Is baptism required for salvation?

[donadams]

then justification is recieved by faith or it is not recieved.

and it is eternal. we can not merit salvation, hence we can not lose it

neither the roman church nor jewish tradition teaches any of these basic scriptural truths

not faith alone!
only one scripture says faith alone and you don't like it, James 2:42 and cos of it luther said that book is not the inspired word of God along with rev. and 7 books of the old testament

we don't merit salvation it is grace and gifts (plural)
the grace (3 kinds) are gifts
the workings of the Spirit are gifts (7) and three are eternal supernatural works and gifts of God, faith, hope, & charity!
"faith alone" is not the greatest! 1 cor 13:13
faith alone even all faith without charity avails nothing! 1 cor 13:2 see deut. 6:5 and commandments are required for salvation!
thanks be to God who is infinite goodness, mercy, and love!

Amen?

Ave Maria!

 

[Johann!@#]

thats alot. I will take a look at it later. thank you

Only a pleasure brother.

J.

 

[donadams]

No it does not

We are saved by grace through faith. not of works

water baptism no more saves us then physical circumcision saved the jews.

Both symbolized the true washing or cleaning. which was performed By God when GOD baptized us into Christ. (no water involved)

we must hear Christ and His church!

the inward washing of grace is not possible ordinarily without the outward washing of baptism!

Born again by “Faith & baptism”!

“Baptismal regeneration” is the initiation into the new covenant!
Jn 3:5 cannot enter!
2 pet 1:11 an entrance shall be ministered unto you!

A sacrament is the fruit of the sacrifice of Christ, an outward (visible) sign that signifies what it accomplishes inward spirituality. (invisible)

we cannot ordinarily have the inward action of grace without the outward sacrament of baptism!

Washing ez 36:25-27 zech 13:1 acts 22:16 titus 3:5

Christian baptism is an outward sign of the inward action of grace, or merits of Christ’s passion blood and death applied to our souls!

We cannot see the inward action of grace purifying the soul, so God gave us the outward “sign” of water washing the body to indicate the inward action of grace and connected the two.

The sacraments are signs of God’s grace!

The grace of justification in the power of the spirit is manifested by the sign of baptism!

Jesus Christ is the sign and the sacrament!

and there is no anointing by "faith alone"!

we are priests prophets and kings and the covenant requires an outward sign, and
anointing with oil, (psalm 23:5) and sealed by God.
Eph 1:13 eph 4:30 sealed by the Holy Spirit!

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism!

"faith alone" has

no outward sign:

no anointing:

no seal:

thks

 

[Johann!@#]

we must hear Christ and His church!

the inward washing of grace is not possible ordinarily without the outward washing of baptism!

Born again by “Faith & baptism”!

“Baptismal regeneration” is the initiation into the new covenant!
Jn 3:5 cannot enter!
2 pet 1:11 an entrance shall be ministered unto you!

A sacrament is the fruit of the sacrifice of Christ, an outward (visible) sign that signifies what it accomplishes inward spirituality. (invisible)

we cannot ordinarily have the inward action of grace without the outward sacrament of baptism!

Washing ez 36:25-27 zech 13:1 acts 22:16 titus 3:5

Christian baptism is an outward sign of the inward action of grace, or merits of Christ’s passion blood and death applied to our souls!

We cannot see the inward action of grace purifying the soul, so God gave us the outward “sign” of water washing the body to indicate the inward action of grace and connected the two.

The sacraments are signs of God’s grace!

The grace of justification in the power of the spirit is manifested by the sign of baptism!

Jesus Christ is the sign and the sacrament!

and there is no anointing by "faith alone"!

we are priests prophets and kings and the covenant requires an outward sign, and
anointing with oil, (psalm 23:5) and sealed by God.
Eph 1:13 eph 4:30 sealed by the Holy Spirit!

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism!

"faith alone" has

no outward sign:

no anointing:

no seal:

thks

To Be Or Not To Be Baptized

A SIMPLE MESSAGE ON BAPTISM Judging from the present-day controversy about water baptism it would seem that it is not possible to write a simple message on the subject. Most assuredly it requires more than a superficial study of the Scriptures to produce a strong conviction in the matter, based upo

bereanbiblesociety.org

Thanks, I'm out of this thread.

J.

 

[Walpole]

You are a proud man are you ?

You did not prove anything.

all of your so called evidence just shown that they were talking to multiple kids telling them to do multiple things

Again, Pter did not contradict jesus.

why do you want to place your works and save yourself so much?

I boast in christ. You boast in your baptism and the one who baptized you.

thats what seperates us

Baptism is not a human work any more than the deluge was. St. Paul clearly states, “…he saved us, not because of deeds done by us in righteousness, but in his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration…” (Titus 3:5-7). There you have it, regeneration (washing in the water of baptism) is not a deed (work) done by us.

Regeneration means to be recreated or born again and we are born again by washing. Through baptism, we are washed with water and the Holy Spirit, just as Jesus told Nicodemus in John 3.

In 1 Peter 3:20-21, St. Peter connects baptism with Noah and his family being saved by deluge that washed away sin from the earth. He says, “Baptism, which corresponds to this (the deluge), now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a clear conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ.”

The flood was not a human work; it was an act of God. Similarly, baptism is not a human work. Rather, it is God’s work. It is God who washes away sins through baptism.

Christianity 101.

 

[Walpole]

To Be Or Not To Be Baptized

A SIMPLE MESSAGE ON BAPTISM Judging from the present-day controversy about water baptism it would seem that it is not possible to write a simple message on the subject. Most assuredly it requires more than a superficial study of the Scriptures to produce a strong conviction in the matter, based upo

bereanbiblesociety.org

Thanks, I'm out of this thread.

J.

Best wishes to you!

 

[donadams]

let go of romansim//Water baptism no more saves than physical circumcision saved the jew.

it is the spiritual circumcision done by the hand of God through baptism which is performed (both) by the HS

Physical baptism and physical circumcision were symbols of this act of God on the believer to save them
(col 2)

the inward washing of sin from the soul by grace of the spirit don't happen without the outward washing of water
Jn 3:5
Jn 3:22
acts 22:16
thks

 

[donadams]

scripture says faith alone all over the place

faith minus everything = faith alone

faith minus works = faith alone

just because the word alone is not used does not mean it is not insinuated. hence you have a weak argument

again, your following words of men, And using their excuses..

Follow the word. and see what the word says

it says to obey the men Christ appointed and sent!

Lk 10:16 Jn 13:20

 

[Johann!@#]

Baptism is not a human work any more than the deluge was. St. Paul clearly states, “…he saved us, not because of deeds done by us in righteousness, but in his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration…” (Titus 3:5-7). There you have it, regeneration (washing in the water of baptism) is not a deed (work) done by us.

Nothing to do with water here.

5) "By the washing of regeneration." (dia loutrou paliggenesias) Through (the) instrument of washing, of generation again (birth again) or the new birth, Joh_3:3; Joh_3:5; Joh_3:7. The new birth is effected through the washing, quickening, or cleansing of the Holy Spirit on the basis of personal faith in the blood of Jesus Christ, Joh_3:8; Joh_6:63; 2Co_3:6; 1Jn_5:1.


The "washing" is both "regenerating" and "renewing." The washing here denotes an inner, spiritual cleansing of sins (compare Eph_5:26) that sanctifies one, making one "righteous" before God.

J.

 

[donadams]

Either way, it does away with infant baptism since an infant cannot be a disciple.

why not? it is the initiation into the covenant and the mediator provides whatever needed!


Infant Baptism!

Acts 2:38-39 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the Lord our God shall call.

Promise is to you’re children! Vs 39

This promise made in ez 36
A promise from God is a sacred oath, and a sacred oath is a sacrament!

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you.

26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh.

27 And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them.

Jn 3:5 born again by water and the spirit.

Acts 16:15 entire household baptized! Does not say adults only or except infants!

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness.

(It does not say adults only or except infants!)
(Scripture does not say anywhere “do not baptized infants”)

Baptism is the Christian initiation sacrament of the new covenant for all men. Matt 28:19 Jn 1:29 Jn 3:16

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. (It does not say except infants!) (but it does say “all”)!

Lk 1:10-11 all people including infants

thank you sir

 

[donadams]

scripture says faith alone all over the place

faith minus everything = faith alone

faith minus works = faith alone

just because the word alone is not used does not mean it is not insinuated. hence you have a weak argument

again, your following words of men, And using their excuses..

Follow the word. and see what the word says

is faith alone the same as accepting Christ?

 

[Walpole]

Nothing to do with water here.

5) "By the washing of regeneration." (dia loutrou paliggenesias) Through (the) instrument of washing, of generation again (birth again) or the new birth, Joh_3:3; Joh_3:5; Joh_3:7. The new birth is effected through the washing, quickening, or cleansing of the Holy Spirit on the basis of personal faith in the blood of Jesus Christ, Joh_3:8; Joh_6:63; 2Co_3:6; 1Jn_5:1.


The "washing" is both "regenerating" and "renewing." The washing here denotes an inner, spiritual cleansing of sins (compare Eph_5:26) that sanctifies one, making one "righteous" before God.

J.

Nothing to do with water???? Did you even read John 3:3-5 or Ephesians 5:26????

"Jesus answered, 'Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of WATER and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.'"

"...that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of WATER with the word..."

 

[Johann!@#]

Nothing to do with water???? Did you even read John 3:3-5 or Ephesians 5:26????

"Jesus answered, 'Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of WATER and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.'"

"...that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of WATER with the word..."

PRACTICAL SANCTIFICATION
It is this that the apostle has in mind as, by the Spirit, he writes that God—

“…hath chosen us in [Christ] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him,

“In love1 having predestinated us unto the adoption of children…” (Eph. 1:4,5).

“For this is the will of God, even your sanctification…” (I Thes. 4:3).

But here a word of caution is needed, lest in seeking to be wholly sanctified to God, we leave ourselves open to discouragement and disillusionment.

Nowhere in Scripture are we instructed to sanctify the “flesh” to God. The Scriptures teach that the “flesh,” the old Adamic nature, is totally bad and experience bears witness that this is so. The “flesh” cannot be improved, or reformed, or converted, and “they that are in the flesh2 cannot please God” (Rom. 8:8). It is for this reason that God sent His own Son “in the likeness of sinful flesh” to “condemn sin in the flesh” at Calvary (See Rom. 8:3).

We are not, then, to seek to improve the old nature or dedicate it to God, but to recognize it as condemned by God and crucified with Christ.

“Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with Him…” (Rom. 6:6).

“Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord” (Rom. 6:11).

But while the believer’s “flesh” cannot be sanctified to God, his body can and should be. The Apostle Paul has much to say about this:

“I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service” (Rom. 12:1).

“What? Know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost, which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

“For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s” (I Cor. 6:19,20).

Thus the apostle writes to the Thessalonians:

“That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honor” (I Thes. 4:4).

“For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness” (I Thes. 4:7).

And thus he concludes:

“And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ” (I Thes. 5:23).

In his very last epistle he declares that while “the Lord knoweth them that are His,” all who name the name of Christ should “depart from iniquity,” and goes on to explain that—

“…in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honor, and some to dishonor.

“If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honor, sanctified, and meet for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work” (II Tim. 2:20,21).

The Church is indeed “a great house,” and in it there are all sorts of vessels. Most of these, it is to be feared, are dishonoring to the Lord and unfit for the Master’s use. God grant that we may not belong to this number, but may rather be vessels which will bring honor to God, “sanctified, and meet [fit] for the Master’s use.”

THE “HOW” OF PRACTICAL SANCTIFICATION
As we consider how to be sanctified to God in walk and experience we must again place the emphasis where God has placed it: upon His blessed Word.

No one will deny that prayer is an important element in practical sanctification, yet the Word places the supreme emphasis upon itself in this matter. Our Lord prayed for His disciples:

“Sanctify them through thy truth: thy Word is truth” (John 17:17).

The Apostle Paul declares that our Lord “loved the Church, and gave Himself for it,

“That He might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the Word” (Eph. 5:25,26).

Many dear Christians have said to the writer: “If only I could remember these Bible truths better, but I have a mind like a sieve.” But pour water through a sieve and it will at least have a cleansing effect. And so does the blessed Word of God have a cleansing effect upon those who prayerfully read it and meditate upon it.

It is the Word which its Author, the Holy Spirit, uses to cleanse and sanctify us more and more to God, and those who are not deeply and sincerely interested in the study of the Word will never enjoy true, practical sanctification no matter how much they pray.

Sanctification

(The following is the sixth in a series of excerpts from Pastor Stam's classic work on True Spirituality. Since this book never appeared as a series in the Searchlight, many of even our long-time readers may not be familiar with these selections.) A PRECIOUS TRUTH TOO LITTLE APPRECIATED It is regr

bereanbiblesociety.org

Brother--you read "water, water, everywhere" but fail to realize the cleansing effect of the word watering our thirsty souls, in the sphere of the Holy Spirit.

God bless, very late here in South Africa.

Johann.

 

[Johann!@#]

Walpole

PAUL AND THE "ONE BAPTISM"
But in the ministry of Paul, with which the rest of Acts is concerned, water
baptism is never required for the remission of sins. Obviously, then, another
commission was replacing that given to the eleven before our Lord's ascension.
It is significant that while Paul did baptize some,68 and mentions this in his
first letter to the Corinthians, he states that he is glad he has baptized so few of
them, adding:
"FOR CHRIST SENT ME NOT TO BAPTIZE, BUT TO PREACH THE
GOSPEL: NOT WITH WISDOM OF WORDS, LEST THE CROSS OF CHRIST
SHOULD BE MADE OF NONE EFFECT.
"FOR THE PREACHING OF THE CROSS IS TO THEM THAT PERISH
FOOLISHNESS, BUT UNTO US WHICH ARE SAVED IT IS THE POWER OF
GOD" (I Cor. 1:17,18).

It is also significant that Paul, the apostle of the Gentiles and minister of the
body of Christ NEVER ONCE, IN ANY OF HIS LETTERS, COMMANDS OR
EVEN EXHORTS US TO BE BAPTIZED WITH WATER.

In his later letters, written after the setting aside of Israel, he states
emphatically that there is now but "ONE BAPTISM" (Eph. 4:5). This baptism is
the operation of the Holy Spirit whereby believers are made one with Christ in
His death, burial and resurrection (Rom. 6:3-4, Gal. 3:26,27, Col. 2:9-12), and so
are also made members of "one body," the "body of Christ" (I Cor. 12:13,27, Gal.
3:26-28).

If believers, especially spiritual leaders, better understood the "one baptism"
by which the "one Spirit" baptizes us into "one body," our unity in Christ would
be more fully enjoyed. Indeed, we are exhorted to endeavor to "keep" or
observe the unity that the Spirit has made, remembering that there is but "one
body ... one Spirit ... one hope ... one Lord, one faith, one baptism, one God and
Father..." (Eph. 4:3-6).

One thing is certain: the student who is willing to put aside preconceived
notions and human traditions, and search the Scriptures concerning this "one
baptism" with an open mind, sits down to a veritable feast of spiritual good
things.
BBS

Shalom.

Johann.

 

[Walpole]

PRACTICAL SANCTIFICATION
It is this that the apostle has in mind as, by the Spirit, he writes that God—

“…hath chosen us in [Christ] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him,

“In love1 having predestinated us unto the adoption of children…” (Eph. 1:4,5).

“For this is the will of God, even your sanctification…” (I Thes. 4:3).

But here a word of caution is needed, lest in seeking to be wholly sanctified to God, we leave ourselves open to discouragement and disillusionment.

Nowhere in Scripture are we instructed to sanctify the “flesh” to God. The Scriptures teach that the “flesh,” the old Adamic nature, is totally bad and experience bears witness that this is so. The “flesh” cannot be improved, or reformed, or converted, and “they that are in the flesh2 cannot please God” (Rom. 8:8). It is for this reason that God sent His own Son “in the likeness of sinful flesh” to “condemn sin in the flesh” at Calvary (See Rom. 8:3).

We are not, then, to seek to improve the old nature or dedicate it to God, but to recognize it as condemned by God and crucified with Christ.

“Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with Him…” (Rom. 6:6).

“Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord” (Rom. 6:11).

But while the believer’s “flesh” cannot be sanctified to God, his body can and should be. The Apostle Paul has much to say about this:

“I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service” (Rom. 12:1).

“What? Know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost, which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

“For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s” (I Cor. 6:19,20).

Thus the apostle writes to the Thessalonians:

“That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honor” (I Thes. 4:4).

“For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness” (I Thes. 4:7).

And thus he concludes:

“And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ” (I Thes. 5:23).

In his very last epistle he declares that while “the Lord knoweth them that are His,” all who name the name of Christ should “depart from iniquity,” and goes on to explain that—

“…in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honor, and some to dishonor.

“If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honor, sanctified, and meet for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work” (II Tim. 2:20,21).

The Church is indeed “a great house,” and in it there are all sorts of vessels. Most of these, it is to be feared, are dishonoring to the Lord and unfit for the Master’s use. God grant that we may not belong to this number, but may rather be vessels which will bring honor to God, “sanctified, and meet [fit] for the Master’s use.”

THE “HOW” OF PRACTICAL SANCTIFICATION
As we consider how to be sanctified to God in walk and experience we must again place the emphasis where God has placed it: upon His blessed Word.

No one will deny that prayer is an important element in practical sanctification, yet the Word places the supreme emphasis upon itself in this matter. Our Lord prayed for His disciples:

“Sanctify them through thy truth: thy Word is truth” (John 17:17).

The Apostle Paul declares that our Lord “loved the Church, and gave Himself for it,

“That He might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the Word” (Eph. 5:25,26).

Many dear Christians have said to the writer: “If only I could remember these Bible truths better, but I have a mind like a sieve.” But pour water through a sieve and it will at least have a cleansing effect. And so does the blessed Word of God have a cleansing effect upon those who prayerfully read it and meditate upon it.

It is the Word which its Author, the Holy Spirit, uses to cleanse and sanctify us more and more to God, and those who are not deeply and sincerely interested in the study of the Word will never enjoy true, practical sanctification no matter how much they pray.

Sanctification

(The following is the sixth in a series of excerpts from Pastor Stam's classic work on True Spirituality. Since this book never appeared as a series in the Searchlight, many of even our long-time readers may not be familiar with these selections.) A PRECIOUS TRUTH TOO LITTLE APPRECIATED It is regr

bereanbiblesociety.org

Brother--you read "water, water, everywhere" but fail to realize the cleansing effect of the word watering our thirsty souls, in the sphere of the Holy Spirit.

God bless, very late here in South Africa.

Johann.

So in your last post you referenced John 3 and Ephesians 5:26 and somehow missed the word WATER in both of those verses.

Now you reference other verses and claim you do not see any verses in Scripture about sanctifying the flesh. Let me help you...

1 Corinthians 6:11 ---> "And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God."

1 Thess 5:23 ---> "Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

1 Cor 6:9-11 ---> "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who submit to or perform homosexual acts, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ AND by the Spirit of our God."

 

[Johann!@#]

So in your last post you referenced John 3 and Ephesians 5:26 and somehow missed the word WATER in both of those verses.

Now you reference other verses and claim you do not see any verses in Scripture about sanctifying the flesh. Let me help you...

1 Corinthians 6:11 ---> "And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God."

1 Thess 5:23 ---> "Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

1 Cor 6:9-11 ---> "Do you not know that the wicked will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who submit to or perform homosexual acts, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God. And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified, in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ AND by the Spirit of our God."

Allow me to repeat myself over and over again--show me "flesh" in the Scripture you cited. And what is the difference between "soma" and "sarx?"

Nowhere in Scripture are we instructed to sanctify the “flesh” to God. The Scriptures teach that the “flesh,” the old Adamic nature, is totally bad and experience bears witness that this is so. The “flesh” cannot be improved, or reformed, or converted, and “they that are in the flesh2 cannot please God” (Rom. 8:8). It is for this reason that God sent His own Son “in the likeness of sinful flesh” to “condemn sin in the flesh” at Calvary (See Rom. 8:3).

Throughout Scripture, believers are consistently instructed to "crucify" (Galatians 5:24), "put to death" (Colossians 3:5), and "put off" (Ephesians 4:22) the flesh, but never to "sanctify" it.

The flesh (σάρξ) in Pauline theology represents the fallen, sinful nature that opposes the Spirit (Galatians 5:17). Sanctification, in contrast, pertains to the inner renewal and holiness imparted by the Holy Spirit (1 Thessalonians 5:23), focusing on the spirit and soul, rather than the corrupt and carnal inclinations of the flesh.

The Flesh Must Be Crucified, Not Sanctified
Galatians 5:24

"And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts."

Paul explicitly states that believers "crucify" the flesh, indicating that it is something to be put to death rather than sanctified.

Romans 6:6

"Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin."

The "old man" (representing the sinful nature) is crucified with Christ, signifying the end of its power rather than its transformation.

2. The Flesh Is Inherently Corrupt
Romans 7:18

"For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing..."

Paul acknowledges that nothing good resides in the flesh, highlighting its incapacity for holiness.

Romans 8:7-8

"Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God."

The flesh is intrinsically hostile to God and cannot be made holy.

3. The Flesh Must Be Put to Death
Colossians 3:5

"Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry."

The command is to "mortify" (put to death) the sinful inclinations, not to sanctify them.

Romans 8:13

"For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live."

Mortifying the deeds of the flesh through the Spirit demonstrates the necessary destruction rather than sanctification of the flesh.

4. Sanctification Applies to the Spirit and Soul
1 Thessalonians 5:23

"And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

While the whole person is to be sanctified, it is the spirit and soul that undergo inner renewal, while the body (which houses the flesh) is to be brought into subjection (1 Corinthians 9:27).

5. The Call to Put Off the Old Nature
Ephesians 4:22-24

"That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness."

The "old man" (fleshly nature) is to be put off, while the "new man" (renewed nature) is to be put on-demonstrating a replacement, not sanctification of the flesh.


Nowhere in Scripture are believers instructed to sanctify the flesh. Rather, they are called to put it to death, crucify it, and live by the Spirit. Sanctification is a process applied to the inner person--the spirit and soul--while the flesh remains an adversary to be subdued.

Now Walpole show me in Scripture that we are to sanctify "the sarx" please--since we are [thankfully] of "water baptism" for now.

Pull out your Greek sources and I will do the same and I will gladly debate you.

Shalom Achi.

J.

 

[Johann!@#]

Allow me to repeat myself over and over again--show me "flesh" in the Scripture you cited. And what is the difference between "soma" and "sarx?"

Nowhere in Scripture are we instructed to sanctify the “flesh” to God. The Scriptures teach that the “flesh,” the old Adamic nature, is totally bad and experience bears witness that this is so. The “flesh” cannot be improved, or reformed, or converted, and “they that are in the flesh2 cannot please God” (Rom. 8:8). It is for this reason that God sent His own Son “in the likeness of sinful flesh” to “condemn sin in the flesh” at Calvary (See Rom. 8:3).

Throughout Scripture, believers are consistently instructed to "crucify" (Galatians 5:24), "put to death" (Colossians 3:5), and "put off" (Ephesians 4:22) the flesh, but never to "sanctify" it.

The flesh (σάρξ) in Pauline theology represents the fallen, sinful nature that opposes the Spirit (Galatians 5:17). Sanctification, in contrast, pertains to the inner renewal and holiness imparted by the Holy Spirit (1 Thessalonians 5:23), focusing on the spirit and soul, rather than the corrupt and carnal inclinations of the flesh.

The Flesh Must Be Crucified, Not Sanctified
Galatians 5:24

"And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts."

Paul explicitly states that believers "crucify" the flesh, indicating that it is something to be put to death rather than sanctified.

Romans 6:6

"Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin."

The "old man" (representing the sinful nature) is crucified with Christ, signifying the end of its power rather than its transformation.

2. The Flesh Is Inherently Corrupt
Romans 7:18

"For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh,) dwelleth no good thing..."

Paul acknowledges that nothing good resides in the flesh, highlighting its incapacity for holiness.

Romans 8:7-8

"Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be. So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God."

The flesh is intrinsically hostile to God and cannot be made holy.

3. The Flesh Must Be Put to Death
Colossians 3:5

"Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry."

The command is to "mortify" (put to death) the sinful inclinations, not to sanctify them.

Romans 8:13

"For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live."

Mortifying the deeds of the flesh through the Spirit demonstrates the necessary destruction rather than sanctification of the flesh.

4. Sanctification Applies to the Spirit and Soul
1 Thessalonians 5:23

"And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ."

While the whole person is to be sanctified, it is the spirit and soul that undergo inner renewal, while the body (which houses the flesh) is to be brought into subjection (1 Corinthians 9:27).

5. The Call to Put Off the Old Nature
Ephesians 4:22-24

"That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts; And be renewed in the spirit of your mind; And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness."

The "old man" (fleshly nature) is to be put off, while the "new man" (renewed nature) is to be put on-demonstrating a replacement, not sanctification of the flesh.


Nowhere in Scripture are believers instructed to sanctify the flesh. Rather, they are called to put it to death, crucify it, and live by the Spirit. Sanctification is a process applied to the inner person--the spirit and soul--while the flesh remains an adversary to be subdued.

Now Walpole show me in Scripture that we are to sanctify "the sarx" please--since we are [thankfully] of "water baptism" for now.

Pull out your Greek sources and I will do the same and I will gladly debate you.

Shalom Achi.

J.

Sanctification

(The following is the sixth in a series of excerpts from Pastor Stam's classic work on True Spirituality. Since this book never appeared as a series in the Searchlight, many of even our long-time readers may not be familiar with these selections.) A PRECIOUS TRUTH TOO LITTLE APPRECIATED It is regr

bereanbiblesociety.org

J.

 

[Walpole]

PRACTICAL SANCTIFICATION
It is this that the apostle has in mind as, by the Spirit, he writes that God—

“…hath chosen us in [Christ] before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before Him,

“In love1 having predestinated us unto the adoption of children…” (Eph. 1:4,5).

“For this is the will of God, even your sanctification…” (I Thes. 4:3).

But here a word of caution is needed, lest in seeking to be wholly sanctified to God, we leave ourselves open to discouragement and disillusionment.

Nowhere in Scripture are we instructed to sanctify the “flesh” to God. The Scriptures teach that the “flesh,” the old Adamic nature, is totally bad and experience bears witness that this is so. The “flesh” cannot be improved, or reformed, or converted, and “they that are in the flesh2 cannot please God” (Rom. 8:8). It is for this reason that God sent His own Son “in the likeness of sinful flesh” to “condemn sin in the flesh” at Calvary (See Rom. 8:3).

We are not, then, to seek to improve the old nature or dedicate it to God, but to recognize it as condemned by God and crucified with Christ.

“Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with Him…” (Rom. 6:6).

“Likewise reckon ye also yourselves to be dead indeed unto sin, but alive unto God through Jesus Christ our Lord” (Rom. 6:11).

But while the believer’s “flesh” cannot be sanctified to God, his body can and should be. The Apostle Paul has much to say about this:

“I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service” (Rom. 12:1).

“What? Know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost, which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?

“For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God’s” (I Cor. 6:19,20).

Thus the apostle writes to the Thessalonians:

“That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honor” (I Thes. 4:4).

“For God hath not called us unto uncleanness, but unto holiness” (I Thes. 4:7).

And thus he concludes:

“And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ” (I Thes. 5:23).

In his very last epistle he declares that while “the Lord knoweth them that are His,” all who name the name of Christ should “depart from iniquity,” and goes on to explain that—

“…in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honor, and some to dishonor.

“If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honor, sanctified, and meet for the master’s use, and prepared unto every good work” (II Tim. 2:20,21).

The Church is indeed “a great house,” and in it there are all sorts of vessels. Most of these, it is to be feared, are dishonoring to the Lord and unfit for the Master’s use. God grant that we may not belong to this number, but may rather be vessels which will bring honor to God, “sanctified, and meet [fit] for the Master’s use.”

THE “HOW” OF PRACTICAL SANCTIFICATION
As we consider how to be sanctified to God in walk and experience we must again place the emphasis where God has placed it: upon His blessed Word.

No one will deny that prayer is an important element in practical sanctification, yet the Word places the supreme emphasis upon itself in this matter. Our Lord prayed for His disciples:

“Sanctify them through thy truth: thy Word is truth” (John 17:17).

The Apostle Paul declares that our Lord “loved the Church, and gave Himself for it,

“That He might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the Word” (Eph. 5:25,26).

Many dear Christians have said to the writer: “If only I could remember these Bible truths better, but I have a mind like a sieve.” But pour water through a sieve and it will at least have a cleansing effect. And so does the blessed Word of God have a cleansing effect upon those who prayerfully read it and meditate upon it.

It is the Word which its Author, the Holy Spirit, uses to cleanse and sanctify us more and more to God, and those who are not deeply and sincerely interested in the study of the Word will never enjoy true, practical sanctification no matter how much they pray.

Sanctification

(The following is the sixth in a series of excerpts from Pastor Stam's classic work on True Spirituality. Since this book never appeared as a series in the Searchlight, many of even our long-time readers may not be familiar with these selections.) A PRECIOUS TRUTH TOO LITTLE APPRECIATED It is regr

bereanbiblesociety.org

Brother--you read "water, water, everywhere" but fail to realize the cleansing effect of the word watering our thirsty souls, in the sphere of the Holy Spirit.

God bless, very late here in South Africa.

Johann.

It's as if you are deliberately avoiding the obvious and explicit verses. Just like how you somehow could not see the word water in John 3:3-5 and Ephesians 5:26, I guess you cannot see the word sanctify and body either...

1 Thess 5:23 ---> "And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul AND BODY be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." (KJV quoted so as to avoid special pleading charge)

 

[Johann!@#]

It's as if you are deliberately avoiding the obvious and explicit verses. Just like how you somehow could not see the word water in John 3:3-5 and Ephesians 5:26, I guess you cannot see the word sanctify and body either...

1 Thess 5:23 ---> "And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul AND BODY be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." (KJV quoted so as to avoid special pleading charge)

The verse does not mention flesh, and it is important to recognize that σῶμα and σάρξ carry distinct connotations in Paul’s epistles.


So what are we to do with the flesh?

J.

 

[Walpole]

The verse does not mention flesh, and it is important to recognize that σῶμα and σάρξ carry distinct connotations in Paul’s epistles.


So what are we to do with the flesh?

J.

We are to sanctify it, as Scripture states. Here is Scripture testifying to cleansing / sanctifying both the σῶμα and σάρξ...

Hebrews 10:19-22 ---> "Therefore, brothers and sisters, since we have confidence to enter the Most Holy Place by the blood of Jesus, by a new and living way opened for us through the curtain, that is, his body, and since we have a great priest over the house of God, let us draw near to God with a sincere heart and with the full assurance that faith brings, having our hearts sprinkled to cleanse us from a guilty conscience and having our bodies washed with pure water."

2 Corinthians 7:1 ---> "Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God."


You couldn't find water in John 3:3-5 or in Ephesians 5:26, but I am hoping you can see flesh / bodies in these passages. I even bolded it and linked it to the Greek to assist you.