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Should the churches have some say in divorce

OK. I'm clearly not married, never have been, probably never will be, but...

...sometimes, I think Protestants are too focused on the individual and His/Her relationship to The Lord, and there's not enough emphasis on community. If people have marital problems that might respond to spiritual guidance, shouldn't it be preferable to talk to your church before friends, before a counselor?
 
Christ_empowered said:
OK. I'm clearly not married, never have been, probably never will be, but...

...sometimes, I think Protestants are too focused on the individual and His/Her relationship to The Lord, and there's not enough emphasis on community. If people have marital problems that might respond to spiritual guidance, shouldn't it be preferable to talk to your church before friends, before a counselor?
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It all depends.I have experienced Church counseling and it was awful.A Christian marriage counselor was wonderful.
 
See...that's true, too. Kinda like the "Nouethic Counseling" (that's probably missepelled, lol) approach to mental illness...read: ITS ALL YOUR FAULT! LOL.
 
Kathi said:
I agree that the first steps should be to separate and go for counseling.If he or she wants to be the spouse that God wants them to be then a reconciliation is in order and that is wonderful.If not after quite some time of anticipating change then a divorce needs to be considered.
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The problem I see with this is if it doesn't work out and so you decide to get a divorce that's exactly the 'I'm not getting what I want, therefore I'm out' attitude that needs to be condemned in the church. I honestly think it is God's will to sit it out in a safe place while staying married and let the other spouse play whatever hand it is they will play. If they come to their senses you get to have what you want out of marriage. If they react by leaving the marriage you get the divorce you can legitimately have. If they do nothing, and they or you don't commit adultery, you do exactly what Jesus wants you to do...tough it out.

God as my witness, I'm not trying to come across as unsympathetic. I'm more acquainted with difficult marital situations than anyone in this forum (save for Reba, perhaps) knows about. This isn't just the ivory tower advice and lack of experience of a self-righteous Christian here. I'm living some of this hard stuff right now. And have been for many, many years.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
The problem I see with this is if it doesn't work out and you get a divorce that's exactly the 'I'm not getting what I want, therefore I'm out' attitude that needs to be condemned in the church. I honestly think it is God's will to sit it out in a safe place while staying married and let the other spouse play whatever hand it is they will play. If they come to their senses you get to have what you want out of marriage. If they react by leaving the marriage you get the divorce you can legitimately have. If they do nothing, and don't commit adultery, you do exactly what Jesus wants you to do...tough it out.

God as my witness, I'm not trying to come across as unsympathetic. I'm more acquainted with difficult marital situations than anyone in this forum (save for Reba, perhaps) knows about. This isn't just the ivory tower advice and lack of experience of a self-righteous Christian here. I'm living some of this hard stuff right now. And have been for many, many years.
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I guess you could be separated for 50 years.And no you are not more acquainted with difficult marital situations.You do not know what I have been through.
 
Kathi said:
I guess you could be separated for 50 years.
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Yup! And then you die and God says, "well done, my good and faithful servant, enter into your master's abundance." I'm welling up with tears just thinking about it.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Yup! And then you die and God says, "well done, my good and faithful servant, enter into your master's abundance." I'm welling up with tears just thinking about it.
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That is one approach.A person is not going to go to hell for divorcing a spouse in an abusive situation.Maybe that person might need to remain single but maybe that is ok.
 
Kathi said:
That is one approach.A person is not going to go to hell for divorcing a spouse in an abusive situation.
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Like any sin, if an unBiblical divorce represents a willful contempt and thumbing of the nose at the forgiveness of God they have received in Christ then they will indeed go to hell. If the unBiblical divorce is because of lack of knowledge or because of weakness there is lots of room for God's forgiveness for the person who seeks it. And that is what I think we need to see in the church: Not an acceptance of divorce no questions asked, but an honest acceptance of what the Bible says about it and moving the person who has sinned in this regard toward an acknowledging and renouncing of that sin and into the forgiveness of Christ. That's what grace is all about.


Kathi said:
Maybe that person might need to remain single but maybe that is ok.
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Might need to? If they want to be obedient to Christ they have to remain single if no grounds for Biblical divorce exist. It's a toughee but it's the truth. The church needs to help people with this, not make it go away.
 
Christ_empowered said:
OK. I'm clearly not married, never have been, probably never will be, but...

...sometimes, I think Protestants are too focused on the individual and His/Her relationship to The Lord, and there's not enough emphasis on community. If people have marital problems that might respond to spiritual guidance, shouldn't it be preferable to talk to your church before friends, before a counselor?
Click to expand...
Honestly, at this point in the condition of the church, generally speaking, you will not get Biblical guidance in regard to a difficult marriage from the church leadership. You'll more likely see their butts sticking up in the air while their heads are stuck in the sand.
 
Christ_empowered said:
The church doesn't hold, nor does it exercise, the power it once had to regulate peoples' behavior.
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I'm thinking it isn't supposed to regulate behavior. It regulates what behavior is allowed and not allowed in the church. Can you see the important difference?

IOW, the church can't make you not get a divorce. But it can close the fellowship to you if you do when you weren't supposed to and you are unrepentant about it.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Honestly, at this point in the condition of the church, generally speaking, you will not get Biblical guidance in regard to a difficult marriage from the church leadership. You'll more likely see their butts sticking up in the air while their heads are stuck in the sand.
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I don't see how the church is any different than years past.
Every era has it's ups and downs.
 
reba said:
We Christians like to say our marriages are like a triangle with God at the top... ETC .. yet we go to the state for a divorce decree
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no you don't say.
 
A lot of issues that lead to do divorce have to do with age at first marriage, social class, educational attainment. Also, inter-faith marriages are at a higher risk of divorce, as are 2nd, 3rd, etc. marriages.
 
Christ_empowered said:
I dunno. When we covered suicide in one of my classes, long, long ago, the professor pointed out that Jewish communities also usually have lower divorce and suicide rates, even though divorce is available and suicide isn't particularly taboo. I think the way Catholics do things--you have to be a member of the community to work out your salvation, confession to a priest, being a part of the body--reduces isolation and helps build community.
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we like to do church on our own, rather then be church as a community.
 
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