blazin Bones said:
I don't mean to be rude Alabaster, but that's what many people say when they claim homosexuality isn't a sin, or that Evolution must be fact. They don't have rational ideas or facts that guide their beliefs, they just choose to believe the notion because,"aha, that sounds good to me."

That's not so. The Spirit in me stirred when I was confronted with it.

Sinners who want to reason away their perversion or their anti-God beliefs have nothing in common with someone who loves and serves God and ponders Jesus Christ' as Immanuel.

So, pardon me if I do consider your inquiry as rude, trying to sniff out a quack. I am not.
 
Alabaster said:
That's not so. The Spirit in me stirred when I was confronted with it.

Sinners who want to reason away their perversion or their anti-God beliefs have nothing in common with someone who loves and serves God and ponders Jesus Christ' as Immanuel.

So, pardon me if I do consider your inquiry as rude, trying to sniff out a quack. I am not.

Alabaster, there are hundreds if not thousands of God fearing, quite possibly saved individuals who believe in either evolution or that Homosexuality is genetically determined and thus not a sin. I would not be the least bit surprised if you meet a Christian who is otherwise solid in their beliefs who supports a form of theistic evolution which is just as baseless as your 24 chromosome belief.

It is not rude at all to suggest there is a common ground between the three ideologies. I used to believe in my spirit I was the next Billy Graham. I laid that idea before God, even though I was 100 percent sure I was going to be the next Billy Graham, and sure enough God showed me I am only another servant who must desire to serve him with my all, and that any fame I may receive should be laid again at the feet of Christ, not in honor of Billy Graham.

So, while you may feel in your spirit that you are correct, what evidence beyond that do you have. Ron Wyatt's account is not definitive, so how can you hold to such an idea?

If you feel I'm attacking you, I apologize, but I do not see how one can arrive at such a belief? If your belief is correct, than why doesn't the spirit give this revelation to all his people?
 
Blazin Bones said:
Alabaster said:
That's not so. The Spirit in me stirred when I was confronted with it.

Sinners who want to reason away their perversion or their anti-God beliefs have nothing in common with someone who loves and serves God and ponders Jesus Christ' as Immanuel.

So, pardon me if I do consider your inquiry as rude, trying to sniff out a quack. I am not.

Alabaster, there are hundreds if not thousands of God fearing, quite possibly saved individuals who believe in either evolution or that Homosexuality is genetically determined and thus not a sin. I would not be the least bit surprised if you meet a Christian who is otherwise solid in their beliefs who supports a form of theistic evolution which is just as baseless as your 24 chromosome belief.


LOL! No Christian would believe that what God finds detestable is not a sin!

It is not rude at all to suggest there is a common ground between the three ideologies. I used to believe in my spirit I was the next Billy Graham. I laid that idea before God, even though I was 100 percent sure I was going to be the next Billy Graham, and sure enough God showed me I am only another servant who must desire to serve him with my all, and that any fame I may receive should be laid again at the feet of Christ, not in honor of Billy Graham.
God is great--no one can put us in our place better than He.

So, while you may feel in your spirit that you are correct, what evidence beyond that do you have. Ron Wyatt's account is not definitive, so how can you hold to such an idea?

I already said:
"I know how people feel about Ron Wyatt. i am not adamant about him"

I have a choice, and I chose to accept what he says he discovered. If I am right, great. If I am wrong, oh well.


If you feel I'm attacking you, I apologize, but I do not see how one can arrive at such a belief? If your belief is correct, than why doesn't the spirit give this revelation to all his people?

1. Oh well.
2. I don't know. It is not for me to judge that.
 
Blazin Bones said:
Alabaster, there are hundreds if not thousands of God fearing, quite possibly saved individuals who believe in either evolution or that Homosexuality is genetically determined and thus not a sin. I would not be the least bit surprised if you meet a Christian who is otherwise solid in their beliefs who supports a form of theistic evolution which is just as baseless as your 24 chromosome belief.

Tim, I think you're being modest. I would estimate that number to be in the millions.

Gabriel
 
Gabriel Ali said:
[quote="Blazin Bones":ffc5rz23]

Alabaster, there are hundreds if not thousands of God fearing, quite possibly saved individuals who believe in either evolution or that Homosexuality is genetically determined and thus not a sin. I would not be the least bit surprised if you meet a Christian who is otherwise solid in their beliefs who supports a form of theistic evolution which is just as baseless as your 24 chromosome belief.

Tim, i think you're being modest. I would estimate that number to be in the millions.

Gabriel[/quote:ffc5rz23]

No, NOT millions of Christians believe in Evolution, OR believe that homosexuality is not the abomination that God says it is. Christians follow the Word. We know what God says. So, trying to put out a false idea that millions of Christians are diluted and polluted with false beliefs, is highly suspect that the one who says these things is up to one's eyeballs in the deception.

The Church of Jesus Christ knows which end is up.
 
Alabaster said:
Gabriel Ali said:
[quote="Blazin Bones":1kevl3ku]

Alabaster, there are hundreds if not thousands of God fearing, quite possibly saved individuals who believe in either evolution or that Homosexuality is genetically determined and thus not a sin. I would not be the least bit surprised if you meet a Christian who is otherwise solid in their beliefs who supports a form of theistic evolution which is just as baseless as your 24 chromosome belief.

Tim, i think you're being modest. I would estimate that number to be in the millions.

Gabriel

No, NOT millions of Christians believe in Evolution, OR believe that homosexuality is not the abomination that God says it is. Christians follow the Word. We know what God says. So, trying to put out a false idea that millions of Christians are diluted and polluted with false beliefs, is highly suspect that the one who says these things is up to one's eyeballs in the deception.

The Church of Jesus Christ knows which end is up.
[/quote:1kevl3ku]

Correct me if I'm wrong (I wont be offended) are you saying that you suspect me of being a gay Christian evolutionist? :lol

I know a lot more Christians who believe that evolution is fact, than Christians who believe the earth to be young. The Vicar at the Church I attend believes evolution to be fact. Their views have nothing to do with mine.
 
Alabaster said:
No, NOT millions of Christians believe in Evolution, OR believe that homosexuality is not the abomination that God says it is. Christians follow the Word. We know what God says. So, trying to put out a false idea that millions of Christians are diluted and polluted with false beliefs, is highly suspect that the one who says these things is up to one's eyeballs in the deception.

The Church of Jesus Christ knows which end is up.

No we don't? If God's church knew which way was up, then there would be no need for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. As it is, we are still prone to sin, and constanly need the guidance of the Holy Spirit to guide us in a right path. Even so, how many Christians do you know are always thinking about the things of God? And then, even if you do know of a few who are close, how many always act according to God's will?

Alabaster, Christians still sin and Christians still hold ideas that are contrary to God's truth revealed in His Word, to say otherwise rejects the reality of Life. This does not make it right to believe in Evolution or believe that Homosexuality is not an abomination and a sin before God, but that does not change that there are plenty of Christians who do.

As for the 24 chromosome theory, God is not a God of confusion, so again, why would He not have compelled Ron to release this data into a more public arena for verification?
 
Blazin Bones said:
No we don't? If God's church knew which way was up, then there would be no need for the indwelling of the Holy Spirit. As it is, we are still prone to sin, and constanly need the guidance of the Holy Spirit to guide us in a right path. Even so, how many Christians do you know are always thinking about the things of God? And then, even if you do know of a few who are close, how many always act according to God's will?


Pardon me, but the CHURCH (capital C) is indwelt and baptized in the Holy Spirit. We know which end is up because of Him. Knowing Him, there is no reason to trust in vain philosophies of man.

Most believers I know personally are consecrated to God, and do not espouse popular worldly theories. I am talking about hundreds of believers...maybe even thousands.


Alabaster, Christians still sin and Christians still hold ideas that are contrary to God's truth revealed in His Word, to say otherwise rejects the reality of Life. This does not make it right to believe in Evolution or believe that Homosexuality is not an abomination and a sin before God, but that does not change that there are plenty of Christians who do.

CHRISTIANS who are serious about knowing God need to realize we are charged with having the mind of God. It's time to start using it. Those who believe such errors need to give their heads a shake, get into the Word and submit their thinking to God Almighty, and not professor Joe Blow. Wake up, I say.

1 Corinthians 2:14-16
But people who aren’t spiritual can’t receive these truths from God’s Spirit. It all sounds foolish to them and they can’t understand it, for only those who are spiritual can understand what the Spirit means. Those who are spiritual can evaluate all things, but they themselves cannot be evaluated by others. For,

“Who can know the Lord’s thoughts?
Who knows enough to teach him?â€Â

But we understand these things, for we have the mind of Christ.



As for the 24 chromosome theory, God is not a God of confusion, so again, why would He not have compelled Ron to release this data into a more public arena for verification?

God compelled Ron to keep the info for a later reveal. That is what he said.

Perhaps you can ask Israel's antiquities bureau why they keep the site under guard? Maybe it is because those who try to enter become very ill? Die? Angelic guards are hard to get past, I should think.

Anyhoo--this is speculation, and not worth the argument. I only threw it out there for a little marvel at what God very well could have done.
 
Gabriel Ali said:
Correct me if i'm wrong (i wont be offended) are you saying that you suspect me of being a gay Christian evolutionist? :lol:

I know a lot more Christians who believe that evolution is fact, than Christians who believe the earth to be young. The Vicar at the Church i attend believes evolution to be fact. their views have nothing to do with mine.


I hope you are praying for that poor vicar...
 
Alabaster said:
Gabriel Ali said:
Correct me if i'm wrong (i wont be offended) are you saying that you suspect me of being a gay Christian evolutionist? :lol:

I know a lot more Christians who believe that evolution is fact, than Christians who believe the earth to be young. The Vicar at the Church i attend believes evolution to be fact. their views have nothing to do with mine.


I hope you are praying for that poor vicar...

No....but i'll ask him and the rest of the congregation to say a prayer for you.
 
Just out of curiosity is it possible that Jesus had neither human male DNA nor human female DNA? Is it beyond the ability of the supernatural to create a life on earth devoid of human DNA? Was Adam created with the DNA of another human? In that Jesus is the "last Adam" was it necessary He be created with human DNA?

The reason I ask these questions is that the evidence is clear that man's sinfulness is part of his DNA. We are born sinners. Anyone with a two-year old and a cookie jar can attest to this! If Jesus was born with any human DNA would that mean He was born with the ability or propensity to sin?

Pogo said:
Originally posted by paulo75 -

My understanding of DNA is that one gets 50% of your DNA from one parent and 50% from the other. So, my question is, if Jesus was born of a virgin, where did the other 50% of his DNA come from?
My understanding of DNA is that one gets 50% of your DNA from one parent and 50% from the other. So, my question is, if Jesus was born of a virgin, where did the other 50% of his DNA come from?

Hello, paulo75 -

I'm sorry, but I see your premise as being heavily, majorly, flawed!

Why do you see a virgin birth as excluding the use of the mother's egg?

In my view, the only requirement for a virgin birth would be an intact hymen past the point of conception.

The supernatural event would be the fertilization of the mother's egg without conventional penetration (or even unconventional penetration, such as "in vitro") of the mother's body, from the ovaries on down, by mortal man!

Whether Mary and Joseph were intimate past this point, or after this fact, seems irrelevant to me.

In Christ,

Pogo

EDIT: Hmm...Upon re-reading the OP, I'm not sure which DNA source paulo75 is questioning!

Please clarify paulo75, is your issue with the DNA of Jesus concerning His divine Father, or His virgin mother?
 
RND said:
Just out of curiosity is it possible that Jesus had neither human male DNA nor human female DNA? Is it beyond the ability of the supernatural to create a life on earth devoid of human DNA? Was Adam created with the DNA of another human? In that Jesus is the "last Adam" was it necessary He be created with human DNA?

The reason I ask these questions is that the evidence is clear that man's sinfulness is part of his DNA. We are born sinners. Anyone with a two-year old and a cookie jar can attest to this! If Jesus was born with any human DNA would that mean He was born with the ability or propensity to sin?

Anything is possible with God. Although He had never committed one Himself I do believe that Jesus Christ was capable of sin just as we all are, otherwise what was the point of the temptation in the desert? Christ's actions while he was with us in the flesh are all the more amazing because of his humanity.
 
I agree that Jesus was capable of sin but that he wasn't born with "original sin."

Gabriel Ali said:
RND said:
Just out of curiosity is it possible that Jesus had neither human male DNA nor human female DNA? Is it beyond the ability of the supernatural to create a life on earth devoid of human DNA? Was Adam created with the DNA of another human? In that Jesus is the "last Adam" was it necessary He be created with human DNA?

The reason I ask these questions is that the evidence is clear that man's sinfulness is part of his DNA. We are born sinners. Anyone with a two-year old and a cookie jar can attest to this! If Jesus was born with any human DNA would that mean He was born with the ability or propensity to sin?

Anything is possible with God. Although He had never commited one Himself i do believe that Jesus Christ was capable of sin just as we all are, otherwise what was the point of the temptation in the desert? Christs actions while he was with us in the flesh are all the more amazing because of his humanity.
 
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