IS MAN FREE TO CHOOSE?

[GodsGrace]

Paul teaches about the present reality of sin and it’s desire to bring us into the bondage of slavery to its lustful desires that each born again Christian must overcome. This is the theme of the book of Romans, especially chapters 6-8.


Each born again Christian must first understand this ever present truth and choose to fight and overcome these temptations by the power of the Holy Spirit.


To sum up the conflict and potential outcome of this struggle to reign in dominion over sin that dwells in our flesh, Paul writes —


Therefore, brethren, we are debtors—not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. Romans 8:12-14

• For if you live according to the flesh you will die;
• but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

Eternal life or eternal damnation are the the two possible outcomes of this conflict.


The person who understands this will ultimately become fruitful in every good work.


The person who doesn’t will continue to fight the truth and those who present it.



But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”
Matthew 13:23

• he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it...

JLB

Do you believe a born again Christian struggles with this conflict all their life?
Or do you believe that, at some point, we UNDERSTAND what makes us truly free
and we wish to do good?

You will know the truth and the truth will set you free.
John 8:31

 

[GodsGrace]

it does ,you
dont see God the same.do you really think that God will have mass where its like that in worship and now at this time each time at 0600 ,0700,and 0800 and 1200 and 1800 its time to kneel on the alter ?

no nothing of the sort ,yet how you perceive or its presented God in worship is how you see it.to those who have not been a charismatic the concept of dancing before the lord is strange and foreign and shouting and clapping ,running .yet I highly doubt you will ritually kneel like a catholic with a rrosary at said times .

I've done it all Jason...believe it or not.
I've been to Pentecostal churches...also Catholic. No surprises for me.

How we perceive God should be how He is represented in scripture.
Is God a loving God?
Is He merciful?
Is He just?

The bible teaches me that God is all of the above....many verses will prove this.
1 John 4:8 God IS love.
Hebrews 4:16 God is merciful.
Isaiah 30:18 The LORD is a God of justice.

in anal about my views on the trinity ,I hate book and movie about God being presented In persons as female ,yet It said its not meant to be theology but a cs Lewis type to reach the lost .

I strongly disagree with that bit I know churches who use it .they are trinitarian ,poor disciple ship so please ,yes that will make the Holy Ghost female .

Agreed.

clearly you have not been in charismatic circles ,God is viewed a bit more personable ,you cant post those Gnostic type things,they do ,its just experienced in that worship setting .

it can be out there or not and I don't always see it being biblical but at times it is and well you have to be involved .

you are hung up on that .i guess if the reformed serve a different God then the arminist then well since the 13 colonies were a cult .

To this day many Christians in Northern Europe are calvinist.
What does this have to do with anything?
The CC has been around since the beginning...does this make it right in all matters??
And yes, I do believe the reformed are serving a different God than the one I know.
The one I know does not predestine persons to go to hell.

I consider it a minor heresy .let God decide and do his saving besides you are shocked about the things I posted .

Jason,,,a heresy is a heresy...there's no such thing as a MINOR heresy.

I Now Better Understand the 'Good German', by Dennis Prager

As my listeners and readers can hopefully attest, I have been on a lifelong quest to understand human nature and human behavior. I am sad to report that I have learned more in the last few years, particularly in 2020, than in any equivalent period of time.

www.creators.com

I read that and felt well man is always depraved ,just needs the chance to show it
these are things i see ,we have snitches here .I know of them .I refuse to snitch on gatherings .I won't .its not me concern .especially given how ravages California is with covid and how harsh the orders are .yet the highest in cases .

We have sniteches here too.
But persons gather anyway...I also would not do this to anyone.
I'm not sure what this has to do with what is being discussed.....

I,dont fear death ,it may come today,but we'll so could have that round over me head a few times and artillery landing near me and only seconds after i left .

God is in control .you seem to ignore how depraved even ole christain America is .

Tulsa race massacre - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

there is more then just that .yet well it was more "Christian "then .

hmmm .

I agree that man is depraved.
We are all born lost and far away from God.

I'm,hardly a blm type but racial division in churches and the past is something I find here .God was not worshipped or presented as the God of all races by some .black only churches existed because they weren't welcome to the white ones!

Agreed.

I have posted a photo of one ,here

https://jasoncran.tumblr.com%2Fpost%2F640249524442595328

built in 1908 and donated by a white family to the church ,its minister traveled from Georgia and was beaten for ministering by the kkk.he was not welcomed ,the blacks received him.so yes let's just ignore depravity of men .

we are that depraved ,Arminism does by that ,you don't

No,,,I agree that man has a depraved nature.
I just do NOT believe it is so depraved as to make it impossible for him to respond to God.
It is possible for man to respond to the call of God.....
We are not regenerated first and then saved.

We are free enough to reply to the grace of God.

 

[jasonc]

I've done it all Jason...believe it or not.
I've been to Pentecostal churches...also Catholic. No surprises for me.

How we perceive God should be how He is represented in scripture.
Is God a loving God?
Is He merciful?
Is He just?

The bible teaches me that God is all of the above....many verses will prove this.
1 John 4:8 God IS love.
Hebrews 4:16 God is merciful.
Isaiah 30:18 The LORD is a God of justice.



Agreed.



To this day many Christians in Northern Europe are calvinist.
What does this have to do with anything?
The CC has been around since the beginning...does this make it right in all matters??
And yes, I do believe the reformed are serving a different God than the one I know.
The one I know does not predestine persons to go to hell.



Jason,,,a heresy is a heresy...there's no such thing as a MINOR heresy.



We have sniteches here too.
But persons gather anyway...I also would not do this to anyone.
I'm not sure what this has to do with what is being discussed.....



I agree that man is depraved.
We are all born lost and far away from God.



Agreed.


No,,,I agree that man has a depraved nature.
I just do NOT believe it is so depraved as to make it impossible for him to respond to God.
It is possible for man to respond to the call of God.....
We are not regenerated first and then saved.

We are free enough to reply to the grace of God.

l

biased much ,if there is no such thing as a minor heresy .I,guess all who disagree with you,are lost .


with you its bad to be a Calvinist but not a Torah observant gentile or jew who believes you must also be cirmcumized and. kosher too.these exist ,

my,brother knows a few .or how about th millienial reign where no uncirmcumized male or female may enter into the presence of God ,the law returns .yes it is taught in some circles .

but we'll ,brow beat only,the 5 pointers whom you assume preach the 5 points to,the lost ,they don't .I have watched my pastor witness .

 

[jasonc]

and stop because i attend a reformed doesnt mean. I,am one
or that I shoukd be perfectly in unisom like zombie with any church teachers view point .

you imply that .my church is small .God forbid I might be called to actually and enabled to serve in any capacity at a church .

my pastors wife a member ,not a Calvinist .I refuse to ignore that blanket statement about them

 

[GodsGrace]

l

biased much ,if there is no such thing as a minor heresy .I,guess all who disagree with you,are lost .


with you its bad to be a Calvinist but not a Torah observant gentile or jew who believes you must also be cirmcumized and. kosher too.these exist ,

my,brother knows a few .or how about th millienial reign where no uncirmcumized male or female may enter into the presence of God ,the law returns .yes it is taught in some circles .

but we'll ,brow beat only,the 5 pointers whom you assume preach the 5 points to,the lost ,they don't .I have watched my pastor witness .

All who disagree with me are not lost.
And remember this:
He who accepts everything...
believes in nothing.

Chesterton...(my wording).

 

[GodsGrace]

and stop because i attend a reformed doesnt mean. I,am one
or that I shoukd be perfectly in unisom like zombie with any church teachers view point .

you imply that .my church is small .God forbid I might be called to actually and enabled to serve in any capacity at a church .

my pastors wife a member ,not a Calvinist .I refuse to ignore that blanket statement about them

How does a person attend a catholic church if they are not catholic?
How do you attend a calvinist church if you're not a follower of Calvin? Or his theology, I should say - I think (or maybe not).
I can't attend a church because I like the pastor...
I also have to agree with their statement of faith...at least 90% of it, if not all.

 

[GodsGrace]

wondering said:
We don't seem to agree on major points.

You don't agree with me that Christ is God???
You don't agree with me that Christ died and rose from the dead?
You don't agree with me that Christ was both man and God?
You don't agree with me that God is in three persons?
You don't agree with me that your at saved by faith?
WOW

wondering said:
Every Christian believes God allows....He allows because He does not interfere with the natural sequence of things at every moment of the day.

Your saying He does not interfere with the natural sequence of things is duelism (the division of something conceptually into two opposed or contrasted aspects); that God does not control the natural sequence of things is saying some unknown force controls the natural sequence of things. This contradicts Col. 1:16-17

wondering said:
This is because He has given us free will.

There is not scripture in the bible to support this contention. It is a vain attempt by liberals to defend God using anthropocentric ideals.

wondering said:
You said God determines all things down to every atom....
He determines that sin will exist and even the extent of sin...
yet He does not create sin.

Agreed ...
whereas you contend that God allows sin but does not control it.
I contend God allows sin but does control it.
whereas you contend that God controls us completely
you contend that we control God, though incompletely

wondering said:
I agree that God does not create sin --- in God there is no darkness.
But I also don't hold Him responsible for sin....

I agree that God does not create sin and is not responsible for sin.
I contend in God there is no darkness means God cannot love (favor) sin (those who will not be saved)
You contend in God there is no darkness means God can love (favor) sin (those who will not be saved)

wondering said:
what you believe makes no sense.
I'm sorry to keep repeating this, but it's the truth.

You contend what I say makes no sense
I contend what I say you cannot make sense of (As Hospes I am sure would agree)

wondering said:
I understand what your saying...you don't have to use examples.
God is God....HE could do whatever HE WANTS TO...we cannot.
So your example is not even acceptable.

This is a false statement. Although you are not as capable as God, you have the ability to find and save some people that would, without your intervention, physically die earlier. Thus, your stance is hypocritical as you ascribe it to be an incorrect doctrine to think God takes not action to save some people, but when you when you take not action to save some people physically ...well, that's different. How convenient.
In simply terms, God lets some people die and you let some people die. When God does it you say that not right, when you do it ... well, that's O.K.

wondering said:
Here's what is JUST from a just God:

LOL ... a just God is defined by whatever God decides to do. He defines justice. He would be just to let everyone go to hell without exception. You define God's justice in human terms ...He has to be fair and give everyone a equal chance to be saved or God is not just. Poppy-cock (excuse bad language ... giggles)

wondering said:
He gives to everyone the same opportunity to be saved and not go to hell.
In order to do this...He inspires the bible to be written and lets us KNOW HOW we can be saved.

The 1232 N.A. Indian does not KNOW HOW we can be saved ... this empirical evidence shows your logic is faulty. The fact that you are a Christian with access to God's word and yet you can't tell us the content of faith for a 1232 N.A. Indian should be is further proof.


I said, "You believe God could have all people who will not believe salvifically die in infancy. "

wondering said:
Huh?
This is incorrect.

So, what part of my statement is incorrect ???
1. That God does not know who will have faith ?????
or 2. God could save those whom he knows will not have faith in adulthood by having them die in infancy
or 3. Infants don't go to heaven?

wondering said:
One thing is for sure...
Either I don't understand calvinism
or you don't.

Agreed.
You don't even understand that the Westminster Confession of Faith says God control all things yet is not the author
of sin. In plain English is says God is not the author of sin and yet you say Reform theology says God is the author of sin. This is not a matter of understanding reformed theology, it is a matter of understanding English.
Example:
I say 1 + 1 = 2
you would say, well Fred never said 1 + 1 = 2

Reformed theology says God is not the author of sin (Westminster Confession, Baptist Confession)
You say Reformed theology says God is the author of sin
This is not rational

I say God allows evil and controls evil and this is not sinful
You say God allows evil and does not control evil as that would be sinful
I say Genesis 50:20, Acts 2:23 and Acts 4:27-28 show how God control evil for good
You say IMO, there is not verse in the bible to substantiate my claim that God does not control evil

wondering said:
I'd say that many calvinists are confused.

I'd say many Christians are confused. Calvinists are less confused as their doctrine is more systematic.

wondering said:
This is because they adhere to the teachings of MEN, instead of coming to an understanding
of God by reading the bible or praying to God for understanding.

Ridiculous, Calvinists and non-calvinists understanding comes from the same Bible. Both get some things wrong.

wondering said:
Everything I state is biblical.
Because you don't agree does not make ME wrong.

Biblical 'true' from your perspective. I agree that you are not necessarily wrong because I think you are.

wondering said:
If you posted the WCF it would be helpful in showing how you believe as you do.

http://vor.org/truth/1689/1689bc00.html ...it's the Baptist confession which came from the WCF and is almost the same. I don't agree with the baptism of babies so I favor the Baptist confession (not a big thing)
WCF: https://bpc.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/D-ConfessionOfFaith.pdf

wondering said:
John Calvin was not confused and that is who I post.
I do not agree with calvinism AT ALL.

Ridiculous ...
Calvinism believes Christ died and rose again. I don't think you mean to say "I do not agree with Calvinism AT ALL."

wondering said:
Maybe you'd like to explain how God tricks some into believing they are saved?

The question is based on a false premise, possibly indicating again that you don't understand Reformed Theology. Reformed Theology believes in compatibilism, not "TRICKING" people. I've never heard to the doctrine of TRICKING PEOPLE. You don't understand Reformed Theology.


Fastfredy0

Hi FF,
I think we need to narrow our scope a little.
Also, I'd like to say that if you tire of speaking about this, you can stop at any time...
No hard feelings. Friends as before, we say here.

This I SAID, YOU SAID, and you calling me hypocritical and telling me I don't understand
has to stop.

Could we do our best to use biblical verses and scripture?

This thread is about man's free will.
Does man have a real choice or not?

It's a simple question.
Did Adam have free will?
Was it taken away from him and mankind after the fall?
What makes you believe what you believe?

 

[Hopeful]

Paul teaches about the present reality of sin and it’s desire to bring us into the bondage of slavery to its lustful desires that each born again Christian must overcome. This is the theme of the book of Romans, especially chapters 6-8.

Each born again Christian must first understand this ever present truth and choose to fight and overcome these temptations by the power of the Holy Spirit.
To sum up the conflict and potential outcome of this struggle to reign in dominion over sin that dwells in our flesh, Paul writes —
Therefore, brethren, we are debtors—not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh. For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live. For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God. Romans 8:12-14

• For if you live according to the flesh you will die;
• but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.

Eternal life or eternal damnation are the the two possible outcomes of this conflict.
The person who understands this will ultimately become fruitful in every good work.
The person who doesn’t will continue to fight the truth and those who present it.

But he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it, who indeed bears fruit and produces: some a hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”
Matthew 13:23

• he who received seed on the good ground is he who hears the word and understands it..

JLB

I rejoice in God almighty who allowed my victory over sin, the flesh, the vile affections, and lusts of who I used to be.
Don't you think your "battle" is winnable?
Grape vines can't bring forth figs.
Those reborn of the seed of God can't bring forth lies, adultery, or thefts.

 

[Hopeful]

I agree with all Paul says.
This thread is about free will and whether or not man has a will that is free from coercion.

God call us to be a holy people.
The question is: Are we holy, set apart, because we wish to be in order to serve God...
OR Does God force us, by predestination, to behave as HE wants us to?

Is our will our own...or does God force HIS will on us?

I agree with Paul too, especially concerning the death of the old man and of freedom from the law of sin.
It is our will to follow the good Shepherd.

 

[Hopeful]

You don't agree with me that Christ is God???
You don't agree with me that Christ died and rose from the dead?
You don't agree with me that Christ was both man and God?
You don't agree with me that God is in three persons?
You don't agree with me that your at saved by faith?
WOW


Your saying He does not interfere with the natural sequence of things is duelism (the division of something conceptually into two opposed or contrasted aspects); that God does not control the natural sequence of things is saying some unknown force controls the natural sequence of things. This contradicts Col. 1:16-17


There is not scripture in the bible to support this contention. It is a vain attempt by liberals to defend God using anthropocentric ideals.



Agreed ...
whereas you contend that God allows sin but does not control it.
I contend God allows sin but does control it.
whereas you contend that God controls us completely
you contend that we control God, though incompletely


I agree that God does not create sin and is not responsible for sin.
I contend in God there is no darkness means God cannot love (favor) sin (those who will not be saved)
You contend in God there is no darkness means God can love (favor) sin (those who will not be saved)



You contend what I say makes no sense
I contend what I say you cannot make sense of (As Hospes I am sure would agree)



This is a false statement. Although you are not as capable as God, you have the ability to find and save some people that would, without your intervention, physically die earlier. Thus, your stance is hypocritical as you ascribe it to be an incorrect doctrine to think God takes not action to save some people, but when you when you take not action to save some people physically ...well, that's different. How convenient.
In simply terms, God lets some people die and you let some people die. When God does it you say that not right, when you do it ... well, that's O.K.



LOL ... a just God is defined by whatever God decides to do. He defines justice. He would be just to let everyone go to hell without exception. You define God's justice in human terms ...He has to be fair and give everyone a equal chance to be saved or God is not just. Poppy-cock (excuse bad language ... giggles)


The 1232 N.A. Indian does not KNOW HOW we can be saved ... this empirical evidence shows your logic is faulty. The fact that you are a Christian with access to God's word and yet you can't tell us the content of faith for a 1232 N.A. Indian should be is further proof.


I said, "You believe God could have all people who will not believe salvifically die in infancy. "

So, what part of my statement is incorrect ???
1. That God does not know who will have faith ?????
or 2. God could save those whom he knows will not have faith in adulthood by having them die in infancy
or 3. Infants don't go to heaven?


Agreed.
You don't even understand that the Westminster Confession of Faith says God control all things yet is not the author
of sin. In plain English is says God is not the author of sin and yet you say Reform theology says God is the author of sin. This is not a matter of understanding reformed theology, it is a matter of understanding English.
Example:
I say 1 + 1 = 2
you would say, well Fred never said 1 + 1 = 2

Reformed theology says God is not the author of sin (Westminster Confession, Baptist Confession)
You say Reformed theology says God is the author of sin
This is not rational

I say God allows evil and controls evil and this is not sinful
You say God allows evil and does not control evil as that would be sinful
I say Genesis 50:20, Acts 2:23 and Acts 4:27-28 show how God control evil for good
You say IMO, there is not verse in the bible to substantiate my claim that God does not control evil




I'd say many Christians are confused. Calvinists are less confused as their doctrine is more systematic.

Ridiculous, Calvinists and non-calvinists understanding comes from the same Bible. Both get some things wrong.


Biblical 'true' from your perspective. I agree that you are not necessarily wrong because I think you are.



http://vor.org/truth/1689/1689bc00.html ...it's the Baptist confession which came from the WCF and is almost the same. I don't agree with the baptism of babies so I favor the Baptist confession (not a big thing)
WCF: https://bpc.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/D-ConfessionOfFaith.pdf




Ridiculous ...
Calvinism believes Christ died and rose again. I don't think you mean to say "I do not agree with Calvinism AT ALL."


The question is based on a false premise, possibly indicating again that you don't understand Reformed Theology. Reformed Theology believes in compatibilism, not "TRICKING" people. I've never heard to the doctrine of TRICKING PEOPLE. You don't understand Reformed Theology.


Fastfredy0

Hi FF,
I think we need to narrow our scope a little.
Also, I'd like to say that if you tire of speaking about this, you can stop at any time...
No hard feelings. Friends as before, we say here.

This I SAID, YOU SAID, and you calling me hypocritical and telling me I don't understand
has to stop.

Could we do our best to use biblical verses and scripture?

This thread is about man's free will.
Does man have a real choice or not?

It's a simple question.
Did Adam have free will?
Was it taken away from him and mankind after the fall?
What makes you believe what you believe?

Hey Wondering...did you know you were answering a post with your own name on it?

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

Thanks Walpole.

I'm so happy that Christianity makes sense!
God made us in His image and that included free will.
As far as I can tell, it was not taken away after the fall.

Indeed, if we are not truly free, we cannot have a moral universe...
morality does not exist.

This is why predestination is not taught in the N.T.
Free will and predestination (determinism) do not go hand in hand and
instead are in conflict.

But, as you may know, our St. Augustine (400 A.D.) came up with this
idea and John Calvin wrote much of what he wrote based on Augustine's
doctrine.

I can't, offhand, think of another prominent Christian that agreed with him,
both then and now.

I agree with him.

 

[jasonc]

How does a person attend a catholic church if they are not catholic?
How do you attend a calvinist church if you're not a follower of Calvin? Or his theology, I should say - I think (or maybe not).
I can't attend a church because I like the pastor...
I also have to agree with their statement of faith...at least 90% of it, if not all.

because I find things in common.

many churches don't disciple mine does

 

[jasonc]

All who disagree with me are not lost.
And remember this:
He who accepts everything...
believes in nothing.

Chesterton...(my wording).

so you do agree in minor heresy .

my point made . I don't know if God or how God reaches those in America when he only had Moses to teach isreal ,not my concern .

some say he didn't ,others say he did .nothing is written .t hey are dead ,im not

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

This is why predestination is not taught in the N.T.
Free will and predestination (determinism) do not go hand in hand and
instead are in conflict.

wondering my sister
Thank you God that free-will is taught all throughout the Bible.
For me, scripture teaches God, Himself is all-knowing - omniscient, from the beginning until the end.
God knows every choice we will ever make and every action we will ever take.
On that basis of our right choices and actions over a lifetime until the end of our life, we are pre-destined to ever-lasting life by God Himself, AS A RESULT OF WHAT WE CHOOSE TO DO OR BE LIKE IN OUR HEARTS AND ACTIONS.
1st Timothy says, "God wants all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."
1st Peter says, "Christ died for our sins, once, and for "ALL."

Scripture nowhere teaches that God picks some to be saved and not others. That is a popular TEACHING BY MAN, but is supported no place in scripture.

Besides a very few Matth. 7:14, being called the "predestined", we are also called the "chosen", the "appointed", the "few", the "elect", the "remnant", the "called", the "foreknew", all throughout God's word.

Our destination is chosen by no one but us individually by the choices we make over a lifetime, and God's "predestination of a few", because of His omniscience, knowing all of our life before we do, is why we are "pre-chosen" or "pre-destined," or maybe not if we continually made poor choices and never let the conviction of the Holy Spirit affect us to change.

 

[GodsGrace]

Hey Wondering...did you know you were answering a post with your own name on it?

It's on purpose....
I'm trying to get Fastfredy0 over here.
You'll see his name at the bottom of the post.

 

[JLB]

Do you believe a born again Christian struggles with this conflict all their life?
Or do you believe that, at some point, we UNDERSTAND what makes us truly free
and we wish to do good?

You will know the truth and the truth will set you free.
John 8:31

I cant speak for all Christians, but I can say, in my case, I struggled and then I got some understanding, and I overcame.



JLB

 

[JLB]

I rejoice in God almighty who allowed my victory over sin, the flesh, the vile affections, and lusts of who I used to be.
Don't you think your "battle" is winnable?
Grape vines can't bring forth figs.
Those reborn of the seed of God can't bring forth lies, adultery, or thefts.

Paul speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, to those Christians under grace.


What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not! Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness.
Romans 6:15-16

 

[Hopeful]

Paul speaking under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, to those Christians under grace.


What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not! Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one’s slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness.
Romans 6:15-16

Thank God for the choice of whether to obey or not.
I hope all will choose to obey, before it is too late.

 

[Seasoned by Grace]

Thank God for the choice of whether to obey or not.
I hope all will choose to obey, before it is too late.

Unfortunately, God says they won't obey in big numbers.
Only a few will make it.

Matthew 7:14, "For the gate is small (Narrow, excruciatingly tight and all but crushingly impossible to pass through, and the way is narrow (The same as "small" above) that leads to life, and only a FEW ARE THOSE WHO FIND IT."
Sometimes God repeats things using different words with the same meaning to "strongly emphasise" a point he is making.
Luke 13:23-24, And someone said to Jesus. "Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?
And Jesus said to them, "Strive to enter the narrow door (Which is Jesus), for MANY, I tell you, will seek to enter, and WILL NOT BE ABLE."

The word "FEW" means to the exclusion of most in the above context.
And "MANY" means to the exclusion of the FEW in the above context.

1st peter 4:18, "If it is with difficulty that the righteous is saved, what will become of the godless man and the sinner?"

The impossibility of getting to heaven is beyond most Christian's comprehension.
The lies of the ease of attaining salvation and eternal life are so pervasive and twisted throughout the Christian culture, that the simplicity that is believed all over the world, is causing all but the FEW to be cursed by eternal destruction.?

God gives us examples.

Noah and the flood. Out of the whole world, 8 were saved.
Out of all those millions leaving Egypt in the exodus, "2" entered the promised land. Joshua and Caleb.
At the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah by God, 3 were saved.
At the destruction of Jericho, RAHAB and her family were the only ones who survived out of the whole city.

There is a reckoning coming one day, like the world has never seen.

 

[GodsGrace]

wondering my sister
Thank you God that free-will is taught all throughout the Bible.
For me, scripture teaches God, Himself is all-knowing - omniscient, from the beginning until the end.
God knows every choice we will ever make and every action we will ever take.
On that basis of our right choices and actions over a lifetime until the end of our life, we are pre-destined to ever-lasting life by God Himself, AS A RESULT OF WHAT WE CHOOSE TO DO OR BE LIKE IN OUR HEARTS AND ACTIONS.
1st Timothy says, "God wants all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth."
1st Peter says, "Christ died for our sins, once, and for "ALL."

Scripture nowhere teaches that God picks some to be saved and not others. That is a popular TEACHING BY MAN, but is supported no place in scripture.

Besides a very few Matth. 7:14, being called the "predestined", we are also called the "chosen", the "appointed", the "few", the "elect", the "remnant", the "called", the "foreknew", all throughout God's word.

Our destination is chosen by no one but us individually by the choices we make over a lifetime, and God's "predestination of a few", because of His omniscience, knowing all of our life before we do, is why we are "pre-chosen" or "pre-destined," or maybe not if we continually made poor choices and never let the conviction of the Holy Spirit affect us to change.

Agreed.

Also, I'd like to add something that for_his_glory states many times:
We are predestined,,,,,
But HOW we will be saved is predestined...
NOT who.

If we examine each passage that speaks of predestination we find that this is true.

Also, yes, I'd say that there is a lot of misunderstanding on the phrase "believe in the Lord and you will be saved".
It's not speaking of a mental belief but a heart belief. Believe means something very specific in the Koine Greek language.
This is overlooked by many that feel that just need to "believe" in Jesus and they will be saved...
Believing also includes obeying and, sooner or later, this has to be understood.