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These Signs Will Follow Those Who Believe (Mark 16:17)

It is not unkind, to tell the truth. What is unkind it to keep telling people that their experience of the Holy Spirit is from Satan. Which is what Alfred seems to spend all his time doing.

How you said it was unkind. I wasn't speaking about what you said but how!

Oz
 
Peter promised they would receive Him if they repented and believed. The text says the did a Peter demanded, it follows they received the Holy Spirit.
I agree, but it doesn't state that fact in scripture.
That being said, we can't be sure they didn't all start speaking in tongues after they received the gift of the holy Ghost...just because it isn't mentioned.
Or did Peter lie to them? Of course he didn't. So they were baptized in the Spirit and as is true for everyone born again, the outward physical evidence of the presence of the Holy Spirit is a changed spirit, love for God, His Truth the bible, and for His people. That born again experience is the same what happens today, whenever people respond to the call to confess Jesus is LORD publicly.
Where did Peter mention "confessing Jesus is Lord publicly"?
Please don't add more than what is written.
 
The Bible is the authority, it alone can validate truth.
Everyday we are shocked by the evil people do, who we thought were good people.
So no, I don't trust my ability to know what is really going on in people's lives.
But I can read the Bible and study what it says, and believe it 100%.
Jesus said we could tell false prophets by their fruit. (Matt 7:15-17)
The same truth applies to us converts.
 
It is not unkind, to tell the truth. What is unkind it to keep telling people that their experience of the Holy Spirit is from Satan. Which is what Alfred seems to spend all his time doing.
That is slanderous. I never said anyone's experience is from Satan.

I have had experiences from Satan or his demons. Because that has happened to me, I don't trust experiences.

Not yours, not mine.

I only trust the Bible.

But it is a fact, humans can generate convincing self delusion about almost anything. So things can be "of the flesh" and not "of Satan".

AND because Christians can fool themselves, (I have done it), I don't say xyz means someone isn't a Christian.

I cannot possibly know that.

Everyone must Examine themselves:

Examine yourselves as to whether you are in the faith. Test yourselves. Do you not know yourselves, that Jesus Christ is in you?-- unless indeed you are disqualified. (2 Cor. 13:5 NKJ)
 
Jesus said we could tell false prophets by their fruit. (Matt 7:15-17)
The same truth applies to us converts.
We can, Jesus is never wrong. But He didn't say "you will always know everything about their private lives."
'
So yes, fruits reveal whether one is of God or not.

But we will never know the fruits of everyone. Con artists are skilled at presenting themselves as your friend, and you may never know it was them who pick your pocket.

Like I said, every day someone is exposed for wrong doing, who no one suspected was doing wrong. Jesus' words only apply to them, after they have been busted.
 
Alfred,

I know the answer because I've done my research about the age of the Received Text.
How do you know Wilbur Pickering's view was correct?

So you live by "that/your conviction" and not by your researched conclusion!

Oz
He made plausible arguments for the "majority text." Using informal logic he presented his case. I think he proved it "beyond a reasonable doubt." That is the best we can do logically.

But a man of Faith can choose to believe God, and I am sure it will be counted to him as righteousness.


Nothing is gained for Christians when they doubt what God said.
 
I agree, but it doesn't state that fact in scripture.
That being said, we can't be sure they didn't all start speaking in tongues after they received the gift of the holy Ghost...just because it isn't mentioned.

Where did Peter mention "confessing Jesus is Lord publicly"?
Please don't add more than what is written.
I agree "arguments from silence" are weak. BUT not if silence is "impossible". For example, if a person doesn't breathe for days, that "silence" likely proves the person is dead. Theoretically, there could be other explanations, but in all probability, the person is dead.

Because the NT does reveal when people spoke in tongues etc,. and these times are seen as special, it is "impossible" the Bible not reveal the 3,000 saved that day spoke in tongues, if they did.

Alternatively, if 3,000 saved today during an Evanglist event began speaking in tongues and prophesying, could they be silent about it? No, therefore neither did that happen in the book of Acts. The 3,000 did not speak in tongues etc., that's why its not recorded they did.

As for your second question, I did not add to what is written:

"Therefore whoever confesses Me before men, him I will also confess before My Father who is in heaven. (Matt. 10:32 NKJ)
 
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He made plausible arguments for the "majority text." Using informal logic he presented his case. I think he proved it "beyond a reasonable doubt." That is the best we can do logically.

But a man of Faith can choose to believe God, and I am sure it will be counted to him as righteousness.


Nothing is gained for Christians when they doubt what God said.

Being a person of faith, I can choose to believe God in the Alexandrian text of the NT.

Oz
 
He made plausible arguments for the "majority text." Using informal logic he presented his case. I think he proved it "beyond a reasonable doubt." That is the best we can do logically.

But a man of Faith can choose to believe God, and I am sure it will be counted to him as righteousness.


Nothing is gained for Christians when they doubt what God said.

Alfred,

Codex Sinaiticus is a 4th Century Greek Alexandrian MSS housed in the British Library and is considered to be the oldest Greek MSS known. There are portions of approx 5,000 Alexandrian MSS in the world.


The Greek NT that Erasmus used for the KJV was the Textus Receptus, dated to 1516. This means there was was a period of approx 12 centuries for copyists to add variants to the NT. I remember the copybook days from secondary school and the errors I made in copying documents. Purely accurate copying remains part of our imagination.

Oz
 
GOD'S GIFTS ARE IMMUTABLE. (Romans 11:29) When the Jews return to God, THE GIFTS ARE STILL THERE, including the additional Gifts of the Holy Spirit given after Pentecost.

This is a fine example of why we are not seeing the operation of the gifts in the Christian Church today, because in the main, with some exceptions, Christians, like the Jews have also gone cold, but when Gentile and Jew return to the fold after being grafted back in, the immutable gifts will still be there. God is ever faithful. So, instead, of being in denial, seek the Lord and His gifts, while they may still be found.
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Clarification: The gifts are available today and always will be for the faithful. As the Bible says, “GOD'S GIFTS ARE IMMUTABLE. (Romans 11:29).
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Alfred,

Codex Sinaiticus is a 4th Century Greek Alexandrian MSS housed in the British Library and is considered to be the oldest Greek MSS known. There are portions of approx 5,000 Alexandrian MSS in the world.


The Greek NT that Erasmus used for the KJV was the Textus Receptus, dated to 1516. This means there was was a period of approx 12 centuries for copyists to add variants to the NT. I remember the copybook days from secondary school and the errors I made in copying documents. Purely accurate copying remains part of our imagination.

Oz
Non sequitur, a hasty generalization. The TR was faithfully recopied continuously through the centuries because its use wore out old copies. But Greek Alexandrian (and others) were so corrupt and such bad copies no one used them. Unfortunately, non-use preserved them in monasteries, garbage dumps, trash cans etc., leaving them for textual critics to find and make a name for themselves, and secure steady employment.

The Alexandrian mss were so bad they littered the local garbage dump with thousands of copies.
 
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Clarification: The gifts are available today and always will be for the faithful. As the Bible says, “GOD'S GIFTS ARE IMMUTABLE. (Romans 11:29).
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Which Cooper is winning the argument? Was so confused he needed a clarification?

You've taken "not letting your left hand know what the right hand is doing" to a whole new level.

Inquiring minds want to know, where will Cooper go after he loses the argument?
 
Immutable and irrevocable mean different things.

And your theory cold Christians stopped God from giving them gifts that would make them "hot Christians" doesn't make any sense.

1)We can't stop God from doing anything; 2) Why would He allow us to stop Him from "fixing us", if indeed that is the "fix" for "coldness".

In the End Time, during the Great Tribulation of the Jews and the Church, when Moses and Elijah appear, then the prophecy of Joel will be fulfilled. Pentecost was only a prefigure of that end time event:

16 "But this is what was spoken by the prophet Joel:
17 `And it shall come to pass in the last days, says God, That I will pour out of My Spirit on all flesh; Your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, Your young men shall see visions, Your old men shall dream dreams.
18 And on My menservants and on My maidservants I will pour out My Spirit in those days; And they shall prophesy.
19 I will show wonders in heaven above And signs in the earth beneath: Blood and fire and vapor of smoke.
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, And the moon into blood, Before the coming of the great and awesome day of the LORD.
21 And it shall come to pass That whoever calls on the name of the LORD Shall be saved.'
(Acts 2:16-21 NKJ)

They mean the same. Immutable and unchanging are homonyms. We know God is unchanging as are his promises which are immutable (unchanging).

The HCSB, NASB, AM, LEB, WEB Bibles have irrevocable.
The King James and NET Bibles have Immutable.
Other translations have unchanging.

Strongs G276 ametathetos a derivative of G3346; unchangeable, or (neuter as abstract) unchangeability: - immutable (-ility).
 
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Which Cooper is winning the argument? Was so confused he needed a clarification?

You've taken "not letting your left hand know what the right hand is doing" to a whole new level.

Inquiring minds want to know, where will Cooper go after he loses the argument?
Clarification does not mean change.
Clarification and change are different words (grin).
Examine yourself.
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This means Mr Alfred Persson that the immutable, irrevocable gifts of the unchanging God are eternal.
We deny the almighty at our peril. I suggest you remember that Mr Persson.
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They mean the same. Immutable and unchanging are homonyms. We know God is unchanging as are his promises which are immutable (unchanging).

The HCSB, NASB, NET, AM, LEB, WEB Bibles have irrevocable.
The King James Bible has Immutable.
Other translations have unchanging.

Strongs G276 ametathetos a derivative of G3346; unchangeable, or (neuter as abstract) unchangeability: - immutable (-ility).

A test? Almost everything you said is incorrect. Homonyms are spelled the same. The KJV reads "without repentance"; G278, not G276. You are right G276 is a derivative of G3346 but it doesn't appear in the verse and so is irrelevant.

For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance (278). (Rom. 11:29 KJV)

278 ἀμεταμέλητος ametameletos {am-et-am-el'-ay-tos}
Meaning: 1) not repentant of, unregretted

Origin: from 1 (as a negative particle) and a presumed derivative of 3338; TDNT
 
A test? Almost everything you said is incorrect. Homonyms are spelled the same. The KJV reads "without repentance"; G278, not G276. You are right G276 is a derivative of G3346 but it doesn't appear in the verse and so is irrelevant.

For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance (278). (Rom. 11:29 KJV)

278 ἀμεταμέλητος ametameletos {am-et-am-el'-ay-tos}
Meaning: 1) not repentant of, unregretted

Origin: from 1 (as a negative particle) and a presumed derivative of 3338; TDNT
I have had enough of this play on words. Whatever you say, God and His gifts are unchanging. I am reminded of the JW translators.
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But these aren't godly Christians Paul is talking about.

Our course they are not, as he plain states they have no power, but only a “form” of godliness, because they resist the Holy Spirit power; the baptism with the Holy Spirit; THE ONLY GOD ORDAINED WAY FOR US TO HAVE POWER.

JLB
 
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