Judas Iscariot: Saved for a while.

[chessman]

15 But the Lord said to him, “Go, for he is a chosen vessel of Mine to bear My name before Gentiles, kings, and the children of Israel. 16 For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My name’s sake.” Acts 8:15-16


Can you explain how it is verse 15 makes Paul an unbeliever, when he preached Christ?

That's not Acts 8:15-16 and your question does not concern Judas. I have answered your previous questions.

Will you answer a relevant question below that I have asked you numerous times concerning what you think about Judas being saved for a while (or not) and defend your OP's claim;"Judas Iscariot: Saved for a while." If you don't answer, you are leaving your position weak in accordance with bullet 8 of this forum's policies and rules?

Is it your opinion that Jesus loved Judas Iscariot at anytime prior to the hour that Satan entered Judas?

 

[JLB]

That's not Acts 8:15-16 and your question does not concern Judas. I have answered your previous questions.

Will you answer a relevant question below that I have asked you numerous times concerning what you think about Judas being saved for a while (or not) and defend your OP's claim;"Judas Iscariot: Saved for a while." If you don't answer, you are leaving your position weak in accordance with bullet 8 of this forum's policies and rules?

15 But the Lord said to him, “Go, for he is a chosen vessel of Mine to bear My name before Gentiles, kings, and the children of Israel. 16 For I will show him how many things he must suffer for My name’s sake.”

17 And Ananias went his way and entered the house; and laying his hands on him he said, “Brother Saul, the Lord Jesus, who appeared to you on the road as you came, has sent me that you may receive your sight and be filled with the Holy Spirit.” 18 Immediately there fell from his eyes something like scales, and he received his sight at once; and he arose and was baptized. 19 So when he had received food, he was strengthened. Then Saul spent some days with the disciples at Damascus. 20 Immediately he preached the Christ in the synagogues, that He is the Son of God. Acts 9:15-20



Please explain how verse 15 makes Paul an "unbeliever", when he preaches Christ in verse 20, after he was baptized in verse 18.


Still waiting for you to post a scripture, that shows where Jesus Christ, empowered an unbeliever, and sent them to preach the Gospel to the lost, and to heal the sick, raise the dead, and cast out devils.


JLB

 

[chessman]

It is not surprising that you will not answer a relevant question concerning your weak case for Judas being "saved for a while" and would rather discuss another person (Saul).

Please explain how verse 15 makes Paul an "unbeliever", when he preaches Christ in verse 20, after he was baptized in verse 18.

Because verse 15 records the Lord telling Ananias that an un-baptized and thus un-believer in the things of God named Saul was a chosen instrument of His to preach His Gospel. It shocked Ananias too. You just acknowledged that Saul was not baptized with the Holy Spirit until verse 18 occurs. Paul was not baptized in the Holy Spirit (and thus still blind to the things of God) yet the Lord told Ananias Saul was his chosen instrument. Astounding, really, if you think about it. Saul does not know who the Lord is yet, thus his question in verse 5 "Who are you Lord?".

You do realize that no one (including Saul or Judas or Peter) knows the things of God (including knowing who the Lord is or whether others do or not) except the Spirit of God is given to them to know Him. (Bolded in red for you below).

Your case for Judas "being saved for a while" is still weak because you will not answer my question about Jesus ever loving Judas (or not). But I have answered your questions about Saul already numerous times.

1 Corinthians 2:9-12 (NKJV) But as it is written: “Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, Nor have entered into the heart of man The things which God has prepared for those who love Him.” But God has revealed them to us through His Spirit. For the Spirit searches all things, yes, the deep things of God. For what man knows the things of a man except the spirit of the man which is in him? Even so no one knows the things of God except the Spirit of God. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might know the things that have been freely given to us by God. ​

Peter was not baptized with the Holy Spirit when he spoke about the disciples believing either (see Acts 2:3-4 when Peter is baptized with the Holy Spirit and begins to "know the things of God"). Peter could have easily been speaking as a;

a Satan-like man

when he said "we have believed", "I will never deny you", "you will never wash my feet" to Jesus back before his baptism in the Holy Spirit. Jesus knew better about Judas' believing and in fact corrected Peter's claim. To me, Peter's claim about the others (if he even meant Judas) is really the only reasonable point you've made. So, in my opinion, it really just boils down to whether you believe Peter's claim (and if it was for Judas' believing) or Jesus' correction to Peter's claim. I believe Jesus knew the things of God better than Peter did at that time.

Or if you could somehow show that Jesus ever loved Judas as the Father loved Jesus, you'd have a reasonable point, too. Can you? I'm trying to help you build a point, you know.

 

[JohnDB]

MODERATOR HAT ON

Please remember the TOS.
Address positions and NOT persons.

Warnings and points will be issued for violations of TOS.

 

[JLB]

Because verse 15 records the Lord telling Ananias that an un-baptized and thus un-believer in the things of God named Saul was a chosen instrument of His to preach His Gospel.

Paul was a chosen instrument.

However, Paul never preached the Gospel until he was saved.

Paul was not an unbeliever, when he preached the Gospel.

Furthermore, it was in verse 5&6 when we see that Paul responded to Jesus by confessing Him as Lord, and submitting himself to obey Him.

This was before verse 15.


Paul was a believer, when he preached Christ, not an unbeliever, as you falsely claim.


JLB

 

[smaller]

Why do you keep twisting my words, to say something I did not.

I didn't say Satan was a metaphor.

Pretty sure you said Peter was a metaphor of Satan in Matt. 16:23

searching...

YEP!

Peter is opposing God's will for Jesus, and "acting" in opposition, which is one of the definitions of the word Satan.

It [SATAN] is a metaphorical reference to a person who is opposing the cause of God.

So Satan in your positions sight is not Satan, a distinct "other" disobedient spirit, but a person, in the case of Matt. 16:23, Peter.

I said one of the definitions of the word Satan, is used to describe a man who is opposing the cause or will of God.

To me, one of the definitions of the word Satan, is:
a metaphorical reference to a person who is opposing the cause of God.

Your positional logic gets turned around in circles here, again, somehow trying to eliminate Satan, the devil, from the picture and replace it with only Judas.

Just like Judas Iscariot was not a devil: a literal wicked spirit, but was "acting" the part of the devil.

I wonder sometimes why positions can't see that Satan/devils are not people, but actual adverse/wicked spiritual entities. And such go to great circle dances to avoid the obvious terms are simply what they are, actually Satan and devils, not people. But then again, if they are what they are and they still in operation "in people" then I'd expect the bulk of FIBS about this subject in scriptures to revolve around them.

One of the real standout features of Gospel/N.T. facts is that devils/Satan were divided from and cast out of PEOPLE, clearly showing these to be 2 separate and distinct "entities."

One of the standout features of evil spirits, Satan and devils, is they like to HIDE in MAN, but the Revealing, the LIGHT, the Presence of the Word "forces" them out into the open. They are drawn like moths to the flame.

To see people and not Satan and devils where those terms are deployed in scripture makes the terms meaningless as 'real entities.'

Your positional sights wouldn't be the first in the thread to claim people are the devil and Satan. I'd observe that many theological sights I consider "off the mark" make that same claim. They VOID OUT Satan as a "REAL" distinct from "people" entity(s) that are IN people, and they REPLACE those entity(s) with PEOPLE instead.

 

[WIP]

As he journeyed he came near Damascus, and suddenly a light shone around him from heaven. Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” Then the Lord said, “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. It is hard for you to kick against the goads.” So he, trembling and astonished, said, “Lord, what do You want me to do?” Then the Lord said to him, “Arise and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.” Acts 9:3-6 NKJV

Could Saul address Jesus as "Lord" if he didn't believe, especially after Jesus explained to him that it was He? I'm thinking since Saul's existence just prior to this moment was to persecute those who preached Jesus, the very One whom he was against would certainly not be his Lord but rather his enemy.

 

[smaller]

All human hearts are slow.

I don't disagree. Romans 13:11-12 hits on why, directly.

It is only after the disciples ate the resurrected Bread of Life, were their eyes opened. Much less their hearts.

Don't you see at least some interests in the fact that the Spirit of The Father spoke through the Apostles, inclusive of Judas, and was IN THEM to speak, PRIOR to the resurrection of Jesus? Matt. 10:20.

You don't see many people highlighting this fact, but it IS a fact.

And it is only by the gift of the Holy Spirit that anyone can believe ALL these things.

Please see the above note of fact. And for the record, we all should remind ourselves that no one sees Perfectly. An interesting thing happens when that fact is vivified. We are led to try to see MORE til we see PERFECTLY. I find it quite fascinating. I find it equally fascinating how deceptive the mind can be when it claims otherwise.

What did they hear? Many things, but none more to the point than:

Acts 2:21 (LEB) And it will be that everyone who calls upon the name of the Lord will be saved.’ ​

If Judas actually and personally called upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ (aorist), he will be saved (future). If not, Judas will not be saved. Simple, really.

Not as simple as you might think. Judas was an Apostle, termed a SHEEP by Jesus, was a child of God by the determinations of the O.T. in Deut. 14:1, Psalm 82:6, and reiterated by Jesus in Matt. 23:9. There are some very unique DISTINCTIONS given to the people of Israel in the scriptures that do NOT apply to Gentiles, or at least applies to Jews FIRST.

I believe "ALL" the people of Israel shall be saved, period, inclusive of Judas, as Paul noted in Romans 11:25-31, even "enemies" of the Gospel, just as Paul says. And why is this the case? Because of the fathers, they are beloved. God made very certain Promises, in writing, to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, that can not be broken.

And WHY are they saved? The scriptural reasons are many.

Just as simply as the fact that Judas perished, yet those who have been given eternal life never perish.

And no, I don't think it works for Judas when Peter speaks for Judas' beliefs. I think it must be called out personally. Peter's track record for accurate claims (prior to receiving baptism of the Holy Spirit), not so good. Even speaking for himself, Peter claimed he'd never deny Jesus and Jesus would never wash his feet. Both, incorrect claims.

I don't deny that Peter was quite a bit off the mark on a lot of subjects, even AFTER salvation. What that doesn't mean is that his H.S. inspired recordings in 1,2 Peter are off, at all. The man was far from Perfect though, as we all are.

 

[MarkT]

22 Then Peter took Him aside and began to rebuke Him, saying, “Far be it from You, Lord; this shall not happen to You!”
Matthew 16:22

Why would Peter rebuke Jesus in an attempt to prevent Jesus from going to Jerusalem to be killed, if he didn't believe Jesus would be killed?

First question is, did Peter rebuke Jesus in an attempt to prevent Jesus from going to Jerusalem to be killed? I don't think so. The text doesn't say.

Jesus tells his disciples he has to go to Jerusalem and suffer many things, and be killed, and on the third day be raised. Then Peter rebukes Jesus. How is that believing? If I tell you something and you reject it, that's not believing. That's disbelieving.

If Peter believed everything Jesus said, then why would he rebuke Jesus? Who is in charge here, Peter or Jesus? I think Peter couldn't believe it. Say it ain't so!

"God forbid, Lord! This shall never happen to you" has disbelief written all over it.

 

[smaller]

As he journeyed he came near Damascus, and suddenly a light shone around him from heaven. Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” Then the Lord said, “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. It is hard for you to kick against the goads.” So he, trembling and astonished, said, “Lord, what do You want me to do?” Then the Lord said to him, “Arise and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.” Acts 9:3-6 NKJV

Could Saul address Jesus as "Lord" if he didn't believe, especially after Jesus explained to him that it was He? I'm thinking since Saul's existence just prior to this moment was to persecute those who preached Jesus, the very One whom he was against would certainly not be his Lord but rather his enemy.

Freewill positions often "make an exception" to free will for Saul or go to great dancing lengths to prove Saul still had free will.

But I'd suggest any of us who were struck down, unannounced, and blinded by the Light of our Savior, wouldn't have much to say about it from the free will perspective.

God in Christ does intervene with people, beyond any doubt. None of us would even be having these discussions were it otherwise.

1 Corinthians 12:3
Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

Just to be able to say that Jesus Is Lord is an intervention of the Holy Ghost in us.

How much of The Lord, Sovereign, that is, is subject only to the limitations of the viewers themselves, not The Lord. But even that the Holy Ghost can DIAL THAT UP to greater degrees, or lesser, as the case may be.

Matthew 13:12
For whosoever hath, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever hath not, from him shall be taken away even that he hath.

 

[JohnDB]

As he journeyed he came near Damascus, and suddenly a light shone around him from heaven. Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” Then the Lord said, “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. It is hard for you to kick against the goads.” So he, trembling and astonished, said, “Lord, what do You want me to do?” Then the Lord said to him, “Arise and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.” Acts 9:3-6 NKJV

Could Saul address Jesus as "Lord" if he didn't believe, especially after Jesus explained to him that it was He? I'm thinking since Saul's existence just prior to this moment was to persecute those who preached Jesus, the very One whom he was against would certainly not be his Lord but rather his enemy.

I view Saul's/Paul's use of "Lord" much in the same way as we might use the title of "Boss".
When you get blinding light and smacked to the ground off your horse... probably a good idea to surrender without reservation.

 

[smaller]

First question is, did Peter rebuke Jesus in an attempt to prevent Jesus from going to Jerusalem to be killed? I don't think so. The text doesn't say.

Jesus tells his disciples he has to go to Jerusalem and suffer many things, and be killed, and on the third day be raised. Then Peter rebukes Jesus. How is that believing? If I tell you something and you reject it, that's not believing. That's disbelieving.

Jesus actually demanded His disciples NOT to tell any man He was the Jesus the Christ:

Matthew 16:20
Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Christ.

Jesus rebuked devils in similar fashions:

Luke 4:41
And devils also came out of many, crying out, and saying, Thou art Christ the Son of God. And he rebuking them suffered them not to speak: for they knew that he was Christ.

If Peter believed everything Jesus said, then why would he rebuke Jesus? Who is in charge here, Peter or Jesus? I think Peter couldn't believe it. Say it ain't so!

When we see the event of Matt. 16:23, we should be cognizant that it was not just Peter involved. Jesus addressed Satan speaking from Peter. It seems quite a few "believers" have a hard time seeing Peter and Satan in that event as TWO separate and distinct parties. And a similar LACK of sight is made with Judas.

"God forbid, Lord! This shall never happen to you" has disbelief written all over it.

Jesus had, by that time, already advised Peter and the other disciples what HAD to happen, Matt. 16:21. It was the resistance/opposition of Satan speaking, that said otherwise. Not simply the 'mind' of Peter.

Jesus TOLD them outright and openly that He was going to be killed and raised from the dead. The reality of these events is that they were all planned in intimate detail by God Himself, on 'all' sides of the matters.

None of these accounts in the Gospels are just random "free form" question and answer sessions with The Lord of All creation, as if it were an episode of Jerry Springer.

Every line of scripture is purposed. Even the resistance factors and Jesus' Responses, were planned by God Himself.

It is Gods Symphony, Him The Conductor. Acts 4:26-28.

 

[smaller]

I view Saul's/Paul's use of "Lord" much in the same way as we might use the title of "Boss".
When you get blinding light and smacked to the ground off your horse... probably a good idea to surrender without reservation.

Uh, yeah. Divine Intervention is nothing to scoff at is it? Who can really "resist?" I'd posture no one.

Romans 9:19
Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?

Scriptures get considerably more complex when we see that it is God Himself who "made" the resistance parties, too. Precisely to show His Power over same. Even people who "resist" this sight are His puppets, resisting. Claiming they are in control and in charge, and not God. It's almost humorous.

Psalm 2:4
He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: the Lord shall have them in derision.

Isaiah 66:4
I also will choose their delusions, and will bring their fears upon them; because when I called, none did answer; when I spake, they did not hear: but they did evil before mine eyes, and chose that in which I delighted not.

 

[chessman]

Could Saul address Jesus as "Lord" if he didn't believe,

Saul did not even know it was Jesus speaking to Him. His question "Who are you, Lord?" Was a question meant to find out who it was speaking to him.

Who are You, Lord?”

It's like someone knocking at your door and you asking them; "Who are you?" Or more precisely, Saul asking the voice he was hearing, if that voice he heard was God (as in the God of the OT). It's the same word Paul uses to quote OT passages.

Or do you believe that just after the voice Saul heard ask him; "Why are you persecuting me?" but before Saul's reply to the voice he heard, that Saul somehow recognized that it was Jesus' voice and then began to believe in Jesus Christ, raised from the dead, and became a non-persecutor of the people following Christ?

Acts 9:4 (NKJV) Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?”​

 

[WIP]

Saul did not even know it was Jesus speaking to Him. His question "Who are you, Lord?" Was a question meant to find out who it was speaking to him.



It's like someone knocking at your door and you asking them; "Who are you?" Or more precisely, Saul asking the voice he was hearing, if that voice he heard was God (as in the God of the OT). It's the same word Paul uses to quote OT passages.

Or do you believe that just after the voice Saul heard ask him; "Why are you persecuting me?" but before Saul's reply to the voice he heard, that Saul somehow recognized that it was Jesus' voice and then began to believe in Jesus Christ, raised from the dead, and became a non-persecutor of the people following Christ?

Acts 9:4 (NKJV) Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?”​

But then, after Jesus told him who He was, Saul still called Him Lord. If Saul was truly persecuting Him, why would he refer to Him as his Lord once he realized it was his enemy? Is it possible it was then that he was converted?

 

[chessman]

Paul was a chosen instrument.

However, Paul never preached the Gospel until he was saved.

Saul (the persecutor of the followers of Christ) was the chosen instrument, per what the Lord told Ananias.

The Lord told Ananias to go to Damascus and ask for "Saul" (not Paul).

Acts 9:11 (NKJV) So the Lord said to him, “Arise and go to the street called Straight, and inquire at the house of Judas for one called Saul of Tarsus, for behold, he is praying.​

When, exactly, do you think Saul was "saved" and why?

Furthermore, it was in verse 5&6 when we see that Paul responded to Jesus by confessing Him as Lord, and submitting himself to obey Him.

Is this the point, on your view that Saul was "saved"? Saul didn't know the voice he heard was Jesus at this point. Thus he asked who the voice was speaking to him.
Are you thinking Saul knew it was Jesus' voice?

Paul was a believer, when he preached Christ, not an unbeliever, as you falsely claim.

Where did I ever say Paul preached Christ as an unbeliever? Your claim above is the false claim. But please answer when you think Paul became a believer in Christ and was "saved".

 

[chessman]

after Jesus told him who He was, Saul still called Him Lord.

What verse are you referring to?

 

[chessman]

Don't you see at least some interests in the fact that the Spirit of The Father spoke through the Apostles, inclusive of Judas, and was IN THEM to speak, PRIOR to the resurrection of Jesus? Matt. 10:20.

Sure. I wouldn't point to Matt 10:20 for that claim as if you read just the verse prior, we find out "when"

Matthew 10:19 (NKJV) But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak; for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.
​

I'm not convinced that Jesus didn't mean later, after His death and their being baptized with the Holy Spirit, here. Or maybe one of those double prophecies. As they went out prior and after, so to speak. But I certainly realize that the Holy Spirit spoke through people long before Pentecost. But baptism in the Holy Spirit prior??? Not to my knowledge.

I find it equally fascinating how deceptive the mind can be when it claims otherwise.

Me too. I 'push-back' at others for this very reason. I am still learning new things and have changed my view given good evidence on a hand full of issues. Still can be persuaded otherwise.

I believe "ALL" the people of Israel shall be saved, period, inclusive of Judas, as Paul noted in Romans 11:25-31, even "enemies" of the Gospel, just as Paul says.

Maybe. But the passage speaks of those "partially blinded". As I think Paul was. I mean, yes He prayed to the Lord. But when did he call Jesus Christ Lord is the current question.

Maybe Saul was only partially blind but Judas totally blind, IDK?

What that doesn't mean is that his H.S. inspired recordings in 1,2 Peter are off, at all.

I would never say his writings there were off the mark as he wrote under inspiration then. But Peter certainly did in John 13:8 and Matt 26:70-74, prior to his baptism in the Holy Spirit.

 

[smaller]

Sure. I wouldn't point to Matt 10:20 for that claim as if you read just the verse prior, we find out "when"

Matthew 10:19 (NKJV) But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak. For it will be given to you in that hour what you should speak; But when they deliver you up, do not worry about how or what you should speak; for it is not you who speak, but the Spirit of your Father who speaks in you.
​

I'm not convinced that Jesus didn't mean later, after His death and their being baptized with the Holy Spirit, here. Or maybe one of those double prophecies.

If you understand the Divine Principle of Gods Speech, you'd see that instant push back and resistance happens. IT's guaranteed via Mark 4:15. The "beware of men" warning was just as much for the time those Words were spoken and they were "sent out" just as the truth they spoke, was given to them by God. Matt. 10:17. Still valid today I might add. The Divine Principle given by Jesus in Mark 4:15 and the other seed parables have been in "effect" from Day 1 of mankind.

We should understand that Israel of the flesh was in captivity. That captivity was, and still IS internal, as shown by Mark 4:15, as to WHO is behind it.

As they went out prior and after, so to speak. But I certainly realize that the Holy Spirit spoke through people long before Pentecost. But baptism in the Holy Spirit prior??? Not to my knowledge.

We've went through this prior. There were many actions of the Holy Spirit LONG before Jesus' resurrection/day of Pentecost.

Speakings/actions of the Holy Spirit pre Jesus point to Him. Speakings post, also, but from an updated perspective.

Me too. I 'push-back' at others for this very reason. I am still learning new things and have changed my view given good evidence on a hand full of issues. Still can be persuaded otherwise.

We are always to set our faces to His Perfection. When that fulness arrives, we'll all know it, collectively. That is or should be our collective HOPE in any case. Contrary to those who try to beat the DAYLIGHTS out of everyone.

Maybe. But the passage speaks of those "partially blinded". As I think Paul was. I mean, yes He prayed to the Lord. But when did he call Jesus Christ Lord is the current question.

Saul had a pre-planned appointment with The Living Word, unavoidable. We are even given a little tidbit/treat of this in Acts, prior to Saul's salvation, via the Holy Spirit. And it speaks directly to the type of ministry Paul would eventually come into. It comes right at the end of Stephan's stoning.

Maybe Saul was only partially blind but Judas totally blind, IDK?

It's pointless to see just Judas. We should also see the working of Satan, the devil and we should also see that it was in fact GODS OWN PLAN for everything that happened. It was not just Judas among the disciples that had a problem. It was ALL of them.

They all FORSOOK Jesus. And that, by Gods Own Hands. No man get's "Cross Credit" for what God in Christ did.

Matthew 26:56
But all this was done, that the scriptures of the prophets might be fulfilled. Then all the disciples forsook him, and fled.

I would never say his writings there were off the mark as he wrote under inspiration then. But Peter certainly did in John 13:8 and Matt 26:70-74, prior to his baptism in the Holy Spirit.

We should not view any of these matters as just by man. The Living Dynamic that is involved with Word is 3 fold. There is Gods Words, living and active. There is a very real "resistance movement" unseen, and there is MAN.

If we submit to this basic construct, the scriptures will take on proper dimensions. And yes, it WILL change how we read them and even how we see ourselves.

 

[WIP]

What verse are you referring to?

Sorry, I thought I included it. See bold highlight.
As he journeyed he came near Damascus, and suddenly a light shone around him from heaven. Then he fell to the ground, and heard a voice saying to him, “Saul, Saul, why are you persecuting Me?” And he said, “Who are You, Lord?” Then the Lord said, “I am Jesus, whom you are persecuting. It is hard for you to kick against the goads.” So he, trembling and astonished, said, “Lord, what do You want me to do?” Then the Lord said to him, “Arise and go into the city, and you will be told what you must do.” Acts 9:3-6 NKJV