Salvation by grace through faith; not through works / law-keeping.

[gordon777]

Just because you fail to see does not mean it is not answered.


Hebrews 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

 

[Butch5]

Just because you fail to see does not mean it is not answered.


Hebrews 12:15 Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled;
16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

What it means is you're not getting your point across.

 

[gordon777]

When you know the Scriptures it doesn't take long to point out error

The error of the wicked, is being slow to hear, and quick to speak. ( wrestling against the scriptures to their own destruction.)


2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

 

[Butch5]

The error of the wicked, is being slow to hear, and quick to speak. ( wrestling against the scriptures to their own destruction.)


2 Peter 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.

Do you intend to address the issue or are you going to continue to ramble on?

 

[gordon777]

What it means is you're not getting your point across.

Gods word has given its point, resisting the truth is done by those not of it.

People not of the truth try to deceive on forums as God told for the end times, but the actions we see in the Apostles, are not their lie.


2 Peter 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as their's also was.
10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
11 Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

 

[gordon777]

Do you intend to address the issue or are you going to continue to ramble on?

Do you have any purpose, other than to confess Jesus Christ and His Holy Apostles are the only to believe and follow, or you have some value to add, not seeing who yo are or what you do ?

 

[Butch5]

Gods word has given its point, resisting the truth is done by those not of it.

People not of the truth try to deceive on forums as God told for the end times, but the actions we see in the Apostles, are not their lie.


2 Peter 3:7 Ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth.
8 Now as Jannes and Jambres withstood Moses, so do these also resist the truth: men of corrupt minds, reprobate concerning the faith.
9 But they shall proceed no further: for their folly shall be manifest unto all men, as their's also was.
10 But thou hast fully known my doctrine, manner of life, purpose, faith, longsuffering, charity, patience,
11 Persecutions, afflictions, which came unto me at Antioch, at Iconium, at Lystra; what persecutions I endured: but out of them all the Lord delivered me.
12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.

Yeah, that's why we're refuting Reformed doctrine.

 

[Butch5]

Do you have any purpose, other than to confess Jesus Christ and His Holy Apostles are the only to believe and follow, or you have some value to add, not seeing who yo are or what you do ?

I'll take that as you're going to continue to ramble.

 

[gordon777]

I'll take that as you're going to continue to ramble.

You are dong the value of man:


Psalm 39:5 Behold, thou hast made my days as an handbreadth; and mine age is as nothing before thee: verily every man at his best state is altogether vanity. Selah.

 

[gordon777]

I'll take that as you're going to continue to ramble.

These words and testimonies of God may be rambling for some, but they point out what vanity is. ( vanity is when we do not see if they are ministers of satan doing nothing but speak great swelling words of vanity, or ministers of God in their suffering afflicted examples.



2 Corinthians 11:15 Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.


2 Peter 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.

Jude 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

 

[gordon777]

We are saved by believing in the works that Jesus Christ Our Lord and Saviour did ( dying and rising) in the works that the Apostles did, laying their lives down. ( to live in faith)

We are hardly saved by hearing the words of the non doers, are we.

 

[RBDERRICK]

In John 5:24, it should be clear that everlasting life begins at first faith and that the person "shall not come into condemnation"

Paul says only for them that walk after the Spirit and not after the flesh.

John says only them doing good are born of God.

James says faith alone is dead and cannot save nor justify any man.

Do you believe it is possible for any Christian to live righteously and holily in a daily walk as Jesus walked on earth?

That a Christian can ensure by works of Christ added to our faith, that we shall never fall and come into condemnation of the sinful world?

 

[RBDERRICK]

In 1 John 5:13 and Romans 8:16, we can know that we know that we know that we "have" everlasting life...

John says only if we are keeping His commandments. Otherwise, we are lying to ourselves by faith alone.

The faith alone gospel guts any doing of the word from salvation and justification by faith alone.

right now and in the present moment.

Do you believe it is possible for any man to be saved and justified by Jesus Christ, while doing an unrighteous work of the flesh right now and in the present moment?

Can any one while committing fornication, robbery, cursed lying, or doing any such thing right now and in the present moment, also be a born again son of God conformed to the image of His dear Son Jesus?

 

[RBDERRICK]

therefore can be said to have spiritual life and are therefore, for all practical purposes "born again".

This is an incredible statement. The gospel of being born again 'for all practical purposes'. Like kind of born again.

Who would ever teach being born again for all practical purposes? Even a child would reject that. This is not a doctrine for serious-minded people.

It's an unwitting confession that faith alone only kind of saves the soul. It's almost like being born again.

'For all practical purposes' has no meaning at all, if something is not being practiced.

No man is 'for all practical purposes' a fisherman, that does not fish. Both cases of faith alone without works, and for all practical purposes without practice, are foolishly unreal.

'For all practical purposes' without the practicing of it is only virtually, and not really. And so is faith alone without works.

Faith alone is virtue-signaling by hearers only, where there's no practical virtue to it.

How can anything, that has no practical work, being of any practical value?

Such is the case of the gospel of being saved by faith alone with neither practice nor work.

 

[RBDERRICK]

However, it should be clear that they are not of the elect.

Another new twist to justify hearers only. Trying to make a difference between only being born again and being the elect of God.

Only in the gospel of faith alone, can such a thing be found, because there's no such thing written in the gospel of Jesus Christ.

It's just giving more lip service to those who actually do the word, while still trying to save those not doing the word.

When Peter wrote to the strangers scattered abroad, he called them all elect. He didn't make difference between those only born again of God and those elected of God.

 

[RBDERRICK]

Memorizing the scripture that I have prescribed for you to memorize will help you to hide that scripture in your heart so that you will not be deceived by false doctrine that is contrary to it.

I'm already not decieved by the false doctrine of faith alone. It's dead.

It bears witness to what I spoke of at another forum, that soil types #2 and #3 in the parable of the sower are living plants and therefore can be said to have spiritual life

True. But faith alone is soil type #1 on the wayside.

Faith alone without works is dead and is taken immediately out of the heart of hearers only, that are not doing the faith.

Paul says the faith of God is to be obeyed, not just heard and agreed with.

And soil types 2 & 3 become as dead hearers only by no more doing the word.

Only soil type #4 is them that do the word unto the end of this life at the appearing of their Lord Jesus Christ.

 

[RBDERRICK]

All the knowledge that people have, what value is it all, such as all that is constantly talked about on your thread so far ?

The Pharisees had lots of knowledge, they strove with Christ, asking questions they believed could not be answered against them.

They are an example of much discussion ( always questioning with Christ) but of Christ always correcting them.

Christ also observed them, so we see they are talk only, ( the wisdom of this world that comes to nothing.) because they say words, and do nothing, they also do all their works to be seen of men, boasting the scriptures they wore, loving the chief seats and uppermost rooms. ( pride of men.)



John 8:5 Now Moses in the law commanded us, that such should be stoned: but what sayest thou?

Matthew 23:1 Then spake Jesus to the multitude, and to his disciples,
2 Saying The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
3 All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
4 For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
5 But all their works they do for to be seen of men: they make broad their phylacteries, and enlarge the borders of their garments,
6 And love the uppermost rooms at feasts, and the chief seats in the synagogues,

Great knowledge you got there. And you shared it too.

Too bad it has no value, since it is now posted on this thread along with all the other valueless posts.

There's always someone who comes out to deride all the arguments. The only problem is they then add to the arguing, by arguing against arguing.

And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

More vain arguing time over Scripture without value.

And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God.

3 whole months of doctrinal disputing with no value.

But when divers were hardened, and believed not, but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he departed from them, and separated the disciples, disputing daily in the school of one Tyrannus. And this continued by the space of two years.

Even 2 whole wasted years of arguing the Bible.

 

[RBDERRICK]

The Pharisees also never stopped what they were, to never hear the rebuke to believe in the righteousness of God, instead they go about, ( as this forum) to establish themselves.

A learned Pharisee couldn't have said it better.

All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

Such as saying a lot about not arguing with others, while arguing against others.

The problem here, once again, is the moment someone begins to make arguments against others arguing, they become their own worst critics and lose any credibility for their argument against arguing.

If I really believed that arguments made on forums like this, were truly a vain waste of time, and even destructive after the manner of hypocrite Pharisees, then of course I wouldn't participate. I wouldn't even come onto the sight and viewage points to it.

But then, that's only because I'm not a hypocrite nor a Pharisee. Not by doctrine nor practise.

 

[RBDERRICK]

No man is saved until the end
There are 20 plus verses stating this here are a few Mk 13:13 Matt 24:13
Thanks

True, but we are saved by grace through faith, means we are saved now.

A better translation is, we are being saved by grace through faith. The same for he that is doing righteousness, is righteous as the Lord is righteous.

It's all a matter of the here and now, especially at the end of this life. And so we are being saved unto the end by hearing and doing the word of faith in Jesus Christ.

At the end, only those continuing to be saved in the faith, will obtain eternal salvation by resurrection of the dead to everlasting life with God.

Also, the free gift is the faith of Jesus that saves, not the salvation. Being saved costs us a price: Our own old lives on our own born crosses for Jesus' sake.

Trying to pay that price without Jesus and His work on His own cross, is what is vain, and is not possible.

Trying to avoid paying that price and be saved by faith alone, is what is also vain and not possible.

 

[RBDERRICK]

He didn't say "a" law. The Law he is talking about is the Mosaic Law. Just because they weren't saved by the Mosaic Law doesn't mean there is no law Christians. There is the Law of Christ

Very well said, and a very necessary response to them that reject the law of God today by Christ Jesus.

Peter says we are commanded to obey the law of man, but not of Christ?

The faith alone gospel is utter foolishness of transgressors that want to save and justify themselves by their own faith alone.

Christians are lawful, not lawless.

Christians are good law abiding citizens of nations on earth, and the commonwealth of Israel from heaven.

That at that time ye were without Christ, being aliens from the commonwealth of Israel, and strangers from the covenants of promise, having no hope, and without God in the world:

But now in Christ Jesus ye who sometimes were far off are made nigh by the blood of Christ.