Questions for every one

[gingercat]

Hi, stove, thanks for responding to my inquiry.

To answer to your questions: "yes" to all of them. But that does not make the Holy Spirit a person. I know that Holy Spirit is a representative of Jesus, but does it have to be a person? Is Spirit is a person? It does not say anything about Holy Spirit is a person. I know it is personalized as "he" but that does not make it a person. The English make many things personalize.

 

[stovebolts]

Hi Gingercat,

Again, you pose very valid questions and I really appreciate the nature of your post.

Let me ask you. Do you believe that you have a body and a soul and a spirit? Well, you do, or rather, you are according to God's holy word. Seek the scriptures, and you will find the two passages that affirm this statment.

So, is it safe to say that we are 3, yet one? According to gen 1:26, we were made in "their" image, or rather, the image of God himself.

Simply put, to not acknowledge that God is truine, is to deny that we are tripartite... And that limits our understanding of not only ourselves, but how we view God in "it's" entirety.

Peace be with you

 

[gingercat]

Stove,

I can understand His Holy Spirit but I dont understand my spirit. It seems to me that spirit is a thought. Is that it? We talk about the Holy Spirit but I never hear anyone discussing our spirit.

I have another similar question: will we be able to see the Holy Spirit in His kingdom?

Thank you

 

[John the Baptist]

Why do some denominations believe that if we dont accept their theology, like trinity we are not Christian?

I believe Jesus is son of God and Savior of the world; but why this is not good enough?

Thank you.

******
Hi, John here: What makes ONE A BORN AGAIN Christian is the total acceptance of the Divine. Where one is at after that will bring them into Unity of all Truth if one follows the Holy Spirits Leading! Romans 8:14

[God is the one who tells us what we are to do.] (Matthew 4:4 & 2 Timothy 3:16-17 for starters) It is our life work to grow up into Christ. :fadein: See Ecclesiastes 12:13-14. And we are safe to save as we follow on in Obedience, regardless of who we are or what denomination that we are now in, in the process.

 

[Johny]

Stove,

I can understand His Holy Spirit but I dont understand my spirit. It seems to me that spirit is a thought. Is that it? We talk about the Holy Spirit but I never hear anyone discussing our spirit.

I have another similar question: will we be able to see the Holy Spirit in His kingdom?

Thank you

The Holy Spirit dwells within us.

http://www.carm.org/doctrine/holyspirit.htm

This website explains Who the Holy Spirit is and what He does.

 

[mutzrein]

Stove,

I can understand His Holy Spirit but I dont understand my spirit. It seems to me that spirit is a thought. Is that it? We talk about the Holy Spirit but I never hear anyone discussing our spirit.

I have another similar question: will we be able to see the Holy Spirit in His kingdom?

Thank you

A question for you gingercat.

What part of man is eternal?

I'm not asking because I don't know - I thought if I could develop a train of thought here, you may come to an understanding of the spirit of man.

Regards

 

[mutzrein]

Why do some denominations believe that if we dont accept their theology, like trinity we are not Christian?

I believe Jesus is son of God and Savior of the world; but why this is not good enough?

Thank you.

******
Hi, John here: What makes ONE A BORN AGAIN Christian is the total acceptance of the Divine. Where one is at after that will bring them into Unity of all Truth if one follows the Holy Spirits Leading! Romans 8:14

[God is the one who tells us what we are to do.] (Matthew 4:4 & 2 Timothy 3:16-17 for starters) It is our life work to grow up into Christ. :fadein: See Ecclesiastes 12:13-14. And we are safe to save as we follow on in Obedience, regardless of who we are or what denomination that we are now in, in the process.

John - what do you by acceptance of the Divine?

 

[John the Baptist]

Why do some denominations believe that if we dont accept their theology, like trinity we are not Christian?

I believe Jesus is son of God and Savior of the world; but why this is not good enough?

Thank you.

******
Hi, John here: What makes ONE A BORN AGAIN Christian is the total acceptance of the Divine. Where one is at after that will bring them into Unity of all Truth if one follows the Holy Spirits Leading! Romans 8:14

[God is the one who tells us what we are to do.] (Matthew 4:4 & 2 Timothy 3:16-17 for starters) It is our life work to grow up into Christ. :fadein: See Ecclesiastes 12:13-14. And we are safe to save as we follow on in Obedience, regardless of who we are or what denomination that we are now in, in the process.

John - what do you by acceptance of the Divine?

Give me a little more to work on OK? ---John

 

[John the Baptist]

Stove,

I can understand His Holy Spirit but I dont understand my spirit. It seems to me that spirit is a thought. Is that it? We talk about the Holy Spirit but I never hear anyone discussing our spirit.

I have another similar question: will we be able to see the Holy Spirit in His kingdom?

Thank you

A question for you gingercat.

What part of man is eternal?

***
I am not gingercat. But there is nothing of created man that is eternal! If you are saying that there is, how would that differ from satan's lie that ye will not die? See man's ending if he is lost in Obadiah 1:16. ---John
***

I'm not asking because I don't know - I thought if I could develop a train of thought here, you may come to an understanding of the spirit of man.

Regards

 

[Imagican]

Gingercat,

Regardless of what ANYONE says, your personal relationship with God through His Son is much MUCH more important than ANY theology. Just like the name 'theology', the principles are man-made as well.

We have the Word. It's the SAME Word that those that would insist that you believe what 'they' believe have read to make their determination. No matter how 'good' something may sound, that doesn't make it so. Therefore, beware of that which you accept of other men and rely instead on the Word.

There are certainly men that understand more of the truth than others. That doesn't change the fact that many false prophets have gone out into the world to 'change' what has been offered into something else.

Many will argue that 'trinity' is Biblical and dates back to the apostles. A cursory study of the history of 'trinity' proves otherwise. My personal view is that I would rather accept the words of Christ and His apostles over the words of others. I am forced to make a choice concerning the authenticity of that contained in the Bible. Either I believe it or I don't. I choose to believe. Therefore that is ALL I have to base my understanding on. If God sees fit to reveal the meaning behind the words written within this book, that is His will. If not, that too is His will. But I will NOT lay down and let men be my guide. How foolish would one be to abandone their will to any other than God? And that's what it takes to start following 'theology', man-made understading.

An analogy that I have used many times to confront those that would teach that I MUST follow men. What if I were abandoned on an island with NO ONE to teach me anything. One day I find a Bible that has floated ashore. I read it and through this reading, I find and accept Christ as my savior and from that day on I develope a relationship with His Father, my God. First, I offer that 'trinity' would be IMPOSSIBLE for me to find without the aide of another human being. If this is true, then how important or 'true' could this 'idea' possibly be? If it is NOT revealed in the Word, then I contend that it is 'Man-made' theology which may or may not have ANY validity whatsoever. What's more important is that it may just be something created for a purpose OTHER than bringing me 'closer' to God. It may be something created to take away rather than enhance one's understanding.

I suggest that man is better off separating themselves from the theology of 'other men', and take responsibility for their own relationship with God through His Son. That doesn't mean that we are NOT to gather. It simply means that denominationalism is nothing more than another tool of satan designed to keep us at odds with one another over nothing more than 'man-made' doctrine.

The Church is one. Churches are NOT one but just the opposite. There will be those that will say that my offering is wrong. They will accuse me of trying to be a 'one man show'. So be it. But what is the difference in my view and that of the denominations? The only difference is that the ONE man that created 'his' denomination has others that follow him. I contend that we should follow NOTHING other than Christ and the Holy Spirit TO the Father, our God. Follow men and you follow the flesh for that's what we all are. Follow the Word to the best of your understanding and I promise you that God knows what's in your heart and you will be judged accordingly.

We were told that the Word is our sustenance, our food. We were told to gather in His name. We were NOT told, however, to follow men and their beliefs. The churches perpetuate the false idea that we MUST follow them. They discourage any attempt of anyone to develope a 'personal' relationship with the Father through His Son. They perpetuate the teachings of men rather than that of Christ and His Father. Not surprising that many have 'bought into' this 'game'. For if there were no one to play this game, there would be NO one to support it.

Trust in Christ and the Holy Spirit to lead you to the Father. I promise you that there is NO MAN that can offer you anything worthy of following him. Worship Christ and His Father, not ANY denominational church or those that are the heads of them. We have ONE God, we have ONE Son, and we have ONE Holy Spirit. That's what the Word offers. To say that all three are the same is to deny the importance of each.

There are a very few lines of scripture that can be twisted into this 'trinity' belief if one chooses to accept it. But there are tons and tons of scripture that refute this teaching. Christ tells us over and over again that He IS the Son of God. NO, NOT God Himself, but the SON of God. The ONLY begotten. A voice from heaven was heard to say, 'This is MY beloved Son in whom I am well pleased.' ?????????????????????????? for 'trinitarians'. If Christ and God are the 'same', or one, then how do we have examples of them being separate? Because they are. Christ certainly spoke for God. But I promise that as Christ fulfilled His destiny, God was looking down on Him with much love and pride in His heart. When Christ prayed for strength, God, His Father was there to offer it. And after He was risen, He returned to the Father where He abides RIGHT NOW. NO, not AS the Father, sitting at the right hand of the Father.

 

[gingercat]

Imagican,

I totally agree with you. I don't have any doubt that I am His follower. I just wanted everyone to think how ridiculous it is to accuse any one that they are not believer because they don't follow their theology.

thank you :angel:

 

[stovebolts]

Stove,

I can understand His Holy Spirit but I dont understand my spirit. It seems to me that spirit is a thought. Is that it? We talk about the Holy Spirit but I never hear anyone discussing our spirit.

Thank you

Hello again gingercat,

I don’t know that I am fully qualified to answer your questions, You are asking the right questions which lead in the right direction and for that, I am very thankful of your consideration.

1 Corinthians 2:11 For what man knows the things of a man, except the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knows no man, but the Spirit of God.

Proverbs 20:27 The spirit of man is the lamp of the LORD, searching all the inner depths of the heart.

Just to back track a tad, I wanted to share this scripture.

1 Thessalonians 5:23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.

First, notice that we are tripartite. Body, Soul, Spirit from verse 23. Now, to put this verse in context, start reading around verse 5. Notice, these are things we are to do. Cross this with the first 5 chapters of Proverbs. Now, in verse 9 of 1 Thess 5, notice the purpose… obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ But these people were already baptized and saved right? Don’t get too stuck on this for the moment.

Moving on, in verse 11, we have the results of the purpose, which is Therefore comfort yourselves together, and edify one another, even as also you do. And again a powerful statement is made in verse 18 In everything give thanks: for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus concerning you

Now, lets get into the meat…

You asked, what is the spirit? Again, I am but a child of God seeking to find this mystery myself. I ask that you search the scriptures and confirm yourself and not stand on what I am about to right.

We know for Genesis 2:7 that we were created tripartite. Break this verse down to it’s Hebrew words and it agrees with 1 Thessalonians 5:23 in the context of being tripartite. In short, we know that we have a body, a soul and a spirit. In addition, we are given the Holy Spirit. I assume and currently believe that the Holy Spirit dwells within our spirit (regeneration) So here we have four separate entities, all becoming united in one movement.

1 Thessalonians 5:19 Quench not the Spirit.

The spirit is something that I cannot fully grasp let alone how it interplays with God’s Holy Spirit. In the OT, we have a tabernacle that Moses was to build. It was a copy of heavenly things. God is a consuming fire and led the Israelites around the desert for 40 years with a cloud and a pillar of fire. God also shone himself to Moses in a burning bush. Within the holy place of the tabernacle, sat a golden lamp stand with 7 candlesticks filled with pure olive oil. If we look how this lamp stand was built, it was beaten from a single piece of gold and if you go into the Hebrew language, the main shaft, is described as a body. Some believe that this candlestick was a copy of Christ and the candlesticks are the Church. Ironically, these candlesticks, these, bowls, these vessels filled with pure oil were to burn continuously. They were not to be quenched. Likewise with the alter, the fire was to never go out (Romans 12:1). It was to continually burn.

My… this is getting a bit longer than it should. Please allow me to quickly tie this back up to 1 Thessalonians 5:23 and I am very sorry for this being as long as it is.
…sanctify you wholly…
Websters states
To purify; to prepare for divine service, and for partaking of holy things. Exodus. 19.

This occurs when God himself (God is a spirit John 4:24) touches our spirit and it transcends to our very soul and often, is manifest through our fleshly body.

I have another similar question: will we be able to see the Holy Spirit in His kingdom?

I can only imagine… Revelation 21. The way I understand it, we will be utterly one with God in a perfect union. It honestly blows my mind and I can’t even begin to grasp it.

 

[stovebolts]

Imagican,

I don't know where to start replying to your last post. :

I can attest that I do not fully understand the trinity, but what I can say is that everything that I have written about it (which is less than I know about it) came by accident through my own studies and not through the teachings of any church (as I am sure somebody will bite my head off for my last post in total disagreement and I will be deemed a heretic...

Life goes on and we were all given different abilities and the spirit moves within each of us differently.

To sum it up is this,
I will not be a stumbling block for you or anyone else (1 John 1:10, 1 Corinthians 1:23) . The scribes and pharisees were given the same scriptures as the bereans, yet they came up with two different conclusions. This only goes to show that you will find what you are seeking and yes, it has EVERYTHING to do with salvation and it has everything to do with THEOLOGY because simply put, theology is how we view the scriptures as the scriptures say what they say...we can only interpret them. I am sure that you will agree that it is a good thing to know God.


I will be back on Monday. Until then,
God Bless

 

[gingercat]

I can only imagine… Revelation 21. The way I understand it, we will be utterly one with God in a perfect union. It honestly blows my mind and I can’t even begin to grasp it.



thank you stove, that's how I feel. You helped me to think about my own spirit. It made me realize that my spirit is my heart.


Anyone else have any insight on if we are able to see Holy Spirit in His kingdom?

 

[Heidi]

Why do some denominations believe that if we dont accept their theology, like trinity we are not Christian?

I believe Jesus is son of God and Savior of the world; but why this is not good enough?

Thank you.

Because some denominations disagree with the bible and Paul clearly tells us that those who pass along a different gospel or different Jesus then they did are false apostles masquerading as apostles of Christ. All you have to do is read the bible for the truth, friend. In there you will find everyuthing you need to know.

 

[stovebolts]

gingercat,

Know that your spirit is so much more than your heart,

You see, it is in our nature to always look in for we are selfish by nature, and that is why you view the spirit as your heart, because your heart, is within you.

Dear gingercat, don't always look in, but rather look up and out. Reach for God, for God is a Spirit and he calls to you. Outward and upward, this is when your spirit, meets with His spirit.

Peace be with you.

 

[stovebolts]

Yes Heidi, you are correct.

But I would like to add that it still comes down to what your looking for because what you seek, will often be what you find. It's called PRIDE.

Matthew 26:31-34 Then said Jesus unto them, All you shall be offended because of me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad. But after I am risen again, I will go before you into Galilee. Peter answered and said unto him, Though all men shall be offended because of you, yet will I never be offended. Jesus said unto him, Verily I say unto you, That this night, before the cock crows, you shall deny me three times.

Can you see where the focus is? Peter focus' on the flesh... and he misses the glory to be held...But after I am risen again, I will go before you into Galilee.

Are we looking in, or are we looking out. Most look inward, as did Peter. This same pride within our very nature causes us to yell and scream at one another. We become stumbling blocks to one another because of our own arrogance. My dear God, when will we learn to edify one another an gently guide one another in Christ?

 

[gingercat]

gingercat,

Know that your spirit is so much more than your heart,

You see, it is in our nature to always look in for we are selfish by nature, and that is why you view the spirit as your heart, because your heart, is within you.

Dear gingercat, don't always look in, but rather look up and out. Reach for God, for God is a Spirit and he calls to you. Outward and upward, this is when your spirit, meets with His spirit.

Peace be with you.

I disagree on this one. My spirit is myself: That's why we have to seek His Spirit. My spirit is so small and His is unlimited.

 

[gingercat]

Why do some denominations believe that if we dont accept their theology, like trinity we are not Christian?

I believe Jesus is son of God and Savior of the world; but why this is not good enough?

Thank you.

Because some denominations disagree with the bible and Paul clearly tells us that those who pass along a different gospel or different Jesus then they did are false apostles masquerading as apostles of Christ. All you have to do is read the bible for the truth, friend. In there you will find everyuthing you need to know.

I agree Heide

 

[Imagican]

Stove,

You are right if taken in the context of the acceptance of man's labels. Theology could certainly be used as the 'name' of one's beliefs. i was refereing to 'group' belief in my posting.

If we could be sure that there were those that followed 'truth' and that these were being led by the Holy Spirit, the churches would be a 'good' thing.
The problem is the ability of the individual to discern. There are many that from the beginning of their walk are able to be led astray due to their lack of understanding. And for these, it's often easiest to simply listen and accept what others offer. This isn't a major problem until we take into consideration that there WILL and ARE those that teach their OWN agenda, and even those that would subvert the innocent for the sake of Satan.

I contend that if we were in the age of the apostles, there would be the possibility of gathering in the Spirit. Shortly after the formation of The Church though, began the falling away.

Question?: There are those that contend that a 'Christian' can't be possessed by demons. Upon this topic I ask this: Can or would the Holy Spirit dwell among a room full of unholy? If a 'church' was only 'half' full of Christians and the other half are 'false Christians', would the Holy Spirit fill such a room?

My point? The churches now days will allow anyone to attend and become members so long as they drop a few bucks in their plate each week. If the Holy Spirit is similar in form and purpose of demons or un-holy spirits, wouldn't there be need for those that were gathered to be 'truly saved' and following the will of God for the Holy Spirit to be present? And if the Holy Spirit is NOT present, then what possible benefit could one receive from a 'gathering' in His name?

Theology in regards to that taught in schools called by this name, is NOTHING more or less than the teachings of men. Regardless of what one accepts or denies, what is taught in theology is the teaching or man.

i still contend that YOUR salvation lies in YOUR relationship. NOT what you get from following other men. There are certainly those that would teach otherwise, but I am here to offer that this teaching is WRONG. Those that wish to receive the reward and follow Christ to the Father need NO MAN to instruct them in this direction. If this were untrue, there would be NO Word and we would be led by the Spirit to those that teach the truth as inspired by the Spirit. We were given the Word so that we would have the ability to discern. Otherwise, how could we possibly know the difference between truth and lies?

And look what happens when the people 'Don't' have the Word. Look at the atrocities committed by the RC in the name of Christ and how the people were powerless to contest them. Without the Word, the people were completely dependant upon 'other men' to read it for them and then tell them what was there. Isn't it obvious that when allowed this kind of power, it is the nature of man to be foiled by it. And so it happened. The RCC taught many complete and utter lies to benefit themselves.

Is this where we should be today in our quest to follow God's will. Simply listen and follow what other men teach us? There is NOT A SINGLE MAN ON THIS EARTH that CAN OFFER ME SALVATION. Therefore, I follow the Word. And through this Word, I have met and KNOW Jesus Christ, MY SAVIOR. And through Him, I am able to develope a relationship with His Father, MY GOD.

But, if I were to listen to the churches, they would insist that I MUST attend their meetings and accept their teachings or I am NOT saved. RUBBISH. If anything, ANYONE that would judge my Salvation according to their empty understanding due to the teachings of men rather than God, THEY are the ones that are most likely UNSAVED. For if they were saved they would have NO DOUBT that they are TOTALLY unable to make a judgement against me that is in ANYWAY 'righteous'. This is what I am refereing to when I speak of theology or doctrine. Each church teaches a 'different' doctrine, therefore their theology is different and therefore the indication is that they follow not the teachings of Christ or God, but follow the teachings of other men. Otherwise they would ALL be following the SAME theology or doctrine. Paul warned us that this would happen. And it came about from people following other men rather than the Word.