The destruction of the temple in 70AD, how do futurists deal with this?

[n2thelight]

Do you all really believe those over in that nation state of Israel are Gods chosen people when they don't believe in Christ ?

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Let me submit a scripture for consideration.

Matthew 11:12 kjv
12. And from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven suffereth violence, and the violent take it by force.

When we (me included) use force to take the kingdom it speaks of our nature?

I’m not sure what this scripture means as we cannot get ahold of the Kingdom of God with violent weapons or violence. Our natures aren’t all the same in any case. Iow, I don’t understand it myself but don’t think that’s the answer although I haven’t anything better to offer.

The death of Jesus was by force. The kingdom belonged to Jesus by right. Jesus still owned / possessed the kingdom by the will of God. Jesus did not use force.

The plaque over his head speaks.

Mississippi redneck
eddif

That is true.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Do you all really believe those over in that nation state of Israel are Gods chosen people when they don't believe in Christ ?

This is very common but really inexplicable except by racial prejudice. (Sounds negative but in this case it means one race is favored over others solely by virtue of racial heritage.)

 

[eddif]

Do you all really believe those over in that nation state of Israel are Gods chosen people when they don't believe in Christ ?

What I believe is:
The Jews that wrote the New Testament were real true Jews.
The true Jew has the oracles of God
The grafted in gentile should not be high minded.

eddif

 

[Dorothy Mae]

It was a type

Well it was a real building from which the Spirit of God left. It’s destruction was a fulfillment of prophesy and so the real destruction is the major message. The covenant was over.

 

[Consecrated Life]

The coming world ruler who will possess a zeal to kill jews that will make Hitler seem like a humanitarian will have a seat of power and a place of worship for himself.
If you are going to say is not the Temple then you have to name another place he will use for this purpose?
To those who would say that this has already happened with Antiochus Epiphanes attempt hellenize his dominion & to force the Greek religion worshiping Zeus by ordering a pig to be offered on the holy altar and set up an idol of Zeus, Jesus's own Word in His most lengthy teaching on prophecy Olivet Discourse contradicts this.
Jesus declares that none of what is prophesized in Daniel will happen until the Gospel is preached " in the whole world."

Mat 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

We are not there yet but we are getting close no doubt.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Did the 1854 Charge of the Light Brigade work? LOL

Mississippi redneck
eddif

???? What does this have to do with the discussion?

 

[eddif]

Well it was a real building from which the Spirit of God left. Its destruction was a fulfillment of prophesy and so the real destruction is the major message. The covenant was over.

I do not have a knowledge of just talking of covenants.

How many covenants/promices were there?
Are these some?
Adam and Eve
Noah
Abraham
Moses

When is the New Covenant?
Is it the law in our hearts and minds?
Is it New Jerusalem?
On purpose I did not check order or look up what I think.

Are the things I listed too long many.

The he idea is to get a list from
Dorothy Mae .
Be nice if the covenants hsd start and finish indicators.

I am headed to look now. Not to get into covenant theology, but it might answer the OP. I would look at 70-AD and place it in the total/whole scheme of things.

eddif

 

[eddif]

???? What does this have to do with the discussion?

Was the destruction of 70-AD just one of the attempts to end some things, but not the whole main battle of all time?

eddif

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Matthew 24:2 "And Jesus said unto them, "See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, there shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down."

The Roman General Titus came against Jerusalem in 70 A.D., and destroyed the city. However one of the points of interest of all tours to Jerusalem is the wailing wall. This is the wall that stands as the only part of Jerusalem that was left of old Jerusalem, at it's destruction.

Jesus prophecy in verse two tells us that "there shall not one stone upon another," and that condition has not happened yet. All of the stones of the temple will be turned to dust, at that end of this earth age. Zechariah 14 gives us a profile of how Jerusalem will be, and the events that shall transpire at that time. When Satan has taken his seat in Jerusalem, fulfilling the role of the Antichrist.

Zechariah 14:4 "And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south."

This will happen on "the day of the Lord". God will shake the earth and send fire and brimstone upon it. The earthquakes will flatten the cities to where not one stone will stand upon another. Those two great mountains will shake, and the mount of Olives will split. All prophecies concerning Christ return include Mount Zion, and the Mount of Olives will be fulfilled. This is where Christ's feet will touch the earth, when He returns.

Jesus said that not one stone of the temple will be left upon another, not the whole city. The wailing wall wasn’t part of the temple. And the Romans left it for their troops. So yes, it was fulfilled as Jesus said.

 

[Consecrated Life]

Jesus said that not one stone of the temple will be left upon another, not the whole city. The wailing wall wasn’t part of the temple. And the Romans left it for their troops. So yes, it was fulfilled as Jesus said.

This was Jesus's prophecy for Herod's Temple.
The destruction of Herod's Temple never included either the required pagan worship, or the subsequent abomination set up by the beast that makes desolate prophesized by Daniel.
Neither one of those things happened in the destruction of Herod's Temple.
Jesus references to Daniel's prophesy for the future Temple is separate, proven so by the events surrounding the beast who will require worship of himself & desecrate the Temple Daniel Prophesizes about.
Events that never happened at Herod's Temple

In continuing to distinguish one Temple from the other, and place them in their proper prophetic connection it is also notable that the Temple takeover of Antiochus Epiphanes, ( the forerunner of what is to come ) did not involve any destruction of the Temple.

Likewise the Temple that Daniel prophesied in which this world ruling beast who will set up an image of himself to be worshipped is not destroyed either.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Great post!
:nod

I don't know much about eschatology but I had learned that the temple must be rebuilt before Jesus returns.

Seems like some on this thread don't believe so.
This would make it easier for His return, i guess.

Since the dwelling of God isn’t in buildings anymore, it doesn’t seem to make any sense to me. The only reason I heard it needs to be there is so it can be destroyed again.

 

[Consecrated Life]

Since the dwelling of God isn’t in buildings anymore, it doesn’t seem to make any sense to me. The only reason I heard it needs to be there is so it can be destroyed again.

God has never dwelt in buildings.
The only place that God The Father said He would dwell in the presence of the Children of Israel was above the Ark on the Mercy Seat between the two cherubims.

Exo 25:22
"And there I will meet with thee, and I will commune with thee from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubims which are upon the ark of the testimony, "

God was never manifest in Herod's Temple since the Ark was not there .
Yet even absent of the Ark Jesus still declared Herod's Temple to be " My House".
Even though at that moment He considered it to be a " Den Of Thieves".
Jesus the Messiah declaring the building to be "My House" clearly shows that one future day a Building on that spot will be shown to serve it's true purpose to the world and Christ will dwell there upon His Throne for the period of His earthly rule .
It's not over.
Jer 3:17
"At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the LORD; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the LORD, to Jerusalem."

 

[for_his_glory]

Great post!
:nod

I don't know much about eschatology but I had learned that the temple must be rebuilt before Jesus returns.

Seems like some on this thread don't believe so.
This would make it easier for His return, i guess.

We have to remember that the veil of the Temple was torn from top to bottom when Jesus was crucified and God does not dwell in temples made by hand as those who are Christ own are now the temple of God, Matthew 27:51; Acts 7:49; 1 Corinthians 3:16. It's only the Jews who want the temple built and to go back to sacrificing animals for their sins.

 

[n2thelight]

What I believe is:
The Jews that wrote the New Testament were real true Jews.
The true Jew has the oracles of God
The grafted in gentile should not be high minded.

eddif

Okay so who are the true Jew's because I see them as Black people , ie, the Tribe of Judah

 

[Dorothy Mae]

This was Jesus's prophecy for Herod's Temple.

So you agree the prophesy was regarding the temple Herod had built?

The destruction of Herod's Temple never included either the required pagan worship, or the subsequent abomination set up by the beast that makes desolate prophesized by Daniel.

What pagan worship? And I understand the Romans brought a pig in at some point or something similar. Or was it an idol of Caesar?

Neither one of those things happened in the destruction of Herod's Temple.
Jesus references to Daniel's prophesy for the future Temple is separate, proven so by the events surrounding the beast who will require worship of himself & desecrate the Temple Daniel Prophesizes about.

Caesar required worship of himself so yes these things happened.

Events that never happened at Herod's Temple

They did.

In continuing to distinguish one Temple from the other, and place them in their proper prophetic connection it is also notable that the Temple takeover of Antiochus Epiphanes, ( the forerunner of what is to come ) did not involve any destruction of the Temple.

So you think a temple needs to built so it can be destroyed?

Likewise the Temple that Daniel prophesied in which this world ruling beast who will set up an image of himself to be worshipped is not destroyed either.

Please provide a scripture that says one person will be ruling the whole world from Revelation.

 

[Dorothy Mae]

God has never dwelt in buildings.
The only place that God The Father said He would dwell in the presence of the Children of Israel was above the Ark on the Mercy Seat between the two cherubims.

That’s IN a building.

Exo 25:22
"And there I will meet with thee, and I will commune with thee from above the mercy seat, from between the two cherubims which are upon the ark of the testimony, "

In a building

God was never manifest in Herod's Temple since the Ark was not there .
Yet even absent of the Ark Jesus still declared Herod's Temple to be " My House".

How do you know this? Obviously since the angel appeared to Zachariah only in the Holy of Holies, not elsewhere, there was a presence there. The veil of the temple before this was ripped in two signifying the opening of the presence of God to those outside the building.

Even though at that moment He considered it to be a " Den Of Thieves".
Jesus the Messiah declaring the building to be "My House" clearly shows that one future day a Building on that spot will be shown to serve it's true purpose to the world and Christ will dwell there upon His Throne for the period of His earthly rule .
It's not over.
Jer 3:17
"At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the LORD; and all the nations shall be gathered unto it, to the name of the LORD, to Jerusalem."

That’s what the pharisees believed, that the Messiah will subjugate the earth from Jerusalem. The presence of God will never again be limited to a building. We are his temple. Do you want a scripture for that?

 

[n2thelight]

Please provide a scripture that says one person will be ruling the whole world from Revelation.

Revelation 13:8 "And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world."

 

[Dorothy Mae]

The coming world ruler who will possess a zeal to kill jews that will make Hitler seem like a humanitarian will have a seat of power and a place of worship for himself.
If you are going to say is not the Temple then you have to name another place he will use for this purpose?
To those who would say that this has already happened with Antiochus Epiphanes attempt hellenize his dominion & to force the Greek religion worshiping Zeus by ordering a pig to be offered on the holy altar and set up an idol of Zeus, Jesus's own Word in His most lengthy teaching on prophecy Olivet Discourse contradicts this.
Jesus declares that none of what is prophesized in Daniel will happen until the Gospel is preached " in the whole world."

Mat 24:14
And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

We are not there yet but we are getting close no doubt.

I thought about this a bit. Those who hold a futurist view could theoretically comfort themselves with the idea that since no temple ground is even being prepared let alone a finished building, the dire predictions are many years away. Maybe decades or longer before a new temple can be built.

By the way, the Bible actually states that in Paul’s day, the Gospel had been preached to the whole world. Col 1:23

 

[Dorothy Mae]

Revelation 13:8 "And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world."

I asked for a scripture that says one man will rule the whole earth. And the word translated “earth” there is actually “land” meaning local.

But thank you. Nice of you to give me a scripture to consider.