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WHY CALVINISM IS UNBIBLICAL - UNCONDITIONAL ELECTION

Episcopius

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Did his opponents lie about him, in other words?

For certain. Arminius went to Rome - and saw the Pope from a distance. His opponents alleged that he had "kissed the Pope's slipper".

Arminius had the book of Luis de Molina in his library - doesn't mean he was a Molinist.

I read Arminius' works online - printing out much of it - which got water-soaked.
 

JLB

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But foreknowing does not mean predetermination.


Amen.


And predetermination does not mean every person who is predetermined by God for a purpose will accomplish that purpose, even if the purpose includes eternal life.


This is why we see false doctrine attack so viciously the idea of a person’s ability to choose…. Right from wrong, good from evil, God’s will or their own will.



Example:


So Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Matthew 19:28


  • you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.


If anyone who is honestly seeking the truth would simply read and believe this passage, and allow the truth of what the Lord is saying hear sink down in their heart, it would safeguard them from so much false indoctrination about predestination.



God predestined, predetermined that the twelve disciples would reign and rule with Christ, in the age to come…





JLB
 

Episcopius

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"It is appointed a man once to die and after that the judgement" - would you call that predetermination?

But it is not true that every person will die - one generation at the end will have those of whom it is written:

"We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed."

At the last trumpet.
 
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Amen.


And predetermination does not mean every person who is predetermined by God for a purpose will accomplish that purpose, even if the purpose includes eternal life.


This is why we see false doctrine attack so viciously the idea of a person’s ability to choose…. Right from wrong, good from evil, God’s will or their own will.



Example:


So Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. Matthew 19:28


  • you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.


If anyone who is honestly seeking the truth would simply read and believe this passage, and allow the truth of what the Lord is saying hear sink down in their heart, it would safeguard them from so much false indoctrination about predestination.



God predestined, predetermined that the twelve disciples would reign and rule with Christ, in the age to come…





JLB
It is a rule of law that no one can be found guilty of a crime if they have had no choice in the matter. It is called "duress". When it comes time for the last judgment, it will be abundantly clear that everyone will be judged according to their personal choice concerning Christ. I believe that there will be one major question that will separate the sheep from the goats: "What did you do in relation to what Christ did for you on the Cross?" An extreme Calvinist may say, "I can't be guilty, because I was predestinated, and had no personal choice". And if this was true, no elect person could be rewarded, because he did only what he was predestined to do. A soldier is not awarded a bravery medal for just doing his duty as ordered. He is awarded the medal because he chose to go above and beyond what was expected of him in terms of acts of bravery. Therefore, an extremist, "elect" Calvinist can't expect a reward from the Lord because he did only what he was predestined to do without having any personal choice in the matter.

This means that a reprobate can't be sentenced to an eternity in hell, because he had no personal choice. "Duress" is the action of removing personal choice concerning what a person intends for another person. It involves a component of force. Predestination has that element of force, because it gives the person only one alternative either predestined to be elect or reprobate without giving the person the right to choose.

This shows the serious fault of predestination. The truth is that every one of us will be judged according to our choice of whether, in the light of the Gospel, we chose to believe it or not, and our subsequent actions commensurate with that choice. Therefore those who are judged to be reprobate are those who choose to remain reprobate in spite of the preaching of the Gospel to them, while those who are judged to be the elect will be on the basis of their choice to believe the Gospel and embrace Christ as their Saviour.
 

Chocolate Roadrunner

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I think the OP's hostility toward Calvinism precludes rational understanding of the actual tenets of Calvinism.

There are different beliefs or tenets in Calvinism. There are four point Calvinists, and there are five point Calvinists.

While I am non-denominational myself, I do understand where the doctrine of John Calvin comes from. The words of God himself.

Just as every denomination within Christendom gleans their understanding of self, our place in this world, the why behind that, and the source for all of it, gleans their understanding from that same source.Man.

And all of it, even we non's, are led to believe in the words on the pages that were cobbled together by our fellow man. And they're interpreted, taught to us, by other men. Especially so in those churches God said cannot contain him, that do not permit women to preach. Because that church tells us, God said so.

We talk about finding peace in Christ. And then in places like this we argue over what God meant when he said what he said in the Bible cobbled together by men. Who said they were acting under the inspiration of one God.Ours.

One God. Many opinions of what he meant to tell us in his own words.
Our piece of Christ.
 

JLB

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The truth is that every one of us will be judged according to our choice

God, who “will render to each one according to his deeds”: eternal life to those who by patient continuance in doing good seek for glory, honor, and immortality; but to those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness—indignation and wrath, Romans 2:6-8
 

wondering

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I think the OP's hostility toward Calvinism precludes rational understanding of the actual tenets of Calvinism.

There are different beliefs or tenets in Calvinism. There are four point Calvinists, and there are five point Calvinists.

While I am non-denominational myself, I do understand where the doctrine of John Calvin comes from. The words of God himself.

Just as every denomination within Christendom gleans their understanding of self, our place in this world, the why behind that, and the source for all of it, gleans their understanding from that same source.Man.

And all of it, even we non's, are led to believe in the words on the pages that were cobbled together by our fellow man. And they're interpreted, taught to us, by other men. Especially so in those churches God said cannot contain him, that do not permit women to preach. Because that church tells us, God said so.

We talk about finding peace in Christ. And then in places like this we argue over what God meant when he said what he said in the Bible cobbled together by men. Who said they were acting under the inspiration of one God.Ours.

One God. Many opinions of what he meant to tell us in his own words.
Our piece of Christ.
Hostile toward Calvinism.
Hostile is a strong word.
Let's say that I dislike Calvinism.
Because I dislike it does not mean I can't know its tenets.

Problem is, as you've stated, there are not set tenets.
I usually address 5 point Calvinists.
I believe the set tenets are what John Calvin believed and taught.

Calvinism does not come from the word of God.
It comes from the mind of John Calvin, who was depending on a 10 year Manechaen named Augustine who became Christian and died after 400AD.
400AD
400, at least, years after Jesus died.
No Christian belonging to the church BEFORE HIM, believed anything of what HE taught.

Does this say anything?
 

Episcopius

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It says that Calvinism is just re-upchucked Augustinian Double Predestination - vomited up 1000 years later.
 

wondering

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It says that Calvinism is just re-upchucked Augustinian Double Predestination - vomited up 1000 years later.
Right.
How does any person believe a teaching that was NEVER TAUGHT IN THE CHURCH until more than 1,500 years AFTER Jesus died???
Were all the theologians till then just plain dumb?
I'd stop and think about this a while....
Not only is calvinism not biblical, it's heretical (not conforming to the norm), and not logical.
I keep bringing up the illogical reasoning Calvinism offers, but it falls on deaf ears.
Ears that can't hear....
Interesting!
 
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