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Jethro Bodine said:
What doctrine has creation declared that is not revealed in our Bibles? What doctrine has the Catholic church declared that is not in our Bibles?
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It don’t matter
What does matter is it ain’t the Bible alone!
So the doctrine of the Bible alone is false
 
Jethro Bodine said:
Suffering does not make you a righteous person. Only the forgiveness of God and the imputation of his righteousness received by faith in the promise does that. The grace of his forgiveness and righteousness then being what produces the patient suffering of the kingdom. Catholics got it backwards and say the patient suffering and obedience to rituals and good deeds is what makes you righteous. It's a works religion.
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What happened grace
 
jeremiah1five said:
I suppose you are not aware.

You post Psalms 19 but don't understand.


1 The heavens declare the glory of God;
And the firmament sheweth his handywork.
2 Day unto day uttereth speech,
And night unto night sheweth knowledge.
3 There is no speech nor language,
Where their voice is not heard.
4 Their line is gone out through all the earth,
And their words to the end of the world.
In them hath he set a tabernacle for the sun,
5 Which is as a bridegroom coming out of his chamber,
And rejoiceth as a strong man to run a race.
6 His going forth is from the end of the heaven,
And his circuit unto the ends of it:
And there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.

7 The law of the LORD is perfect, converting the soul:
The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.
8 The statutes of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart:
The commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes.
9 The fear of the LORD is clean, enduring for ever:
The judgments of the LORD are true and righteous altogether.
10 More to be desired are they than gold, yea, than much fine gold:
Sweeter also than honey and the honeycomb.
11 Moreover by them is thy servant warned:
And in keeping of them there is great reward.
12 Who can understand his errors?
Cleanse thou me from secret faults.
13 Keep back thy servant also from presumptuous sins;
Let them not have dominion over me:
Then shall I be upright,
And I shall be innocent from the great transgression.
14 Let the words of my mouth,
And the meditation of my heart, be acceptable in thy sight,
O LORD, my strength, and my redeemer.
Ps 19:1–14.

3 He healeth the broken in heart,
And bindeth up their wounds.
4 He telleth the number of the stars;
He calleth them all by their names.
Ps 147:3–4.

There are trillions and trillions of stars and other celestial objects in the sky. And each one has been named by God. Imagine if you can the immensity of the Mind of God to do such a thing. Imagine the mind of Adam to name the hundreds of thousands of animal names and other species of creeping thing, mammal, reptilian, insect, etc.

With God names have meaning. The name of a star has meaning. A group of stars in a constellation describe a sentence. And each star and constellation reveal the prophecies of the gospel of God to man concerning His Son. Out of the known 88 constellations known to man in the sky God had place a star-Bible, if you will, that revealed to Adam and his children the prophecies of the coming Redeemer. Since man did not know to read a graphic star-Bible in the sky expressed to our early descendants the Promise of God to His people. Such a star-Bible enabled Enoch to prophesy the second coming of the Lord with thousands of His saints before the first coming. What it comes down to is that God had placed the story of the Redeemer in the stars. And although such knowledge was lost after the flood this knowledge is again being revealed.

So, it's not only the Holy Writ God has preserved through the centuries for His people this star-Bible is also part of the Revelation of Jesus Christ. And the Scripture records many prophecies concerning Israel's Messiah in the stars.

But I thought you were aware of this but by your reaction and words I believe I was incorrect.
Whether in the stars or in script no man is able to mutilate or corrupt the Word of God to His people. And that word is found in the Authorized Version King James Bible/Book. The heavens do not declare the glory of God by virtue of their creation and existence. The stars actually speak to God's people the Gospel of God concerning His Son.
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That’s good and fine
But it don’t scan authority of revelation that’s not the “Bible alone” another authority of revelation disproves the the doctrine of scripture alone or the Bible is the ONLY authority!
Thanks
 
jeremiah1five said:
Ah...but not all men have faith.

Only those to whom God has granted faith in order to believe after conversion.

For when the grace of God has been given to a person in absence of a person seeking God for Scripture says no man seeks God, THEN everything related to salvation follows.
It is a gift of God lest any man boast.

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them. Eph 2:8–10.

Salvation is of the LORD, as Jonah said.

Man is passive in salvation. There is no "accepting Jesus into your heart." That is a lie.
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All men are redeemed by Christ
All men receive sufficient light and grace to be saved
 
donadams , the necessity to believe does not make the gospel a justification by works gospel. As you can plainly see here, Paul is differentiating between works and faith, not equating them as you are doing:

"...to him that worketh not, but believeth..." Romans 4:4
 
donadams , the necessity to believe does not make the gospel a justification by works gospel. As you can plainly see here, Paul is differentiating between works and faith, not equating them as you are doing:

"...to him that worketh not, but believeth..." Romans 4:4
 
Jethro Bodine said:
donadams , the necessity to believe does not make the gospel a justification by works gospel. As you can plainly see here, Paul is differentiating between works and faith, not equating them as you are doing:

"...to him that worketh not, but believeth..." Romans 4:4
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Just opposed to works alone!

Is faith the only way to receive grace?
Thanks
 
donadams said:
Just opposed to works alone!
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No, if you read the whole passage you'll see it has nothing to do with becoming righteous by faith and works.

Paul uses the example of how Abraham became righteous when he believed God's promise, through the believing itself apart from doing any work at all. But if you are sure he became righteous by faith and works show me in the passage what work Paul says he did with his faith to be made righteous.

donadams said:
Is faith the only way to receive grace?
Thanks
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Faith is the only way to receive the grace of justification (being made righteous).

You become justified by trusting in God's promise about his Son, "being fully persuaded that God (is) able to do what He (has) promised" - Romans 4:21. That is the faith without works that God makes you righteous for having.

That's how Abraham was justified and became righteous (not shown to be righteous as James talks about that). That is how we, also, are made righteous by faith apart from works (Romans 4:23-24).
 
Jethro Bodine said:
No, if you read the whole passage you'll see it has nothing to do with becoming righteous by faith and works.

Paul uses the example of how Abraham became righteous when he believed God's promise, through the believing itself apart from doing any work at all. But if you are sure he became righteous by faith and works show me in the passage what work Paul says he did with his faith to be made righteous.


Faith is the only way to receive the grace of justification (being made righteous).

You become justified by trusting in God's promise about his Son, "being fully persuaded that God (is) able to do what He (has) promised" - Romans 4:21. That is the faith without works that God makes you righteous for having.

That's how Abraham was justified and became righteous (not shown to be righteous as James talks about that). That is how we, also, are made righteous by faith apart from works (Romans 4:23-24).
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I don't think it has anything to do with "...justification (being made righteous.)"

Justification means God declaring the sinner He saves as "Not Guilty."

Sanctification is the means of our being made righteous.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
No, if you read the whole passage you'll see it has nothing to do with becoming righteous by faith and works.

Paul uses the example of how Abraham became righteous when he believed God's promise, through the believing itself apart from doing any work at all. But if you are sure he became righteous by faith and works show me in the passage what work Paul says he did with his faith to be made righteous.


Faith is the only way to receive the grace of justification (being made righteous).

You become justified by trusting in God's promise about his Son, "being fully persuaded that God (is) able to do what He (has) promised" - Romans 4:21. That is the faith without works that God makes you righteous for having.

That's how Abraham was justified and became righteous (not shown to be righteous as James talks about that). That is how we, also, are made righteous by faith apart from works (Romans 4:23-24).
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Trust in Jesus Christ and his word
Mk 16:16
 
donadams said:
Trust in Jesus Christ and his word
Mk 16:16
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We trust in Jesus and the Apostle's word. What we reject is what the Catholic church says their word means, and the things they've added to them.

We're not afraid of the Catholic church's demands that we submit to them and their claim that they are the one and only church. Centuries of born again, water baptized, Spirit filled, fruit bearing, non-Catholic Christians show us that the Catholic church is not the one and only church that must be attended and obeyed in order to be saved.
 
Jethro Bodine said:
...in our behavior. Yes.
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jeremiah1five said:
That's what you said:

QUOTE: "All men are redeemed by Christ."

RESPONSE: That's the definition of Universalism.

Seems someone needs to tell the rich man he's in the wrong place.
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Redemption
Justification
Sanctification
Salvation
Glorification

Four completely different things all part of salvation

Redemption:
The redemption was accomplished by Christ with no participation on our part. All mankind is redeemed.
Lk 2:11 Jn 1:29 rm 5:8 1 pet 1:21-23

Justification:
then if we accept His redemption we are justified, born again by faith and baptism. Mk 16:16 Jn 3:5 acts 2:38 8:36 Titus 3:5 1 pet 3:21

Sanctification:
Members of Christ and his church by grace we practice good works (prayer, alms, fasting, virtues charity, suffering other sacraments etc. until death. Phil 1:29

At the hour of death separation from the grace of God by apostasy / rejection of Christ or failing to repent of serious sin a man is lost in damnation! Or

Salvation:
Is for those who are faithful and die in the grace of God united to Christ and in his saints at death enter into eternal salvation! Mk 13:13 Matt 24:13

Titus 2:14
Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, (redemption) and purify unto himself a peculiar people, (justification / baptism notice purify / wash) Jn 3:5 zealous of good works. (Sanctification) Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.
(Salvation)

Glorification:

Suffering required for glorification with Christ! Phil 1:29

Romans 8:17
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

2 Timothy 2:12
If we suffer, we shall also reign with him: if we deny him, he also will deny us:

Thanks

Sorry for the confusion
 
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