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Gospel Preached to all the World?

parousia70

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Was the Gospel Preached to all the world, to all nations, to every creature under heaven, way back in the 1st century?

Scripture tells us it indeed was:

Colossians 1:5-6 (NKJV) because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel, 6 which has come to you, as it has also in all the world, and is bringing forth fruit, as it is also among you since the day you heard and knew the grace of God in truth;

Colossians 1:23 (NKJV) if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Romans 1:8 (NKJV) First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.

Romans 16:25-26 (NKJV) Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began 26 but now has been made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures has been made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith;

If we are to Believe St Paul, writing under he inspiration of the holy Spirit, we must assert that the Gospel was preached to all the world by the late 60's AD
 
parousia70 said:
Was the Gospel Preached to all the world, to all nations, to every creature under heaven, way back in the 1st century?

Scripture tells us it indeed was:

Colossians 1:5-6 (NKJV) because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel, 6 which has come to you, as it has also in all the world, and is bringing forth fruit, as it is also among you since the day you heard and knew the grace of God in truth;

Colossians 1:23 (NKJV) if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Romans 1:8 (NKJV) First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.

Romans 16:25-26 (NKJV) Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began 26 but now has been made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures has been made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith;

If we are to Believe St Paul, writing under he inspiration of the holy Spirit, we must assert that the Gospel was preached to all the world by the late 60's AD

So then, has the Great Commission been fulfilled? Do we no longer have any responsibility toward it?
 
Hey wait a minute~ parousia...

What about the world today and not just in the days of the apostles... don't you and I count as part of the world that the gospel is still being preached to? How else did we recieve our salvation, you and I? Was the gospel not faithfully preached to you brother ~ in this world ~ in this time? :yes

How else can anyone recieve their salvation unless the gospel is preached... in every generation of the world?

Isn't it true that the scriptures you quoted are the very ones which exhort us today to preach the gospel? The apostles had done their job (and the will of God) in thier time in the world...

Now it is our turn... can we say that the gospel has been preached to all the world in our day? :shrug

bonnie
 
parousia70 said:
Was the Gospel Preached to all the world, to all nations, to every creature under heaven, way back in the 1st century?

Scripture tells us it indeed was:

Colossians 1:5-6 (NKJV) because of the hope which is laid up for you in heaven, of which you heard before in the word of the truth of the gospel, 6 which has come to you, as it has also in all the world, and is bringing forth fruit, as it is also among you since the day you heard and knew the grace of God in truth;

Colossians 1:23 (NKJV) if indeed you continue in the faith, grounded and steadfast, and are not moved away from the hope of the gospel which you heard, which was preached to every creature under heaven, of which I, Paul, became a minister.

Romans 1:8 (NKJV) First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world.

Romans 16:25-26 (NKJV) Now to Him who is able to establish you according to my gospel and the preaching of Jesus Christ, according to the revelation of the mystery kept secret since the world began 26 but now has been made manifest, and by the prophetic Scriptures has been made known to all nations, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith;

If we are to Believe St Paul, writing under he inspiration of the holy Spirit, we must assert that the Gospel was preached to all the world by the late 60's AD




Ezekiel 29:21 In that day will I cause the horn of the house of Israel to bud forth, and I will give thee the opening of the mouth in the midst of them; and they shall know that I am the LORD."


"In that day" is when the king of Babylon, (historically king Nebuchadrezzar but in the future sense it is Satan himself), will arrive for his great tribulation, his hour of temptation. DECEPTION, DECEPTION, DECEPTION, for he will be pretending to be Christ just as his followers now pretend to be Christian. Perhaps they even believe they are Christians. They are the "many antichrists/antichristians" running around spreading lies. Will we believe them/him? God tells us many will. As...they are now.

However, "in that day," when folks are falling all over themselves to worship the fake because they aren't being taught that the fake comes first.....God will "cause the horn of the house of Israel to bud forth." When does this "budding" first begin? While we are in the wilderness and that is, I believe, NOW. The witnesses are teaching God's children as the Holy Spirit speaks through them.

Biblically, "horn" is symbolic of power. The power of the house of Israel (CHRISTIANS!) will "bud forth." The horn/power is....God's very elect, His "man child" of end times.....the two witnesses, of whom there are many. Notice the rod of power isn't fully developed but they/we are "budding." We are getting stronger as His Spirit is teaching us, opening new revelations, preparing us for that day. Already we witness for Him as the time draws nearer but soon......


Mark 13:9-13 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not yet that speak, but the Holy Ghost. Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.


The gospel must first be "published," or...


#2784 to herald (as a public crier), espec. divine truth (the gospel), - preacher (-er), proclaim, publish.


The definition of "gospel" is the good news. Here it is the "divine truth." That is an interesting distinction. The good news has been spread around the world but the...divine truth is, I believe, the latter rain that has yet to be proclaimed. That deeper knowledge is what "must first be published," and that happens when the Holy Spirit speaks through the witnesses of end times.


Joel 2:23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the LORD your God: for He hath given you the former rain moderately, and He will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month.

2:28-29 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out My spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out My spirit.
 
sheshisown said:
Hey wait a minute~ parousia...

What about the world today and not just in the days of the apostles...

What about it?

don't you and I count as part of the world that the gospel is still being preached to? How else did we recieve our salvation, you and I? Was the gospel not faithfully preached to you brother ~ in this world ~ in this time? :yes

Yeppers

How else can anyone recieve their salvation unless the gospel is preached... in every generation of the world?

They Can't. The Gospel is everlasting. It can never cease in it's function of calling sinners to salvation.

Isn't it true that the scriptures you quoted are the very ones which exhort us today to preach the gospel?

you'll get no argument from me there.

The apostles had done their job (and the will of God) in thier time in the world...

BINGO!

Now it is our turn... can we say that the gospel has been preached to all the world in our day? :shrug
Nope, but we can say the Apostles fulfilled Matt 24:14 in their day.
24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.(NKJ)
 
lou11 said:
So then, has the Great Commission been fulfilled? Do we no longer have any responsibility toward it?

You mean Matt 28:16-19?:

Matt 28:16 Then the eleven disciples went away into Galilee, to the mountain which Jesus had appointed for them. 17 When they saw Him, they worshiped Him; but some doubted.
18 And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. 19 Go therefore[a] and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit,

All biblical expectations of the ever-expanding dominion of God's kingdom and righteousness on earth are carried out by, in, and through Christ and His Church (Isaiah 9:6-7; Daniel 7:27; Lk 1:33; Eph 3:9-11,21; Heb 12:27-28; Matt 21:43; Titus 2:14; Rev 5:9-10; Rev 2:26; Matt 25:21). The Church is the very Body of Christ, the "fullness of Him that fills all in all" (Eph 1:22-23). As St Paul wrote, "Unto him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus throughout all generations, forever and ever" (Eph 3:21). God's people must exercise dominion and teach covenantal law. The Church, ruling and reigning with Christ, must continue to bring all created things into accordance with God's law, be it individuals, families, states, governments, or any other aspect of creation. All power in heaven and earth belongs to Christ and his people (Matt 28:18-19; Matt 16:18-19).

Affirming the Biblical account of the 1st century fulfillment of Matt 24:14 in no way negates any of that.
 
whirlwind said:
Already we witness for Him as the time draws nearer but soon......

so, by "nearer but soon" you are telling us it will be 2000 more years from today?

Mark 13:9-13 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not yet that speak, but the Holy Ghost. Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

All of that happened to the very apostles Jesus was speaking to.

2:28-29 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out My spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out My spirit.[/b]

And St Peter infallibly claims the fulfillment of the above took place right before his very eyes in Acts 2.

Not sure what you are getting at with this WW, or how it supports or rebuts Paul's claim that the gospel was preached to all nations, every creature and the whole world by the late 60's AD.

I'm confident you will elaborate though.
 
parousia70 said:
whirlwind said:
Already we witness for Him as the time draws nearer but soon......

so, by "nearer but soon" you are telling us it will be 2000 more years from today?


No. That is not what I'm saying and I believe you fully understand that.


[quote:3np5r3yn]Mark 13:9-13 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not yet that speak, but the Holy Ghost. Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

All of that happened to the very apostles Jesus was speaking to.[/quote:3np5r3yn]


Did it? We'll see what the future holds.

[quote:3np5r3yn]
2:28-29 And it shall come to pass afterward, that I will pour out My spirit upon all flesh; and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, your old men shall dream dreams, your young men shall see visions: And also upon the servants and upon the handmaids in those days will I pour out My spirit.[/b]

And St Peter infallibly claims the fulfillment of the above took place right before his very eyes in Acts 2.

Not sure what you are getting at with this WW, or how it supports or rebuts Paul's claim that the gospel was preached to all nations, every creature and the whole world by the late 60's AD.

I'm confident you will elaborate though.[/quote:3np5r3yn]


You are mistaken. Not only on how you understand Scripture but on your confidence that there will be any further elaboration from me. Sorry to have wasted your time.
 
whirlwind said:
parousia70 said:
whirlwind said:
Already we witness for Him as the time draws nearer but soon......

so, by "nearer but soon" you are telling us it will be 2000 more years from today?


whirlwind said:
No. That is not what I'm saying and I believe you fully understand that.

If we could only hear Jesus and His inspired writers who said "soon" and "near," they might object as vehemently as you did, Whirlwind, when people say they really meant later and far.

I can hear them now--"No. That is not what I'm saying and I believe you fully understand that!"

If you mean soon and near, why didn't the NT writers mean the same thing! Shouldn't they demand to be understood in the same way YOU seek to be understood? I wish futurists would stop using time words--they're so confusing! :crazy

Matthew 24:34
 
:wave

If ...
... we can say the Apostles fulfilled Matt 24:14 in their day.
24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.(NKJ)

How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace, Who bring glad tidings of good things!â€Â


Paul correctly observes that it all goes back to the preaching of the gospel... and preachers must be sent ~ both by God and the Christian community. When we think about it, God could have chosen any means for the message of salvation to come, such as angelic messengers or directly working ~without a human preacher. BUT He did not~ he chose one dominant way of bringing people to Jesus Christ~ through the preaching of the gospel. :yes

The feet speak of activity, motion, and progress, and those who are active and moving in the work of preaching the gospel have beautiful feet!

Parousia, you have solid knowledge of the word... don't tell me that you have never witnessed to an unsaved person and told them how they may be saved who asked you for the reason you are hoping? :thumb

Then why would Paul through the scripture continue to exhort the Christians in Rome, AFTER Matthews gospel was written to preach the gospel? What about all the epistles... and the book of Revelation? Many many times the church is commanded to preach the gospel~ It is the great commission spoken of in Matthew 28?

And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Amen. Matthew 28:18-20 :thumb

Jesus' command commissioning them and us today, is given because of His authority. This indicates that this is an authoritative command, not a suggestion. . . It is the same idea as if an officer reminded a private of his rank before he gave the order.
Because Jesus has this authority, we are therefore commanded to go. It is His authority that sends us, His authority that guides us, and His authority that empowers us.
The command is to make disciples, not merely converts or supporters of a cause. The idea behind the word disciple is of a learner, or a student.

Of all the nations... In His previous ministry, Jesus deliberately restricted His work to the Jewish people (Matthew 15:24) and previously sent His disciples with the same restriction (Matthew 10:6).

Only on rare exceptions did Jesus minister among the Gentiles (Matthew 15:21-28).

Now all of that is in the past, and the disciples are commissioned to take the gospel to all the nations. There is no place on earth where the gospel of Jesus should not be preached, and were disciples should not be made.

All the world still includes us, we are part of that world that needed top hear the gospel, so the preaching MUST go on jsut as Jesus commanded it to be preached to all the world. :salute

How else can anyone recieve their salvation unless the gospel is preached... in every generation of the world?

They Can't. The Gospel is everlasting. It can never cease in it's function of calling sinners to salvation.

In Matthew 23:13 the word gospel means the following:

gospel = euaggelion in Greek; From Vine's expository dictionary...

Gospel (Noun and Verb: to Preach):

originally denoted a reward for good tidings; later, the idea of reward dropped, and the word stood for "the good news" itself. The Eng. word "gospel," i.e. "good message," is the equivalent of euangelion (Eng., "evangel"). In the NT it denotes the "good tidings" of the Kingdom of God and of salvation through Christ, to be received by faith, on the basis of His expiatory death, His burial, resurrection, and ascension, e.g., Act 15:7; 20:24; 1Pe 4:17. Apart from those references and those in the Gospels of Matthew and Mark, and Rev 14:6, the noun is confined to Paul's Epistles. The Apostle uses it of two associated yet distinct things,
(a) of the basic facts of the death, burial and resurrection of Christ, e.g., 1Cr 15:1-3;

(b) of the interpretation of these facts, e.g., Rom 2:16; Gal 1:7, 11; 2:2; in (a) the "Gospel" is viewed historically, in (b) doctrinally, with reference to the interpretation of the facts, as is sometimes indicated by the context.

The following expressions are used in connection with the "Gospel:"

(1) kerusso, "to preach it as a herald," e.g., Mat 4:23; Gal 2:2

(2) laleo, "to speak," 1Th 2:2

(3) diamarturomai, "to testify (thoroughly)," Act 20:24;

(4) euangelizo, "to preach," e.g., 1Cr 15:1; 2Cr 11:7; Gal 1:11 (see B, No. 1 below);

(5) katangello, "to proclaim," 1Cr 9:14

(6) pleroo, "to preach fully," Rom 15:19

Nothing in the bible that I have ever seen or read says otherwise... we are commanded to preach it, to be heralds of the good news to testify of its saving power, to proclaim liberty to the captives as our lord Jesus Christ did. May we preach his gospel fully! For when we do we are promised a reward. :D Why else would any person AFTER they are redeemed be left here on earth? For what other purpose do we remain and suffer, filling up the sufferings of Christ? How else may we glorify God? :nod

Do you REALLY think that the last 2000 years the church has mis-interpreted the scriptures? That godly men greater than you or I in Christ mis-understood what you now know? :nono that they have been preaching the gospel in pulpits for centuries in error? And women and men and children have lost their lives for the sake of the preaching of the gospel in vain? No~ certainly you cannot think that.

I pray not. bonnie
 
whirlwind said:
parousia70 said:
whirlwind said:
Already we witness for Him as the time draws nearer but soon......

so, by "nearer but soon" you are telling us it will be 2000 more years from today?


No. That is not what I'm saying and I believe you fully understand that.

Matt 24 is right, How could I possibly understand that when you yourself claim the apostolic usage of the terms "near and soon" actually mean "far and long", even 2000 years and counting?

Why should I understand YOUR usage of those terms IN POLAR OPPOSITE FASHION to the way you say I should understand the apostles use of those exact terms?
 
sheshisown said:
:wave

If ...
... we can say the Apostles fulfilled Matt 24:14 in their day.
24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.(NKJ)

How then shall they call on Him in whom they have not believed? And how shall they believe in Him of whom they have not heard? And how shall they hear without a preacher? And how shall they preach unless they are sent? As it is written: “How beautiful are the feet of those who preach the gospel of peace, Who bring glad tidings of good things!â€Â


Paul correctly observes that it all goes back to the preaching of the gospel... and preachers must be sent ~ both by God and the Christian community. When we think about it, God could have chosen any means for the message of salvation to come, such as angelic messengers or directly working ~without a human preacher. BUT He did not~ he chose one dominant way of bringing people to Jesus Christ~ through the preaching of the gospel. :yes

The feet speak of activity, motion, and progress, and those who are active and moving in the work of preaching the gospel have beautiful feet!

Parousia, you have solid knowledge of the word... don't tell me that you have never witnessed to an unsaved person and told them how they may be saved who asked you for the reason you are hoping? :thumb

Then why would Paul through the scripture continue to exhort the Christians in Rome, AFTER Matthews gospel was written to preach the gospel? What about all the epistles... and the book of Revelation? Many many times the church is commanded to preach the gospel~ It is the great commission spoken of in Matthew 28?

And Jesus came and spoke to them, saying, "All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, teaching them to observe all things that I have commanded you; and lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the age." Amen. Matthew 28:18-20 :thumb

Again Bonnie, the Gospel, is EVERLASTING. It will NEVER cease performing it's SOLE FUNCTION of calling sinners to salvation. EVER.

Jesus' command commissioning them and us today, is given because of His authority.

What authority is that Bonnie?
I though you futurist types claim Satan is the authority figure, Indeed RULER of earth today.

The following expressions are used in connection with the "Gospel:"

(1) kerusso, "to preach it as a herald," e.g., Mat 4:23; Gal 2:2
Yes, In Matthew 24:14, the Greek word for preached is kerusso, it is in the future tense. But in Colossians 1:23 the same word kerusso is in the aorist tense (past). Jesus said that it is to be preached and Paul says in AD 62, that it has been preached to every creature.

Why do you think Paul would have said such a thing?

Nothing in the bible that I have ever seen or read says otherwise... we are commanded to preach it, to be heralds of the good news to testify of its saving power, to proclaim liberty to the captives as our lord Jesus Christ did. May we preach his gospel fully! For when we do we are promised a reward. :D Why else would any person AFTER they are redeemed be left here on earth? For what other purpose do we remain and suffer, filling up the sufferings of Christ? How else may we glorify God? :nod
Again, I'm not sure where you are finding I am in disagreement with you on this point??

Do you REALLY think that the last 2000 years the church has mis-interpreted the scriptures? That godly men greater than you or I in Christ mis-understood what you now know? :nono

Godly men have been proclaiming what I know for 2000 years.... my view is nothing new to Christendom.

And women and men and children have lost their lives for the sake of the preaching of the gospel in vain? No~ certainly you cannot think that.

Of course I don't, and I am still unclear what it is I said that led you to believe I think that?
 
whirlwind said:
parousia70 said:
Mark 13:9-13 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not yet that speak, but the Holy Ghost. Now the brother shall betray the brother to death, and the father the son; and children shall rise up against their parents, and shall cause them to be put to death. And ye shall be hated of all men for My name's sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.

All of that happened to the very apostles Jesus was speaking to.


Did it?

Yes Indeed, All this was remarkably fulfilled in the lives of the disciples. Peter and John were imprisoned:

Acts 4:3 (NKJV) And they laid hands on them, and put them in custody until the next day, for it was already evening.

Paul and Silas were beaten and imprisoned:

Acts 16:23-24 (NKJV) And when they had laid many stripes on them, they threw them into prison, commanding the jailer to keep them securely. 24 Having received such a charge, he put them into the inner prison and fastened their feet in the stocks.

Paul was brought before Gallio (Acts 28:12), Felix (Acts 24:24), and Agrippa (Acts 25:23). Stephen was stoned to death (Acts 7:59): James was killed by Herod (Acts 12:2). As soon as Paul began preaching, he began to experience persecution:

Acts 9:23-24 (NKJV) Now after many days were past, the Jews plotted to kill him. 24 But their plot became known to Saul. And they watched the gates day and night, to kill him.

Acts 9:29 (NKJV) And he spoke boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus and disputed against the Hellenists, but they attempted to kill him.

Paul was beaten five times by the Jews:

2 Corinthians 11:24 (NKJV) From the Jews five times I received forty stripes minus one.

Jesus said the disciples would be afflicted, beaten, imprisoned; they would be hated for his name's sake and some would be killed; they would be brought before councils, rulers, and kings, for a testimony; they would be given a mouth of wisdom which their adversaries could not dispute. The disciples experienced all of this before the fall of Jerusalem in AD 70, just as the Lord said they would. It was unmistakably fulfilled in every detail!
 
Parousia~

I obviously have misunderstood your view, perhaps you will kindly inform me. This is the FIRST time I have heard of the Preterist view other than from Vic, whose view is only partial Preterist as I understand it. Would you especially detail (what you mean) when you say that the gospel "was" preached... and if I understand you correctly after 62AD the verse Col 1:23, is no longer preached?

How is something completed (no longer preached) yet must go on everlastingly? Why would the gospel be preached after the new heavens and the new earth? Who will be born who has never heard it? Why would God have the gospel preached when their is no more need of faith since God will dwell among mankind? That just makes no sense to me ~ so I must mis-understand it. :shrug

Give me a Preterist 101 course in short, if you will. And I will inform you of my basic beliefs... so we can better understand where we each stand. :nod

Thanks~ bonnie
 
Yes, the gospel was preached in the known world before the end of the age like Jesus said.

Mat 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.

The Greek word Jesus used for "world" is different than the one normally used. It was the known world.

World
G3625
οἰκοÃ…μένη
oikoumenē
oy-kou-men'-ay
Feminine participle present passive of G3611 (as noun, by implication of G1093); land, that is, the (terrene part of the) globe; specifically the Roman empire: - earth, world.

That word was used here also
Luk 2:1 And it came to pass in those days, that there went out a decree from Caesar Augustus, that all the world should be taxed.

The other word for world was Kosmos, as in the whole world.

G2889
κÃŒÃμοÂ
kosmos
kos'-mos
Probably from the base of G2865; orderly arrangement, that is, decoration; by implication the world (in a wide or narrow sense, including its inhabitants, literally or figuratively [morally]): - adorning, world.

And that word was used like..

Mat 13:35 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophet, saying, I will open my mouth in parables; I will utter things which have been kept secret from the foundation of the world.

The preaching to the world was just a sign for the disciples to know when the temple would be destroyed and the end of the age anyway. They asked for the signs, and, Jesus told them what they would be.
 
Originally posted by researcher

The Greek word Jesus used for "world" is different than the one normally used. It was the known world.

World
G3625
οἰκοÃ…μένη
oikoumenē
oy-kou-men'-ay
Feminine participle present passive of G3611 (as noun, by implication of G1093); land, that is, the (terrene part of the) globe; specifically the Roman empire: - earth, world.


OK, let's try it.

Luke 4:5 Then the devil, taking Him up on a high mountain, showed Him all the kingdoms of the world [oikoumenes] in a moment of time.

So let's give this a shot:

Luke 4:5 Then the devil, taking Him up on a high mountain, showed Him all the kingdoms of the Roman Empire in a moment of time.

The kingdom(s) (plural) of the Roman Empire? Nah; don't think so. Actually, in this verse oikoumenes is translated as "the inhabited earth" and/or "the habitable world".


Let's try it again. Need to post verses 1-6 for the full context:

Hebrews 1:1-6 God, who at various times and in various ways spoke in time past to the fathers by the prophets, has in these last days spoken to us by His Son, whom He has appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds; who being the brightness of His glory and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, having become so much better than the angels, as He has by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they. For to which of the angels did He ever say, "You are My Son, Today I have begotten You"? And again: "I will be to Him a Father, And He shall be to Me a Son"? But when He again brings the firstborn into the world [oikoumenen] , He says: "Let all the angels of God worship Him."

And the last line again:

"But when He again brings the firstborn into the Roman Empire, He says: 'Let all the angels of God worship Him.' "

Sorry; won't cut it. Again in this verse oikoumenes is translated as "the inhabited earth" and/or "the habitable world".


And again:

Romans 10:18 But I say, have they not heard? Yes indeed: "Their sound has gone out to all the earth [gen], And their words to the ends of the world [oikoumenes]."

In this verse, Paul used the words earth and world interchangeably, so the two obviously had the same intended meaning. So............

Romans 10:18 "But I say, have they not heard? Yes indeed: 'Their sound has gone out to all the Roman Empire, And their words to the ends of the Roman Empire.' "

Yeah... sure. Also, the above verse was actually a quotation from Psalms 19:4, so world must mean the same thing in Romans 10:18 above:

Psalms 19:1-4 "The heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament shows His handiwork. Day unto day utters speech, and night unto night reveals knowledge. There is no speech nor language where their voice is not heard. Their line has gone out through all the earth, and their words to the end of the world."

Here in Psalms 19:1-4, this was speaking of the glory of God that had been declared by his handiwork in the heavens (i.e. stars - planets etc.). It certainly didn't mean that this "glory of God" had been declared only in a "limited area" or only within the land of "the Roman Empire".

No, don’t let anyone tell you oikoumenes must refer to the Roman Empire. Just an old full-preterist trick.
 
OK Osgiliath. Let's look at the Bible.

Titus 2:11 For the saving grace of God was manifested to All men,

Rom 16:26 made known to All nations for the obedience of faith:

Rom 1:8 First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the Whole world.

1Ti 3:16...God was manifested in flesh, declared righteous in spirit, seen by messengers, preached among nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory!

1Th 1:8 For from you hath sounded forth the word of the Lord, not only in Macedonia and Achaia, but in Every place your faith to God-ward is gone forth; so that we need not to speak anything.

Col 1:23 if so be that ye continue in the faith, grounded and stedfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel which ye heard, which was preached in all creation under heaven; whereof I Paul was made a minister.


The Apostles said that the gospel was made known to All nations, and all men.

Did they reach South America, Australia, or Japan? Or only the part of the world that they knew existed?

There is no trick here, only belief in what the Bible says.

Jesus said the gospel would be preached to the known world before the end of the age and the destruction of the temple. Was it? The scripture says it was.

And I'm not a full-preterist. Partial.
 
Originally posted by researcher
Jesus said the gospel would be preached to the known world before the end of the age and the destruction of the temple. Was it? The scripture says it was.

And I'm not a full-preterist. Partial.

So as a "partial" preterist, what "AGE" was that?
 
If we could only hear Jesus and His inspired writers who said "soon" and "near," they might object as vehemently as you did, Whirlwind, when people say they really meant later and far.

I can hear them now--"No. That is not what I'm saying and I believe you fully understand that!"

If you mean soon and near, why didn't the NT writers mean the same thing! Shouldn't they demand to be understood in the same way YOU seek to be understood? I wish futurists would stop using time words--they're so confusing!

Matthew 24:34


They are not at all confusing. You are seeing them from your point of view which is....it has all already happened. Which to me, in the light of Scriptures...is very confusing indeed. As far as the "gospel being published," I will again write....


The gospel must first be "published," or...

Published #2784 to herald (as a public crier), espec. divine truth (the gospel), - preacher (-er), proclaim, publish.


The definition of "gospel" is the good news. Here, to publish the gospel is to proclaim the "divine truth." That is an interesting distinction. The good news has been spread around the world but the...divine truth is, I believe, the latter rain that has yet to be proclaimed. That deeper knowledge is what "must first be published," and that happens when the Holy Spirit speaks through the witnesses of end times.

When does that happen?

Revelation 11:3 And I will give power unto My two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth."

Mark 13:9-11-13 But take heed to yourselves: for they shall deliver you up to councils; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten: and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for My sake, for a testimony against them. And the gospel must first be published among all nations. But when they shall lead you, and deliver you up, take no thought beforehand what ye shall speak, neither do ye premeditate: but whatsoever shall be given you in that hour, that speak ye: for it is not ye that speak, but the Holy Ghost.

I again ask...when does that happen? It could be now. We could be at the end of this period or at the beginning...we are not to know the day or the hour. The Holy Spirit is opening revelations, or the deeper truths, to many and they are spreading that truth. Think of the synagogues, councils, rulers etc. as our churches, Christian forums...wherever His Word is taught. Many times when those deeper truths are taught the witness is brow-beaten, cast out, ridiculed, scorned by the religious folks.
 
researcher said:
OK Osgiliath. Let's look at the Bible.

Titus 2:11 For the saving grace of God was manifested to All men,

Hi Jeff, :-)

Jesus, the saving grace, was manifested for all time, for all men.



Rom 16:26 made known to All nations for the obedience of faith:

16:26 But now is made manifest, and by the scriptures of the prophets, according to the commandment of the everlasting God, made known to all nations for the obedience of faith.

By the scriptures He is made known, manifested, to all nations.



Rom 1:8 First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the Whole world.

And, it is. The scriptures manifest Him throughout the whole world.

1Ti 3:16...God was manifested in flesh, declared righteous in spirit, seen by messengers, preached among nations, believed on in the world, taken up in glory!

Yes He was.

1Th 1:8 For from you hath sounded forth the word of the Lord, not only in Macedonia and Achaia, but in Every place your faith to God-ward is gone forth; so that we need not to speak anything.

And, it "sounded forth" from us too. This is a continuing process as people continue to be born.

Col 1:23 if so be that ye continue in the faith, grounded and stedfast, and not moved away from the hope of the gospel which ye heard, which was preached in all creation under heaven; whereof I Paul was made a minister.

Jeff.....did they preach it to you? If not then the verse meant to those under heaven at that time or it means the scriptures and the Holy Spirit which teach us now.


The Apostles said that the gospel was made known to All nations, and all men.

Did they reach South America, Australia, or Japan? Or only the part of the world that they knew existed?

There is no trick here, only belief in what the Bible says.

Jesus said the gospel would be preached to the known world before the end of the age and the destruction of the temple. Was it? The scripture says it was.

And I'm not a full-preterist. Partial.

The divine truth will be published before this age ends...it is now being published. The temple will never be destroyed for....Know ye not that ye are the Temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? [1 Corinthians 3:16] Jesus didn't say the temple would be destroyed but that the "great buildings" would be thrown down AND that "there shall not be left one stone upon another." [Mark 13:2]....stones still stand.
 
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