Twelve rules that are broken when people speak in tongues Part 2

[gordon777]

I hope you have a lot of snacksclose by when you return, sounds like you will be here for the long haul .

Did you ever solve the riddle of the 2X4 ?

Our faith does not stand in the wisdom of men, ( enticing words of mans wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and power of God.) does that not solve anything for you.



1 Corinthians 2:4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.

 

[gordon777]

Who corrects you?

What does not take part in endless geneologies, is edifying, which is that which is good, to minister grace to the hearers.




Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

1 Timothy 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

 

[gordon777]

If all people do is take part in endless discussions, they are not edifying at all.

If anyone seeks edification, all has to be done unto edifying.

All was done by the Apostles for our edifying.

The body is edified in love, ( charity edifieth) if no love is seen( love is in deed and truth) it is a confused debate instead and is devilish, not heavenly. (you are all corrected and rebuked and it wont go on for ever, it will end sooner than you think. Ecclesiastes 8:11-13.)





1 John 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

James 3: 14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.




1 Corinthians 14:26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.


2 Corinthians 12:19 Again, think ye that we excuse ourselves unto you? we speak before God in Christ: but we do all things, dearly beloved, for your edifying.

Ephesians 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Ephesians 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.


1 Corinthians 8:1 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.

 

[electedbyHim]

My choices are either .
A. a man's commentary saying god
or
B. many versions of the bible saying the same thing , God !

Choice B , sorry commentary man .

Are not the Bible versions you quoted written by fallible man?

For me, the verse in context makes sense because the Corinthians were abusing the gift of languages like the pagan cults did. There is no denying that when reading 1 Corinthians, that these people were living a sinful life style.

Background and Setting

The city of Corinth was located in southern Greece, in what was the Roman province of Achaia, c. 45 miles west from Athens. This lower part, the Peloponnesus, is connected to the rest of Greece by a four-mile-wide isthmus, which is bounded on the east by the Saronic Gulf and on the west by the Gulf of Corinth. Corinth is near the middle of the isthmus and is prominently situated on a high plateau. For many centuries, all north-south land traffic in that area had to pass through or near this ancient city. Since travel by sea around the Peloponnesus involved a 250-mile voyage that was dangerous and obviously time-consuming, most captains carried their ships on skids or rollers across the isthmus directly past Corinth. Understandably, Corinth prospered as a major trade city, not only for most of Greece but for much of the Mediterranean area, including North Africa, Italy, and Asia Minor. A canal across the isthmus was begun by the emperor Nero during the first century A.D., but was not completed until near the end of the nineteenth century.

The Isthmian games, one of the two most famous athletic events of that day (the other being the Olympian games), was hosted by Corinth, causing more people-traffic. Even by the pagan standards of its own culture, Corinth became so morally corrupt that its very name became synonymous with debauchery and moral depravity. To "corinthianize" came to represent gross immorality and drunken debauchery. In 1Co_6:9-10, Paul lists some of the specific sins for which the city was noted and which formerly had characterized many believers in the church there. Tragically, some of the worst sins were still found among some church members. One of those sins, incest, was condemned even by most pagan Gentiles (1Co_5:1).

Like most ancient Greek cities, Corinth had an acropolis (lit. "a high city"), which rose 2,000 feet and was used both for defense and for worship. The most prominent edifice on the acropolis was a temple to Aphrodite, the Greek goddess of love. Some 1,000 priestesses, who were "religious" prostitutes, lived and worked there and came down into the city in the evening to offer their services to male citizens and foreign visitors.

The church in Corinth was founded by Paul on his second missionary journey (Act_18:1 ff.). As usual, his ministry began in the synagogue, where he was assisted by two Jewish believers, Priscilla and Aquila, with whom he lived for a while and who were fellow tradesmen. Soon after, Silas and Timothy joined them and Paul began preaching even more intensely in the synagogue. When most of the Jews resisted the gospel, he left the synagogue, but not before Crispus, the leader of the synagogue, his family, and many other Corinthians were converted (Act_18:5-8).

After ministering in Corinth for over a year and a half (Act_18:11), Paul was brought before a Roman tribunal by some of the Jewish leaders. Because the charges were strictly religious and not civil, the proconsul, Gallio, dismissed the case. Shortly thereafter, Paul took Priscilla and Aquila with him to Ephesus. From there, he returned to Israel (Rom_16:18-22).

Unable to fully break with the culture from which it came, the church at Corinth was exceptionally factional, showing its carnality and immaturity. After the gifted Apollos had ministered in the church for some time, a group of his admirers established a clique and had little to do with the rest of the church. Another group developed that was loyal to Paul, another claimed special allegiance to Peter (Cephas), and still another to Christ alone (see 1Co_1:10-13; 1Co_3:1-9).

The most serious problem of the Corinthian church was worldliness, an unwillingness to divorce the culture around them. Most of the believers could not consistently separate themselves from their old, selfish, immoral, and pagan ways. It became necessary for Paul to write to correct this, as well as to command the faithful Christians not only to break fellowship with the disobedient and unrepentant members, but to put those members out of the church (1Co_5:9-13).

Before he wrote this inspired letter, Paul had written the church other correspondence (see 1Co_5:9), which was also corrective in nature. Because a copy of that letter has never been discovered, it has been referred to as "the lost epistle." There was another non-canonical letter after 1 Corinthians, usually called "the severe letter" (2Co_2:4).

I would still like some to explain how tongues are beneficial today. Are there unbelieving Jews in the assembly when speaking in tongues? If so, they do not speak English?

 

[electedbyHim]

What does not take part in endless geneologies, is edifying, which is that which is good, to minister grace to the hearers.




Ephesians 4:29 Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth, but that which is good to the use of edifying, that it may minister grace unto the hearers.

1 Timothy 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do.

Where is the corrupt communication?

Fables? Genealogies?

 

[electedbyHim]

If all people do is take part in endless discussions, they are not edifying at all.

If anyone seeks edification, all has to be done unto edifying.

All was done by the Apostles for our edifying.

The body is edified in love, ( charity edifieth) if no love is seen( love is in deed and truth) it is a confused debate instead and is devilish, not heavenly. (you are all corrected and rebuked and it wont go on for ever, it will end sooner than you think. Ecclesiastes 8:11-13.)





1 John 3:18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.

James 3: 14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.
16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.




1 Corinthians 14:26 How is it then, brethren? when ye come together, every one of you hath a psalm, hath a doctrine, hath a tongue, hath a revelation, hath an interpretation. Let all things be done unto edifying.


2 Corinthians 12:19 Again, think ye that we excuse ourselves unto you? we speak before God in Christ: but we do all things, dearly beloved, for your edifying.

Ephesians 4:12 For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ:

Ephesians 4:16 From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.


1 Corinthians 8:1 Now as touching things offered unto idols, we know that we all have knowledge. Knowledge puffeth up, but charity edifieth.

I believe we are discussing these issues as mature adults. I see no name calling or tearing one another down in the conversations I am having with some of the members here.

My conscience is clear on this.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[gordon777]

What edifies is charity, love in deed and truth, all disputes gender strife=create evil, and are evidence that people of no faith, are engaging in their forbidden( by the Lord) debates.

YOu are both withdrawn from and exposed, and even if you continue on and excuse yourself, you are WITHOUT EXCUSE.





Romans 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Romans 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,


1 Timothy 6:3 If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,
5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.


2 Timothy 2:23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

James 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.

James 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

 

[gordon777]

Grace and peace to you.

Psalm 28:3 Draw me not away with the wicked, and with the workers of iniquity, which speak peace to their neighbours, but mischief is in their hearts.

 

[electedbyHim]

What edifies is charity, love in deed and truth, all disputes gender strife=create evil, and are evidence that people of no faith, are engaging in their forbidden( by the Lord) debates.

YOu are both withdrawn from and exposed, and even if you continue on and excuse yourself, you are WITHOUT EXCUSE.





Romans 1:20 For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Romans 1:29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers,


1 Timothy 6:3 If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
4 He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,
5 Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.


2 Timothy 2:23 But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

James 3:14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.

James 3:16 For where envying and strife is, there is confusion and every evil work.

engaging in their forbidden( by the Lord) debates

Debates are forbidden by God? Christiaan apologetics and debates are sinful?

 

[electedbyHim]

Psalm 28:3 Draw me not away with the wicked, and with the workers of iniquity, which speak peace to their neighbours, but mischief is in their hearts.

No one knows my intentions but God Himself, and if there be a hidden sin in me. He will reveal that to me as well.

My conscience is clear.

 

[eddif]

Are not the Bible versions you quoted written by fallible man?

For me, the verse in context makes sense because the Corinthians were abusing the gift of languages like the pagan cults did. There is no denying that when reading 1 Corinthians, that these people were living a sinful life style.

I would say you are installing the context you want the 1 Corinthians passage to have.

1 Corinthians 12:1 jjv
1. Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
2. Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.

The Context:
A gentile people previously led astray to worship idols.
Ignorant of spiritual gifts.
Being instructed as to:
1.What the spiritual gifts are
1 Corinthians Chap. 12
2. The type of love to use the gifts with 1 Corinthians Chap. 13
3. The order oh Church Worship
1 Corinthians Chap. 14
4. What the Gospel is
1 Corinthians Chap 15

The instructions for spiritual gifts come before the Gospel.

Mississippi redneck
eddif

 

[eddif]

I would say you are installing the context you want the 1 Corinthians passage to have.

1 Corinthians 12:1 jjv
1. Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
2. Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.

The Context:
A gentile people previously led astray to worship idols.
Ignorant of spiritual gifts.
Being instructed as to:
1.What the spiritual gifts are
1 Corinthians Chap. 12
2. The type of love to use the gifts with 1 Corinthians Chap. 13
3. The order oh Church Worship
1 Corinthians Chap. 14
4. What the Gospel is
1 Corinthians Chap 15

The instructions for spiritual gifts come before the Gospel.

Mississippi redneck
eddif

What to do with children who get carried away with a new gift. You tell the child:
Slow down
Be a little quieter
Share your gift that others can be included

With care the assembly will be orderly, so that the Gospel can be heard and preached. There is a whole country that needed the Gospel and spiritual gifts. The Holy Spirit is the power to be a witness.

There is no get rid of the spiritual gifts right this minute.

There is: know how to operate the public spiritual gifts in order.

Tongues will pass away when Jesus returns. There is a long time period between Pentecost and the return of Jesus in the clouds.

In the meantime new tongue talkers may still get overly excited with their gift and have to be slowed down. Children are children, and to have someone forbid a gift from the Holy Spirit seems …….

eddif

 

[electedbyHim]

I would say you are installing the context you want the 1 Corinthians passage to have.

1 Corinthians 12:1 jjv
1. Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I would not have you ignorant.
2. Ye know that ye were Gentiles, carried away unto these dumb idols, even as ye were led.

The Context:
A gentile people previously led astray to worship idols.
Ignorant of spiritual gifts.
Being instructed as to:
1.What the spiritual gifts are
1 Corinthians Chap. 12
2. The type of love to use the gifts with 1 Corinthians Chap. 13
3. The order oh Church Worship
1 Corinthians Chap. 14
4. What the Gospel is
1 Corinthians Chap 15

The instructions for spiritual gifts come before the Gospel.

Mississippi redneck
eddif

Please clarify the context. Are you saying that the Corinthians were not abusing the gifts?

Chapter 14 is a rebuke, they were misusing tongues and prophecy.

I do not understand what you are trying to say.

Again, I am not the sharpest tool in the shed.

 

[eddif]

Please clarify the context. Are you saying that the Corinthians were not abusing the gifts?

Chapter 14 is a rebuke, they were misusing tongues and prophecy.

I do not understand what you are trying to say.

Again, I am not the sharpest tool in the shed.

If you train youngsters to use woodworking tools. There is a learning curve in shop class. Because woodworking tools are dangerous to use, there are warnings that go along with learning. You may hear rebuke along with the course. You might hear the teacher tell a student ( stay in the classroom today and read the safety manual. The rest of us will be in the shop using the saw.

The lord chastens them he loves.

He seldom tells someone the first week you are out of this class forever. Warnings are common.

You are talking about a 1,000 year?old Corinthian society that knew nothing about God. God is slow to anger.

Cut these young Christians some slack. Do they have errors? Yes.

Are they being warned? Yes. Is it serious business? Yes.

For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

We are not training Navy Seals.


eddif

 

[electedbyHim]

If you train youngsters to use woodworking tools. There is a learning curve in shop class. Because woodworking tools are dangerous to use, there are warnings that go along with learning. You may hear rebuke along with the course. You might hear the teacher tell a student ( stay in the classroom today and read the safety manual. The rest of us will be in the shop using the saw.

The lord chastens them he loves.

He seldom tells someone the first week you are out of this class forever. Warnings are common.

You are talking about a 1,000 year?old Corinthian society that knew nothing about God. God is slow to anger.

Cut these young Christians some slack. Do they have errors? Yes.

Are they being warned? Yes. Is it serious business? Yes.

For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God.

We are not training Navy Seals.


eddif

I just do not understand.

 

[hawkman]

Are not the Bible versions you quoted written by fallible man?

This is critical you answer this question . Do you think man wrote the bible ?

For me, the verse in context makes sense because the Corinthians were abusing the gift of languages like the pagan cults did. There is no denying that when reading 1 Corinthians, that these people were living a sinful life style.

Well sure after the verse is altered to the commentary man version with god in it .

I would still like some to explain how tongues are beneficial today.

Good reading here for you ! The Benefits of Speaking in Tongues

Are there unbelieving Jews in the assembly when speaking in tongues?

I would hope so .

If so, they do not speak English?

Do all Jewish people speak English ?

 

[electedbyHim]

This is critical you answer this question . Do you think man wrote the bible ?

Well sure after the verse is altered to the commentary man version with god in it .

Good reading here for you ! The Benefits of Speaking in Tongues

I would hope so .

Do all Jewish people speak English ?

You have yet to share a commentary on the verses in the original op. You have shared your opinion and that was welcomed. Your opinions on these scriptures do not override an exegetical verse by verse commentary derived from the original languages. Feel free to share a commentary or two that you use.

I know that most Pentecostals and charismatics do not use commentaries, they assume that Holy Spirit will guide them in all knowledge and truth. They use John 14:26 amongst other verses. If that were the case then we do not need Pastor/teachers and the like.

This is critical you answer this question . Do you think man wrote the bible ?

Scripture is God breathed in to man when they penned the scriptures.

Well sure after the verse is altered to the commentary man version with god in it .

That is an assumption. Please show proof of this claim.

Good reading here for you ! The Benefits of Speaking in Tongues

I have scanned the article and perhaps will read it completely later today. I already know how this will go because I have read such studies like it in the past. I can count this as a commentary, I suppose.

I would hope so . Do all Jewish people speak English ?

The person speaking the language would be a Jewish foreign tongue (Yiddish, Hebrew? I am not certain) and the interpreter would know that is was a foreign Jewish language.

Grace and peace to you.

 

[eddif]

hawkman
See if this fits rebuke that helps

James 5:19 kjv
19. Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back,
20. Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Luke 17:3 kjv
3. Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

It seems to me that a rebuke can cause a brother to repent and be forgiven by God and man..

Luke 17:4 kjv
4. And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.

Also it seems that one confrontation is the end. It goes on to (70X7?).

Matthew 18:22 kjv
18. Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

I hope electedbyhim is reading this too.

eddif

 

[electedbyHim]

hawkman
See if this fits rebuke that helps

James 5:19 kjv
19. Brethren, if anyone among you wanders from the truth, and someone turns him back,
20. Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

Luke 17:3 kjv
3. Take heed to yourselves: If thy brother trespass against thee, rebuke him; and if he repent, forgive him.

It seems to me that a rebuke can cause a brother to repent and be forgiven by God and man..

Luke 17:4 kjv
4. And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.

Also it seems that one confrontation is the end. It goes on to (70X7?).

Matthew 18:22 kjv
18. Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

I hope electedbyhim is reading this too.

eddif

Who is sinning against who?

How is this post in line with this subject?

 

[electedbyHim]

Now I have a question to all that speaks in tongues.

How does one decide if it is from Holy Spirit or from Satan?