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Rapture and the Second Coming

Deborah13 said:
Brother Mike said:
They never received the knowledge of the truth. We have to look for those that once stood in the Christian faith and then left.
Click to expand...


When I read it quickly I saw 'receive knowledge of the truth' but that is not what it says. It says, " love of the truth".
Isn't the last church age the 'lukewarm' church?

I'm just really glad that what we believe about the end times is not about our salvation. We'd really get desperate about this and we shouldn't. I think we should just be ready all the time and be witnessing the Gospel message of Christ and His work, to anyone who will listen.
Click to expand...
[MENTION=93058]Deborah13[/MENTION]:

Laodicean dialogue

Mom: Johnny!

Johnny: U-huh...

Mom: Coming to church with me?

Johnny: U-huh...

Mom: Why do you keep saying 'U-huh'?

Johnny: Umm...Mom! D'you know something?

Mom: What is it, dear?

Johnny: You forgot to buy the birthday card for the preacher's wife!

Mom: U-huh...
 
Interesting

The Word of God, and not the dictionary, is the final authority. Does the scripture confirm what
we are told? Two opposing entities are given: Truth, and the Lie. When the antichrist shall come
it will be with “power and signs and lying wonders, and with all deceivableness of
unrighteousness.†They that “received not the love of the Truth,†“who believed not the Truth
that they might be saved†shall “perish.†Then, of course, they that do receive the love of the
Truth, will be saved. (Read all the verses, nine through twelve.)



“That they all might be damned who believed not the Truth, but had pleasure in
unrighteousness†II Thes. 2:12. The opposite is seen in Abraham, who “believed God, and it
was accounted to him for righteousness†Gal. 3:6. When Solomon assumed the throne of David
he began his prayer unto God thusly: “Thou hast shewed unto thy servant David my father
great mercy, according as he hath walked before thee in Truth and in righteousness, and in
uprightness of heart with thee. . .“ I Kings 3:6. Truth affords a firm foundation for
righteousness, the two being steadfastly bonded together. In Ephesians chapter six and verse
fourteen we are exhorted to stand, and that, by “having your loins girt about with truth, and
having on the breastplate of righteousness.†Concerning Truth, we are to “gird up the loins of
your mind†I Peter 1:13. Concerning the breastplate of righteousness: “for with the heart man
believeth unto righteousness†Rom. 10:10.



Should we be at all surprised to find unbelief and unrighteousness as bedfellows?



“That they all might be damned who believed not the Truth, but had pleasure in
unrighteousness.â€



We are continuing on our subject of the “falling away.†In the Garden of Eden was placed a man
and his wife, Adam and Eve. All readily proclaim [who acknowledge the truth] that man fell.
Yes, he fell, but from what? I propose to compare the account found in Genesis with that which
is seen in II Thessalonians chapter two.



If in II Thessalonians we find a “falling away†and “that man of sin†being “revealed†then
should it be any wonder if we find the first revealing of the “serpent†to be in the Garden; that
the first “apostates†who should “fall away†from the Truth are there also?



They had been given the Truth, the Word of God: “Of every tree of the garden thou mayest
freely eat:†[They had a God-given Liberty] But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil,
thou shalt not eat of it. . .†“the serpent. . . said unto the woman. Yea, hath God said, Ye shall
not eat of every tree of the garden?†The serpent has taken a truth and manipulated it in such
a way as to remove the liberty and the blessing with which it was originally given. With the
eating of the fruit of the trees in the garden they might experience a walking in the cool of the
day with the Lord; might know the joy and peace to be found with such communion. But
Satan’s design was to bring about an unrest, an uneasiness, to disquiet that glow of fellowship
they enjoyed in His presence. Eve, being the theologian that she was, engages the serpent in
debate. Regretfully, instead of quoting the Word of God as God gave it, she must add her own
commentary to it for good measure: “Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.â€
Eve is reading from the N.E.V., the New Eden Version!



What has just happened here? Eve has compromised the Word of God, she has just “fallen
away†from the Truth. What did we find concerning the “falling away� Defection from the
Truth, the state of apostasy, separative, divorce. Notice, had she fell down to the ground from
the tree from which she plucked the fruit - that would have happened suddenly. But the “falling
away†occurs subtly, slowly.



Now that Eve has placed herself in such a vulnerable position, the serpent “quotes†back to her
the Word of God; only he adds just one little three letter word - not. “Ye shall not surely die.â€



“And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the
eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise. . .†While those found in II Thessalonians
“believed not the Truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.†The act of partaking of the
forbidden fruit was an act of unrighteousness. Eve evidently found “pleasure in
unrighteousness;†she “believed not the Truth†“Thou shalt surely die,†else she would have
abstained.



Man fell away from the Truth. Why did he fall? Because he did not stand.



Oh Eve! If you had only had Ephesians chapter six! You might have found that you “wrestle not
against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the
darkness of this world.†You might have taken “unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may
be able to withstand in the evil day.†You might have had your loins girded about with Truth.
[How powerless a fig leaf religion] and having on the breastplate of righteousness.†Oh that you
might have taken “the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts
of the wicked.†But she did not have Ephesians chapter six - We do!

http://scripturetruthsbiblestudy.blogspot.com/2009/03/2-thessalonians-falling-away.html
 
The Word of God, and not the dictionary, is the final authority. Does the scripture confirm what
we are told? Two opposing entities are given: Truth, and the Lie. When the antichrist shall come
it will be with “power and signs and lying wonders, and with all deceivableness of
unrighteousness.†They that “received not the love of the Truth,†“who believed not the Truth
that they might be saved†shall “perish.†Then, of course, they that do receive the love of the
Truth, will be saved. (Read all the verses, nine through twelve.)



“That they all might be damned who believed not the Truth, but had pleasure in
unrighteousness†II Thes. 2:12. The opposite is seen in Abraham, who “believed God, and it
was accounted to him for righteousness†Gal. 3:6. When Solomon assumed the throne of David
he began his prayer unto God thusly: “Thou hast shewed unto thy servant David my father
great mercy, according as he hath walked before thee in Truth and in righteousness, and in
uprightness of heart with thee. . .“ I Kings 3:6. Truth affords a firm foundation for
righteousness, the two being steadfastly bonded together. In Ephesians chapter six and verse
fourteen we are exhorted to stand, and that, by “having your loins girt about with truth, and
having on the breastplate of righteousness.†Concerning Truth, we are to “gird up the loins of
your mind†I Peter 1:13. Concerning the breastplate of righteousness: “for with the heart man
believeth unto righteousness†Rom. 10:10.



Should we be at all surprised to find unbelief and unrighteousness as bedfellows?



“That they all might be damned who believed not the Truth, but had pleasure in
unrighteousness.â€



We are continuing on our subject of the “falling away.†In the Garden of Eden was placed a man
and his wife, Adam and Eve. All readily proclaim [who acknowledge the truth] that man fell.
Yes, he fell, but from what? I propose to compare the account found in Genesis with that which
is seen in II Thessalonians chapter two.



If in II Thessalonians we find a “falling away†and “that man of sin†being “revealed†then
should it be any wonder if we find the first revealing of the “serpent†to be in the Garden; that
the first “apostates†who should “fall away†from the Truth are there also?



They had been given the Truth, the Word of God: “Of every tree of the garden thou mayest
freely eat:†[They had a God-given Liberty] But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil,
thou shalt not eat of it. . .†“the serpent. . . said unto the woman. Yea, hath God said, Ye shall
not eat of every tree of the garden?†The serpent has taken a truth and manipulated it in such
a way as to remove the liberty and the blessing with which it was originally given. With the
eating of the fruit of the trees in the garden they might experience a walking in the cool of the
day with the Lord; might know the joy and peace to be found with such communion. But
Satan’s design was to bring about an unrest, an uneasiness, to disquiet that glow of fellowship
they enjoyed in His presence. Eve, being the theologian that she was, engages the serpent in
debate. Regretfully, instead of quoting the Word of God as God gave it, she must add her own
commentary to it for good measure: “Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die.â€
Eve is reading from the N.E.V., the New Eden Version!



What has just happened here? Eve has compromised the Word of God, she has just “fallen
away†from the Truth. What did we find concerning the “falling away� Defection from the
Truth, the state of apostasy, separative, divorce. Notice, had she fell down to the ground from
the tree from which she plucked the fruit - that would have happened suddenly. But the “falling
away†occurs subtly, slowly.



Now that Eve has placed herself in such a vulnerable position, the serpent “quotes†back to her
the Word of God; only he adds just one little three letter word - not. “Ye shall not surely die.â€



“And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the
eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise. . .†While those found in II Thessalonians
“believed not the Truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.†The act of partaking of the
forbidden fruit was an act of unrighteousness. Eve evidently found “pleasure in
unrighteousness;†she “believed not the Truth†“Thou shalt surely die,†else she would have
abstained.



Man fell away from the Truth. Why did he fall? Because he did not stand.



Oh Eve! If you had only had Ephesians chapter six! You might have found that you “wrestle not
against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the
darkness of this world.†You might have taken “unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may
be able to withstand in the evil day.†You might have had your loins girded about with Truth.
[How powerless a fig leaf religion] and having on the breastplate of righteousness.†Oh that you
might have taken “the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts
of the wicked.†But she did not have Ephesians chapter six - We do!

http://scripturetruthsbiblestudy.blogspot.com/2009/03/2-thessalonians-falling-away.html
 

So Satan being a Person is going to make him Worse. Giving him a limited flesh body where he just can't zip from one place to another just makes Satan so awesome.

Oh my................. I am thinking that there won't be much left to do for you here.

I would ask for the scripture, but there are none saying that Satan is coming as a person. ZERO. :wall
Click to expand...
And you would have us do what with

II Thessalonians 2:4"Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God."

Or do you not know that the man of sin is satan?

So when Satan walks up to you and introduces himself, then you know he just got kicked out of Heaven.... Got it!!! :screwloose


I have just got to ask. Who the heck you listen to, or you just make this stuff up?

You know the drill, please provide all the backing scriptures please.

Mike.
Click to expand...


Not quite,but I will be delivered up to him,however for you,when the below happens,then you will know

Revelation 13:13 "And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men."

Revelation 13:14 "And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live."

Guess you don't know who this beast is either......Hint,same as the man of sin
 
Deborah13 said:
When I read it quickly I saw 'receive knowledge of the truth' but that is not what it says. It says, " love of the truth".
Isn't the last church age the 'lukewarm' church?
Click to expand...

Possible............. but Luke warm would be someone that knows but does not fully commit. Someone that never received, I don't think they can be Luke warm. It seems Paul was writing about the after effect after the Day of Christ had come anyway. I have to stand on what I see in those passages though. I just can't find enough evidence to see the whole Church running off after things that are not true.

In fact as I type TV stations are under writing ministries to give them time on the air, Large projects are being started that never was possible before. We are close to the technology where a Pastor could preach or teach and it is instantly translated into over 50 languages. I see massive reports of many giving their life to Jesus.

We are not failing in the least bit.

Does everyone succeed? NO, and not everyone receives healing or gets born again. I don't think the focus is on how bad the church as a whole is doing but the focus is on How Jesus is able to keep his Church spotless and blameless. If the sheep fail, the Shepard failed and I have more than enough scripture to support Our Lord is more than able to keep his and run a great flock.

Jesus does not fail, nor does his church fall from the truth.

Deborah13 said:
I'm just really glad that what we believe about the end times is not about our salvation.
Click to expand...

I have to think at what time would it be safe to take a week off and chase women and blow all my money on drugs. NOPE, I think giving any place like that to the devil is a recipe for early death and just wouldn't you know, after the 2nd chick you pick up, Jesus shows up. How you explain something like that to the Lord?

I can't get to the last page of this forum now. So if this post seems way late then you know.

N2thelight....................... I still am waiting on those scriptures partner. lets cough em up!!!

Mike.
 
Deborah13 said:
When I read it quickly I saw 'receive knowledge of the truth' but that is not what it says. It says, " love of the truth".
Isn't the last church age the 'lukewarm' church?

I'm just really glad that what we believe about the end times is not about our salvation. We'd really get desperate about this and we shouldn't. I think we should just be ready all the time and be witnessing the Gospel message of Christ and His work, to anyone who will listen.
Click to expand...


Umm. Having issues posting. Can't reach last page of this thread.
 
n2thelight said:
Wanted to do a study on the fact that the rapture and the 2nd coming are one in the same event.
Click to expand...

I apologize that this sequence of events will be a little lengthy, there's little I can do to shorten it....I believe in the pre-trib rapture of the Bride (elect) of Jesus Christ. Rev. 3:10 Because you have kept my word about patient endurance, I will keep you from the hour of trial that is coming on the whole world, to try those who dwell on the earth".

Rev. 12:1-6 The woman (church), her Son (the Bride/elect), the dragon (Satan) ....V.2 The church (Bride/Elect and believers from the general call of the Gospel) are waiting for Jesus' return (10 virgins of Mt. 25:1-12). The woman (church) gives birth to a Son (Bride/Elect) V.5 The Boy was "caught up" to be with God (the first gathering or rapture) V.6 and the church (general call believers) "flee's into the wilderness" protected by God for the first three and a half years of the tribulation.

Even though protected by God, the church will still suffer persecution (tests) to separate true believers from the false (mark of the beast will be one of them).

A second gathering will occur at the mid point of the tribulation (2 Thess. 2:1-7) Believers who persevere through the testing of the first half of the tribulation will be "caught up". The false believers will be lost and enter the second half of the tribulation called Jacobs trouble(strictly to bring Israel to its knees.

As for the difference between the "rapture" and "second coming"....The rapture (gathering) will occur between the first advent (coming to earth) of Jesus Christ and the second advent at the end of the tribulation.

Hope this helps. Grace & Peace to you and yours.
 
Something is wrong with this thread. Can't get to page 13.

Mike.
 
Chopper said:
Because you have kept my word about patient endurance, I will keep you from the hour of trial that is coming on the whole world, to try those who dwell on the earth".
Click to expand...

Just as in the days of Noah.

God kept Noah and his family from the very thing that came upon the whole world.

You seem to assume that "keep from" means Rapture.

John was writing to the Churches of his day.

What does that have to do with the end of the age.

Matthew 24, 2 Thessalonians 2, 1 Thessalonians 4&5, 1 Corinthians 15 all speak of the resurrection and the rapture as well as the coming of the Lord.

These scriptures directly speak to us about Jesus Coming after the tribulation, after the man of sin is revealed, at the end of the age at the last trump.

How can anyone just sweep all the direct and plain, clear teachings under the rug in favor of a letter written to one of John's Churches 1900 years ago that never mentions anything at all about The Coming of the lord, The Resurrection, the end of the age, but only say's -

I will keep you from.
EDITED

JLB
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Brother Mike said:
Chopper said:
Rev. 12:1-6 The woman (church), her Son (the Bride/elect)
Click to expand...

Recheck Jesus Body being that of a Women. We are told exactly who the bride is somewhere else in Rev..

Blessings.

Mike.
Click to expand...

The Bride is taken from the body of Christ as Eve was taken from the body of Adam.


22 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is head of the wife, as also Christ is head of the church; and He is the Savior of the body.24 Therefore, just as the church is subject to Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in everything. 25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her, 26 that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word, 27 that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish. 28 So husbands ought to love their own wives as their own bodies; he who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as the Lord does the church. 30 For we are members of His body, of His flesh and of His bones. 31 "For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh." 32 This is a great mystery, but I speak concerning Christ and the church. Ephesians 5:22-32

JLB
 
JLB said:
The Bride is taken from the body of Christ as Eve was taken from the body of Adam.
Click to expand...

John said he was a friend of the Bridegroom not a bride, Jesus is male, and we are told exactly who the bride is. This "We are the bride of Christ" was made up by old hens in the Pentecostal movement who was so Ugly that every time they walked to the bank they had to turn off the security camera's.

Church is the Body of Christ. Not ugly hen.

Mike.
 
It's no wonder that men thought the earth was flat. How else would all people see Jesus coming in the clouds?
Has someone answered this?
 
reba said:
Be careful you guys (Notice guys not pointing at any ONE) do not go personal....
Click to expand...

Always seems these notices pop up after I post. NAh, just a coincidence......


Deborah13 said:
It's no wonder that men thought the earth was flat. How else would all people see Jesus coming in the clouds?
Has someone answered this?
Click to expand...


We have untold number of Angels zooming in all over the place and Jesus coming in the clouds. If you ever looked into the realm of the spirit you see through other things and fixate on what the Holy Spirit is showing you. It will appear to everyone Jesus coming in the clouds, even those hiding their face from the lamb.

I had an experience like that once being dumb. Won't do that again. However, the Lord opened my eyes and it was if I was standing in my living room and there were not walls.

Mike.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Brother Mike said:
JLB said:
The Bride is taken from the body of Christ as Eve was taken from the body of Adam.
Click to expand...

John said he was a friend of the Bridegroom not a bride, Jesus is male, and we are told exactly who the bride is. This "We are the bride of Christ" was made up by old hens in the Pentecostal movement who was so Ugly that every time they walked to the bank they had to turn off the security camera's.

Church is the Body of Christ. Not ugly hen.

Mike.
Click to expand...

Brother Mike,

This scripture says the Church is the Lord's wife -

31 "For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh." 32 This is a great mystery, but I speak concerning Christ and the church. Ephesians 5:31


JLB
 
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