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John Chapter 5 is Against Total Depravity

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There is no mention of elimination of sin in 1 John 1:9 nor were we discussing the elimination of sin, so I’m a bit perplexed by your reply.
Just getting any notions of sinlessness off the table. Which some here promote, surprisingly. I haven't posted here in quite awile. It seems to be a newer wrinkle

Earlier you said sin was from Satan which is why I posted that verse. 1John 1:9 says, “Our sins”. It doesn’t say Satans sins.
John 3:8 is clear about sin being "of the devil"

So is Mark 4:15 likewise clear about sin being of the devil i.e. theft of Word.

As is Satan's presentation of being a deceiver, a liar, a thief, a destroyer, a tempter and a killer, a capturer, the blinder of minds, the spirit of disobedience, all the bulk of which transpires in mankind.
While I agree that Satan can tempt us, our own desires I.E. our flesh can also lead us into temptation which leads to sin. James writes about this and I believe JLB already mentioned it.
I would only concur that whatever "lusts" people are prone to are courtesy of devils and as such, theirs to bear in particular.

James also acknowledges that believers can be prone to having devilish wisdom as well.

James 3:
14 But if ye have bitter envying and strife in your hearts, glory not, and lie not against the truth.
15 This wisdom descendeth not from above, but is earthly, sensual, devilish.

Seems rather obvious, doesn't it?
And we’re in agreement here.
If we explore this a bit deeper, let’s say a random evil thought pops into your head seemingly out of nowhere. Regardless if it’s Satan or our flesh, we are not responsible, nor held accountable for that thought. What we are responsible for, is the action we take with that thought. Do we embellish the thought which leads to sin? Or do we take it captive to Gods word?
Let's presume that random evil thoughts are attributed to Satan/devils. That doesn't mean such things that transpire in us does NOT have repercussions, at least unto the perps. To think we skate for "their" intrusions is probably not true at all. We all pay a price in our own flesh for sin, which is ultimately death, the wages of sin. Romans 6:23, Romans 8:10

As to evil thoughts not being a big deal, Jesus did not cut us that kind of slack

Matthew 15:19-20 Mark 7:21-23 and Matthew 5:28 all show that evil thoughts defile us, and it's not presented as optional to have them

Jesus was tempted, and he resisted and was without sin. If we follow Jesus, he has shown us the way to navigate temptation.
Big caveat with Jesus, that being "without sin"

I'm not jumping into the "I'm sinless" pool because it's a lie. Why? Because the tempter is jumping in as well, and I'm not cutting that bad actor a spittle of slack or excuse
When we sin, we have a Father who desires to forgive us, and we have a savior who will never leave or forsake us.

In short, grace does not condone sin. Instead, grace says, “What you did was wrong, but Ive got you covered. Together, we’ll get you through this and you’ll hit the mark.”
We're forgiven

The devils are not

Therein resides the walk of Mercy in the Grace of God in Christ,, because apart from that, we'd be instant toast
 

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It has always been man's freewill choice
Yeah, we can probably chalk our differences up right there

I don't think there is any such thing as freewill choice available to slaves/captives of Satan
Nor do I think our wills over ride God's Will in any way

In both cases, we have subservient inferior wills to both the other parties

And if freewillers acknowledge tampering within man by either party, which is problematic to avoid, then freewill is again off the table of credibility
 

stovebolts

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Just getting any notions of sinlessness off the table. Which some here promote, surprisingly. I haven't posted here in quite awile. It seems to be a newer wrinkle
Good, I’m glad we’re in agreement here. I think you’ll find more agreement between us than disagreement.
John 3:8 is clear about sin being "of the devil"
I’m thinking you meant to post a different verse here. If not, I’m afraid it’s not so clear to me.
So is Mark 4:15 likewise clear about sin being of the devil i.e. theft of Word.
Perhaps I’m stuck on your phrase, “sin, being of the devil”. Satan can cause us to sin, but let’s be clear in that we are responsible for our sin. In other words, it’s our sin. I have to add, there are two types of sin and they are willful and Unwillful sin and God treats these sins differently.
Let's presume that random evil thoughts are attributed to Satan/devils. That doesn't mean such things that transpire in us does NOT have repercussions, at least unto the perps. To think we skate for "their" intrusions is probably not true at all. We all pay a price in our own flesh for sin, which is ultimately death, the wages of sin. Romans 6:23, Romans 8:10
Random thoughts that enter our mind can be from our own flesh or Satan. You can’t presume every random evil thought is from Satan. Regardless, and It doesn’t matter how debase or evil these random thoughts may be, but these random thoughts are not counted to us as sin. It’s what we do with these random thoughts that either leads to sin / death or we take these thoughts captive to Gods Word which leads to life. If we take these random, evil thoughts captive to Christ, we do not sin. If we meditate or ruminate as if in a daydream on these evil thoughts to satisfy our desires, we sin and if we continue, this sin leads to death. Not all sin leads to death.

As to evil thoughts not being a big deal, Jesus did not cut us that kind of slack

Matthew 15:19-20 Mark 7:21-23 and Matthew 5:28 all show that evil thoughts defile us, and it's not presented as optional to have them
I agree, these random, evil thoughts that stir either from Satan our our flesh MAY become a big deal if we feed them. The trick is not to feed them. Take them captive to Gods Word before they cause you to sin. This is serious business.
Big caveat with Jesus, that being "without sin"

I'm not jumping into the "I'm sinless" pool because it's a lie. Why? Because the tempter is jumping in as well, and I'm not cutting that bad actor a spittle of slack or excuse
Like I said earlier, I’m not jumping into that pool earlier. We all sin, everyone of us. Sin is missing the mark, which means there are things we are to do and things we are not to do. Many don’t understand this and get stuck on the “Don’t do that” and still miss the mark and sin not even knowing it.
For example, we are not to lie negative command). But simply not telling a lie does not mean one isn’t sinning. In other words, if I ask a certain question and you refuse to answer, you’ve now broken the positive commandment to be truthful. In short, negative commands show us what not to do and positive commands show us what to do.

If one doesn’t know what to do, then this is unwillful sin and grace is applied to bring about repentance.

If one knows what to do and willfully does it anyway, then justice is applied since grace has been rejected or abused.

But it’s not all about the sin. It’s about what we do once we realize, or once that sin is realized. Look at David, a murderer and adulterer yet Scripture states that David had a heart after Gods. Why? Because of what David did with that sin once it was realized and exposed. David repented, he did not harden his heart and because he repented, his sin was not counted against him in Gods court.

We're forgiven

The devils are not

Therein resides the walk of Mercy in the Grace of God in Christ,, because apart from that, we'd be instant toast
If we walk in willful disobedience, our condemnation is deserved.

Gods righteousness is bound in mercy and when that grace is rejected, justice is applied.
 
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for_his_glory

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Show that statement in scripture. You think it's there but have failed to provide a single citing

Claims that it's there does not constitute proof if it's there

I do contract law for a living. Do you know what I believe?

Show me in writing.

Otherwise it's irrelevant.
Anointed by God is that of a divine or holy office as in the case of Lucifer before his fall who was a holy cherub as a cherub attends to God in the highest holy status.

Please Explain Ezekiel 28:14-15 as to what or who this anointed cherub is/was.

Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
 

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Anointed by God is that of a divine or holy office as in the case of Lucifer before his fall who was a holy cherub as a cherub attends to God in the highest holy status.

Please Explain Ezekiel 28:14-15 as to what or who this anointed cherub is/was.

Eze 28:14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
Eze 28:15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
I appreciate your attempt to find Holy Satan

Glad it's not in the scriptures

When found, please advise
 

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I guess you do not want to explain Ezekiel Chapter 28, so will put all of this behind us and move on.
Yes, it is quite pointless to continuing trying to find Holy Satan in the scriptures

Explaining Ezekiel 28 is another matter altogether. It should be understood that the speaking-acting out location of the tempter, the devil, Satan, and his own, is where? That's right! In MANKIND.

Lucifer, Satan, is also called 'a man' in the scriptures. Because that's where he/they sit, in mankind.

Mark 4:15, Acts 26:18, 2 Corinthians 4:4, Ephesians 2:2, 1 John 3:8

This really should be no surprise.

Jesus came to set captives free.

WHO is their captor?
 

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Explaining Ezekiel 28 is another matter altogether. It should be understood that the speaking-acting out location of the tempter, the devil, Satan, and his own, is where? That's right! In MANKIND.
One of the goals of this site is to promote healthy discussions that promote unity.

for_his_glory had brought up Ezk 28 and you dismiss what she has brought to the table as nothingness. You’ve shown no understanding, let alone an attempted understanding of her point of view.

I’m going to ask for_his_glory to start a new thread on this topic and I would encourage you to at least attempt to understand which faucet of scripture she sees instead of so smugly driving your own agenda.

Thanks.
 

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One of the goals of this site is to promote healthy discussions that promote unity.

for_his_glory had brought up Ezk 28 and you dismiss what she has brought to the table as nothingness. You’ve shown no understanding, let alone an attempted understanding of her point of view.

I’m going to ask for_his_glory to start a new thread on this topic and I would encourage you to at least attempt to understand which faucet of scripture she sees instead of so smugly driving your own agenda.

Thanks.
Don't you mean "facet" instead of "faucet"?
 

for_his_glory

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One of the goals of this site is to promote healthy discussions that promote unity.

for_his_glory had brought up Ezk 28 and you dismiss what she has brought to the table as nothingness. You’ve shown no understanding, let alone an attempted understanding of her point of view.

I’m going to ask for_his_glory to start a new thread on this topic and I would encourage you to at least attempt to understand which faucet of scripture she sees instead of so smugly driving your own agenda.

Thanks.
Thank you, and I will start a new thread on this and will title it Satan. I want to show the dual meaning of Ezekiel 28:13-15.
 

stovebolts

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I did computer programming of one form or another for decades. Even the slightest error in punctuation would produce a fatal error. It's the same thing with the OT law, only animal sacrifices weren't required.
I’m an ETL developer so I hear ya!
I hate writing code in meetings where I’m sharing my screen!
 

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One of the goals of this site is to promote healthy discussions that promote unity.

for_his_glory had brought up Ezk 28 and you dismiss what she has brought to the table as nothingness. You’ve shown no understanding, let alone an attempted understanding of her point of view.

I’m going to ask for_his_glory to start a new thread on this topic and I would encourage you to at least attempt to understand which faucet of scripture she sees instead of so smugly driving your own agenda.

Thanks.
I'll admit to being a bit mystified by such adamant promotions of "used to be Holy" Satan.

Not my bad for pointing out a perfect devil "in all thy ways" is a devil nonetheless and regardless, and one that Jesus stated matter of factly, to be a liar and a murderer from the beginning.

In determinist theology the idea of Holy Satan is largely thought of as christian fairy tale that sprang from the freewill camps, and it's rife in charismatic land which discounts the promotions even more so, to some
 

for_his_glory

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I'll admit to being a bit mystified by such adamant promotions of "used to be Holy" Satan.

Not my bad for pointing out a perfect devil "in all thy ways" is a devil nonetheless and regardless, and one that Jesus stated matter of factly, to be a liar and a murderer from the beginning.

In determinist theology the idea of Holy Satan is largely thought of as christian fairy tale that sprang from the freewill camps, and it's rife in charismatic land which discounts the promotions even more so, to some
I made a new thread in Theology forum titled "The fall of Lucifer/Satan" where I explain Lucifer being created holy until iniquity was found in him. I hope you will go read what I have written as it might help clear up what you and I have been discussing.
 
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