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Bible Study Lets Talk About God's Will to heal.

So in a nutshell Mike, Job was being punished for being the greatest believer on the earth?
New American Standard Bible
The LORD said to Satan, "Have you considered My servant Job? For there is no one like him on the earth, a blameless and upright man, fearing God and turning away from evil."

All your words and long winded theory hinge on,"Job gave satan a place." What verse is this?
Job........
First I write a small out line of what is in question and then quote scripture that show what i am saying. Please follow through this and see for your self.
The first thing we learn about Job is the Blessing of God was working in his life. We have all agreed on this point. We know Job was wealthy in finances and live stock and spiritually. Job lived by faith in the blessing of God and then his children grew up.

Once his children grew up he began to fret and worry every time his children got together and had a party. He worried in fear that his children were sinning against God.

Job developed such a terror about this that every time one of them had a party or get together, well Job sent and sanctified them, and rose up early in the morning, and offered burnt offerings according to the number of them all: FOR JOB SAID, it may be that my sons have sinned and cursed God in their hearts. Thus did Job continually. (job1:5)


We see in Job1:5 that he was obsessed with the fact his children might have cursed God and sinned against God.

We see in .....that the thing which I greatly feared is come upon me......I was not in safety.....neither had I rest......neither was I quiet.....yet trouble came.....

I broke these two scriptures down this way so as to make it easier to see.

1. the thing which I greatly feared has come upon me.....
Job stepped out of walking by Faith in God and stepped into walking into fear of his children sinning against God and cursing God.

2. I was not in safety.........
This is saying that Job was not walking in Faith of God and under the blessing of God...Once you step out into fear..you have left out from under the blessing....his fear over his children sinning against God was bigger in his thinking then his remembering of Gods protection of the blessing.

3. Neither had I rest.........
Why did Job say he had no rest ? Easy he was to busy worrying about his children.....he was up all night worrying.....he had lost his peace in God, once he stepped out into fear and doubt.

4. Neither was I quiet......Job ran his mouth...speaking words of fear and doubt and worry.....remember he has stepped out of the safety place of God and His blessing. See every one of us falls right into this every time we allow our words to speak anything other then the word of God or another words faith filled words.

5. yet trouble came..... job thought he was doing right by his family by worrying and thought he was being responsible and this happens to many believers.

Ok Next is the conversation between God and satin.....

First a few points....all the devil knew was this man had the blessing over him and the devil described it as a hedge of protection. The devil wanted Job all along to curse God and that is why he even had an interest in Job.

Now lets look at two verses here.

Doth Job fear God for nought? Has not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all he hath on every side? Thou has blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land. BUT put forth thine hand now and touch all that he hath and he will CURSE you to thy face.

And the Lord said unto satin, Behold all that he hath is in thy power: only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So satin went froth from the presence of the Lord.

We can see two things .
1..the devil had wanted Job to curse God from the beginning.
........This is why Job was speaking in all that fear about his children sinning and cursing God...That is how our enemy works,,,,he has to get us to speak out against what the word of God says... Then he has the right to enter into the situation.....even jobs wife eventually sided with satin and told Job to just give up and cures God.( job2:9 ) ...Man that is easy to see where she got that idea from..........However in all Job did say, He never cursed God. THATS WHY WE READ.....In ALL this did not Job sin with his lips. ( )

2....The second thing we learn here in these two verses is this.....
God did not tell the devil, "Here I put Job into your hands and you do what ever you want".
The devil was poorly mistaken to even suggest such a thing because God was in no way going to stretch out His hand against Job. God NEVER agreed with satin to what satin suggested.

HOWEVER GOD DID SAY THIS......"BEHOLD he is already in your hand"
We don't use the word Behold much at all these days. I mean when was the last time you heard some one say BEHOLD is not this car beautiful ?

Now if you look up this word "Behold" in any of the translations such as Hebrew or Greek or English or Spanish or any other translation...YOU WILL LEARN that it ALWAYS MEANS " Look and see. Wake up and pay attention"

See God was telling satan that JOB had already opened the door to him or had given satan the right to do as he wanted to do. God was simply telling the devil the truth....Job had already tore down the protective hedge around him ( the blessing of God) when he stepped out into fear and worry and doubt. HOWEVER God did sent a boundary.....spare his life or another words satin could do whatever....EXCEPT....KILL JOB...

The once satan finally grasped that Job had stepped out of or lost the blessing this protective hedge...well you know the story....satin with after job with vengeance.

Then Job ran his mouth complaining about everything but still NEVER CURSED GOD......Funny how this story ends.....God sends a preacher to preach some sense back into job.......AND once Job repented of his errors...God restored the blessing back and Job increased in all.

I hope this helps some of you understand what many have been trying to show you...
Have thee most blessed and wonderful week end
Jim
 
Galatians 4:13-14 As you know, it was because of an illness that I first preached the gospel to you. Even though my illness was a trial to you, you did not treat me with contempt or scorn. Instead, you welcomed me as if I were an angel of God as if I were Christ Jesus himself.

Here is the entire scripture reference to what was partially posted.....makes better sense this way
Galatians 4:13-16 KJV ; )
13...Ye know how through infirmity of the flesh I preached the gospel unto you at the first.
14...And my temptation which was in my flesh, ye despised not, nor rejected; but received me as an angel of God, even as Christ Jesus.
15..Where is then the blessedness ye spoke of? for I bear you record, that, if it had been possible, ye would have plucked out your own eyes, and have given them to me.
16.. Am I therefore become your enemy, because i tell you the truth?
 
Then explain cancer or the common cold for that matter.

.

Because cancer, colds and all the other crap are in the world Mr Gary. Sin is free roaming in the world.
You have to be a born again believer filled with the spirit of God to get what Christ Jesus did for us to work.
The written word never said this crap wont come to your house. The written word says that no weapon formed against you will prosper or run it's full course or kill you. BUT you have to know and believe and have faith that is built up and not doubting to see these things healed.

Explain why you think because there is evil in this world that we have not be delivered from it ?
 
Rollo I see another REAL PROBLEM here. It is when people try to correct others who bring truth and yet have things totally wrong. Anything from the OT talking about Christ Jesus is right on the money and right today. This includes Isaiah 53. You really belive because it says ye were healed makes any changes in this ?

Christ Jesus shed His blood on that Cross....What was written before or after about this is good for all time. Ye were healed.......This means every time you have an issue it has been covered by the blood shed on the cross.
The prophets of old spoke about the coming Christ and what he was to do and so forth. It is words given by God and those words are just as true today asd the day they were spoken.....
You're way off base.
If what you say is true, then do you live it?
Have you ever seen a person with acne on their face?
Did you lay hands on them, cast the acne out of them, and see it disappear?
Of course not, you don't believe it could happen.
Ever see a cripple?
Did you say to them, "I don't have any money but what I have, I give you. In the name of Jesus, get up and walk".
I don't think you would dare try such a thing because you don't have the faith to believe that God would do it.
How many blind people have you met?
How many of them got their sight back after you laid hands on them?
Please give me some answers before you tell me that I have a real problem.
 
...comedic brake.
But officer, I had the brakes checked just last week.
images
 
You're way off base.
If what you say is true, then do you live it?
Have you ever seen a person with acne on their face?
Did you lay hands on them, cast the acne out of them, and see it disappear?
Of course not, you don't believe it could happen.
Ever see a cripple?
Did you say to them, "I don't have any money but what I have, I give you. In the name of Jesus, get up and walk".
I don't think you would dare try such a thing because you don't have the faith to believe that God would do it.
How many blind people have you met?
How many of them got their sight back after you laid hands on them?
Please give me some answers before you tell me that I have a real problem.
I, having, laid hands on and prayed for people and having seen miraculous healing always include one statement, "If it be Thy will LORD." You have touched the heart of the issue with the Healing Ministries. I have laid hands on, I have prayed, I have seen "some" healed and I am responsible for nothing!

Believe me, Rollo, if I could I would heal us both and I would shut down every hospital within fifty miles of my home. When people go forward at the healings and they are told told their faith is not strong enough to be healed, it does not do the work of building them up, quite the opposite, it destroys some. And if faith is from God, as the scriptures teach, the idea that their faith is not strong enough can and to often does run down two paths. They begin to think God does not love them because the measure of faith they were given is to small, making God evil and faith becomes a work, so by logical extension, is salvation not of works also.

Far, far to many folks do not study the bible 365 days a year, the way I did until I became so weak that remaining awake is laborious but that can be for a multitude of reasons. Are they not as saved as me foolishness, sheer foolishness.

Hang tight brother.
 
1 Tim 5:23~~New American Standard Bible
No longer drink water exclusively, but use a little wine for the sake of your stomach and your frequent ailments.

2 Tim 4:20~~New American Standard Bible
Erastus remained at Corinth, but Trophimus I left sick at Miletus.

1 Cor 11:30~~New American Standard Bible
For this reason many among you are weak and sick, and a number sleep.

These believers were made weak, became ill and even died(sleep) according to Gods will.

According to 1 Cor 11:30, God does not always heal.

Your references all pertain to sickness because the people mentioned were not obeying the words of Jesus. Timothy had stomach problems because he was drinking only water, no wine, because he thought it would be better if he abstained from wine. Many of the wells in those area's were contaminated by the under ground water supply because they had no toilets, just out-houses. It was a known fact at that time that wine purifies water, thus Paul's exhortation.

Your reference to the Lord's Supper, or communion was that the people were not serious about the respecting and honoring the communion. They were having "party time", Therefore they became sick....Sin, in many cases produces sickness, not all but some. James chapter five has the remedy.

As far as Trophimus being left sick, I can't comment on that because Scripture is silent. All I can say is that Paul needed to get going and someone else was in charge of the healing, only opinions here, and opinions are worth nothing.
 
Believe me, Rollo, if I could I would heal us both and I would shut down every hospital within fifty miles of my home. When people go forward at the healings and they are told told their faith is not strong enough to be healed, it does not do the work of building them up, quite the opposite, it destroys some. And if faith is from God, as the scriptures teach, the idea that their faith is not strong enough can and to often does run down two paths. They begin to think God does not love them because the measure of faith they were given is to small, making God evil and faith becomes a work, so by logical extension, is salvation not of works also.
Agreed...
 
Hello all my friends. You know that I love you all, and that was my purpose in starting this thread in the first place. I have been picking Brother Mikes brain on the subject of healing. You see, I have personally been involved in Many, I said, many physical healing of various situations from children, adults, and even pets. Because I also saw failure, I wanted to know more about this subject so my faith would increase and I could see more. Especially in my frequent infirmities.

The good news is that, following Brother Mikes teachings, I have learned crucial facts that are so very valuable....I was hoping that all of you would take my challenge to search the Scriptures to find as many verses on healing that would in turn build your faith so that when needed, you could see someone that you value who is sick, be healed. I applaud those of you who have done just that. For one, Deb13 has blessed my heart with her positive posts.

Now, some of you persist in presenting negative posts on healing. Hey, if that is your position, than hang with it. If you want to get sick with no hope, that's your business. It certainly is not mine. My Wife's twin Sister Nancy has had a report from the doctors that she has terminal cancer and will only live one more year. She also has failing kidneys....Am I going to sit by and watch her die? NO WAY. I have anointed her with oil and prayed over her and not only me, but others are seeing miraculous results. I believe with all my heart that God is ridding her body of cancer, and bad kidneys.

Again, thank all of you for presenting healing Scriptures, there are many more than the ones that appear to say no. God bless you all with Peace and Grace.
 
Now, some of you persist in presenting negative posts on healing. Hey, if that is your position, than hang with it. If you want to get sick with no hope, that's your business.
I had been thinking about this thread and thought that I would chime in with an encouragement today that nobody should walk away from this discussion thinking they should not pray for healing.
 
then why does the bible say this in james. say not we shall do this or that? but if the lord wills we shall do this or that? for tomorrow isn't promised. does that mean death by cancer is impossible? I think not, we are ordained a life whatever god wants to live or not. your message says all men that have enough faith will live to 120 jewish years. which isn't really what the book of james implies.

With long life I'll satisfy there. Run the race set before thee.

James is not talking about cancer. What did Jesus say?

Luk 17:32-33 kjva 32 Remember Lot's wife. 33 Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.

What did lots wife do? She looked back wanting to reserve her old life. She grew up in Sodom, it was her homeland and it was being burnt to the ground. All her memories, her home, everything. She looked back, and was told not to. There was nothing of value to look back on.

A man's life does not consist of what he owns. His life is not in what he decides to do.

Jesus said.
Luk 12:16-21 kjva 16 And he spake a parable unto them, saying, The ground of a certain rich man brought forth plentifully: 17 And he thought within himself, saying, What shall I do, because I have no room where to bestow my fruits? 18 And he said, This will I do: I will pull down my barns, and build greater; and there will I bestow all my fruits and my goods. 19 And I will say to my soul, Soul, thou hast much goods laid up for many years; take thine ease, eat, drink, and be merry. 20 But God said unto him, Thou fool, this night thy soul shall be required of thee: then whose shall those things be, which thou hast provided? 21 So is he that layeth up treasure for himself, and is not rich toward God.

What the guy in the parable say?

I will lay up extra in a barn and eat and drink to be merry.

Back to James. What were they saying?

Jas 4:13-17 amp 13 Come now, you who say, Today or tomorrow we will go into such and such a city and spend a year there and carry on our business and make money. 14 Yet you do not know [the least thing] about what may happen tomorrow. What is the nature of your life? You are [really] but a wisp of vapor (a puff of smoke, a mist) that is visible for a little while and then disappears [into thin air]. 15 You ought instead to say, If the Lord is willing, we shall live and we shall do this or that [thing]. 16 But as it is, you boast [falsely] in your presumption and your self-conceit. All such boasting is wrong. 17 So any person who knows what is right to do but does not do it, to him it is sin.

They said we are going to do this and that to make their own life and get rich. They were going to take a whole year seeking the things of their own life with total disregard to what the Lord's will was.

They were not rich in God but themselves. Stepping out of the will of God can get you killed.

Even Isaac who by reason to keep his own life comfortable sought to go to Egypt to escape the famine. The Lord said stay in this land, don't go to Egypt. The Lord blessed him in that land a hundred fold despite the famine.

Many of us are dead today be doing what James said don't do. I know a few of them seeking not to loose what they had and not doing what the Lord said do.
 
And if faith is from God, as the scriptures teach, the idea that their faith is not strong enough can and to often does run down two paths. They begin to think God does not love them because the measure of faith they were given is to small, making God evil...
That's why healing and salvation is by God's mercy. If he doesn't make the way, nothing happens. Nothing.

...and faith becomes a work...
You lost me. How does God giving faith, in his time, make faith a work when he's not giving that faith?

, so by logical extension, is salvation not of works also.
In healing, as in salvation, the question is. "what are we doing with the measure of faith that God has given, when he gives it, for us to be healed?" Is faith being snuffed out by the discouragement of other's sufferings? Is it being replaced by a preferred confidence in other remedies? Is the mustard seed we have been given being planted, or discarded altogether?

My feeling on the matter in regard to the people who nay say healing because they haven't been given faith from God to begin with--like in the matter of salvation among unbelievers--is just that......God hasn't given them the faith to believe in healing....yet.
 
I had been thinking about this thread and thought that I would chime in with an encouragement today that nobody should walk away from this discussion thinking they should not pray for healing.

Thank you so very much for your response Jethro, my very good friend. I appreciate that. I remember an old preacher who said something like this. "I still pray for people to be healed. Not everyone has been healed, but some have been healed and that's why I still pray for healing." I think that's a pretty good statement.

About 30 years ago, I was holding a "healing clinic" in Portland, Maine. A young couple brought up front their newborn daughter who had "spinal bifita" (spelling) They had just come from the Maine Medical Center with this diagnosis. I anointed the little infant with oil and prayed for her healing and the next week, they returned all happy because when they had another cat scan done, she had been completely healed. Praise Jehovah Rapha, (I AM the Lord thy Physician).
 
You're way off base.
If what you say is true, then do you live it?
Have you ever seen a person with acne on their face?
Did you lay hands on them, cast the acne out of them, and see it disappear?
Of course not, you don't believe it could happen.
Ever see a cripple?
Did you say to them, "I don't have any money but what I have, I give you. In the name of Jesus, get up and walk".
I don't think you would dare try such a thing because you don't have the faith to believe that God would do it.
How many blind people have you met?
How many of them got their sight back after you laid hands on them?
Please give me some answers before you tell me that I have a real problem.

Your post that I replied to started of (your words) you have a problem with that reply and went on about how what they said was wrong. I said Rollo I see another REAL PROBLEM here. It is when people try to correct others who bring truth and yet have things totally wrong........Dont miss use my words....
Don't ever judge what I have done or not done brother until you know me and do not ever judge me or my faith with out knowing me. You jumpme and those you disagree with then correct thpose who say things you do not like.
Try again.
 
Your post that I replied to started of (your words) you have a problem with that reply and went on about how what they said was wrong. I said Rollo I see another REAL PROBLEM here. It is when people try to correct others who bring truth and yet have things totally wrong........Dont miss use my words....
Don't ever judge what I have done or not done brother until you know me and do not ever judge me or my faith with out knowing me. You jumpme and those you disagree with then correct thpose who say things you do not like.
Try again.

Okay Jim, I'll try again.
Too bad we both seem to misunderstand each other.
My wife has been diagnosed with diverticulitis.
She has had quite a spell this past year dealing with it.
Doctors don't and can't do anything for her.
We know that.
We try our best to keep her on a diverticulitis diet.

Now does she really have diverticulitis or is this just the way the doctor answers when he doesn't know what's wrong?
Our next stop is this Thursday to an gastroenterologist.
Why?
Because the pain is getting worse and continual.

Now here's where all of you reading this come in.
It shouldn't matter if you like me or not.
My wife is a wonderful woman of God, I wouldn't trade her in for anything.
She is a prayer warrior.
She never stops praying and praising God all day long.
Year after year.

Who wants to start praying for her daily until she receives her healing?
I don't know what to expect anymore.
God can heal her, God can take her home, or God can let her suffer.
What will it be?
Do we have a say in it?
Help me!
 
Okay Jim, I'll try again.
Too bad we both seem to misunderstand each other.
My wife has been diagnosed with diverticulitis.
She has had quite a spell this past year dealing with it.
Doctors don't and can't do anything for her.
We know that.
We try our best to keep her on a diverticulitis diet.

Now does she really have diverticulitis or is this just the way the doctor answers when he doesn't know what's wrong?
Our next stop is this Thursday to an gastroenterologist.
Why?
Because the pain is getting worse and continual.

Now here's where all of you reading this come in.
It shouldn't matter if you like me or not.
My wife is a wonderful woman of God, I wouldn't trade her in for anything.
She is a prayer warrior.
She never stops praying and praising God all day long.
Year after year.

Who wants to start praying for her daily until she receives her healing?
I don't know what to expect anymore.
God can heal her, God can take her home, or God can let her suffer.
What will it be?
Do we have a say in it?
Help me!
Rollo, I would bet that everybody here that agrees or thinks that God heals EVERYTIME, believes that we, as believers, can lose salvation in some way. We would have to see the hypocrisy in their theology if they think God heals(physically) every time.

From your description here, I would bet that You and Your wife have the chance to bear much fruit. In your sufferings, You have the privilege to glorify God. It is not ALWAYS about making the illness go away. It is about how we handle the suffering.
Philippians 4:12~~New American Standard Bible
I know how to get along with humble means, and I also know how to live in prosperity; in any and every circumstance I have learned the secret of being filled and going hungry, both of having abundance and suffering need.

Most of us have stories like this and I pray for you and your wife. I know how it is.

Everybody looks at fruit as overt works,missions,feeding the poor,going to church,being nice....the list goes on. But you and your wife have the opportunity to bear much fruit.....rely on His doctrines,be occupied with Christ,Do not complain,be content in all situations......this is fruit my Brother. Real fruit. Fruit that most religious Christians have no clue about. You hang in there and bear much fruit for our Lord and Glorify Him in your sufferings!

Don't let religion say,"You have a sin,you don't have enough faith,God always heals(this must be your fault.)"
I believe that a lot of Brothers here have shamed you, And are the three religious "friends" in Job.

1 Pet 4:16~~New American Standard Bible
but if anyone suffers as a Christian, he is not to be ashamed, but is to glorify God in this name.

No one knows the outcome but God.

But based on His Character and nature, you and your wife can be witnesses for Him,Glorify Him,bear much fruit for Him,bring an unbeliever to him through your sufferings.
 
Okay Jim, I'll try again.
Too bad we both seem to misunderstand each other.
My wife has been diagnosed with diverticulitis.
She has had quite a spell this past year dealing with it.
Doctors don't and can't do anything for her.
We know that.
We try our best to keep her on a diverticulitis diet.

Now does she really have diverticulitis or is this just the way the doctor answers when he doesn't know what's wrong?
Our next stop is this Thursday to an gastroenterologist.
Why?
Because the pain is getting worse and continual.

Now here's where all of you reading this come in.
It shouldn't matter if you like me or not.
My wife is a wonderful woman of God, I wouldn't trade her in for anything.
She is a prayer warrior.
She never stops praying and praising God all day long.
Year after year.

Who wants to start praying for her daily until she receives her healing?
I don't know what to expect anymore.
God can heal her, God can take her home, or God can let her suffer.
What will it be?
Do we have a say in it?
Help me!

Rollo Greetings,
First thing is this.....I have not one thing against you and love you as a brother. There is no not like you in this.
You never give up hope Brother, Seek God and follow His lead. Perhaps getting in touch with an anointed man of God who knows about Faith and so forth and meet with Him. He can help you in your styruggle with this and he can also hear from the Lord as well. Just an idea......

I understand what you are saying, I have one here who has ms/lupas and many other things going on in her.
I know the pain and the struggle she has and you and your weife have. It is not easy nore fun.
How does your wife stand in this or what is her true hearts desire in this ?

You asked if you have any say in this and what will God do or rather what will it be ?
This is why I suggested getting in touch with a anointed man of God who teaches and operates in Faith and Healing. This is the person who can help you see the truth and help get you and your faith built up. What is important is to not walk in fear or speak words of fear. I do not care if you believe me or not but what I do care about is you and your wife and situation. So take a cvhance and change the way you speak and conffess things about this situation and life.... This is the hard part brother but it allows your being to be quiet in faith and not scared or worried and in fear and can hear the Lord much better.

Again Brother this is not about you or me. It is about God and your wife....Please find an anointed man of God who in His heading or listing speaks about faith. Pray about it and ask and expect the Lord to lead you to Him. Now this might sound dumb but seek this anointed man of God out side of this forum......There is to much confusion of His word in here. We all will be praying........
Jim
 
Hello all my friends. You know that I love you all, and that was my purpose in starting this thread in the first place. I have been picking Brother Mikes brain on the subject of healing. You see, I have personally been involved in Many, I said, many physical healing of various situations from children, adults, and even pets. Because I also saw failure, I wanted to know more about this subject so my faith would increase and I could see more. Especially in my frequent infirmities.

The good news is that, following Brother Mikes teachings, I have learned crucial facts that are so very valuable....I was hoping that all of you would take my challenge to search the Scriptures to find as many verses on healing that would in turn build your faith so that when needed, you could see someone that you value who is sick, be healed. I applaud those of you who have done just that. For one, Deb13 has blessed my heart with her positive posts.

Now, some of you persist in presenting negative posts on healing. Hey, if that is your position, than hang with it. If you want to get sick with no hope, that's your business. It certainly is not mine. My Wife's twin Sister Nancy has had a report from the doctors that she has terminal cancer and will only live one more year. She also has failing kidneys....Am I going to sit by and watch her die? NO WAY. I have anointed her with oil and prayed over her and not only me, but others are seeing miraculous results. I believe with all my heart that God is ridding her body of cancer, and bad kidneys.

Again, thank all of you for presenting healing Scriptures, there are many more than the ones that appear to say no. God bless you all with Peace and Grace.


I will continue to pray for Nancy's healing! She is a mighty important person in the eyes of the Lord (as we all are). And i thank God Almighty for total healing and restoration to come to her body, with many more years to come! Thank You Father that no weapon formed against her shall prosper! We give You all of the glory Father. In Jesus mighty Name we pray, Amen!
 
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