Bible Study The Lord's Day....the 7th Day Sabbath

[Solo]

8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. 2 Peter 3:8

Most of the Jews did not understand the scriptures that foretold the coming of Jesus Christ either. I would suggest that in order to understand God and His Word, one is required to know Him first. What do you think?

By this reckoning, Christ was in the wilderness for 40 years, was in the grave 3 years, and the prophet laid on his side for 40 years.

It must be nice to pick and choose what this verse can apply to, never mind that it is merely talking about God being beyond time when applicable with Himself. However, the seventh day was brought into the week for man and commanded within the time scope of man.

This is the type of biblical interpretation most Protestants desire to engage in. One that is a knee-jerk, quick cursory glanced intepretation to fit their preconceived notions (no personal offense to you, Solo, I do respect your posts)

One must look deeper into the context of the scriptures both linguistic and cultural and use the bible as it's own intepreter by cross referencing to truly find out what the truth of specific doctrines are all about.

Let me help your understanding a bit. I spoke of the six days of creation and the one day of rest possibly being a template of the workings of God with mankind. God created one day, morning and night equals one day. That is very plain in the Bible. Man is governed by time, days and nights. God is not governed by time. God created time for man. One day to God is no different than one thousand years because God exists in both moments at the same time because he transcends time.

Where the Bible mentions a day, it is equal to a morning and a night. If the Bible speaks of years, as in the one thousand year reign of Jesus Christ, it means one thousand years. Any time constraints mentioned where man is involved is as God created time where one morning and one night equals one day. God could very easily reveal that the six days of creation and one day of rest could be the template to show the six thousand years of history of man, and the one thousand year reign of Jesus Christ with his believers.

No knee jerking or a quick cursory glanced intepretation to fit my preconceived notions. Just a still, small voice speaking to me during my study of the Word of God.

 

[SputnikBoy]

What day of the week should we stop doing the works of God?

Sputnik: The commandment says to work six days and set aside the seventh-day for God. This ‘every day should be the Sabbath’ argument is not a command of God. Um …NOR is it practical.

Solo: Jesus healed on the Sabbath, so should we consider him a heretic and sinner of the Jewish ordinance of the sabbath?

Sputnik: The Sabbath command was no more an ordinance than were the other nine commandments. Do you know what the ordinances were, Solo? Why is it that the 4th-command is the one and only command that Christians want chiseled out of the tables of stone? Well …we kind of know why, I guess.

As for Jesus healing on the Sabbath ...it's quite alright to do good on the Sabbath as Jesus demonstrated. Incidentally, since Jesus would have been the ONLY one capable of healing on ANY day, would this 'sin' even have BEEN in the Pharisee 'book of Sabbath rules'? I don't see how. So, the Pharisees would have had other agenda (jealousy perhaps) for picking on this particular ‘Sabbath sin’ of Jesus. I believe that whenever this particular passage of scripture is used to support the idea that Jesus 'broke the Sabbath', we're simply playing into the hands of the Pharisees. Jesus did NOT break any Sabbath command. Remember, He was sinless. This is why it should never be an issue whenever one desires to emulate the practices of Jesus.

Solo: I believe that each of us should be keeping every day holy as unto God, and resting from worldly work seven days a week. We should be about God's business seven days a week.

Sputnik: That's an impossibility for the majority of people who have to work for a living at least 5 days a week. God asked only ONE day of us - the seventh. I guess He figured we could handle that without being put out too much. But, if as you say we should devote SEVEN days of the week to God, then we should certainly have no problem keeping the ONE day that He asked, should we?

Solo: I suspect that the six days of creation and the seventh day of rest was the template of mans days on the earth prior to entering God's eternity with the new heaven and new earth being created. Man will live under his reign for six thousand years and then Jesus will reign for one thousand years, after which the new heavens and new earth will be created.

Elementary my dear Watson.

Sputnik: Not exactly, Sherlock, as guibox explained.[/quote:6ce52]

[/quote:6ce52]

 

[Radlad72]

The mind boggles as to why people think a human being like Paul has ANY authority at all to even think about instigating a change of a day which GOD set aside for us to worship and rest from our worldly work. (NB. Doing good is anything but worldly work BTW).

Paul cannot, indeed, does not instigate any change of the weekly Sabbath because he isn't able to.

God put it in place and until Heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle (dotted 'i' or crossed 't') will pass away from the Law of God. I think the earth is still here and so is heaven so the Law of God must be too.

Thanks,

Rad

 

[Bick]

The seventh day---the Lord's day?

Personally, I couldn't quote the ten commandments and give them little creedence, because, as Christ said, and Paul repeated, Love is the fullfillment of the law. And we love because He first loves us.

Bick

 

[Solo]

So what works shall we rest from on the Sabbath? God's works or the works of the flesh?

Are we to keep just the Sabbath day holy or are we to keep all days holy, now that God lives inside of us?

Did God create man for the Sabbath or Sabbath for man?

Are we to judge a person for his Sabbath days? One, two, three or all seven days?

Perhaps it is easier for some to have a legalistic viewpoint of God's commands from the Law perspective as opposed to the Grace perspective. I for one much rather live in grace as opposed to the law. Paul explains much in his writings, and he notes that some false doctrines are being taught to the Galatians who are foolish to leave grace for the law.

 

[SputnikBoy]

The mind boggles as to why people think a human being like Paul has ANY authority at all to even think about instigating a change of a day which GOD set aside for us to worship and rest from our worldly work. (NB. Doing good is anything but worldly work BTW).

Paul cannot, indeed, does not instigate any change of the weekly Sabbath because he isn't able to.

Sputnik: Right. Plus, there would have been no earthly reason why he would have even WANTED to anyway! Would he desire to change one day only to replace it with another day for no reason at all, even if he DID have the authority to do so? It simply doesn't make any sense.

Rad: God put it in place and until Heaven and earth pass away, not one jot or tittle (dotted 'i' or crossed 't') will pass away from the Law of God. I think the earth is still here and so is heaven so the Law of God must be too.

Thanks,

Rad

Sputnik: That's quite clear isn't it? ...so clear that it makes one's arguing against continued adherence to the Law of God a work of futility.

 

[SputnikBoy]

Re: The seventh day---the Lord's day?

Personally, I couldn't quote the ten commandments and give them little creedence, because, as Christ said, and Paul repeated, Love is the fullfillment of the law. And we love because He first loves us.

Bick

Sputnik: Sounds kind of warm and fuzzy but not much else. Is our 'love' to be such a passive thing that it results in none other than mere words? The only way we can let our light (love) shine to others is by outwardly displaying our love. Obedience to ALL TEN of the commandments would be a good place to start. Incidentally, the first four commandments are the most important ones. Why? Because, while even many nonchristians keep commandments 5-10, they certainly would not keep the first four! These are the ones that REALLY set the Christian apart.

 

[SputnikBoy]

So what works shall we rest from on the Sabbath? God's works or the works of the flesh?

Sputnik: Works of the flesh.

Solo: Are we to keep just the Sabbath day holy or are we to keep all days holy, now that God lives inside of us?

Sputnik: It's because God lives in us that we desire to keep the Sabbath. Obviously, we let our Christian light shine every day but the 7th-day is a special day that was set aside by God at Creation.

Solo: Did God create man for the Sabbath or Sabbath for man?

Sputnik: Well, since you ask ...Jesus said that the Sabbath was made for man (note: NOT just the Jew), and not man for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27

Solo: Are we to judge a person for his Sabbath days? One, two, three or all seven days?

Sputnik: God is the judge ...we don't judge anyone. Paul's instruction not to judge others was a general one. Besides that, there is only ONE Sabbath Day per week ...that's the one that occurs on the seventh day.

Solo: Perhaps it is easier for some to have a legalistic viewpoint of God's commands from the Law perspective as opposed to the Grace perspective. I for one much rather live in grace as opposed to the law.

Sputnik: Simply words, my friend. As has been mentioned a number of times previously, those who kept the Law in the OT were ALSO saved by grace, NOT by keeping the Law. Those who kept the SPIRIT of the Law did so BECAUSE they were saved by grace ...the same as we Christians do today.

Solo: Paul explains much in his writings, and he notes that some false doctrines are being taught to the Galatians who are foolish to leave grace for the law.

Sputnik: You can bet your life, Solo, that the false doctrines had nothing to do with obedience to the Ten Commandments. No one, including you and Bick, I'm sure, would ever admonish someone for adhering to the Moral Law. To do so, whether your name be Solo, Bick or Paul, would be foolhardy. Grace does not cancel out the Law ...God forbid!

 

[Orthodox Christian]

The mind boggles as to why people think a human being like Paul has ANY authority at all to even think about instigating a change of a day which GOD set aside for us to worship and rest from our worldly work. (NB. Doing good is anything but worldly work BTW).

Paul cannot, indeed, does not instigate any change of the weekly Sabbath because he isn't able to.

According to this reasoning, then the Council at Jerusalem had no right to change the expectation that Christian believers become members of the covenant of circumcision.

"Ah," but you will answer,"that is not the Royal Law." (ie, the Ten Words). Sorry to say, SDA reasoning regarding this imaginary distinction between the Ten Words and the remainder of the moral teaching of Torah is simply indefensible. Jesus invoked the "it is written" over many things that mentioned in the law and prophets, and not specifically in Moses' discourse on the Ten Words.

Authority to interpret the Torah in its application, however, most assuredly was given to the Church, and this authority to Paul. "Whatsoever you bind in heaven, shall be bound on earth; and whatsoever you loose in heaven, shall be loosed on earth." The teaching of the New Testament epistles is clearly Torah interpretation.

 

[Solo]

So what works shall we rest from on the Sabbath? God's works or the works of the flesh?

Sputnik: Works of the flesh.

Solo: Are we to keep just the Sabbath day holy or are we to keep all days holy, now that God lives inside of us?

Sputnik: It's because God lives in us that we desire to keep the Sabbath. Obviously, we let our Christian light shine every day but the 7th-day is a special day that was set aside by God at Creation.

Solo: Did God create man for the Sabbath or Sabbath for man?

Sputnik: Well, since you ask ...Jesus said that the Sabbath was made for man (note: NOT just the Jew), and not man for the Sabbath. Mark 2:27

Solo: Are we to judge a person for his Sabbath days? One, two, three or all seven days?

Sputnik: God is the judge ...we don't judge anyone. Paul's instruction not to judge others was a general one. Besides that, there is only ONE Sabbath Day per week ...that's the one that occurs on the seventh day.

Solo: Perhaps it is easier for some to have a legalistic viewpoint of God's commands from the Law perspective as opposed to the Grace perspective. I for one much rather live in grace as opposed to the law.

Sputnik: Simply words, my friend. As has been mentioned a number of times previously, those who kept the Law in the OT were ALSO saved by grace, NOT by keeping the Law. Those who kept the SPIRIT of the Law did so BECAUSE they were saved by grace ...the same as we Christians do today.

Solo: Paul explains much in his writings, and he notes that some false doctrines are being taught to the Galatians who are foolish to leave grace for the law.

Sputnik: You can bet your life, Solo, that the false doctrines had nothing to do with obedience to the Ten Commandments. No one, including you and Bick, I'm sure, would ever admonish someone for adhering to the Moral Law. To do so, whether your name be Solo, Bick or Paul, would be foolhardy. Grace does not cancel out the Law ...God forbid!

You may continue to follow the Law dear one, from obeying the Sabbath day principles from 6pm Friday to 6 pm on Saturday. You may also run and get circumsized if you are not already. Make sure that you also keep your eyes from looking at women so that lust doesn't take place in your heart which is adultery. Let me know when you completely obey the entire law that God gave to the Israelites. You and Jesus will have something in common then, as there has been no other person able to accomplish this feat.

 

[Jay T]

Re: The seventh day---the Lord's day?

Personally, I couldn't quote the ten commandments and give them little creedence, because, as Christ said, and Paul repeated, Love is the fullfillment of the law. And we love because He first loves us.

Bick

So. you're telling me that you don't knoe the 4 ways God has revealed to us the 'how', to love God ?

You're telling me you don't know the 6 ways God has revealed the 'how' to love your fellow man ?

And love is fulfilling the Law ? .....when one does not know or understand the 10 ways God has detailed, the 'how', it is to be done ?

 

[Solo]

Re: The seventh day---the Lord's day?

Personally, I couldn't quote the ten commandments and give them little creedence, because, as Christ said, and Paul repeated, Love is the fullfillment of the law. And we love because He first loves us.

Bick

So. you're telling me that you don't knoe the 4 ways God has revealed to us the 'how', to love God ?

You're telling me you don't know the 6 ways God has revealed the 'how' to love your fellow man ?

And love is fulfilling the Law ? .....when one does not know or understand the 10 ways God has detailed, the 'how', it is to be done ?

JayT,
The law is now written on our hearts since the indwelling of the holy Spirit from our rebirth of the Spirit.
Jesus tells us that there are only two commandments now to know and understand as all of God's commandments hinge on these two. There is so much more involved in living by the two, then there was by keeping the ten.

Love the Lord God with all of your heart, mind, soul, and strength is number 1, and Love your neighbor as yourself is number 2.

Committing adultery now involves the looking at a woman with lust in ones eye, as opposed to the act of adultery.
Keeping one day holy is now lacking as we are the temple of God as the holy Spirit dwells within us. Every day should be holy.
We should now sin not when we are angry.
We should not be drunkards as Noah was.
We should be transformed to the mind of Jesus Christ by the renewing of our minds by the Word of God; Not be conformed to this world as are many in the various churches throughout the world today.

Just my 2 cents. Thanks for letting me reply.
Michael

 

[guibox]

Re: The seventh day---the Lord's day?

Committing adultery now involves the looking at a woman with lust in ones eye, as opposed to the act of adultery.
Keeping one day holy is now lacking as we are the temple of God as the holy Spirit dwells within us. Every day should be holy.
We should now sin not when we are angry.
We should not be drunkards as Noah was.
We should be transformed to the mind of Jesus Christ by the renewing of our minds by the Word of God; Not be conformed to this world as are many in the various churches throughout the world today.

So under the new covenant, all the commandments are MORE emphasises and important, beyond the letter of the law, EXCEPT the Sabbath?

How convenient.

Now I don't have to literally sleep with a woman to commit adultery, just look at her and I have done so...much more difficult you would think. And yet now, 'every day is the Sabbath'.

Really?

First of all, where is the proof of such nonsense?
Second, how does one 'keep the Sabbath every day'?
Thirdly, if the law has been magnified even MORE, and every day is the sabbath, then you should be keeping the Sabbath as was kept in the OT and NT EVERY day.

This logic is merely nothing more than another attempt to abandon the Sabbath commandment while keeping all the rest.

That is definitely legalism

James says that when you break one, you are breaking all. This is under the NC. This is the same law internalized in our hearts that James speaks of.

But of course, the Sabbath is that one exception :roll:

"He who adds or takes away from this book shall have the plagues upon them"

Many law abrogators and doctrine twisters will have much to answer for on the day of judgement.

 

[Solo]

Re: The seventh day---the Lord's day?

Committing adultery now involves the looking at a woman with lust in ones eye, as opposed to the act of adultery.
Keeping one day holy is now lacking as we are the temple of God as the holy Spirit dwells within us. Every day should be holy.
We should now sin not when we are angry.
We should not be drunkards as Noah was.
We should be transformed to the mind of Jesus Christ by the renewing of our minds by the Word of God; Not be conformed to this world as are many in the various churches throughout the world today.

So under the new covenant, all the commandments are MORE emphasises and important, beyond the letter of the law, EXCEPT the Sabbath?

How convenient.

All days are important and every day should be kept holy unto the Lord. If you just want to keep one day a week holy, that is your choice. I would expect that Believers should now stop from doing their own work, and instead do the work that God lines them up to do seven days a week.

Now I don't have to literally sleep with a woman to commit adultery, just look at her and I have done so...much more difficult you would think. And yet now, 'every day is the Sabbath'.

Really?

You are calling every day the Sabbath, I said that every day should be kept holy including the Sabbath.

First of all, where is the proof of such nonsense?
Second, how does one 'keep the Sabbath every day'?
Thirdly, if the law has been magnified even MORE, and every day is the sabbath, then you should be keeping the Sabbath as was kept in the OT and NT EVERY day.

You can keep the one day holy or you can keep all seven holy, that is your choice. If you have the Holy Spirit living inside of you, keep every day holy, or else you one day a week practice is a joke.[/quote]

This logic is merely nothing more than another attempt to abandon the Sabbath commandment while keeping all the rest.

That is definitely legalism

You ought to know legalism, you are preaching it.

James says that when you break one, you are breaking all. This is under the NC. This is the same law internalized in our hearts that James speaks of.

Then I guess that you have broken the commandment to keep the Sabbath because of your committing adultery by looking at women.

But of course, the Sabbath is that one exception :roll:

No, don't forget adultery.....remember! :

"He who adds or takes away from this book shall have the plagues upon them"

Many law abrogators and doctrine twisters will have much to answer for on the day of judgement.

You are pretty good at twisting doctrine as you have in the above statement, "He who adds or takes away from this book shall have the plagues upon them". The real scripture says the following:

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book: 19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.

Notice that the warning about adding or taking away from the words of the book of prophecy is what the truth is. The Sabbath isn't even mentioned in Revelation.

Be careful and do not judge someone in relation to the Sabbath or any other Holy day.

16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. 18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, 19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God. 20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, 21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not; 22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men? 23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh. Colossians 2:16:23


Meditate upon this scripture after you pray for understanding and truth.


1 O foolish Galatians, who hath bewitched you, that ye should not obey the truth, before whose eyes Jesus Christ hath been evidently set forth, crucified among you? 2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? 3 Are ye so foolish? having begun in the Spirit, are ye now made perfect by the flesh? 4 Have ye suffered so many things in vain? if it be yet in vain. 5 He therefore that ministereth to you the Spirit, and worketh miracles among you, doeth he it by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

6 Even as Abraham believed God, and it was accounted to him for righteousness. 7 Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham. 8 And the scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached before the gospel unto Abraham, saying, In thee shall all nations be blessed. 9 So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham. 10 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse: for it is written, Cursed is every one that continueth not in all things which are written in the book of the law to do them. 11 But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith. 12 And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them. 13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree: 14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. 15 Brethren, I speak after the manner of men; Though it be but a man's covenant, yet if it be confirmed, no man disannulleth, or addeth thereto. 16 Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. 17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect. 18 For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more of promise: but God gave it to Abraham by promise.

19 Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator. 20 Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, but God is one. 21 Is the law then against the promises of God? God forbid: for if there had been a law given which could have given life, verily righteousness should have been by the law. 22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe. 23 But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed. 24 Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith. 25 But after that faith is come, we are no longer under a schoolmaster. 26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if ye be Christ's, then are ye Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. Galatians 3:1-29

 

[Radlad72]

So let's all forget what Jesus has said and done about the matter of the Ten Commandments. Paul is obviously the oracle on this subject. Higher even than Jesus.

Sorry, but that is the way it seems to me. People are taking what Paul is saying over the words and deeds of Jesus and that is just wrong.

Actually, I am not sure that last statement is 100% correct. People are actually taking their interpretation of what Paul says over their interpretation of what Jesus has done and said. Paul does not once contradict Jesus because he couldn't and still have his writings in the canon.

Peter tells us that Paul's writing can be confusing and people will take them and use them the wrong way, which can be seen over and over again on topics like this one.

Please have a look at Jesus' life. It is His life which is the one we are supposed to model our own on, not Pauls (or our interpretation of Paul's).

Thanks,

Rad.

 

[Solo]

9 Then said Jesus unto them, I will ask you one thing; Is it lawful on the sabbath days to do good, or to do evil? to save life, or to destroy it? Luke 6:9

1 At that time Jesus went on the sabbath day through the corn; and his disciples were an hungred, and began to pluck the ears of corn, and to eat. 2 But when the Pharisees saw it, they said unto him, Behold, thy disciples do that which is not lawful to do upon the sabbath day. 3 But he said unto them, Have ye not read what David did, when he was an hungred, and they that were with him; 4 How he entered into the house of God, and did eat the shewbread, which was not lawful for him to eat, neither for them which were with him, but only for the priests? 5 Or have ye not read in the law, how that on the sabbath days the priests in the temple profane the sabbath, and are blameless? 6 But I say unto you, That in this place is one greater than the temple. 7 But if ye had known what this meaneth, I will have mercy, and not sacrifice, ye would not have condemned the guiltless. 8 For the Son of man is Lord even of the sabbath day. 9 And when he was departed thence, he went into their synagogue: 10 And, behold, there was a man which had his hand withered. And they asked him, saying, Is it lawful to heal on the sabbath days? that they might accuse him. 11 And he said unto them, What man shall there be among you, that shall have one sheep, and if it fall into a pit on the sabbath day, will he not lay hold on it, and lift it out? 12 How much then is a man better than a sheep? Wherefore it is lawful to do well on the sabbath days. 13 Then saith he to the man, Stretch forth thine hand. And he stretched it forth; and it was restored whole, like as the other. Matthew 12:1-13

24 And the Pharisees said unto him, Behold, why do they on the sabbath day that which is not lawful? 25 And he said unto them, Have ye never read what David did, when he had need, and was an hungred, he, and they that were with him? 26 How he went into the house of God in the days of Abiathar the high priest, and did eat the shewbread, which is not lawful to eat but for the priests, and gave also to them which were with him? 27 And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath: 28 Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath. Mark 2:24-28

10 And he was teaching in one of the synagogues on the sabbath. 11 And, behold, there was a woman which had a spirit of infirmity eighteen years, and was bowed together, and could in no wise lift up herself. 12 And when Jesus saw her, he called her to him, and said unto her, Woman, thou art loosed from thine infirmity. 13 And he laid his hands on her: and immediately she was made straight, and glorified God. 14 And the ruler of the synagogue answered with indignation, because that Jesus had healed on the sabbath day, and said unto the people, There are six days in which men ought to work: in them therefore come and be healed, and not on the sabbath day. 15 The Lord then answered him, and said, Thou hypocrite, doth not each one of you on the sabbath loose his ox or his ass from the stall, and lead him away to watering? 16 And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day? 17 And when he had said these things, all his adversaries were ashamed: and all the people rejoiced for all the glorious things that were done by him. Luke 13:10-17

8 Jesus saith unto him, Rise, take up thy bed, and walk. 9 And immediately the man was made whole, and took up his bed, and walked: and on the same day was the sabbath. 10 The Jews therefore said unto him that was cured, It is the sabbath day: it is not lawful for thee to carry thy bed. 11 He answered them, He that made me whole, the same said unto me, Take up thy bed, and walk. 12 Then asked they him, What man is that which said unto thee, Take up thy bed, and walk? 13 And he that was healed wist not who it was: for Jesus had conveyed himself away, a multitude being in that place. 14 Afterward Jesus findeth him in the temple, and said unto him, Behold, thou art made whole: sin no more, lest a worse thing come unto thee. 15 The man departed, and told the Jews that it was Jesus, which had made him whole. 16 And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to slay him, because he had done these things on the sabbath day. 17 But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work. 18 Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God.Luke 5:8-18

13 They brought to the Pharisees him that aforetime was blind. 14 And it was the sabbath day when Jesus made the clay, and opened his eyes. 15 Then again the Pharisees also asked him how he had received his sight. He said unto them, He put clay upon mine eyes, and I washed, and do see. 16 Therefore said some of the Pharisees, This man is not of God, because he keepeth not the sabbath day. Others said, How can a man that is a sinner do such miracles? And there was a division among them. John 9:13-16

4 And this I say, lest any man should beguile you with enticing words. 5 For though I be absent in the flesh, yet am I with you in the spirit, joying and beholding your order, and the stedfastness of your faith in Christ. 6 As ye have therefore received Christ Jesus the Lord, so walk ye in him: 7 Rooted and built up in him, and stablished in the faith, as ye have been taught, abounding therein with thanksgiving. 8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ. 9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. 10 And ye are complete in him, which is the head of all principality and power: 11 In whom also ye are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands, in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ: 12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses; 14 Blotting out the handwriting of ordinances that was against us, which was contrary to us, and took it out of the way, nailing it to his cross; 15 And having spoiled principalities and powers, he made a shew of them openly, triumphing over them in it.
16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the sabbath days: 17 Which are a shadow of things to come; but the body is of Christ. 18 Let no man beguile you of your reward in a voluntary humility and worshipping of angels, intruding into those things which he hath not seen, vainly puffed up by his fleshly mind, 19 And not holding the Head, from which all the body by joints and bands having nourishment ministered, and knit together, increaseth with the increase of God. 20 Wherefore if ye be dead with Christ from the rudiments of the world, why, as though living in the world, are ye subject to ordinances, 21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not; 22 Which all are to perish with the using;) after the commandments and doctrines of men? 23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of the flesh. Colossians 2:4-23

 

[guibox]

Solo,

I have already addressed Colossians 2 in great detail elsewhere. Perhaps you should go to some of the past pages and find it.

Needless to say, as Radlad has pointed out, many take Paul's writings (especially this one) and misinterpret what it is saying.

Brief summary on what I've expounded in great detail elswhere...

Paul was addressing the Colossian controversy which was pagan rulers enforcing ascetic rituals on both pagan and Jewish celebrations that the early Colossian church was celebrating. This including more fasting, less feasting, angelic worship and debasement of the body to uplife the spirit. Paul was admonishing those pagan leaders who were 'judging' the people, not on NOT keeping these days and celebrations (i.e., they were ALREADY keeping them, including the Sabbath) but on HOW they were to be kept (i.e. in a pagan manner)

What was nailed to the cross was not the moral or ceremonial law or the Sabbath but the 'cheirgraphon' (sp?), the written record of our sins which was 'against us'.

These regulations that were being placed upon them was the 'shadow of things to come' not the celebrations themselves.

In short, Paul was saying that because of Christ's forgiveness, we don't need to 'work' our way to heaven by observing rituals and debasing our bodies to get closer to God. His forgiveness by the act of getting rid of our sins has done that.

So these rulers shouldn't be judging the people that they aren't being ritualistic in their 'worship' because we can't work our way to God. He has taken our sins and nailed them to the cross. Because of this act of forgiveness, the principalities and powers have been triumphed over and cannot hold it against us.

There is gross misinterpretation and poor study habits on this chapter from both Sabbath defenders and Sabbath abrogators

 

[Solo]

I see the Holy Spirit as the final authority in all things including the interpretation of scripture. If God knew that I would need to understand the various cultures and times, then he would have addressed that within his Word. Some try to incorporate man's wisdom within the Word of God and mess the whole thing up. I see that God wants his elect to keep every day holy as unto God, and to cease from the works of man replacing them by the works of the Father, just as Jesus taught in the gospels. See the scriptures of the gospel record that I posted. Those legalist Pharisees were blind to the truth of God, and considered Jesus as breaking the Sabbath. Jesus did nothing of the sort. Jesus was about the kingdom business just the same as we are to be seven days a week.

 

[guibox]

I see the Holy Spirit as the final authority in all things including the interpretation of scripture. If God knew that I would need to understand the various cultures and times, then he would have addressed that within his Word

A poor excuse and an ignorant one, I'm afraid. One cannot read a section of scripture, expecting to get something out of it and then ignore that very context that provides the meaning they came for. I suppose that books with names such as Colossians, Ephesians, Galatians and Phillipians are merely names and not letters reflecting the issues the church faced in these geographical areas. Areas such as the very pagan religion they came out of.

Nope. Instead we take a cursory glance at ambiguous passages and make it fit what we are comfortable with. And then (as an added bonus) we get to say and believe that we are right.

To ignore the context is to be content to impose and accept preconceived ideas on what the text is not saying.I sure wouldn't want you to interpret Revelation for me.

When you properly read the whole of Colossians 2 and read the WHOLE context, you will find that the issues put forth are very important to the verses in question. Nevermind that the word 'law' is not even found in the chapter, never mind that Paul preaches against ascetism, elemental worship, debasement of the body, forgiveness of sins and pagan rulers judging.

Nope. All these things are merely added in. The REAL issue is that the Colossians don't have to observe the seventh day Sabbath. :roll:

 

[SputnikBoy]

I see the Holy Spirit as the final authority in all things including the interpretation of scripture.

Sputnik: But, surely the Holy Spirit doesn't make people into robots where they are incapable of thinking for themselves. And, if one has the HS working in their lives, wouldn't He then be revealing the relevance of Sabbath-keeping to present-day Christians? Why is it that the HS is active within you but not in someone who is obedient to the Sabbath command? I'm sure you don't intend this, but the implication of your message seems to come across as being that the only HS-filled Christians are those who DON'T keep the Sabbath.

Solo: If God knew that I would need to understand the various cultures and times, then he would have addressed that within his Word.

Sputnik: The only reason that some have found it necessary to delve into the various cultures and times is BECAUSE of what mainstream Christianity has done with the actual Word of God. Research has been responsible for a clearer understanding of the intent of the Bible writers (specifically the writings of Paul) and the clarification of apparent inconsistencies and discrepencies within the scriptures that have led to some 'questionable' present-day Christian beliefs. Research involving history, culture, and latter-day church practices has uncovered any number of erroneous doctrines of the modern Church.

Solo: Some try to incorporate man's wisdom within the Word of God and mess the whole thing up.

Sputnik: Well, you said it! Look no further than the RCC and note how they have STRONGLY influenced the mainstream Evangelical Church. They took the 7th-day Sabbath and made it into a nonevent. In it's place they substituted their own holy day because they felt they had the authority to do so. That fact alone would cause me to question Sunday worship. Since you question 'man's wisdom within the Word of God that messes the whole thing up', how come you so readily accept (even if only by virtue of passing it off as being 'irrelevant) this counterfeit 'Sabbath' of the RCC?

Solo: I see that God wants his elect to keep every day holy as unto God, and to cease from the works of man replacing them by the works of the Father, just as Jesus taught in the gospels. See the scriptures of the gospel record that I posted.

Sputnik: That Jesus kept the SPIRIT of the Sabbath should not even be under dispute. There is nothing that mainstream Christians can do to alter the fact that Jesus customarily obeyed the 4th-commandment. Where in the scriptures does it say that we should not follow that example? Was Jesus a legalist? If not, based on what you have to say about present-day practicing Sabbatarians ...why wasn't He?

Solo: Those legalist Pharisees were blind to the truth of God, and considered Jesus as breaking the Sabbath. Jesus did nothing of the sort.

Sputnik: So, we ARE in agreement that Jesus 'kept' the Sabbath ...? And, what the legalistic Pharisees did with the Sabbath has been addressed a number of times already, Solo. One CAN be obedient to the Sabbath-command and not be a legalist.

Solo: Jesus was about the kingdom business just the same as we are to be seven days a week.

Sputnik: No one, to my knowledge, is arguing against the fact that Christians should not be about 'the kingdom business' seven days a week. Of course we should. The truth of the matter, however, is that ONE 24-hour period (Saturday to us) was set aside from the other six days for the specific purpose of ceasing from one's work and devoting that time to God. Mainstream Christians have no argument with this since they participate in this practice every Sunday. Many of them REALLY believe that they're keeping the 4th-commandment, thanks to the RCC. Don't you at least find this fact somewhat worthy of recognition and acknowledgment, Solo?