Woman on the Beast

[Quantrill]

Apparently you are not understanding what I have been saying.

Mystery Babylon is the mother of harlots. Babylon is her first daughter followed by three more daughters, Medo/Persian Empire, Grecian Empire and Roman Empire. The ten horns represent the nations the Roman Empire scattered to when the deadly wound was put upon them, Daniel 7:23-25; Rev 13:3. I am not mixing anything as it is these four Empires, being political and a false religion as being pagan, that are her four daughters that follow in the footsteps of their harlot mother.

Rev 13 The beast out of the sea, meaning people and nations, is the Luciferian system that controls world wide economics, political, military, educational and false religious system. This beast system that Satan works through gives its power to the beast out of the earth as the beast out of the earth appears as the Lamb of God, but is a false Christ being the son of perdition, 2 Thessalonians 2:3-12 with two horns. The two horns represent the Old Roman Empire that received its deadly wound back in 1798 by General Berthier who made his entrance into Rome and abolished the Roman government and established a secular one. That caused them to scatter into the other ten nations (ten horns). The wound was healed in 1929 by Mussolini.

I understand what you're saying. I just disagree.

In my opinion, Mystery Babylon did not produce the beast, the Persisan, or Grecian, or Roman empires. She is certainly part of those empires.

Mystery Babylon, the woman, (Rev. 17:1-6) is only the religious aspect of Babylon. The beast is the political aspect of Babylon.

The beast was introduced in (Rev. 13). But even there, in order to understand the beast. distinction had to be made between the political and religious. This is done by describing two beasts. One beast rises out of the sea. (Rev. 13:1-10). Another beast rises out of the earth. (Rev. 13:11-18). The beast out of the sea speaks to the political. The beast out of the earth speaks to the religious. These certainly work together to form one evil system. Babylon.

In (Rev. 17) further information and distinction is given concerning the religious and political aspects of Babylon. The woman is the religious. The beast is the political.

So, in my opinion, we cannot use any papal authority or person to describe anything, including the 7 heads and 10 horns, concerning the beast. The papal authority or person can be used to describe the woman that sits on the beast.

This is where I am at, at this time. This is a difficult portion of Scripture.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

Can you explain this a little further as I do not know what you mean by a virgin mother/child goddess

Yes. I recommend the book "The Two Babylon's" by Alexander Hislop for a very thorough presentation of it. It is very difficult reading, but it is very good. He proves how Romanism in the Christian faith has been so shaped by this Mystery religion.

Basically you find this mother/child worship in all the ancient religions.

Babylon--Mylitta or Semiramis is the mother. Tammuz is her son.
Egypt--Isis is the mother. Horus is her son.
India--Devaki is the mother. Crishna is her son.
India--Indrani is the mother holding a child.
Asia--Cybele is the mother. Deoius is her son.
Pagan Rome--Fortuna is the mother. Jupiter is her son.

You will find this false religion being observed even in Israel. See (Ezekiel 8:13-14) (Jer. 7:18) (Jer. 44:18-19)

And as already mentioned, you find it most clearly in the Roman church today.

All have their origin from Babylon. It can be traced back to Nimrod who was a descendant of Ham, the rebellious son of Noah. (Gen. 10:6-10)

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

Revelation 1:10
I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and heard behind me a great voice, as of a trumpet,

The book of Revelation begins with John being in the Spirit. Being in the Spirit as apposed to being of the flesh. Seven times to the seven churches the same word is given: He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches.

Revelation 17:3
So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman .............

Again, John was carried away in the spirit into the wilderness, and he saw a woman... in the wilderness.

Revelation 12:14
And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.


To all these things, they where given in the Spirit, and they can only be understand in the Spirit. To each of the seven churches, they are implored to hear what the Spirit saith.

John 3:6
That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

The woman in the wilderness, was seen by John in the spirit, an no matter all the hours of study and carnal knowledge secured, the flesh does not reveal the spirit. For that which is born of the flesh seeketh after the things of the flesh, and does mind the things of the flesh.


1 Corinthians 2:6-14
Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought: But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him. But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


To the seven churches he saith, He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches. The Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God. The Spirit does not search out the deep things of Satan. For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? Where can the churches be found after Revelation 3? In the wilderness, where John was taken in the spirit and shown the Woman, the Mother of harlots, sitting upon the waters. He who hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith to the seven churches.


And unto the angel of the church in Thyatira write; These things saith the Son of God, who hath his eyes like unto a flame of fire, and his feet are like fine brass; I know thy works, and charity, and service, and faith, and thy patience, and thy works; and the last to be more than the first. Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols. And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.
But unto you I say, and unto the rest in Thyatira, as many as have not this doctrine, and which have not known the depths of Satan, as they speak; I will put upon you none other burden.

What does the warning to the seven churches in Asia have to do with Rev Chapter 12?

Rev Chapter 12

John is shown a great sign in heaven as he sees a vision of a woman clothed with the sun and the moon under her feet. The sun is representative of the glory and brilliance of Gods righteousness that surrounds her and protects her. Under her feet the moon which is illustrative of eternity, light, Gods faithfulness in His Son Jesus who is the greater light of the gospel age as Jesus being the light of the world that shines in darkness, but the darkness can not comprehend the light, Psalms 72:5-7; Isaiah 2:3-5; Jeremiah 31:35-37; Isaiah 30:26-33; John 1:1-5.

The woman is symbolic of Israel and the congregation of Gods people as she wears a crown of twelve stars which represents the twelve tribes of Israel that have repented of their arrogance as they felt they deserved Gods favor, but yet kept killing the prophets God sent to them, including the very Messiah they were waiting for. This is when the times of the Gentiles began as God went to them to take Himself a people that were humbled enough to receive salvation as God had mercy on them, Matthew 23:37-39; Acts 15:14; Romans 11:25-27.

Paul also warned the Gentiles against being lifted up in pride because they had been favored by God with salvation as he explained the blindness of Israel would not last forever as when they see the Gentiles now having favor in the Lord and being grafted into the branch of Israel they repent of their sin and turn back to God being once again found in His favor, Romans Chapter 11.

The true congregation of God can be symbolized here as a mother that has all here children gathered in one place for safety which in this case is under the wings of the almighty God, Psalms 91. She cries out like a woman in labor as the pain of her persecutions has become too great to bear as she waits to be delivered from her persecutors, 2 Timothy 4:18; 2 Peter 2:9; Colossians 1:13.

The other sign John saw was a great red dragon meaning Satan. Remember, this is a vision and a sign as Satan has not yet been thrown out of heaven yet. The description of the dragon being great and red depicts its nature and character as being fierce and murderous, John 8:44. This red dragon is depicted as having seven heads, ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. The seven heads and ten horns refer to the original ten kingdoms of which three were subdued by the little horn of Daniel 7:8. The last kingdom which stands greater than all the others is that of a revived Roman Empire that takes control over all the ten nations who then implements a deceiving peace treaty to a world that is in great distress. Below is that of the seven kingdoms described as four beasts in Daniel 7:1-8 and the three kingdoms that were subdued by the little horn, which is the Roman Empire.​

 

[for_his_glory]

I understand what you're saying. I just disagree.

In my opinion, Mystery Babylon did not produce the beast, the Persisan, or Grecian, or Roman empires. She is certainly part of those empires.

Mystery Babylon, the woman, (Rev. 17:1-6) is only the religious aspect of Babylon. The beast is the political aspect of Babylon.

The beast was introduced in (Rev. 13). But even there, in order to understand the beast. distinction had to be made between the political and religious. This is done by describing two beasts. One beast rises out of the sea. (Rev. 13:1-10). Another beast rises out of the earth. (Rev. 13:11-18). The beast out of the sea speaks to the political. The beast out of the earth speaks to the religious. These certainly work together to form one evil system. Babylon.

In (Rev. 17) further information and distinction is given concerning the religious and political aspects of Babylon. The woman is the religious. The beast is the political.

So, in my opinion, we cannot use any papal authority or person to describe anything, including the 7 heads and 10 horns, concerning the beast. The papal authority or person can be used to describe the woman that sits on the beast.

This is where I am at, at this time. This is a difficult portion of Scripture.

Quantrill

There is no shame in disagreeing and we will probably not see eye to eye on this. It is a very deep study that takes one from Genesis to Rev to search out ones understanding. It's taken me forty years and I still only know in part by studying scripture and the history of the four empires.

 

[for_his_glory]

All have their origin from Babylon. It can be traced back to Nimrod who was a descendant of Ham, the rebellious son of Noah. (Gen. 10:6-10)

Hey, something that we can agree on, LOL

 

[ezrider]

What does the warning to the seven churches in Asia have to do with Rev Chapter 12?

He who hath an ear, let him hear what the spirit saith.

In order to hear, one must first listen. But one is unable to listen if they presume they must teach. Why do you presume you must teach me about Revelation 12?

What is all this below? Have you just copied and pasted this from something else? It sure seems that way to me. What does any of this have to do with what I actually posted?

Rev Chapter 12

John is shown a great sign in heaven as he sees a vision of a woman clothed with the sun and the moon under her feet. The sun is representative of the glory and brilliance of Gods righteousness that surrounds her and protects her. Under her feet the moon which is illustrative of eternity, light, Gods faithfulness in His Son Jesus who is the greater light of the gospel age as Jesus being the light of the world that shines in darkness, but the darkness can not comprehend the light, Psalms 72:5-7; Isaiah 2:3-5; Jeremiah 31:35-37; Isaiah 30:26-33; John 1:1-5.

The woman is symbolic of Israel and the congregation of Gods people as she wears a crown of twelve stars which represents the twelve tribes of Israel that have repented of their arrogance as they felt they deserved Gods favor, but yet kept killing the prophets God sent to them, including the very Messiah they were waiting for. This is when the times of the Gentiles began as God went to them to take Himself a people that were humbled enough to receive salvation as God had mercy on them, Matthew 23:37-39; Acts 15:14; Romans 11:25-27.

Paul also warned the Gentiles against being lifted up in pride because they had been favored by God with salvation as he explained the blindness of Israel would not last forever as when they see the Gentiles now having favor in the Lord and being grafted into the branch of Israel they repent of their sin and turn back to God being once again found in His favor, Romans Chapter 11.

The true congregation of God can be symbolized here as a mother that has all here children gathered in one place for safety which in this case is under the wings of the almighty God, Psalms 91. She cries out like a woman in labor as the pain of her persecutions has become too great to bear as she waits to be delivered from her persecutors, 2 Timothy 4:18; 2 Peter 2:9; Colossians 1:13.

The other sign John saw was a great red dragon meaning Satan. Remember, this is a vision and a sign as Satan has not yet been thrown out of heaven yet. The description of the dragon being great and red depicts its nature and character as being fierce and murderous, John 8:44. This red dragon is depicted as having seven heads, ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads. The seven heads and ten horns refer to the original ten kingdoms of which three were subdued by the little horn of Daniel 7:8. The last kingdom which stands greater than all the others is that of a revived Roman Empire that takes control over all the ten nations who then implements a deceiving peace treaty to a world that is in great distress. Below is that of the seven kingdoms described as four beasts in Daniel 7:1-8 and the three kingdoms that were subdued by the little horn, which is the Roman Empire.​

I am actually more interested in what you can tell me about Jezebel, who sought out and taught her knowledge of the depths of Satan. What is it you are teaching?

 

[for_his_glory]

He who hath an ear, let him hear what the spirit saith.

In order to hear, one must first listen. But one is unable to listen if they presume they must teach. Why do you presume you must teach me about Revelation 12?

What is all this below? Have you just copied and pasted this from something else? It sure seems that way to me. What does any of this have to do with what I actually posted?





I am actually more interested in what you can tell me about Jezebel, who sought out and taught her knowledge of the depths of Satan. What is it you are teaching?

What I posted about Rev 12 is my own writing of what I have studied. If I copy and paste I always give my source.

Here is what I found today about virgin daughter of Babylon and the lady of Chaldean and you can see how she is traced from Babylon up to present day Roman Catholic church.

Virgin Daughter of Babylon

Isaiah 47 speaks to the virgin daughter of Babylon. The phrase “virgin daughter of…” is used not only for Babylon but also the Lord’s people and of Egypt. This phrase is obviously an idiom. As I…

holyhighway.info

Virgin Daughter of Babylon by Beth Mehaffey

Isaiah 47 speaks to the virgin daughter of Babylon. The phrase "virgin daughter of Babylon" is not only used for Babylon, but also the Lord's people and Egypt. The phrase is obviously an idiom. The virgin daughter of Babylon is told to sit on the ground without a throne. The Lord was telling Babylon that He was going to take away her throne and give it to another who would be the Medes who conquered Babylon.

The word virgin is possibly used because of the privacy, sin or the shame of this nation that had not been exposed yet. Notice Isaiah 47:2-3 as the Lord intended to expose Babylon by sending Medo-Persia to conquer it.

This virgin should be contrasted to the woman in Rev 17. The woman is not the beast as she rides, or in other words controls the scarlet covered beast temporarily until the scarlet beast turns on her and destroys this woman, Rev 17:16-18. Just as disaster came upon the virgin daughter of Babylon it will also come upon the harlot, Babylon the great.

*************************************************************************************************************************************
Chaldean rite Christianity - britannica.com

Lady of Chaldean - Isaiah 47 concerns the fall of Babylon, which is personified as a woman, the virgin daughter of Babylon, a daughter of the Chaldeans, no longer to be called "the Lady of Kingdoms" or "Lady for ever".

Chaldeans originated from north of Mesopotamia, southeast of modern day Turkey and northeast of Syria. Chaldeans classify themselves as Assyrian. The name Chaldean means a person born or living in Chaldea. A member of a Semitic people related to Babylon. They are a member of an ancient Semitic people who ruled in Babylon.

Chaldean rite, also called East Syrian Rite system of liturgical practices and discipline historically associated with the Assyrian Church of the East, called the Nestorin Church, and also used by the Roman Catholic patriarchate of Babylon of the Chaldeans where it is called the East Syrian Rite. Found principally in Iraq, Iran, and Syria. It is also the original rite of the St. Thomas (Malabar Christians) in India.

The Chaldean rite originally grew out of Jerusalem-Antioch liturgy. Its Christians were from Mesopotamia and Chaldea, descendants of the ancient Babylonians, later extending throughout Asia and into India. (having a form of Godliness, 2Timothy 3:5, but denying the power there of). The term Chaldean was first used in 1445 by Pope Eugenius IV to distinguish those members of the Assyrian Church of the East in Cyrus, whose patriarch had converted to Catholicism, from those who were living outside of Cyrus. The term came into popular use following the profession of faith to Rome by John Sulaka, who was appointed patriarch of "Catholic Nestorian's by Pope Julius III in 1551.

The successors of Sulaka later assumed the name Simon and bore the title of "Patriarch-Catholicos of Babylon of the Chaldeans". In India the Malabae Church retained the Syriac language of the Chaldean (Babylonian) bishops. In the modern church, however, the vernacular Malayalam is gradually replacing Syriac as the liturgical language of the Malabarese.

The Chaldean rite, in comparison with other Eastern rites, is simpler in form, lacking, for instance, a detailed lectionary of scriptural verses and commemorating fewer saints. The liturgy is sometimes accompanied with cymbals and triangles and is always chanted.

 

[for_his_glory]

Yes. I recommend the book "The Two Babylon's" by Alexander Hislop for a very thorough presentation of it. It is very difficult reading, but it is very good. He proves how Romanism in the Christian faith has been so shaped by this Mystery religion.

Basically you find this mother/child worship in all the ancient religions.

Babylon--Mylitta or Semiramis is the mother. Tammuz is her son.
Egypt--Isis is the mother. Horus is her son.
India--Devaki is the mother. Crishna is her son.
India--Indrani is the mother holding a child.
Asia--Cybele is the mother. Deoius is her son.
Pagan Rome--Fortuna is the mother. Jupiter is her son.

You will find this false religion being observed even in Israel. See (Ezekiel 8:13-14) (Jer. 7:18) (Jer. 44:18-19)

And as already mentioned, you find it most clearly in the Roman church today.

All have their origin from Babylon. It can be traced back to Nimrod who was a descendant of Ham, the rebellious son of Noah. (Gen. 10:6-10)

Quantrill

Thank you for this.

 

[for_his_glory]

I am actually more interested in what you can tell me about Jezebel, who sought out and taught her knowledge of the depths of Satan. What is it you are teaching?

What do you mean, what am I teaching or did you not read my OP. This is all about the woman on the beast.

Concerning Jezebel

Rev 2:18-29

Jesus is relaying a message to his Church that there will be a greater need more than ever as Gods final wrath moves over the world. The Church, those who are in Christ and he in them, are here to preach salvation to those who have yet to repent until that door of salvation is closed when Jesus returns for His Bride.

Here again we see a warning against this Jezebel spirit teaching in the church. She is the type of paganism that has crept into the Church and causes a great falling away with her doctrines of Satan, 2 Thessalonians 2:3. God gave Jezebel time to repent, but she never did so God cast her into a metaphoric bed like a whore waiting to seduce those who come to lay with her as they continue to promote her pagan religious ideas. Later in the revelations we will see her being called the great whore of Babylon as she is a harlot who has lead Israel astray as Gods chosen people, but yet even they are given time to repent.

God said that he will kill her children meaning those who promote paganism in the Church that when they fall others will realize that God is the one who judges the intents of the heart. We will be judged by our works whether they be good or evil as only God knows those who are his own.

Jesus relays again to the Church that he will put no more burdens or in another word judgments on those who have never been seduced by these false doctrines as they continue in all truths of the Gospel and overcome that of Satan by maintaining their good works he will give them power over the nations as we will rule them with a rod of iron meaning we are the vessels God works through and as Jesus was made to die by the hands of the accusers so will we be like Jesus in times of great persecutions against the Church. We will receive that morning star, which is Jesus, when he comes in the clouds and we are taken up to him to be with the Lord forever.

You can study about Jezebel and how Israel lost the right to be Gods chosen people as her spirit still enters the house of the Lord to lead many astray from truth as those without Spiritual knowledge will reconcile what they hear with a carnal mind, 1 Kings Chapters 9, 16-19, 21.

 

[Quantrill]

Hey, something that we can agree on, LOL

Always good to build on.

Quantrill

 

[Quantrill]

Thank you for this.

You're quite welcome.

Quantrill

 

[ezrider]

What I posted about Rev 12 is my own writing of what I have studied. If I copy and paste I always give my source.

It sounded like it was something you copied and pasted. Did you copy and paste it from your own writings then? Or did you just happen to write all that off the hand as you replied?

 

[Quantrill]

for_his_glory

Understand that the next question to be presented by unbelievers and skeptics, and scientist's, is, 'why should we believe the Christian view of the Virgin Birth when other religions that preceded it, spoke of the same'? In other words, the Virgin Birth of Christ is just like all other religions.

Answer: Because all other religions got their view of the Virgin Birth from God's revelation in the heavens. The Zodiac. Virgo. See (Job 38:32)

Christianity is not the product of other religions views. All other religious views are the product of perverting the truth that God had revealed.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

for_his_glory

Understand that the next question to be presented by unbelievers and skeptics, and scientist's, is, 'why should we believe the Christian view of the Virgin Birth when other religions that preceded it, spoke of the same'? In other words, the Virgin Birth of Christ is just like all other religions.

Answer: Because all other religions got their view of the Virgin Birth from God's revelation in the heavens. The Zodiac. Virgo. See (Job 38:32)

Christianity is not the product of other religions views. All other religious views are the product of perverting the truth that God had revealed.

Quantrill

Not sure what this has to do with the topic. Skeptics and many scientist do not believe in the virgin birth as they have no truth found in them as they seek logical things of a carnal mind and can not perceive the Spiritual things of God. Creation vs Evolution, Atheist for instance comes to mind as evolutionist do not believe in God or the virgin birth of Christ. There are over 4000 different religions in the world and not all of them are of God, nor do they even recognize Christ.

Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, The Church of Latter Day Saints, Bali' and many of the 4000 different religions in the world do not believe in God or the virgin birth. It's only those who are truly God's own that believe in the virgin birth of Christ by faith which comes by hearing the word of God.

If you are talking about Astrology it is forbidden by God, Deuteronomy 4:19; 18:9-12, Leviticus 19:31: 20:6; Isaiah 47:13-14 and so many other scriptures.

1Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

 

[for_his_glory]

It sounded like it was something you copied and pasted. Did you copy and paste it from your own writings then? Or did you just happen to write all that off the hand as you replied?

It's from the book I wrote on Revelation that you can find in the sub-forum clicking on Revelation.

 

[ezrider]

It's from the book I wrote on Revelation that you can find in the sub-forum clicking on Revelation.

Oh, okay. I was trying to have an actual conversation with YOU. Not with the words of your book, nor the words of the book. No wonder it is so confusing trying to figure out what your response has to do with the question I asked. Please stop quoting your own book without indicating you are doing so. I've been told my words can be rude and demeaning, but I find it just as rude and belittling that you are not actually replying to my questions as I try to probe your understanding, but rather you give me the words of your books, trying to instruct me in something I did not ask to be instructed on.

I do not believe you actually read my posts, and get to the heart of the question. You see a word or a phrase, then ask why, skip the rest, then presume to teach. That is not listening. That is not having a discussion.

 

[ezrider]

I am actually more interested in what you can tell me about Jezebel, who sought out and taught her knowledge of the depths of Satan. What is it you are teaching?

What do you mean, what am I teaching or did you not read my OP. This is all about the woman on the beast.

Concerning Jezebel

Yes, I have read your OP, and many many more comments beyond that. And as I will point out one more time. The Woman does not sit nor does she ride upon the beast. She sits upon the waters, She is carried away by the beast.

Concerning Jezebel, I asked what is it you teach? The church suffered that woman Jezebel, who put upon them the depths of the knowledge of Satan. There are numerous times in this thread where you have stated your interest is in the Lucifierian systems, as if you are going to expose them.

It is the spirit of man after the flesh who seeks the knowledge of evil, who seeks after the depths of Satan. It is the Spirit of God that seeks after the deep things of God, the hidden things of God.

You have stated that you have over 40 years of studying the doctrines and histories of man. But if all that labor produces a spirit of Jezebel that burdens the church with the depth of Satan rather than the deep things of God, then what has it profited you?

Stand now with thine enchantments, and with the multitude of thy sorceries,
wherein thou hast laboured from thy youth;
if so be thou shalt be able to profit, if so be thou mayest prevail.
Thou art wearied in the multitude of thy counsels.
Let now the astrologers, the stargazers, the monthly prognosticators,
stand up, and save thee from these things that shall come upon thee.


2 Thessalonians 2:11
And for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:

If Spirit of God were to send one someone strong delusion, so that they should believe a lie, do you think they would recognize the lie, or would they proclaim it as the truth?

 

[Quantrill]

Not sure what this has to do with the topic. Skeptics and many scientist do not believe in the virgin birth as they have no truth found in them as they seek logical things of a carnal mind and can not perceive the Spiritual things of God. Creation vs Evolution, Atheist for instance comes to mind as evolutionist do not believe in God or the virgin birth of Christ. There are over 4000 different religions in the world and not all of them are of God, nor do they even recognize Christ.

Buddhism, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism, The Church of Latter Day Saints, Bali' and many of the 4000 different religions in the world do not believe in God or the virgin birth. It's only those who are truly God's own that believe in the virgin birth of Christ by faith which comes by hearing the word of God.

If you are talking about Astrology it is forbidden by God, Deuteronomy 4:19; 18:9-12, Leviticus 19:31: 20:6; Isaiah 47:13-14 and so many other scriptures.

1Corinthians 2:14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.

It is relevant because the mystery religion, which involved the virgin mother/child worship, was in existence long before God revealed His Word to the Hebrews.

Therefore skeptics and unbelievers will use that to say the Jews just created some tribal faith that was like the others they encountered. Of which Christianity has it's origin.

But, it is the mystery religion that has tried to imitate and pervert God's plan of salvation. Long before God produced the 'Written Word', He produced the Zodiac which was the Gospel written in the starry heavens. Again see (Job 38:31-32). "Canst thou bring forth Mazzaroth in his season". Mazzaroth is the Zodiac. And the sign Virgo speaks to the Virgin woman.

This is why you find the virgin mother/child in ancient religions. Of course astrology is condemned in Scripture. But the ancient Zodiac was not astrology. It has been perverted by satan, as he does with everything God creates. To try and use the Zodiac to tell ones future is a perversion of it's purpose. It's purpose was God's plan of salvation.

I don't believe it is coincidence that the wise men from the east who came to see Christ at his birth were magi who studied the stars, and followed a star.

And this is why the Zodiac is mentioned in the book of (Job). Job lived in a time when there was no written revelation from God.

Of course today, we have the complete written Word of God, which goes far beyond what the Zodiac revealed. But it is good to know the truth of it.

A good book concerning this is "The Gospel in the Stars" by Joseph Seiss.

Quantrill

 

[for_his_glory]

It is relevant because the mystery religion, which involved the virgin mother/child worship, was in existence long before God revealed His Word to the Hebrews.

Therefore skeptics and unbelievers will use that to say the Jews just created some tribal faith that was like the others they encountered. Of which Christianity has it's origin.

But, it is the mystery religion that has tried to imitate and pervert God's plan of salvation. Long before God produced the 'Written Word', He produced the Zodiac which was the Gospel written in the starry heavens. Again see (Job 38:31-32). "Canst thou bring forth Mazzaroth in his season". Mazzaroth is the Zodiac. And the sign Virgo speaks to the Virgin woman.

This is why you find the virgin mother/child in ancient religions. Of course astrology is condemned in Scripture. But the ancient Zodiac was not astrology. It has been perverted by satan, as he does with everything God creates. To try and use the Zodiac to tell ones future is a perversion of it's purpose. It's purpose was God's plan of salvation.

I don't believe it is coincidence that the wise men from the east who came to see Christ at his birth were magi who studied the stars, and followed a star.

And this is why the Zodiac is mentioned in the book of (Job). Job lived in a time when there was no written revelation from God.

Of course today, we have the complete written Word of God, which goes far beyond what the Zodiac revealed. But it is good to know the truth of it.

A good book concerning this is "The Gospel in the Stars" by Joseph Seiss.

Quantrill

There is a difference between astrology/Zodiac, which is an abomination to the Lord, and astronomy, which deals with celestial objects, space, and the physical universe that God created and set forth in the heavens.

In Job 38:31-32 Mazzaroth deals with the celestial of God's glory in creation. God asks Job various questions in chapter 38 and in vs. 31-32 God is asking Job if he can change the pattern of the constellations that God has already set in place.

Man has taken the word mazzaroth and interpreted into the Zodiac signs as in astrology that deals with mediums and psychics naming various religious gods after some planets like Jupiter, Saturn, Mars, Venus and Mercury as they became their gods and goddesses throughout the four Empires with the last revived Roman Empire that still worships these gods.


Babylonian Empire gods - Shamash and Marduk

Medo-Persian gods - Angra Mainyu, Mithra, Vrthraghna

Grecian Empire - Zeus, Hera, Poseidon, Demeter, Athena, Ares, Aphrodite, Apollo, Artemis, Hephaestus, Hermes, Dionysus

Roman Empire gods - Sol, Ra, Jupiter, Juno, Minerva, Venus, Diana, Vulcan, Neptune, Apollo, Ceres, Mercury, Vesta, Janus, Saturn, Hercules, Fortuna, Victoria, Quirinus, Flora, Bellona, Terra, Liber, Silvanus

 

[for_his_glory]

You have stated that you have over 40 years of studying the doctrines and histories of man. But if all that labor produces a spirit of Jezebel that burdens the church with the depth of Satan rather than the deep things of God, then what has it profited you?

Are you saying I have a spirit of Jezebel in what I teach? Please tell me I am wrong thinking this.

I do not study the doctrines of man as there you will find many false teachings of a Jezebel spirit. We are to expose her false teachings.

Romans 16:17 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them. 18 For they that are such serve not our Lord Jesus Christ, but their own belly; and by good words and fair speeches deceive the hearts of the simple.

Ephesians 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

1 Timothy 5:20 Them that sin rebuke before all, that others also may fear.

Titus 1: 10 For there are many unruly and vain talkers and deceivers, specially they of the circumcision: 11 Whose mouths must be stopped, who subvert whole houses, teaching things which they ought not, for filthy lucre's sake. 12 One of themselves, even a prophet of their own, said, The Cretians are alway liars, evil beasts, slow bellies. 13 This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith; 14 Not giving heed to Jewish fables, and commandments of men, that turn from the truth. 15 Unto the pure all things are pure: but unto them that are defiled and unbelieving is nothing pure; but even their mind and conscience is defiled. 16 They profess that they know God; but in works they deny him, being abominable, and disobedient, and unto every good work reprobate.

Titus 3:9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. 10 A man that is an heretic after the first and second admonition reject; 11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.