Revelation 1:1-3 Seldom examined verses

[Dorothy Mae]

Does the fact a futurist,amil,preterist ,or historicist.all do do the same witnesses and reach the lost .

The problem Is I don't need to know the exact details of His coming .only avoid the clear warnings.
Don't die in sin ,don't take the mark.
Don't decieve or become a false prophet

Do reach the lost ,do repent and believe ,do make disciples if so called .

The didache simplicity on eschatology

You say two resurrection?

Where does Jesus say at the two ressurection?

Paul says he believes in the ressurection of the just and unjust .

Two Resurrections? “Blessed and holy are those who share in the first resurrection.”

Otherwise I agree. When Jesus comes and the Resurrection happens, has less of an impact than all that you mention.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

What does 70 AD have to do with anything written in the book of Revelation?

The destruction of Jerusalem is described therein.

 

[JLB]

The destruction of Jerusalem is described therein.

Here is what is described --

Then I was given a reed like a measuring rod. And the angel stood, saying, “Rise and measure the temple of God, the altar, and those who worship there. But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles. And they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months.

These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands standing before the God of the earth. And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.
Revelation 11:1-4

• And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.

How many Roman soldiers were killed by fire coming down from heaven upon them?


In the same hour there was a great earthquake, and a tenth of the city fell. In the earthquake seven thousand people were killed, and the rest were afraid and gave glory to the God of heaven. The second woe is past. Behold, the third woe is coming quickly.
Revelation 11:13




No mention of Jerusalem being destroyed by Roman soldiers.


JLB

 

[JLB]

As I understand it, the beast recieved a fatal wound in 70 AD. It's all better now.

No events of 70 AD mentioned in the book of Revelation.

The book of Revelation was written in 90 AD.

The events after Revelation 4:1 are future.


After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, “Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this.”
Revelation 4:1

 

[jasonc]

I really think visions are a shadow of things to come, and not the reality of what will be.

With the kingdom in us, we see the visions and dreams.

I will put my law in your hearts and minds.

eddif

You need to look at Ezekiel,Daniel and John's visions and isiahs ,also what Moses saw.

Mostly Torah

 

[jasonc]

42 months is a count down .

 

[Shilohsfoal]

No events of 70 AD mentioned in the book of Revelation.

The book of Revelation was written in 90 AD.

The events after Revelation 4:1 are future.


After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, “Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this.”
Revelation 4:1

The beast recieved the mortal wound before 90 AD.

Revelation 17:8 NIV: The beast, which you saw, once was, now is not, and yet will come up out of the Abyss and go to its destruction. The inhabitants of the earth whose names have not been written in the book of life from the creation of the world wi

In 70 AD it recieved a mortal wound. In 90 AD it was not. It is today though.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

No events of 70 AD mentioned in the book of Revelation.

The book of Revelation was written in 90 AD.

The events after Revelation 4:1 are future.


After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, “Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this.”
Revelation 4:1

It was written in 60 something AD. The temple is still standing. John is told he will still minister in the world and was 60 something. In 90 AD, he was too frail being and old man who couldn’t walk or talk and had to be carried to events. This was the view of the church fathers. He was on Patmos in the same years Peter and Paul were killed. That makes sense. It makes no sense for John to be put on Patmos at 90 when he couldn’t walk or talk.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

No events of 70 AD mentioned in the book of Revelation.

The book of Revelation was written in 90 AD.

The events after Revelation 4:1 are future.


After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, “Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this.”
Revelation 4:1

Jesus repeatedly said “soon” and what happened soon after that fits the description.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

No events of 70 AD mentioned in the book of Revelation.

Yes they are but it would take a book to lay out the details described by Josephus that match Revelation.

The book of Revelation was written in 90 AD.

The events after Revelation 4:1 are future.

Future for them, past for us. (Except the Resurrection and Judgement of course)

After these things I looked, and behold, a door standing open in heaven. And the first voice which I heard was like a trumpet speaking with me, saying, “Come up here, and I will show you things which must take place after this.”
Revelation 4:1

They happened shortly after he saw it.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Here is what is described --

Then I was given a reed like a measuring rod. And the angel stood, saying, “Rise and measure the temple of God, the altar, and those who worship there. But leave out the court which is outside the temple, and do not measure it, for it has been given to the Gentiles. And they will tread the holy city underfoot for forty-two months.

These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands standing before the God of the earth. And if anyone wants to harm them, fire proceeds from their mouth and devours their enemies. And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.
Revelation 11:1-4

• And if anyone wants to harm them, he must be killed in this manner.

How many Roman soldiers were killed by fire coming down from heaven upon them?


In the same hour there was a great earthquake, and a tenth of the city fell. In the earthquake seven thousand people were killed, and the rest were afraid and gave glory to the God of heaven. The second woe is past. Behold, the third woe is coming quickly.
Revelation 11:13




No mention of Jerusalem being destroyed by Roman soldiers.


JLB

The Romans were only the tool although Titus the General looked up to God and said to him, you know I didn’t do this, meaning the events were so horrible it was divinely ordained, not Roman.

The Book of Revelation of the ending of the Jewish covenant culminating in the final destruction of the temple which can never be rebuilt. That covenant age is over.

But it is in metaphors or symbols as so much of Hebrew prophesy is. Nevertheless those who had pierced him saw these events as Jesus said they would. That generation was still there when it happened. It was the Master coming and killing those servants who had killed the son. That is my view.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

I find it odd as I once did .that some spend hours and months looking hard for the return and miss that we'll that heart may stop today.

I'm not at all against studying the eschaton just don't be so focused on it that you miss the other parts .seen it .

We had a visitor who was too novice to be doing what he did,he knew the Bible but was to rigid ,caged Calvinist ,and had no eye and tolerance for the grey areas .you were not saved if you were anot a five pointer .

He was out there and he was a futurist .the elders here aren't that way .yes sine teach with a opinion and I would hear and ask in class or person .but never challenge them there .

The jewess who is kosher is a futurist .she is fluent in Hebrew ,raised in the temple ,believed and still does all feasts and can point each to the Messiah .

Another who debates her is as Dorothy and I told him .I see your point but those side debates .she is a jew .you won't budge that .he didn't get that .

She will listen .but won't change .she is in her seventies .

You’re not talking about me, right? I’m certainly not a Jew and I’m not in my 70s. The lack of putting your sentences in the normal order makes it hard to understand.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Some may look for a nuclear bomb, I have heard people like Hal Lindsey and such spout that stuff for quite a long time. But if I'm considering the image of their flesh being consumed and the heavens burning, then I would consider the Glory of the Lord, and how it might appear. I'm thinking more like the dedication of Solomons Temple and the flames lapping up the burnt offerings.

Forget Hal Linsey.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Futurists have to swallow the idea that the Dom of the Rock site held by Moslems will be given to the Jews and they’ll rebuild their temple there only so that the prophecies can be fulfilled. Now one can talk is flowery etherial language but the hard reality is that the muslims hold it and are not giving it up. But for futurists, they must.

 

[n2thelight]

The stars of heaven fall in Revelation 6.It takes place on the day of the Lord when those in Judea flee to the mountains and hide in the caves and dens. The stars cause a great earthquake and the heavens depart from the earth as a scroll being rolled together.
No these are not angels.

Revelation 6:12 - The Sixth Seal: Terror

And when I saw the Lamb open the sixth seal, there was a great earthquake, and the sun became black like sackcloth of goat hair, and the whole moon turned blood red,

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Revelation 6:13 - The Sixth Seal: Terror

and the stars of the sky fell to the earth like unripe figs dropping from a tree shaken by a great wind.

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Revelation 6:14 - The Sixth Seal: Terror

The sky receded like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved from its place.

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Revelation 6:15 - The Sixth Seal: Terror

Then the kings of the earth, the nobles, the commanders, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and free man hid in the caves and among the rocks of the mountains.

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Revelation 6:16 - The Sixth Seal: Terror

And they said to the mountains and the rocks, Fall on us and hide us from the face of the One seated on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb.

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None of these things have anything to do with angels.
This is the armed forces of the king of the north destroying the middle east.
This is great tribulation caused by the abomination of desation.All this takes place on the day of the Lord.

What are the stars ?

 

[Shilohsfoal]

What are the stars ?

Nuclear missiles.
They are placed in the middle east when the king of the north sets forth in great rage to innihilate many.

Daniel 11:44 - The King Who Exalts Himself

But news from the east and the north will alarm him, and he will go out with great fury to destroy many and devote them to destruction.

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Daniel goes on to write that "At that time" there would be tribulation, like there has never been.

Daniel 12:1 - Michael's Deliverance and the End Times

At that time Michael, the great prince who stands watch over your people, will rise up. There will be a time of distress, the likes of which will not have occurred from the beginning of nations until that time. But at that time your people--everyone whose name is found written in the book--will...

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The people in Revelation 6 who are hiding in caves and dens are in bomb shelters.

 

[jasonc]

You’re not talking about me, right? I’m certainly not a Jew and I’m not in my 70s. The lack of putting your sentences in the normal order makes it hard to understand.

To all

Does anyone honestly debate in fellowship in church for hours and hours ?

Did anyone do this outside of seminary ,they do it for apologetics on any subject ?

Does anyone ,I have mentioned it,become so focused on the eschaton that you isolate yourself from church and any possible minute off teaching .

Watch various end time pastors ,ministries and obsess over it ?

 

[Shilohsfoal]

To all

Does anyone honestly debate in fellowship in church for hours and hours ?

Did anyone do this outside of seminary ,they do it for apologetics on any subject ?

Does anyone ,I have mentioned it,become so focused on the eschaton that you isolate yourself from church and any possible minute off teaching .

Watch various end time pastors ,ministries and obsess over it ?

I don't debate in church. I left Insted.

I havnt debated on a forum such as this.

I have isolated myself from everyone studying scripture for days on end. And have done that for many years.

I don't watch pastors or videos on end times. I just read scripture.

 

[Shilohsfoal]

To all

Does anyone honestly debate in fellowship in church for hours and hours ?

Did anyone do this outside of seminary ,they do it for apologetics on any subject ?

Does anyone ,I have mentioned it,become so focused on the eschaton that you isolate yourself from church and any possible minute off teaching .

Watch various end time pastors ,ministries and obsess over it ?

I meant to say, have debated on forums such as this. I couldn't edit it. Time expired.

 

[jasonc]

I don't debate in church. I left Insted.

I havnt debated on a forum such as this.

I have isolated myself from everyone studying scripture for days on end. And have done that for many years.

I don't watch pastors or videos on end times. I just read scripture.

That's exactly what I talked about .

Who in persons challenged you.

Forsake not assembling together .online church isn't church at all.

How does one even know you if you died and went to heaven ,if they ever talked to you ?

Name tags if online personas ?