Bible Study The Work of God: Terminal Agitation Ending in Silence

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Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20

Have we established that the sin that dwelt in Paul's flesh was NOT Paul yet?

Let me know when you manage to get up to speed on the subject matter.

 

[JLB]

Have we established that the sin that dwelt in Paul's flesh was NOT Paul yet?

Let me know when you manage to get up to speed on the subject matter.

Yes, we have established that sin in Paul was not Paul.

20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20


JLB

 

[smaller]

Yes, we have established that sin in Paul was not Paul.

Brilliant deduction.

 

[JLB]

Brilliant deduction.

Sin in Paul, not Satan.

20 Now if I do what I will not to do,it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20


JLB

 

[smaller]

Sin in Paul, not Satan.

20 Now if I do what I will not to do,it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20

Make of it what you can, and consider that there is an opponent to truthful sight, in the flesh, that Paul termed "no more I" and "evil present."

Mark 4:
15 And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts.

Romans 7:
8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead.

2 Corinthians 12:7
And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

 

[ezrider]

As I stroll along the wayside, I no longer hunger nor thirst, for I have been filled. And what the thief steals, why I have been instructed to give him my cloak also.

As I walk along the wayside I come upon a pond and gaze upon its still surface, and see a reflection in the waters. As I cast a stone upon the pond, ripples begin to appear and spread upon the waters, and the reflection becomes distorted and begins to waver.

As I walk along the wayside, If all I look for is Satan, then Satan is all I should hope to see. Two stones in the pond, and the debate goes on.

Who should expect to see the Righteousness of God, when they are looking to lift up Satan instead?

 

[JLB]

Make of it what you can, and consider that there is an opponent to truthful sight, in the flesh, that Paul termed "no more I" and "evil present."

It's not up to me to "make of it what I will" but to read and believe the word of God.

Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20

It's called sin.

Sin is what Paul taught was in his flesh, not Satan.

Paul taught us to walk according to the Spirit within, not by the desires of the flesh where sin dwells.


Satan is not mentioned, because Satan can not touch, those who keep themselves from sin.

We know that whoever is born of God does not sin; but he who has been born of God keeps himself, and the wicked one does not touch him. 1 John 5:18


The wicked one was not in Paul.

The wicked one did not touch him.


Paul was a man who walked according to the Spirit, and who crucified his flesh.

• 16 I say then: Walk in the Spirit, and you shall not fulfill the lust of the flesh. Galatians 5:16

• 24 And those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. Galatians 5:24

8 For he who sows to his flesh will of the flesh reap corruption, but he who sows to the Spirit will of the Spirit reap everlasting life.
Galatians 6:8


Let's encourage people to walk according to the Spirit, and experience the victory that Jesus paid for on the cross, which is dominion over sin and the devil and the flesh.



JLB

 

[JLB]

1 John 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

Yes, indeed, it's the person who sins, and not the devil who sins.


Your getting it.

 

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Who should expect to see the Righteousness of God, when they are looking to lift up Satan instead?

Paul appears to believe the facts to be critical disclosures:

Romans 11:32
For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

Not saying the disobedience that everyone is bound to is all that fond of the facts however.

2 Samuel 22:29
For thou art my lamp, O Lord: and the Lord will lighten my darkness.

Ephesians 5:11
And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

Romans 13:12
The night is far spent, the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armour of light.

Every believer who claims they ain't got none are under deception. And those who want NO LIGHT shed on the facts are ACTIVE RESISTORS of the Gospel.

 

[smaller]

Yes, indeed, it's the person who sins, and not the devil who sins.

Your getting it.

I accept what's written. What's clear as a bell to me is not even seen by your positions.

 

[smaller]

Sin is what Paul taught was in his flesh, not Satan.

Paul says what he says. 2 Cor. 12:7 speaks clear enough.

Paul taught us to walk according to the Spirit within, not by the desires of the flesh where sin dwells.

Indwelling sin and evil present do not and can not "walk by the Spirit." Contrary to your proposals.

 

[smaller]

Believers really hate it when the scriptural facts of indwelling sin and evil present with "us" are connected by scriptures to Satan, the Devil. 2 Cor. 12:7, 1 John 3:8.

But, some might see the reality of Mark 4:15 and understand that RESISTANCE is NOT the believers who are doing it.

Scriptures pour GAS on the FIRE:

Amos 9:8
Behold, the eyes of the Lord God are upon the sinful kingdom, and I will destroy it from off the face of the earth; saving that I will not utterly destroy the house of Jacob, saith the Lord.

Romans 7:
13 Was then that which is good made death unto me? God forbid. But sin, that it might appear sin, working death in me by that which is good; that sin by the commandment might become exceeding sinful.

1 Corinthians 15:56
The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law.

 

[JLB]

Paul says what he says. 2 Cor. 12:7 speaks clear enough.

Please tell us what is clear about 2 Cor 12:7 ?

What is 2 Cor 12:7?

What does it say?

Here is what Romans 7:20 says.

Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20


JLB

 

[smaller]

Please tell us what is clear about 2 Cor 12:7 ?

What is 2 Cor 12:7?

What does it say?

Here is what Romans 7:20 says.

Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20

JLB

I've NEVER believed your positions claims that indwelling sin and evil present are obedient, legal, faithful to the Gospel or that these factual workings "walk" in the Spirit. Nor do I believe your positions proposals that claim choice eliminates what indwelling sin and evil present does.

So let's make sure we understand each others, to that extent anyway.

 

[Chopper]

I asked smaller to provide a scripture in this Bible Study, that shows us that Satan steals the word of God from believer's.

He has used mark 4:15 to claim that Satan has stolen the word of God from believer's, when mark 4:15 is a reference to Satan stealing the "Gospel Message" from unbelievers, not believers.

If you agree with him that Satan steals the word of God from believers, and has stolen the word that God recently spoke to you, then please provide a scripture for your belief.

Mark 4:15 teaches us that Satan was only successful in stealing the Gospel Message from 25% of the unbelievers who heard the message.

Smaller has built an entire Theology that comes from "Satan dwelling in every believer's flesh", and that the "sin in our flesh" is really "Satan himself", and that it's Satan doing the sinning not the person themselves.

That is his core belief which he propagates in every thread he participates in.



JLB

First of all, Mark 4:15 is not isolated to only the Gospel. Pastors have preached it that way, so everyone thinks of the Gospel when they view those verses. Notice....Mark 4:14 The sower soweth the word.
Mark 4:15 "And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts."

No where do you see the word Gospel. You do, but it's not there! It's the Word of God that is sowed, which can be any instruction of importance.

Secondly please notice....Romans 7:17 "Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me." Sin dwells in us and Satan is the author of sin, therefore sin is activated in us because it dwells there and the lust of our flesh responds to Satans prompting.

 

[smaller]

First of all, Mark 4:15 is not isolated to only the Gospel. Pastors have preached it that way, so everyone thinks of the Gospel when they view those verses. Notice....Mark 4:14 The sower soweth the word.
Mark 4:15 "And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts."

No where do you see the word Gospel. You do, but it's not there! It's the Word of God that is sowed, which can be any instruction of importance.

Secondly please notice....Romans 7:17 "Now then it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me." Sin dwells in us and Satan is the author of sin, therefore sin is activated in us because it dwells there and the lust of our flesh responds to Satans prompting.

BRILLIANT deductions Chopper! At least some see. But if we understand the REALITY of Mark 4:15, we'll see active resistance also, even in BELIEVERS.

We are to understand that it is "no more them" that do it. Romans 7:17 & 20.

 

[JLB]

Believers really hate it when the scriptural facts of indwelling sin and evil present with "us" are connected by scriptures to Satan, the Devil. 2 Cor. 12:7, 1 John 3:8.

But, some might see the reality of Mark 4:15 and understand that RESISTANCE is NOT the believers who are doing it.

Scriptures pour GAS on the FIRE:

Amos 9:8
Behold, the eyes of the Lord God are upon the sinful kingdom, and I will destroy it from off the face of the earth; saving that I will not utterly destroy the house of Jacob, saith the Lord.

Let's post these scriptures, with the context, to see what they actually say, and maybe we can get Chopper and some other's to join in the discussion.


5 And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. 6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him. 7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 1 John 3:5-8

• Jesus was manifested to take away our sins.
• He who practices righteousness is righteous.
• He who sins is of the devil.

The person who sins is of or aligned with the devil. This does not say the devil is in our flesh doing the sinning.


7 And lest I should be exalted above measure by the abundance of the revelations, a thorn in the flesh was given to me, a messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I be exalted above measure. 2 Corinthians 12:7


The "thorn in the flesh" is a Hebraic idiom for source of irritation of frustration, like we would say "pain in the a___".
If we say he is a pain in my a___, we don't mean this as a literal pain in our a___, but a source of frustration.

Furthermore this condition was unique to Paul, lest I should be exalted above measure by the abundance of the revelations.

This would not be a condition that applies to all of us.




JLB

 

[JLB]

First of all, Mark 4:15 is not isolated to only the Gospel. Pastors have preached it that way, so everyone thinks of the Gospel when they view those verses. Notice....Mark 4:14 The sower soweth the word.
Mark 4:15 "And these are they by the way side, where the word is sown; but when they have heard, Satan cometh immediately, and taketh away the word that was sown in their hearts."

No where do you see the word Gospel. You do, but it's not there! It's the Word of God that is sowed, which can be any instruction of importance.

• First of all, the word is by context, referring to the Gospel, by which we are saved or not.

13 And He said to them, “Do you not understand this parable? How then will you understand all the parables? 14 The sower sows the word. 15 And these are the ones by the wayside where the word is sown. When they hear, Satan comes immediately and takes away the word that was sown in their hearts. 16 These likewise are the ones sown on stony ground who, when they hear the word, immediately receive it with gladness;17 and they have no root in themselves, and so endure only for a time. Afterward, when tribulation or persecution arises for the word’s sake, immediately they stumble. 18 Now these are the ones sown among thorns; they are the ones who hear the word, 19 and the cares of this world, the deceitfulness of riches, and the desires for other things entering in choke the word, and it becomes unfruitful. 20 But these are the ones sown on good ground, those who hear the word, accept it, and bear fruit: some thirtyfold, some sixty, and some a hundred.” Mark 4:13-20

• Secondly, this principle in which Satan steals the word, the Gospel Message, is referring to him stealing the word from unbelievers, so they won't believe and be saved.

11 “Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. 12 Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.13 But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:11-13



What other "word" of God is there, that we believe and are saved?



JLB

 

[smaller]

When any believer who actually SEES the reality of "NO MORE I" working, and turns to EXPOSE this fact, they will quickly find out that "NO MORE I" is NOT FOND of having Scriptural Light Shed upon IT. And it will scream, kick and hollar to RESIST being exposed. Just as is being witnessed in this thread.

"In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them."

Here is a picture of THEM in MAN:

Mark 1:24
Saying, Let us alone; what have we to do with thee, thou Jesus of Nazareth? art thou come to destroy us? I know thee who thou art, the Holy One of God.

It is no wonder WHY they resist and are afraid of THE LIGHT being shed on THEM.

They STEAL the Word, and BLIND their captives lest The Word shines on them and destroys THEM, because that's what's coming at THEE, THEIR END.

 

[JLB]

What any believer who actually SEES the reality of "NO MORE I" working, and turns to EXPOSE this fact, they will quickly find out that "NO MORE I" is NOT FOND of having Scriptural Light Shed upon IT. And it will scream, kick and hollar to RESIST being exposed. Just as is being witnessed in this thread.

I have posted what Romans 7:20 says, unlike you.

You just keep talking about your theories of Satan in your flesh.

20 Now if I do what I will not to do, it is no longer I who do it, but sin that dwells in me. Romans 7:20


No Satan here.

Sin is the "no more I".



JLB