Should one exercise speaking in tongues?

[Rodger]

It might not be done in your church, but I have been in many church's where this Spiritual gift is exercised for the lifting up and edifying of the body of Christ and also in my private prayer time.

I am very blessed that you are able to say that.

You said.......
"I have been in MANY church's where this Spiritual gift is exercised for the lifting up and edifying".

In your thinking, does "MANY" constitute doing it Biblically?

I believe that I am older than you and I have attended lots and lots of churches. That was my job before retiring. I can say with 100% clarity that I have NEVER seen speaking in tongues done Biblically.

In simple English Here is the Assembly of God Pentecostal logic at = Source...https://news.ag.org/en/article-repository/spiritual-life/2019/05/faq-speaking-in-tongues.
1. All followers of Jesus should be baptized in the Holy Spirit.
2. The initial physical evidence of this baptism is speaking in tongues.
3. Therefore, all believers should speak in tongues.

There you will read........
"The Spirit's fullness, evidenced initially by the phenomenon of speaking in other tongues, is the common experience all celebrate with joy."

One paragraph down from that is this.....
"There is an essential link between that experience and speaking in other tongues, as pointed out above."

In common, easy to understand English, they are going around the bush to say that IF you are saved you will speak in tongues.

 

[Rodger]

So many go by whatever the doctrine is of the various types of church's that are out there, but yet neglect the true doctrine of Jesus as they would rather believe what their church believes. Why do people believe that the Spiritual gifts were only given to the Apostles?

1Cor 12:11 But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

Because that is what the Bible says!

Mark 16:14-16.....
"Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
(This in Greek grammar is an ATECEDANT and it explains that the "THEM" in verse 15 is the ELEVEN in verse 14).
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."

This is the Great Commission given to the Apostles, and it was given from Jesus to the ELEVEN standing in front of them.

As the LITERAL WORDS of Scripture say......The apostles (The Eleven) would be prepared and empowered for the work of the Great Commission; the thus made disciples were to be taught all things; and Jesus would be with the apostles in their work (Matt. 28: 18; vs. 19; vs. 19; vs. 19; vs. 19; Mk. 16: 16; Lk. 24: 47; vs. 49, cp. Mk. 16: 20; Matt. 28: 20; vs. 20).

Many, many people confuse the Commission given to the Apostles and the one given in Matthew 28:19-20. This Commission famously includes Jesus’s words “Go and make disciples of all nations”....
however as you can see Jesus did not include the Sign Gifts.

 

[JLB]

I think that if you investigate a little, you will see that the letters to the church in Corinth were "corrective".

I agree.

The church in Corinth very carnal, but rich in manifestations of the Spirit.

 

[Rodger]

I agree.

The church in Corinth very carnal, but rich in manifestations of the Spirit.

But.......the manifestations were not Biblical. The church misused the speaking in tongues terribly.

 

[JLB]

That being the case, then in 1 Corinthians 12 -14, the Context is Paul "correcting" the church on the use of tongues. It is out of that "Context" that he says....."And you women keep silent in church."

Yes corrective in the sense, that walking in love; loving God and loving our neighbor is the priority.

Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I have become sounding brass or a clanging cymbal.
1 Corinthians 13:1


No, in the sense that Paul forbid the operation of the Godhead (Trinity) through the body of Christ, individually as the Spirit wills.

Now there are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. And there are differences of administrations, but the same Lord. And there are diversities of operations, but it is the same God which worketh all in all. But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to every man to profit withal. For to one is given by the Spirit the word of wisdom; to another the word of knowledge by the same Spirit; To another faith by the same Spirit; to another the gifts of healing by the same Spirit; To another the working of miracles; to another prophecy; to another discerning of spirits; to another divers kinds of tongues; to another the interpretation of tongues: But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.
1 Corinthians 12:4-11

 

[JLB]

But.......the manifestations were not Biblical. The church misused the speaking in tongues terribly.

Manifestations were very biblical, but operated through immature and carnal individuals.

What parent would forbid a baby from eating because they made a mess when they first started learning to do it on their own.

The gifts and callings are without repentance.

 

[for_his_glory]

Because that is what the Bible says!

Mark 16:14-16.....
"Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;
(This in Greek grammar is an ATECEDANT and it explains that the "THEM" in verse 15 is the ELEVEN in verse 14).
They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover."

This is the Great Commission given to the Apostles, and it was given from Jesus to the ELEVEN standing in front of them.

As the LITERAL WORDS of Scripture say......The apostles (The Eleven) would be prepared and empowered for the work of the Great Commission; the thus made disciples were to be taught all things; and Jesus would be with the apostles in their work (Matt. 28: 18; vs. 19; vs. 19; vs. 19; vs. 19; Mk. 16: 16; Lk. 24: 47; vs. 49, cp. Mk. 16: 20; Matt. 28: 20; vs. 20).

Many, many people confuse the Commission given to the Apostles and the one given in Matthew 28:19-20. This Commission famously includes Jesus’s words “Go and make disciples of all nations”....
however as you can see Jesus did not include the Sign Gifts.

The Apostle have all died so does that mean the none of us have been prepared and equipped to continue in the great commission? Where in 1 Corinthians 15:4-31 does it say anything about the great commission or that only the Apostles received Spiritual gifts? Please read Romans 10:13-15 as it is only through the calling and anointing of the Holy Spirit that we are called and sent out to preach the Gospel of God's grace.

 

[hawkman]

I too was a Pentecostal and I Just wanted you to know when I am coming from.

Because you attended a Pentecostal church with your parents ? If you did not agree with Pentecostal teaching from the Bible how could you have ever been Pentecostal , please tell me .
I have been in a Catholic Church but that does not make me Catholic .

When you were attending church as Pentecostal and someone asked what does that mean to be Pentecostal ? What was your answer .

No one ever asked me what it meant to be a Pentecostal. As a child, It was just an accepted thing to do as my parents told me. So to answer you......I had not answer.

Were you given a choice by your parents on what church you could attend as a 16 year old ?

 

[for_his_glory]

I am very blessed that you are able to say that.

You said.......
"I have been in MANY church's where this Spiritual gift is exercised for the lifting up and edifying".

In your thinking, does "MANY" constitute doing it Biblically?

I believe that I am older than you and I have attended lots and lots of churches. That was my job before retiring. I can say with 100% clarity that I have NEVER seen speaking in tongues done Biblically.

In simple English Here is the Assembly of God Pentecostal logic at = Source...https://news.ag.org/en/article-repository/spiritual-life/2019/05/faq-speaking-in-tongues.
1. All followers of Jesus should be baptized in the Holy Spirit.
2. The initial physical evidence of this baptism is speaking in tongues.
3. Therefore, all believers should speak in tongues.

There you will read........
"The Spirit's fullness, evidenced initially by the phenomenon of speaking in other tongues, is the common experience all celebrate with joy."

One paragraph down from that is this.....
"There is an essential link between that experience and speaking in other tongues, as pointed out above."

In common, easy to understand English, they are going around the bush to say that IF you are saved you will speak in tongues.

I'm 70 and in my 70 years have attended many different types of denominational/non-denominational churches . I don't care what logic the AoG, (in which I use to attend), or any church uses as we need to believe in the Doctrine of Christ and not man's traditional doctrines that their church establishes. If you do not believe in praying or speaking in tongues then that is on you as many of us have been given this beautiful gift.

 

[Rodger]

I'm 70 and in my 70 years have attended many different types of denominational/non-denominational churches . I don't care what logic the AoG, (in which I use to attend), or any church uses as we need to believe in the Doctrine of Christ and not man's traditional doctrines that their church establishes. If you do not believe in praying or speaking in tongues then that is on you as many of us have been given this beautiful gift.

Agreed. I am not speaking against anyone speaking in tongues and have stated that.

If you want to do it....do it! It is that it just can not be done with the claim that it is Biblical when it clearly is not or that the evidence of speaking in tongues is needed to prove salvation.

I am 10 years on you. I will be glad to wait till you catch up.

 

[Rodger]

Because you attended a Pentecostal church with your parents ? If you did not agree with Pentecostal teaching from the Bible how could you have ever been Pentecostal , please tell me .
I have been in a Catholic Church but that does not make me Catholic .



Were you given a choice by your parents on what church you could attend as a 16 year old ?

My dear friend.....when you are a child you do as your parents tell you what to do. How can anyone as a child not agree with what their parents tell them?

I had NO idea what was going on. I watched, I saw but had no understanding. As a child, I had no knowledge of what was Pentecostal or Catholic or Methodist or Baptist.

As I stated....as I grew older (16-18 somewhere around there) I began to ask questions as I read the Bible and what the Bible said our church did not do. It was and is just that simple.

If you are questioning my post on being in a Pentecostal church as a child, why not just say so instead of the round about way you are now doing with these accusatory questions.

Do you require the name of the church and city it is still in? I will be glad to tell you if that will satisfy your curiosity.

 

[Rodger]

The Apostle have all died so does that mean the none of us have been prepared and equipped to continue in the great commission? Where in 1 Corinthians 15:4-31 does it say anything about the great commission or that only the Apostles received Spiritual gifts? Please read Romans 10:13-15 as it is only through the calling and anointing of the Holy Spirit that we are called and sent out to preach the Gospel of God's grace.

It means that NO ONE today can be an Apostle! The Bible has several qualification in order to be one of the 12 Apostles and they are.......
1. The person had to have been an eyewitness to Jesus after his resurrection.
(Acts 1:21-22; Acts 10:39-42; Acts 22:14; 1 Corinthians 9:1)
2. Apostles had to be selected by Christ Himself.
(Matthew 10:5; Mark 3:13-14; Luke 6:13; Acts 1:24-26; Acts 9:15; Acts 22:14-15,21; Acts 26:16).
That being the Bible facts, There are no men today that meet the above qualifications, thus there are NO Apostles today and according to Mark 16:14, the "sign gifts" were given to the ELEVEN men standing in front of Jesus.

Yes.....All of the Apostles died and hold on now.......there is not one single Scripture anywhere in the Bible that says the office of an Apostle was passed down to anyone else.

Anyone who says that they are an Apostle today is a false prophet!

 

[hawkman]

If you are questioning my post on being in a Pentecostal church as a child, why not just say so instead of the round about way you are now doing with these accusatory questions.

There is a reason for the questions and that brings us back to your statement below .

I too was a Pentecostal and I Just wanted you to know when I am coming from.

What I think you should have said above is " I have attended at Pentecostal churches . " Unless you want to tell me how you would be considered to be Pentecostal back then .
Otherwise you are suggesting you came out of Pentecostalism when actually you were only a close observer of Pentecostalism .

 

[Rodger]

Manifestations were very biblical, but operated through immature and carnal individuals.

What parent would forbid a baby from eating because they made a mess when they first started learning to do it on their own.

The gifts and callings are without repentance.

Brother, you have already agreed that the actions and goingson in the Corinthian church were carnal!

You can not now turn around and say......."Manifestations were very Biblical"!
That is an impossibility which is why Paul wrote letters of correction to them which you also have agreed with.

Babies need direction and correction and discipline.

Brother...."The phrase "The gifts and callings are without repentance" is from the Romans 11:29.

That simply means that God's gifts and callings are irrevocable and not based on human merit and IN opinion does not apply to our discussion.

 

[Rodger]

There is a reason for the questions and that brings us back to your statement below .

What I think you should have said above is " I have attended at Pentecostal churches . " Unless you want to tell me how you would be considered to be Pentecostal back then .
Otherwise you are suggesting you came out of Pentecostalism when actually you were only a close observer of Pentecostalism .

I am not sure how this got misinterpreted. It seems to me that I have explained this a couple of times now.

I said exactly what I should have said. Not only did I attend a Pentecostal church, I was raised in a Pentecostal church and was a member in a Pentacostal sure for about the 1st 20 years of my life.

I just like you lived with my parents.
I just like you did what my parents told me to do.
I just like you was taken to the church with my parents.
I was in Sunday School.
I was in the Youth department.

I was NOT A CLOSE OBSERVER. (Yes, I meant to yell).

 

[JLB]

Brother, you have already agreed that the actions and goingson in the Corinthian church were carnal!

Carnal and immature. Absolutely.

And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ. I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able; for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men? For when one says, “I am of Paul,” and another, “I am of Apollos,” are you not carnal?
1 Corinthians 3:1-4

 

[Rodger]

Carnal and immature. Absolutely.

And I, brethren, could not speak to you as to spiritual people but as to carnal, as to babes in Christ. I fed you with milk and not with solid food; for until now you were not able to receive it, and even now you are still not able; for you are still carnal. For where there are envy, strife, and divisions among you, are you not carnal and behaving like mere men? For when one says, “I am of Paul,” and another, “I am of Apollos,” are you not carnal?
1 Corinthians 3:1-4

We are on the same page.

It is clear to me that these Corinthians are undoubtedly Christians.

Now, though, Paul says the fact that they are saved does not mean he can call them spiritual people because they are not living as spiritual people. They are still living as if they were of the flesh.

That is the key to the Christian life today. Way too many people believe that they can read Playboy magazines, go the local bar and get drunk, beat the wife and kick the dog during the week and then show up on Sunday morning and all is well!

Instead of living in the supernatural power of the Holy Spirit and according to God's wisdom about spiritual things, the Corinthian Christians are still behaving as if they were mere, unspiritual human beings thus the word "Carnal".

Paul's evidence of this is the issue he brought up in chapter 1.

The church in Corinth is divided. Some claim to follow Paul and others Apollos and still others Peter.

I have experience that very same thing. I was called to a church that had one family sitting on one side of the church and another family on the other side. I was a young man and fortunately I had several very good deacons. They advised me to bring the two families together, demand from them repentance and forgivness...or......tell them to leave and go to another church because if waht they were doing continued, God loses and no one gets saved when there is anger in the midst.

Something that most believrs ignore or do not know and that is the fact that A fire is coming to test their work, Paul writes. That fire is Christ's judgment of the work of Christians on the day of the Lord during the end times. Those whose work is built on the foundation of Jesus Christ will receive a reward. Those whose work is shown to be weak and worthless will suffer a loss, but they will be saved by God's grace through faith in Christ. There will be no salvation, though, for anyone who destroys God's temple, the church (1 Corinthians 3:13–17).

Instead of being wise by the world's standards, one must become a fool in this culture to be wise before God. God will reveal the wisdom of those who deceive themselves by thinking they are wise to be worthless and futile. All things belong to those who are in Christ and there should not be animosity between believers over Bible doctrine.

 

[for_his_glory]

Agreed. I am not speaking against anyone speaking in tongues and have stated that.

If you want to do it....do it! It is that it just can not be done with the claim that it is Biblical when it clearly is not or that the evidence of speaking in tongues is needed to prove salvation.

I am 10 years on you. I will be glad to wait till you catch up.

Speaking in tongues does not prove our salvation, but if you read and study Act 2:1-4; Romans 8:26; 1Corinthians 12:1-11; 1Corinthians14 will help explain to you about praying in tongues and is very Biblical, especially when it is a gift from the Holy Spirit.

 

[for_his_glory]

Agreed. I am not speaking against anyone speaking in tongues and have stated that.

If you want to do it....do it! It is that it just can not be done with the claim that it is Biblical when it clearly is not or that the evidence of speaking in tongues is needed to prove salvation.

I am 10 years on you. I will be glad to wait till you catch up.

Age has nothing to do with this as I was taught about speaking in tongues that I was given this beautiful gift from the Holy Spirit when I was in my 30's.

 

[for_his_glory]

It means that NO ONE today can be an Apostle! The Bible has several qualification in order to be one of the 12 Apostles and they are.......
1. The person had to have been an eyewitness to Jesus after his resurrection.
(Acts 1:21-22; Acts 10:39-42; Acts 22:14; 1 Corinthians 9:1)
2. Apostles had to be selected by Christ Himself.
(Matthew 10:5; Mark 3:13-14; Luke 6:13; Acts 1:24-26; Acts 9:15; Acts 22:14-15,21; Acts 26:16).
That being the Bible facts, There are no men today that meet the above qualifications, thus there are NO Apostles today and according to Mark 16:14, the "sign gifts" were given to the ELEVEN men standing in front of Jesus.

Yes.....All of the Apostles died and hold on now.......there is not one single Scripture anywhere in the Bible that says the office of an Apostle was passed down to anyone else.

Anyone who says that they are an Apostle today is a false prophet!

I never said anyone can be an Apostle, but we are the Disciples of Christ as we are to continue in the works of the Lord. The exact same works that the Apostles done before the Lord.

Do you believe all that has been written is for all of us, or just for the Apostles?