Who is that directed at?
Why would you even say that about another Christian?
How do you know their heart?
In your eyes, if a Christian is not baptized they are not truly regenerated.
That is not what the Bible teaches about Salvation.
Christian Forums
This is a sample guest message. Register a free account today to become a member! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!
-
Are you taking the time to pray? Christ is the answer in times of need
https://christianforums.net/threads/psalm-70-1-save-me-o-god-lord-help-me-now.108509/
-
Depending upon the Holy Spirit for all you do?
Read through the following study by Tenchi for more on this topic
https://christianforums.net/threads/without-the-holy-spirit-we-can-do-nothing.109419/
-
-
-
How are famous preachers sometimes effected by sin?
Join Sola Scriptura for a discussion on the subject
https://christianforums.net/threads/anointed-preaching-teaching.109331/#post-1912042
Is Baptism necessary for Salvation?
- Thread starter electedbyHim
- Start date
- Status
Why would you even say that about another Christian?
How do you know their heart?
In your eyes, if a Christian is not baptized they are not truly regenerated.
That is not what the Bible teaches about Salvation.
Corinth77777
Member
Your questions begs your aplication of logic - that just because something is commanded that it means baptism in water is necessary for everyone.
Scriptures says they received the Spirit just as we have who can
forbid water.They were saved when they received the Spirit..Scripture has spoken!
So some reasons why water Baptism after Salvation:
1. Everyone would know they were accepted in the community of believers. Could that be important where before the Gentiles were consider dogs and without God? Of course
2.Is this something that could be shared later to other( Jews or Gentiles )so that the Jews accepted the Gentiles? Yes
3. By the same token that other Gentiles could hear that they also can access the kingdom in the name of Jesus, seeing that Water Baptism was a part of their culture.
4. Jesus's own Baptism was said to reveal himself to Israel.
AND I KNEW HIM NOT; BUT THAT HE SHOULD BE MADE MANIFEST TO ISRAEL, THEREFORE AM I COME BAPTIZING WITH WATER.” John 1:31.
“YE MEN OF ISRAEL, HEAR THESE WORDS; JESUS OF NAZARETH, A MAN APPROVED OF GOD AMONG YOU BY MIRACLES AND WONDERS AND SIGNS, WHICH GOD DID BY HIM IN THE MIDST OF YOU, AS YE YOURSELVES ALSO KNOW.” Acts 2:22
One thing that is important to know is this:
....For what can be seen is temporary, but what cannot be seen is eternal....
2 Cor 4
Recap:
So here is what has been shown:
*Yes, Water can be used by Faith in God to cleanse sins at Water Baptism.
But the key is Faith
Liken to God telling Moses to those bitten by snakes to use a bronze snake and hold it up- and that everyone who looks up to it, will stop perishing.
The woman believed that if she could just touch the hem of his garment she would be made whole. Now Did the garment heal her or her faith in Jesus?
That's like that statement Guns Kill. And the answer to this of those who oppose: Guns don't kill, people do.
It's faith in God that makes people whole..
As I said to hope2,
As Circumcision could be counted to those who were without the law that did those things pertaining to the law, Likewise wouldn't water baptism be accounted to those through belief on Jesus, who die daily to their flesh and have come alive?...
Don't Forget it is God who makes one Stand..
And one does not have to have all knowledge about water baptism before He does.
This passage in Chapter 14 confirms the above:
Romans 14:4
Who are you to pass judgment on another’s servant? Before his own master he stands or falls. And he will stand, for the Lord 1 is able to make him stand.
Last edited:
Labelling others will result in a forum ban if it continues.
If this is in reference to eternal salvation, that would fall under the same category, brother, so clarify if you were simply talking about saving them from their misconceptions.
Moderator's note: Those who cannot discuss theology peaceably will have to be banned from such discussions at the very least, so please keep your comments civil and respectful.
Thanks,
Hidden
Wow! Just wow! Is anyone of us so righteous and has the authority to tell another person they are beyond salvation? Really? How can you say such a thing? This totally flies in the face of what Jesus teaches.
"God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved. He who believes in Him is not condemned; but he who does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God."
John 3:16-18 NKJV
Salvation is offered to all who believe in the Son of God, Jesus of Nazareth.
Are we not called to lead people to Christ rather than to push them away? Telling someone they are beyond saving is reprehensible to say the least.
My Rock
Member
Quite a few here are saying baptism isn't necessary for Salvation. Answer me this if receiving the Holy Spirit was all that is necessary for Salvation 1. Why were they commanded to be baptized afterwards? 2. Why was it necessary if they were already saved? Please give me a theological explanation answer to both questions please.
My Rock
Member
I am so very sorry please remove post #481 I allowed Carry_Your_Name to bring out my human nature in a negative way just wanting the truth to prevail and I did it in a negative way and I am very sorry.
Does Mark 16:16 teach that baptism is necessary for salvation?
Answer
As with any single verse or passage, we discern what it teaches through careful consideration of the language and context of the verse. We also filter it through what we know the Bible teaches elsewhere on the subject. In the case of baptism and salvation, the Bible is clear that salvation is by grace through faith in Jesus Christ, not by works of any kind, including baptism (Ephesians 2:8-9). So, any interpretation which comes to the conclusion that baptism, or any other act, is necessary for salvation is a faulty interpretation. For more information, please visit our webpage "Is salvation by faith alone, or by faith plus works?"
Regarding Mark 16:16, it is important to remember that there are some textual problems with Mark chapter 16, verses 9-20. There is some question as to whether these verses were originally part of the Gospel of Mark or whether they were added later by a scribe. As a result, it is best not to base a key doctrine on anything from Mark 16:9-20, such as snake handling, unless it is also supported by other passages of Scripture.
Assuming that verse 16 is original to Mark, does it teach that baptism is required for salvation? The short answer is, no, it does not. In order to make it teach that baptism is required for salvation, one must go beyond what the verse actually says. What this verse does teach is that belief is necessary for salvation, which is consistent with the countless verses where only belief is mentioned (e.g., John 3:18; John 5:24; John 12:44; John 20:31; 1 John 5:13).
“He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned” (Mark 16:16). This verse is composed of two basic statements. 1—He who believes and is baptized will be saved. 2—He who does not believe will be condemned.
While this verse tells us something about believers who have been baptized (they are saved), it does not say anything about believers who have not been baptized. In order for this verse to teach that baptism is necessary for salvation, a third statement would be necessary, viz., “He who believes and is not baptized will be condemned” or “He who is not baptized will be condemned.” But, of course, neither of these statements is found in the verse.
Those who try to use Mark 16:16 to teach that baptism is necessary for salvation commit a common but serious mistake that is sometimes called the Negative Inference Fallacy. This is the rule to follow: “If a statement is true, we cannot assume that all negations (or opposites) of that statement are also true." For example, the statement “a dog with brown spots is an animal” is true; however, the negative, “if a dog does not have brown spots, it is not an animal” is false. In the same way, “he who believes and is baptized will be saved” is true; however, the statement “he who believes but is not baptized will not be saved” is an unwarranted assumption. Yet this is exactly the assumption made by those who support baptismal regeneration.
Consider this example: "Whoever believes and lives in Kansas will be saved, but those that do not believe are condemned." This statement is strictly true; Kansans who believe in Jesus will be saved. However, to say that only those believers who live in Kansas are saved is an illogical and false assumption. The statement does not say a believer must live in Kansas in order to go to heaven. Similarly, Mark 16:16 does not say a believer must be baptized. The verse states a fact about baptized believers (they will be saved), but it says exactly nothing about believers who have not been baptized. There may be believers who do not dwell in Kansas, yet they are still saved; and there may be believers who have not been baptized, yet they, too, are still saved.
The one specific condition required for salvation is stated in the second part of Mark 16:16: “Whoever does not believe will be condemned.” In essence, Jesus has given both the positive condition of belief (whoever believes will be saved) and the negative condition of unbelief (whoever does not believe will be condemned). Therefore, we can say with absolute certainty that belief is the requirement for salvation. More importantly, we see this condition restated positively and negatively throughout Scripture (John 3:16; John 3:18; John 3:36; John 5:24; John 6:53-54; John 8:24; Acts 16:31).
Jesus mentions a condition related to salvation (baptism) in Mark 16:16. But a related condition should not be confused with a requirement. For example, having a fever is related to being ill, but a fever is not required for illness to be present. Nowhere in the Bible do we find a statement such as “whoever is not baptized will be condemned.” Therefore, we cannot say that baptism is necessary for salvation based on Mark 16:16 or any other verse.
Does Mark 16:16 teach that baptism is necessary for salvation? No, it does not. It clearly establishes that belief is required for salvation, but it does not prove or disprove the idea of baptism being a requirement. How can we know, then, if one must be baptized in order to be saved? We must look to the full counsel of God’s Word. Here is a summary of the evidence:
1—The Bible is clear that we are saved by faith alone. Abraham was saved by faith, and we are saved by faith (Romans 4:1-25; Galatians 3:6-22).
2—Throughout the Bible, in every dispensation, people have been saved without being baptized. Every believer in the Old Testament (e.g., Abraham, Jacob, David, Solomon) was saved but not baptized. The thief on the cross was saved but not baptized. Cornelius was saved before he was baptized (Acts 10:44-46).
3—Baptism is a testimony of our faith and a public declaration that we believe in Jesus Christ. The Scriptures tell us that we have eternal life the moment we believe (John 5:24), and belief always comes before being baptized. Baptism does not save us any more than walking an aisle or saying a prayer saves us. We are saved when we believe.
4—The Bible never says that if one is not baptized then he is not saved.
5—If baptism were required for salvation, then no one could be saved without another party being present. Someone must be there to baptize a person before he can be saved. This effectively limits who can be saved and when he can be saved. The consequences of this doctrine, when carried to a logical conclusion, are devastating. For example, a soldier who believes on the battlefield but is killed before he can be baptized would go to hell.
6—Throughout the Bible we see that at the point of faith a believer possesses all the promises and blessings of salvation (John 1:12; 3:16; 5:24; 6:47; 20:31; Acts 10:43; 13:39; 16:31). When one believes, he has eternal life, does not come under judgment, and has passed from death into life (John 5:24)—all before he or she is baptized.
If you believe in baptismal regeneration, you would do well to prayerfully consider whom or what you are really putting your trust in. Is your faith in a physical act (being baptized) or in the finished work of Christ on the cross? Whom or what are you trusting for salvation? Is it the shadow (baptism) or the substance (Jesus Christ)? Our faith must rest in Christ alone. “We have redemption through His blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of His grace” (Ephesians 1:7).
Gotquestions.org
He who has believed and has been baptized shall be saved - This sounds like it saying one must be baptized (assuming water baptism) to be saved. While this is not inspired Scripture, people who believe baptism is necessary for salvation will appeal to this non-inspired passage. While we could simply tell them this text is not accepted by almost all writers as the inspired, inerrant Word of God, there is something else we can do. We can challenge them to read the text in context.
but he who has disbelieved shall be condemned - What does this passage teach us in context? It clearly unhinges belief from baptism and states that if one does not believe they will be condemned. The implication clearly is that they are not saved. What is clear is that it does not say one who has disbelieved and not been baptized will be condemned. So even thought this text is not inspired, an honest reading in context clearly refutes the false teaching that one needs to be baptized (assuming water baptism) to be saved.
My Rock
Member
Nothing I am saying here is new it is ALL Scriptural and theologically sound.
In the New Testament, water baptism is not presented as an optional symbolic act but as a direct command from Jesus and the apostles that is integral to the process of salvation. When Jesus gave the Great Commission in Matthew 28:19, He commanded His disciples to "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." Similarly, in Mark 16:16, Jesus clearly states, “Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.” This shows that belief and baptism are linked together in Jesus’ own teaching as prerequisites for salvation.
Refusal of baptism, therefore, reflects disobedience to a direct command of Christ, which has serious spiritual consequences. In John 14:15, Jesus said, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.” Deliberate refusal to obey the command to be baptized may indicate a lack of genuine submission to Christ's lordship, thereby preventing full entrance into the kingdom of God.
In John 3:5, Jesus tells Nicodemus, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God." Here, water baptism is understood by many theologians to be the “water” of the new birth. This means that baptism is not simply a symbolic rite but an essential part of the process of spiritual regeneration, where a believer enters into new life in Christ.
In Acts 2:38, Peter, in response to the crowd on the day of Pentecost, instructs them to "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Baptism is directly connected to the forgiveness of sins, repentance, and receiving the Holy Spirit. Refusing to be baptized, therefore, would be to reject this divinely ordained process of spiritual rebirth, which is essential for entering the kingdom.
Water baptism symbolizes the believer's identification with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection, as Paul explains in Romans 6:3-4: "Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? We were buried therefore with Him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life."
Refusing baptism means a person is not identifying with Christ’s redemptive work. Baptism, by immersion, signifies the believer’s participation in Christ's burial (going under the water) and resurrection (coming up out of the water). By rejecting baptism, a person is, in effect, refusing the prescribed way of entering into Christ’s saving work, which is critical for being part of His kingdom.
In the New Testament, water baptism is not presented as an optional symbolic act but as a direct command from Jesus and the apostles that is integral to the process of salvation. When Jesus gave the Great Commission in Matthew 28:19, He commanded His disciples to "Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit." Similarly, in Mark 16:16, Jesus clearly states, “Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.” This shows that belief and baptism are linked together in Jesus’ own teaching as prerequisites for salvation.
Refusal of baptism, therefore, reflects disobedience to a direct command of Christ, which has serious spiritual consequences. In John 14:15, Jesus said, “If you love Me, keep My commandments.” Deliberate refusal to obey the command to be baptized may indicate a lack of genuine submission to Christ's lordship, thereby preventing full entrance into the kingdom of God.
In John 3:5, Jesus tells Nicodemus, "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God." Here, water baptism is understood by many theologians to be the “water” of the new birth. This means that baptism is not simply a symbolic rite but an essential part of the process of spiritual regeneration, where a believer enters into new life in Christ.
In Acts 2:38, Peter, in response to the crowd on the day of Pentecost, instructs them to "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." Baptism is directly connected to the forgiveness of sins, repentance, and receiving the Holy Spirit. Refusing to be baptized, therefore, would be to reject this divinely ordained process of spiritual rebirth, which is essential for entering the kingdom.
Water baptism symbolizes the believer's identification with Christ’s death, burial, and resurrection, as Paul explains in Romans 6:3-4: "Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? We were buried therefore with Him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life."
Refusing baptism means a person is not identifying with Christ’s redemptive work. Baptism, by immersion, signifies the believer’s participation in Christ's burial (going under the water) and resurrection (coming up out of the water). By rejecting baptism, a person is, in effect, refusing the prescribed way of entering into Christ’s saving work, which is critical for being part of His kingdom.
My Rock
Member
Honestly though if a person doesn't believe do you think they will still get baptized and if so would it have any effect on an unbeliever. Believing in itself does not equate to Salvation because even the devils believe and tremble, why because they know the truth. While belief in Jesus is essential, salvation requires more than intellectual assent or mental agreement with the truth. The Bible teaches that genuine faith leads to obedient action and transformation.
This verse from James 2:19, which says, "You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe—and shudder!" This passage highlights that mere belief—simply acknowledging God's existence or even affirming theological truths—is not enough to save. James goes on to say in James 2:26, "For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also."
True faith results in a life that responds to God in obedience. If it does not produce change, repentance, and action, it’s no different from the belief demons have, which acknowledges God's power and authority but does not lead to salvation.
He who does not believe will be condemned.
Does not believe what?
In context he who does not believe what Jesus just revealed: “he who believes and is baptized shall be saved”!
Thks
I don't think anyone is arguing that "receiving the Holy Spirit was all that is necessary for Salvation;" everyone simply receives the Holy Spirit upon being saved.
One of the issues is the numerous times that salvation is mentioned as being only on the basis of faith:
Joh 1:12 But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
Joh 1:13 who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. (ESV)
Joh 3:14 And as Moses lifted up the serpent in the wilderness, so must the Son of Man be lifted up,
Joh 3:15 that whoever believes in him may have eternal life.
Joh 3:16 “For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.
Joh 3:17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
Joh 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. (ESV)
Joh 5:24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life. (ESV)
Joh 6:40 For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who looks on the Son and believes in him should have eternal life, and I will raise him up on the last day.” (ESV)
Joh 20:31 but these are written so that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that by believing you may have life in his name. (ESV)
Act 13:38 Let it be known to you therefore, brothers, that through this man forgiveness of sins is proclaimed to you,
Act 13:39 and by him everyone who believes is freed from everything from which you could not be freed by the law of Moses. (ESV)
Rom 3:22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction:
Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Rom 3:24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,
Rom 3:25 whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins.
Rom 3:26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Rom 3:27 Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By a law of works? No, but by the law of faith.
Rom 3:28 For we hold that one is justified by faith apart from works of the law.
Rom 3:29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also,
Rom 3:30 since God is one—who will justify the circumcised by faith and the uncircumcised through faith. (ESV)
Rom 5:1 Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.
Rom 5:2 Through him we have also obtained access by faith into this grace in which we stand, and we rejoice in hope of the glory of God. (ESV)
Rom 10:9 because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
Rom 10:10 For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. (ESV)
Gal 2:16 yet we know that a person is not justified by works of the law but through faith in Jesus Christ, so we also have believed in Christ Jesus, in order to be justified by faith in Christ and not by works of the law, because by works of the law no one will be justified. (ESV)
Gal 3:24 So then, the law was our guardian until Christ came, in order that we might be justified by faith.
Gal 3:25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian,
Gal 3:26 for in Christ Jesus you are all sons of God, through faith. (ESV)
Eph 2:8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, (ESV)
Any one of those passages would have been a great opportunity to mention the need for baptism, but none do. The emphasis is on justification, which is by grace alone, through faith alone, in Christ alone. That is the point of salvation, when Christ's righteousness is imputed to the one who believes and the Holy Spirit is given.
It could be argued that baptism is a part of sanctification, by growing in holiness through obedience to the command to be baptized and so identify with Christ's death and resurrection. There is also something to be said for the public identification with Christ and his death and resurrection, thereby removing identification with the world and the world's systems. However, one is already saved prior to that point. There are a handful of other verses that appear to say that one must be baptized in order to be saved, but each can also be understood in a way that is consistent with what I've stated above.
I think what we have to define then is what faith is. Faith in what or Whom? (capitalized on purpose) Too often we teach that belief is superficial, and I think it goes back to the fear that so many denominations have with regard to works. I see that right here in my own Lutheran church and have had to confront it. We fear works so much that we see works as a dirty word and that is far from the truth. We fall back on Paul's comments recorded in Ephesians 2:8-9 but leave out verse 10 where he clearly states that we are created for good works.
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God,
9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
10 For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them.
NKJV
Jesus himself said that if we love Him, we will keep his commandments. James also points out that a faith devoid of works is a dead faith.
So, bottom line is that we cannot save ourselves by our good works but rather we do good works because of our love for Jesus and what He has done for us. In other words, our salvation is purely by the grace of God for He is not required to grant it to us. We certainly do not deserve it.
My Rock
Member
Basically what I am trying to say in a nutshell is the full redemptive work of Christ is His death, burial and resurrection. If we neglect baptism in water in effect we are not truly identifying with the full scope of his redemptive work, which I believe is detrimental to our spiritual life.
Carry_Your_Name
Member
“Then if anyone says to you, ‘Look, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There!’ do not believe it. For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. See, I have told you beforehand." (Matt. 24:23-25)
Last edited:
Carry_Your_Name
Member
What's really negative of that nature is clinging onto an unbiblical doctrine and doubling down to justify the effort you've made to defend it. For the record, I've never rejected baptism, I pointed out in my first post in this thread that baptism is a public declaration of faith in Christ, but you have to have faith in Christ first, you can't supercede belief in the gospel with water baptism and sell it as a requirement for salvation.
You correctly identified the FULL redemptive work of Christ is His death, burial and resurrection, if we were to imitate Christ, to be comformed to his image, then the old self must be crucified with Christ, all the sins must be laid at the cross, if the temple is still corrupted, God couldn't use it, that's what repentance is all about, right? It is written: "I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me." (Gal. 2:20) It does NOT say "I have been baptized in Christ", because baptism only symbolizes this inner transformation which has already completed by the Holy Spirit.
Last edited:
Carry_Your_Name
Member
1. To make a public declaration of your salvation, with fellow brothers and sisters in Christ bearing witness; 2. To be initiated into a church community, partaking communion instead of "solo Christianity" in the closet.
Here's an analogy: think about a major business contract that would determine the fate of a company, or a major political treaty that would determine the fate of a country, long before such a significant document is signed, there must be countless back-and-forth deliberation, negotiation and calculation behind the curtain, sometimes it could be streatched to a full-blown bloody war or ugly sabotage, that's how the transformation is made and how the consensus is reached, that document is just the final touch to seal the deal, right? If you sign such a document before any substantial effort is made, then it's just piece of paper with no effect. Case in point, during WWII, Hitler and Stalin signed a treaty to split Poland and keep peace, and we all know how that goes. So is water baptism. Water can wash away your dirty, but it can't wash away your sins.
Last edited:
Corinth77777
Member
Scriptures says they received the Spirit just as we have who can
forbid water.They were saved when they received the Spirit..Scripture has spoken!
So some reasons why water Baptism after Salvation:
1. Everyone would know they were accepted in the community of believers. Could that be important where before the Gentiles were consider dogs and without God? Of course
2.Is this something that could be shared later to other( Jews or Gentiles )so that the Jews accepted the Gentiles? Yes
3. By the same token that other Gentiles could hear that they also can access the kingdom in the name of Jesus, seeing that Water Baptism was a part of their culture.
4. Jesus's own Baptism was said to reveal himself to Israel.
AND I KNEW HIM NOT; BUT THAT HE SHOULD BE MADE MANIFEST TO ISRAEL, THEREFORE AM I COME BAPTIZING WITH WATER.” John 1:31.
“YE MEN OF ISRAEL, HEAR THESE WORDS; JESUS OF NAZARETH, A MAN APPROVED OF GOD AMONG YOU BY MIRACLES AND WONDERS AND SIGNS, WHICH GOD DID BY HIM IN THE MIDST OF YOU, AS YE YOURSELVES ALSO KNOW.” Acts 2:22
One thing that is important to know is this:
....For what can be seen is temporary, but what cannot be seen is eternal....
2 Cor 4
Recap:
So here is what has been shown:
*Yes, Water can be used by Faith in God to cleanse sins at Water Baptism.
But the key is Faith
Liken to God telling Moses to those bitten by snakes to use a bronze snake and hold it up- and that everyone who looks up to it, will stop perishing.
The woman believed that if she could just touch the hem of his garment she would be made whole. Now Did the garment heal her or her faith in Jesus?
That's like that statement Guns Kill. And the answer to this of those who oppose: Guns don't kill, people do.
It's faith in God that makes people whole..
As I said to hope2,
As Circumcision could be counted to those who were without the law that did those things pertaining to the law, Likewise wouldn't water baptism be accounted to those through belief on Jesus, who die daily to their flesh and have come alive?...
- Status