No condemnation in Christ Jesus !

[savedbygrace57]

webb:

Reading your previous posts I conclude the scriptures you cite do not support your case.

Thats too bad, because that is the only response you will get. This subject is over your head !

 

[savedbygrace57]

webb:

perhaps you will arrange for a one on one or as this forum calls is a "private study". Then we shall see.

Thats a waste of my time !

 

[Eventide]

Reading your previous posts I conclude the scriptures you cite do not support your case.

If you think all this is "over my head" as you suggest, perhaps you will arrange for a one on one or as this forum calls is a "private study". Then we shall see.

In case you're not aware.. it's basically impossible for Calvinists to be corrected on anything.. to them the glorious and limitless power of the holy scriptures is all reduced to nothing more than a TULIP..

Sad but true..

 

[stovebolts]

Why is it that these simple Terms of Service are so frequently violated?

5 - Respect each others' opinions. Address issues, not persons or personalities.

6 - No Bashing of other members. Give other members the respect you would want them to give yourself.

7 - Any personal problems with another member, then deal with it through private messages.

22 - Respect where others are in their spiritual walk, do not disrupt the flow of discussion or act in a way that affects others negatively including when debating doctrinal issues, in the defense of the Christian faith, and in offering unwelcome spiritual advice.

While everyone involved in this thread ponders the above, I would ask each to examine himself in light of the above mentioned and ask the simple question: How can I adhere to that while moving my belief forward the the Apologetic realm.

If you can't be creative in this sense, let me know now and I'll happily have your account deactivated for 30 days to give you more time to think about it. It will save us all some frustration in the coming week.

Thank you!

 

[savedbygrace57]

In Him by Faith !

Finally by means of the Work of the Spirit, the New Birth believers are in Him by Faith. In this manner one can be said to have been in Christ before another as Paul said of this one Rom 16:7

Salute Andronicus and Junia, my kinsmen, and my fellow-prisoners, who are of note among the apostles, who also were in Christ before me.

This has to do with one knowing or realizing they are in Christ. They were converted to Christ before Paul was.

When the Holy Spirit brings us to belief of the Truth, we are then in Christ experimentally. 2 Thess 2:13

13But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

 

[Webb]

But Gal.3:26,27 tells us HOW we are the children of God by faith in Christ. This passage alone disproves your theory.

 

[savedbygrace57]

But of Him are ye in Christ Jesus !

Paul writing to the Corinthian Church these words 1 Cor 1:30-31

30But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

31That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

God the Father put us in Christ Jesus, if we be in Him at all, by it being God's doing, it was done from everlasting to everlasting !

Those who are in Christ, are so by the Sovereign Grace of God the Father Eph 1:3-4

3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who hath blessed us with all spiritual blessings in heavenly places in Christ:

4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

6To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

Yes, first and foremost The Father puts us in Him by Sovereign Election before the world began. In Him we were and have been preserved and blessed from everlasting even before being called in time ! Jude 1:1

1Jude, the servant of Jesus Christ, and brother of James, to them that are sanctified by God the Father, and preserved in Jesus Christ, and called:

When we are called, that secret eternal union is made manifest in time, when God the Holy Spirit gives us life and faith in Christ by the Operation of His Grace !

One's being in Christ is all the work of God, yes even our conversion, our saving union with Christ is not the consequence of ones actions, it was not because we were wiser, or better, or made a wiser choice than others, which is what most think today. If we are in Christ, it is because God put us in Christ, for Salvation [ experientially] is of the LORD. It is the purpose of God to make this evident and all men to concede to it. It shall be seen[At the Judgment] that God has apportioned His Saving Grace in such a means that men will see with regards to others, and to confess with concern to themselves, that Salvation, being in Christ is His work alone ! So that it is as it is written:

" He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord"

 

[Webb]

There is onliy one way God puts anyone in Christ, can you give us the scriptures?

 

[savedbygrace57]

There is onliy one way God puts anyone in Christ, can you give us the scriptures?

Read all my previous posts..

 

[Webb]

I don't have time nor inclination to read all your posts. You recently said you would meet all challenges, so please do not disregard this one!

 

[savedbygrace57]

I don't have time nor inclination to read all your posts. You recently said you would meet all challenges, so please do not disregard this one!

I have answered it already in previous posts, if you do not have time to read them, too bad !

 

[Webb]

As you wish, however with the energy you wasted in refusing to simply reproduce the scriptures I asked for you could have done it easily. Please dont't talk to us about your willingness to meet all challenges!

 

[savedbygrace57]

As you wish, however with the energy you wasted in refusing to simply reproduce the scriptures I asked for you could have done it easily. Please dont't talk to us about your willingness to meet all challenges!

I have answered it, I am not going to keep wasting my energy for a question I have answered, because you just dont want read what I have stated, thats none sense.

 

[Webb]

as you wish

 

[savedbygrace57]

If we are in Christ Jesus, we were Chosen in Him before the foundation pf the world Eph 1:4

4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:


And it is also written that Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever Heb 13:8


8Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Now lets look at Eph 1:19-23

19And what is the exceeding greatness of his power to us-ward who believe, according to the working of his mighty power,

20Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead, and set him at his own right hand in the heavenly places,

21Far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come:

22And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,

23Which is his body, the fulness of him that filleth all in all.

The Church is His Body ! How long has that been ? Well How Long has Christ been the Head of the Body, the Church ? Col 1:14-19

14In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:

15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;

Since the beginning ? John 1:1,4

1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

4In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Now if these things be True, and there has has ever been a period of time when the Church was not in Him and any of it's members, then there has been a period of time when His Body was not full, which means there was a Head without a Body.

That Jesus Christ existed before Creation is seen in Paul's writings Eph 3:9

9And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:

Was the Church His Body then ? If not, He was a bodiless Head, which I cannot conceive.

 

[Webb]

I do not find your conclusions scripturally grounded. The scripture clearly reveals when the chiurch whilch is His body began and how we by faith are in it. The plan was surely before the foundation of the world but the actuality was not.

 

[Elijah674]

I do not find your conclusions scripturally grounded. The scripture clearly reveals when the chiurch whilch is His body began and how we by faith are in it. The plan was surely before the foundation of the world but the actuality was not.

You mean that we agree for once?;) And his problem is that he thinks that he can do as Christ does in Rom. 4:17's last part of the verse, and NO ONE CAN, except by faith!

[17] (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.

Even Christ the Son, before the Plan was consumated! Prov. 8:22-24 & 30-31.

And yes, one can be [IN] Christ with NO CONDEMNATION Rom. 8:1 & then can balk his way right back from the Holy Spirits 'LEADING' into condemnation! Hosea 4:6, or Rev. 3:16's sick Lukwarm Love & [SPEWED OUT ONES!] or the whole fold Candelstick of Rev. 2:5 (and if he does not know what the Candelstick is?? See Rev. 1:20's last part of the verse.

--Elijah

 

[savedbygrace57]

As in Adam, so in Christ !

1 Cor 15:49

49And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

It was God's decision that we would be born of Adam [Flesh] and that we would be born of the Spirit ! It is the Spirit to begin that heavenly image 2 Cor 3:18

But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.

Now if that Physical Life which was given the Elect in Adam could be distinctly identified and by it be involved in the condemnation of Adam's Transgression Rom 5:18

Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto

and this over 6000 yrs ago before being born in the flesh, is it therefore unreasonable that in Christ, the Antitype, their Spiritual and Eternal Life, which was with the Father and was manifested [ 1 Jn 1:2] and was given to us in God's only begotten Son , according to the record borne by the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost [ 1 Jn 5:7,11] should so identify us in Christ, that it is said that we were Chosen in Him before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4

4According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

There is no doubt about it, if the elect are given physical life, this is proof that they were in Adam before that life was manifested, and if the elect are now enjoying spiritual and eternal life, this is proof that they were in Christ before the foundation, and consequently never could have been condemned, since scripture states Rom 8:1

1There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus

 

[childeye]

as you wish

The Princess Bride was a very enertaining movie. Whenever the male leading character said to the female leading character "as you wish", he was in reality saying "I Love you".

 

[Sinthesis]

If we are in Christ Jesus, we were Chosen in Him before the foundation pf the world Eph 1:4

And it is also written that Jesus Christ is the same yesterday, today and forever Heb 13:8

Now lets look at Eph 1:19-23

The Church is His Body ! How long has that been ? Well How Long has Christ been the Head of the Body, the Church ? Col 1:14-19

Since the beginning ? John 1:1,4

Now if these things be True, and there has has ever been a period of time when the Church was not in Him and any of it's members, then there has been a period of time when His Body was not full, which means there was a Head without a Body.

That Jesus Christ existed before Creation is seen in Paul's writings Eph 3:9

Was the Church His Body then ? If not, He was a bodiless Head, which I cannot conceive.

Are you now teaching that you, as a member of the church and therefore part of His body, are not a created being?:dunno

Inconceivable!:eyebrow