Abomination that causes Desolation

[Douglas Summers]

e prophecy of the son of perdition in 2 Thessalonians 2:2-4 and the great falling away before the return of Jesus.

If the Lord was waiting for the "great" falling away, then He would be here already. For the "great falling away" is not in Scripture. For the "great" falling away as you call it Started in Rome and fits all the descriptions of (2 Thes. 2:4) Except for sitting in the Temple of God which would be in Jerusalem, but is coming close. You pointed out to me that there is no "Great" Tribulation in Scripture as I'am pointing out to you, there is no "Great" falling away in Scripture either. The World is filled with a visible church that is anything but Godly and full of the son's of Satan, Yet, Christ has not come. For what you call a "great" falling away is a miss translation of "Taken Away"

 

[markathome]

Then what is the Abomination that causes Desolation that would cause Christ to return?

Daniel 11-12
And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, (~70ad or 691ad)
and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, (to start the process of sitting up)
there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days (1290 days/years).

doesn't really say it will start instantly but "set up could years or longer"?

 

[for_his_glory]

If the Lord was waiting for the "great" falling away, then He would be here already. For the "great falling away" is not in Scripture. For the "great" falling away as you call it Started in Rome and fits all the descriptions of (2 Thes. 2:4) Except for sitting in the Temple of God which would be in Jerusalem, but is coming close. You pointed out to me that there is no "Great" Tribulation in Scripture as I'am pointing out to you, there is no "Great" falling away in Scripture either. The World is filled with a visible church that is anything but Godly and full of the son's of Satan, Yet, Christ has not come. For what you call a "great" falling away is a miss translation of "Taken Away"

It is you who put parentheses around great, not me. It's like all of those who put parentheses around "The Great Tribulation" that is nowhere found in scripture, but does say great tribulation that has never been seen before nor ever will be again, Matthew 24:21. I use the word great to emphasis how massive this falling away from God will be in the end of days as spoken of in 2Thessalonians 2:2,3 before the day of Christ that is at hand (no one knows the day or hour of His return). When the son of perdition takes his seat upon the throne on the very ground where once stood the Temple of God, Isaiah 14:12-15, the son of perdition being the false prophet will deceive many into falling away from the true God as he claims to be God by the lying signs and wonders he performs that could cause even the very elect to fall if possible, Matthew 24:24.

 

[JLB]

If the Lord was waiting for the "great" falling away, then He would be here already. For the "great falling away" is not in Scripture. For the "great" falling away as you call it Started in Rome and fits all the descriptions of (2 Thes. 2:4) Except for sitting in the Temple of God which would be in Jerusalem, but is coming close. You pointed out to me that there is no "Great" Tribulation in Scripture as I'am pointing out to you, there is no "Great" falling away in Scripture either. The World is filled with a visible church that is anything but Godly and full of the son's of Satan, Yet, Christ has not come. For what you call a "great" falling away is a miss translation of "Taken Away"

Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, 2 not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. 3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition... 2 Thessalonians 2:1-3

That Day, whereby the Lord gathers His people at the Ressurection/Rapture will not come... unless the falling away and man of sin is revealed, comes first.

The man of sin is revealed, who is instrumental in causing the falling away.


It's clear that the coming of the Lord to gather His people [Resurrection/Rapture] is te same coming that destroys the antichrist.

If the coming of the Lord to resurrect/rapture His people and destroy the antichrist occurs before the tribulation, then there would be no tribulation, because there would be no AOD, as the source of the AOD would have been destroyed.

Coming of the Lord = Destroy antichrist and Gather His people.


JLB

 

[markathome]

Playing around and taking Daniel's 1290/1305 days/years we get

Taking Dome of Rock & adding the 1290
691 + 1290 = 1981 (to start the process of sitting up the abomination that maketh desolate)
1981 A.D. / January, 21 : American Hostages Released, Iranian/Persia beast appears
http://www.fouman.com/Y/Get_Iranian_History_Today.php?year1=1981
a) 1981 and 30 = 2011 Blessed is he
(US troop withdrawal Iraq/It was marked by a wave of revolutions in the Arab World known as the Arab Spring )

Taking 70ad & adding the 1290/1305
70 + 1305 = 1375 or 70 + 1290 = 1360 (to start the process of sitting up the abomination that maketh desolate)
The Ottoman Empire: 1350 to 1918 ~ 568 years
a) 1918 WWI/End of WWI/flu pandemic: "Spanish 'flu" (influenza)/Allied Occupation of Constantinople/British military government of Palestine begins/ 7 Seals are starting to be opened?

Taking Dome of Rock & 1305 and 30 Blessed is he
691 + 1305 = 1996 + 30 = 2026

2026-7=2019 ~ 3 years from now

 

[for_his_glory]

Playing around and taking Daniel's 1290/1305 days/years we get

Taking Dome of Rock & adding the 1290
691 + 1290 = 1981 (to start the process of sitting up the abomination that maketh desolate)
1981 A.D. / January, 21 : American Hostages Released, Iranian/Persia beast appears
http://www.fouman.com/Y/Get_Iranian_History_Today.php?year1=1981
a) 1981 and 30 = 2011 Blessed is he
(US troop withdrawal Iraq/It was marked by a wave of revolutions in the Arab World known as the Arab Spring )

Taking 70ad & adding the 1290/1305
70 + 1305 = 1375 or 70 + 1290 = 1360 (to start the process of sitting up the abomination that maketh desolate)
The Ottoman Empire: 1350 to 1918 ~ 568 years
a) 1918 WWI/End of WWI/flu pandemic: "Spanish 'flu" (influenza)/Allied Occupation of Constantinople/British military government of Palestine begins/ 7 Seals are starting to be opened?

Taking Dome of Rock & 1305 and 30 Blessed is he
691 + 1305 = 1996 + 30 = 2026

2026-7=2019 ~ 3 years from now

Are you date setting? I do though think we might be approaching the sixth seal as the last 3 1/2 years will start with the seventh trumpet sounding.

God speaks to us in scripture of a seven year tribulation period with the first 3 1/2 being the beginning of sorrows starting with the first seal to the sixth seal and the last 3 1/2 starting with the seventh seal that calls fourth the seven trumpets with the seventh trumpet more devastating then the ones before it. Time, times and half time which equals 1260 days = 3 ½ years or 3 ½ Times – Hebrew calendar only had 30 days for each month and this is where you get 1260 days or 3 ½ years.

[Scripture reference]

Revelation 12:14; Daniel 7:25; Daniel 12:7

1260 days – Revelation 11:3; Revelation 12:6

42 months – Revelation 11:2; Revelation 13:5

 

[markathome]

I didn't put the numbers there, Daniel did. :nod

 

[for_his_glory]

I didn't put the numbers there, Daniel did. :nod

None of what you posted makes any sense as it looks like you are setting an actual date for this abomination that will cause desolation. For one thing it was 1260 days not 1290 and where did you get 1305 days from.

 

[Sinthesis]

In Matthew the Olivet discord it has a footnote.(let the reader understand)

We know it happened around 66AD.

Why did it include the footnote?

Is that a prophesy of both mid and distant future?

If it was to metaphorically happen today what would that look like?

Luk 21:20 ¶ And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.​

Yes, it happened during the first Roman Jewish war. Thank God those early Christians understood and fled Jerusalem when Rome withdrew from their first siege while preoccupied with who should be Emperor. That prophesy is fulfilled. It is not going to happen again.

 

[markathome]

Daniel 11:31

And arms shall stand on his part,
and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength,
and shall take away the daily sacrifice,
and they shall place
the abomination that maketh desolate

arm/forces (political and military)/shoulder (of animal s... ~zrowa`
abide (behind), appoint, ar... ~`amad to profane, defile, pollute, desecrate ~chalal
chapel, hallowed part, holy place, sanctuary (whether of ...~miqdash rock/fortress ~ma`owz
be(-head), bring, call back... ~cuwr alway(-s), continual (emplo... ~tamiyd
add, apply, appoint, ascrib... ~nathan idolatrous abomination ~shiqquwts
to be desolate, be appalled, stun, stupefy ~shamem
.
arm/forces abide to profane;
chapel rock/fortress
bring always add
idolatrous abominationto be desolate

sounds like it's happened and it is still being added daily

 

[Sinthesis]

Daniel 11:31 has already been fulfilled by Antiochus IV Epiphanes. There will be no future fulfillment of it.

 

[for_his_glory]

Luk 21:20 ¶ And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.​

Yes, it happened during the first Roman Jewish war. Thank God those early Christians understood and fled Jerusalem when Rome withdrew from their first siege while preoccupied with who should be Emperor. That prophesy is fulfilled. It is not going to happen again.

What makes you think the prophecy has been fulfilled when Jerusalem has been destroyed twice, besieged 23 times, attacked 52 times, and captured and recaptured 44 times and the abomination of desolation that Daniel spoke of in Daniel Chapter 7, 9, 11, Isaiah spoke of in Isaiah 14:12-14 and John wrote of during his vision of still future events in Rev Chapter 13 that have not been fulfilled yet.

 

[Sinthesis]

What makes you think the prophecy has been fulfilled

Biblical and historical context. I understand evidence differently than you, in a way that fulfills similar patterns all through the bible. Then there is the underlying belief that Jesus' work actually changes the world for the better such that we no longer dread the future.

 

[for_his_glory]

Biblical and historical context. I understand evidence differently than you, in a way that fulfills similar patterns all through the bible. Then there is the underlying belief that Jesus' work actually changes the world for the better such that we no longer dread the future.

The finished works of Christ on the cross will never change a wicked world that waxes even more with evil men and seducers, 2Timothy 3:13. The finished works of Christ on the cross is for those who will believe and trust in Him through faith. We are no longer of this world as we are now risen with Christ and seek those things from above where Christ sits at the right hand of God as our life is hid with Christ in God, Colossians Chapter 3. We will always face persecutions, even to death, here on this present earth, but yet are told not to fear what men can do to us as they can kill the body, but never the soul, but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell, Matthew 10:28.

 

[markathome]

Daniel 12:11
1190 + 70 = 1260
1260 leads to Joachim

• The advent of the Age of the Holy Spirit predicted by Joachim of Fiore, according to his interpretation of the Book of Revelation, chapter 6.

which leads to the
Cult of the Holy_Spirit
so what is that?

 

[for_his_glory]

Daniel 12:11
1190 + 70 = 1260
1260 leads to Joachim
which leads to the
Cult of the Holy_Spirit
so what is that?

The 1260 years has nothing to do with Joachim and the cult of the Holy Spirit that was inspired by Christian millenarian mystics.

Time, times and half time which equals 1260 days = 3 ½ years or 3 ½ Times – Hebrew calendar only had 30 days for each month and this is where you get 1260 days or 3 ½ years.

The first half of the seven year end time tribulation that is Gods final wrath on those who refuse to repent starts with 3 1/2 years which consist of the first six seals being the beginning of sorrows in Revelations and the last 3 1/2 years being the beginning of the first trumpet judgment to the end of all things that the seventh trumpet judgment brings, including the abomination that causes desolation ending with the seven vial judgments inflicted on those who refuse to repent. Then will Satan be cast into the lake of fire and the new Jerusalem ushered down once this present earth and heaven have been purified from all sin.

 

[markathome]

Blaspheme against the Holy Ghost is an Abomination!

Daniel 12:11
after, (al-)ways, × certain, + continually, + eve... ~`eth
alway(-s), continual (employment, -ly), daily, (n-)e... ~tamiyd
be(-head), bring, call back, decline, depart, eschew... ~cuwr
idolatrous abomination ~shiqquwts
to be desolate, be appalled, stun, stupefy ~shamem
add, apply, appoint, ascribe, assign, × avenge, × ... ~nathan
1000 ~'eleph
100/sixscore ~me'ah
ninety ~tish`iym
day/time/year ~yowm

1000 100 90 = 1190, dont ask me why it was changed to
Daniel 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. 1290

 

[for_his_glory]

Blaspheme against the Holy Ghost is an Abomination!

Daniel 12:11
after, (al-)ways, × certain, + continually, + eve... ~`eth
alway(-s), continual (employment, -ly), daily, (n-)e... ~tamiyd
be(-head), bring, call back, decline, depart, eschew... ~cuwr
idolatrous abomination ~shiqquwts
to be desolate, be appalled, stun, stupefy ~shamem
add, apply, appoint, ascribe, assign, × avenge, × ... ~nathan
1000 ~'eleph
100/sixscore ~me'ah
ninety ~tish`iym
day/time/year ~yowm

1000 100 90 = 1190, dont ask me why it was changed to
Daniel 12:11 And from the time that the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be a thousand two hundred and ninety days. 1290

I have no idea what you are talking about with all these confusing definitions and what does 1190 have to do with 1260? Can you lay it all out in plain English?

 

[Sinthesis]

The finished works of Christ on the cross will never change a wicked world that waxes even more with evil men and seducers, 2Timothy 3:13. The finished works of Christ on the cross is for those who will believe and trust in Him through faith. We are no longer of this world as we are now risen with Christ and seek those things from above where Christ sits at the right hand of God as our life is hid with Christ in God, Colossians Chapter 3. We will always face persecutions, even to death, here on this present earth, but yet are told not to fear what men can do to us as they can kill the body, but never the soul, but rather fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell, Matthew 10:28.

One of the greatest obstacles to understanding scripture is the assumption that there is only one definition of 'world'.

 

[JLB]

One of the greatest obstacles to understanding scripture is the assumption that there is only one definition of 'world'.

For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life.
John 3:16

What do you teach your family about the word "world" here in this verse?

Does "world" represent saved or unsaved people, here in this verse?


JLB