There is no Second Coming

[Heneni]

This is how i understand it:

During jesus's time here on earth, he did have contact with some gentiles but the majority of the gentile world (unbelievers) were completely unaware of his presence on this earth. His fame did spread yes, but it only spread to the gentile nations in a big way after he left.

Now in the same way he came and left he will come again. He will come for a group (the believers) while another group will have no idea he was even here (the non-believers).

And then he will come again visually, when all of the non-believers will see him, just like all the non-believing jews saw him back in the OT.

He left in full view of believers (but not in full view of the world) and will return in full view for the believers (but not in full view of the world)

And then he will also come again in full view of the unbelieving world.

Heneni

 

[Osgiliath]

Sorry I posted that "Benoni's Baloney" comment Benoni (I was thinking Robert De Niro again :D). Though I still disagree with you wholeheartedly regarding this particular subject, I never would have posted that if I knew how nice of a guy you turned out to be . I apologize.

 

[VenomFangX]

To me the second coming is a positive thing but I am not sure about the bad things that are going to happen before this. I like to be a little more positive.

 

[Benoni]

I really do not need you're ideas, opinions or bias the world and religion is full of them.

Satan has ideas, opinions and bias.

So if there is a “second coming or rapture†in God’s Word; how about showing all of us in stead of you’re opinions, bias and assumptions?

The real baloney is dogma and creeds based on opinion, bias and assumption and not God’s Word.

 

[Joe67]

To me the second coming is a positive thing but I am not sure about the bad things that are going to happen before this. I like to be a little more positive.

VF,

Truly, the return of our Lord and the redemption of our bodies and our being gathered unto Jesus is our blessed hope. The resurrection is the salvation of our Lord and God.

Romans 8:18-21
18 For I consider that the sufferings of this present time are not worthy to be compared with the glory that is to be revealed to us. 19 For the anxious longing of the creation waits eagerly for the revealing of the sons of God. 20 For the creation was subjected to futility, not willingly, but because of Him who subjected it, in hope 21 that the creation itself also will be set free from its slavery to corruption into the freedom of the glory of the children of God. NASU

Joe

 

[VenomFangX]

I know some Christian fundamentalists who actually pray for the end of the world, and hope there is a nuclear holocaust to reach the state you described. Some do acts deleterious to their good health and others in the misguided belief that will somehow atone them for their sins. I think the good lord gave us a prescription to live on earth in happiness as well, and not to live in a temporal precursor to death.
yours
ÒõýþüäðýóÖ

 

[veteran]

In the following, Jesus is 'explaining' the parable of the tares of the field to His disciples after they asked Him. That means the following is a direct declaration. It's not another parable or symbolic meaning, it's the meaning of the tares parable...

Matt 13:36-43
36 Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and His disciples came unto Him, saying, "Declare unto us the parable of the tares of the field."
37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man;
38 The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one;
39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.
40 As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world.
41 The Son of man shall send forth His angels, and they shall gather out of His kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity;
42 And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
43 Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.
(KJV)

Matt 13:49-50
49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.
(KJV)

Did Christ send His angels after His resurrection to do any of that? Obviously not, for the wicked are still here on earth among us. And I'm talking about the truly wicked, the servants of the devil who know they worship the devil, and they love to do wickedness.

Notice verse 41 is saying the angels Christ sends will gather "out of His kingdom all things that offend", meaning the wicked. Christ said the field represents this world. Those wicked tares are to be gathered out of His Kingdom, meaning at some point this world, this earth, will literally become Christ's Kingdom, like Revelation 11:15 declares. That in itself is declaring another literal coming of our Lord Jesus Christ to this earth, with this earth becoming His de facto Kingdom. Do we see that today with the wicked literally gathered out of it? No.

The "furnace of fire" is about the "lake of fire" written at the end of Revelation 20. By that we know there's to be a "thouand years" period prior to that one time "lake of fire" event at the end of it, as written.

Our Lord Jesus at His first coming was meek as a Lamb, to be the Perfect Sacrifice for sin. He did not come to rule then. Our Lord Jesus showed in John 18 if it were time to claim His Kingdom at His first coming, then His servants would fight so He wouldn't be delivered up. Yet in Revelation and in the Psalms, etc., it is written of a time when He will rule over the nations with "a rod of iron". That rod of iron is in direct contrast to His first coming meek as a Lamb to offer Himself for us. That again, is another pointer to at least another coming of Christ Jesus, in order to rule over His enemies.

 

[MMarc]

This is how i understand it:

During jesus's time here on earth, he did have contact with some gentiles but the majority of the gentile world (unbelievers) were completely unaware of his presence on this earth. His fame did spread yes, but it only spread to the gentile nations in a big way after he left.

Now in the same way he came and left he will come again. He will come for a group (the believers) while another group will have no idea he was even here (the non-believers).

And then he will come again visually, when all of the non-believers will see him, just like all the non-believing jews saw him back in the OT.

He left in full view of believers (but not in full view of the world) and will return in full view for the believers (but not in full view of the world)

And then he will also come again in full view of the unbelieving world.

Heneni

Agreed, all eyes might see Jesus, but not all eyes will recognize Him. Just like the first time, Jesus was only revealed by the Holy Spirit.

Jesus told His disciples, not to tell anyone He was Messiah. In Mathew He says the same thing, don't believe anyone who says is the Christ and don't go after Him in the wilderness or in the secret chamber.

 

[veteran]

This is how i understand it:

During jesus's time here on earth, he did have contact with some gentiles but the majority of the gentile world (unbelievers) were completely unaware of his presence on this earth. His fame did spread yes, but it only spread to the gentile nations in a big way after he left.

Now in the same way he came and left he will come again. He will come for a group (the believers) while another group will have no idea he was even here (the non-believers).

And then he will come again visually, when all of the non-believers will see him, just like all the non-believing jews saw him back in the OT.

He left in full view of believers (but not in full view of the world) and will return in full view for the believers (but not in full view of the world)

And then he will also come again in full view of the unbelieving world.

Heneni

Agreed, all eyes might see Jesus, but not all eyes will recognize Him. Just like the first time, Jesus was only revealed by the Holy Spirit.

Jesus told His disciples, not to tell anyone He was Messiah. In Mathew He says the same thing, don't believe anyone who says is the Christ and don't go after Him in the wilderness or in the secret chamber.

Nah..., there's only one coming or return of Christ Jesus written of in God's Word. And it's nowhere written that the wicked won't recognize His coming. Instead, it's written they will want to HIDE from Him, saying for the mountains and rocks, "...Fall on us, and hide us from the face of Him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb." (Rev.6:14-16). Don't let men's doctrines about a "secret rapture" sway you from the simplicity of God's Word. Not a good thing to try and force two more comings of Christ into Scripture just because that's how some us might WANT to believe. We have to take the bitter and the sweet of God's Word together, and keep the Faith through all tribulations.

 

[Bob0matiC]

2Pe 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
2Pe 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

 

[veteran]

Just to make myself clear, there are two separate comings to earth of our Lord Jesus. His first coming was to be meek as a Lamb to die on the cross for the remission of sins of many. His return, or second coming has not happenned yet today. When He appears the second time, that is when He will gather us to Himself by separating the wicked out of His Kingdom, and we will rule with Him over the nations with "a rod of iron".

The "secret rapture" idea (coined by John Darby in the 1800's) tries to ADD another coming of Christ prior to the tribulation, with another coming of Christ after the tribulation in final. That equates to THREE times of Christ's coming, which is not written in God's Word. The word "secret" was originally used along with the word "rapture" by Darby, and has been largely omitted among the pre-trib scholars today, their favouring the usage of the phrase "the rapture" by itself.

Heb 9:28
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for Him shall He appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
(KJV)

Thus the idea of a "second coming" is very Biblical per that. The ones that won't be looking for Him will obviously not have Salvation through Him. But those not looking will see His coming also, even those that pierced Him, as they also will be resurrected, what Jesus called the resurrection unto damnation.

 

[Bob0matiC]

Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.