Losing Salvation after getting saved?

[chessman]

, Revelation 2 is still a warning that you must overcome in order to get that crown.

Warning: a statement or event that indicates a possible or impending danger, problem, or other unpleasant situation.

Advise: offer suggestions about the best course of action to someone.

Revelation 3:18-19 (LEB) I advise you to buy from me gold refined by fire, in order that you may become rich, and white clothing, in order that you may be clothed and the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed, and eye salve to smear on your eyes, in order that you may see. As many as I love, I reprove and discipline. Be zealous, therefore, and repent! ​

 

[JLB]

Warning: a statement or event that indicates a possible or impending danger, problem, or other unpleasant situation.

Advise: offer suggestions about the best course of action to someone.

Revelation 3:18-19 (LEB) I advise you to buy from me gold refined by fire, in order that you may become rich, and white clothing, in order that you may be clothed and the shame of your nakedness may not be revealed, and eye salve to smear on your eyes, in order that you may see. As many as I love, I reprove and discipline. Be zealous, therefore, and repent! ​

1 "And to the angel of the church in Sardis write,'These things says He who has the seven Spirits of God and the seven stars: "I know your works, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead. 2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die, for I have not found your works perfect before God. 3 Remember therefore how you have received and heard; hold fast and repent. Therefore if you will not watch, I will come upon you as a thief, and you will not know what hour I will come upon you. 4 You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. 5 He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life; but I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. 6 He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches." 'Revelation 3:1-6


"I know your works, that you have a name that you are alive, but you are dead. 2 Be watchful, and strengthen the things which remain, that are ready to die...

These have become spiritually dead!

You have a few names even in Sardis who have not defiled their garments; and they shall walk with Me in white, for they are worthy. 5 He who overcomes shall be clothed in white garments, and I will not blot out his name from the Book of Life;


And I will not blot out his name from the book of life!


The nail in the coffin for OSAS!


JLB

 

[chessman]

And I will not blot out his name from the book of life!

The nail in the coffin for OSAS!

JLB

Your buddy said Bible crowns is figurative language. What about you; does 'blotting someone's name out of the book of life' literally mean to un-save someone?

 

[follower]

Your buddy said Bible crowns is figurative language. What about you; does 'blotting someone's name out of the book of life' literally mean to un-save someone?

consider this analogy. suppose 12 sons are all in line to inherit land from their father in california. in his will, after he passes, they will each inherit 12,000 acres of good valuable land. also, in his will, if any of them abandons their wife for another woman, they are disinherited and the land they would have inherited will be divided up among the homeless.

9 of the sons abandon their wives and go live with other women.

this happens 1 day before their father passes, so none of those 9 inherit any of the land from his estate that they would have had if they had remained faithful.

did any of those 9 sons who were disinherited ever "OWN" the land specified in the will ?

 

[Gregg]

Gregg i dont have a horse in this race... I bounce from one side to the other.... the words too and fro come to mind... :neutral

Way back in the 50s if you met my uncle you would believe him to be a Christian. We can not truly judges a persons walk ,but i hope you understand what i am trying to say.... He knew the Word claimed Jesus as his saviour... On his death bed he told Dad i want no part of your God.get away with that blankety blank etc...

Stories like the this one are what keep me on the fence .. The OSAS would just say uncle mark never truly knew the Lord.The non-osas would say see i told ya..

I am thinking along the lines of Eugene and chessman in the post following yours. Aging can effect our brain. The Lord knew your uncle's heart.

 

[reba]

Aging can effect our brain. SHEESH now you tell me

 

[JLB]

Your buddy said Bible crowns is figurative language. What about you; does 'blotting someone's name out of the book of life' literally mean to un-save someone?

Please don't act as if you don't know what blotting out of the book of life means.

In others words: if the thought process that brought you to this place at this time in this thread of the forum, and you still have not found the answer, then you might as well flip a coin to let that decide...

Call it....

Heads I win, tails you lose!


JLB

 

[chessman]

Please don't act as if you don't know what blotting out of the book of life means.

I know what it means but at one time I thought you'd said that you thought it meant to un-save someone.

Then you go and post a Scripture that says I will not un-save you.

So yes, I'm confused as to what you think it means now.

 

[Gregg]

Do not be deceived -

Oh the irony in your often saying, 'Do not be deceived.'

 

[gr8grace3]

Who is the one who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? 1 John 5:5 NASB

'He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. Rev 3:5 NASB

The Subtle deception.......This is a warning instead of a promise to the believer. I will NOT erase has turned into I "could" erase.

Only bible doctrine will protect the believer from these subtle attacks.

 

[Eugene]

The Subtle deception.......This is a warning instead of a promise to the believer. I will NOT erase has turned into I "could" erase.

And that truly has continued to amaze me.

 

[JLB]

I know what it means but at one time I thought you'd said that you thought it meant to un-save someone.

Then you go and post a Scripture that says I will not un-save you.

So yes, I'm confused as to what you think it means now.

So you want be confused about this scripture anymore.

In the book of life means that you are saved and your name is written in the book of Life.

Blot you out of the book of life means you are no longer saved and your name has been removed from the book of life.

Book of Life = Heaven with God!

Blotted out of the book of Life = Hell with out God!


JLB

 

[Gregg]

Who is the one who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? 1 John 5:5 NASB

'He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. Rev 3:5 NASB

The Subtle deception.......This is a warning instead of a promise to the believer. I will NOT erase has turned into I "could" erase.

Only bible doctrine will protect the believer from these subtle attacks.

Yes gr8grace3. I am encouraged by your understanding and discernment of the Scriptures

 

[JLB]

Oh the irony in your often saying, 'Do not be deceived.'

Brother, if can't answer the most basic simple question about your salvation, that should be the very foundation of your faith and belief, then please don't throw insults at me about deception.




JLB

 

[JLB]

Are you 100% sure that if a person takes his mark that person has no way to later on in their life to become saved?

Lets see what the word says -

"If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

This starts with and ends with the same warning!

When I am told something this serious and straightforward two times in the same breath, from scripture it means what it means!

If ANYONE takes the mark and worships the beast they will suffer the same fate as the beast himself and the devil who deceived them.

THIS FATE IS TO BE TORMENTED DAY AND NIGHT FOREVER AND EVER IN THE LAKE OF FIRE!

THIS IS A WARNING TO CHRISTIANS, BORN AGAIN BAPTIZED BELIEVERS!


JLB

 

[chessman]

Blotted out of the book of Life = Hell with out God!


JLB

Cool. Then at least those few in Sardis were OSAS.

Revelation 3:4-5 But you have a few people in Sardis who have not defiled their clothing, and they will walk with me in white, because they are worthy. The one who conquers in this way will be dressed in white clothing, and I will never [send them to Hell]
​

And the ones of us that are worthy and conquer in this way are also OSAS, right? I mean if to not blot out means to not un-save then Sardis is a defining OSAS message. De-salvation "will never" happen to conquerers, that conquer "in this way".

John 3:16 (LEB) For in this way God loved the world, so that he gave his one and only Son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life. ​

When I am told something this serious and straightforward two times in the same breath, from scripture it means what it means!

I agree:

everyone who believes in him will not perish, [told once]
but will have eternal life. [told twice]
​

 

[chessman]

When I am told something this serious and straightforward two times in the same breath, from scripture it means what it means!

I agree again:

Romans 8:10-17 (LEB)
But if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, [told once]

but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. [told twice]

And if the Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead lives in you, the one who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also make alive your mortal bodies through his Spirit who lives in you. [told thrice]

For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, [told four times]

but you have received the Spirit of adoption, by whom we cry out, “Abba! Father!” [told five times]

The Spirit himself confirms to our spirit that we are children of God, [told six times]

and if children, also heirs
[told seven times]

—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, [told eight times]

If indeed we suffer together with him so that we may also be glorified together with him. [told nine times]




​

 

[Jethro Bodine]

Who is the one who overcomes the world, but he who believes that Jesus is the Son of God? 1 John 5:5 NASB

'He who believes'. You can take that to the bank. But stop believing, and, well, the Bible says you don't have a sacrifice for sin left any more. But so many claim that you 'really' do.

What OSAS can't prove is that a believer can not stop believing. Which is simply amazing to me since the Bible plainly talks about those who believe and then stop believing, and what happens to them for doing that.

'He who overcomes will thus be clothed in white garments; and I will not erase his name from the book of life, and I will confess his name before My Father and before His angels. Rev 3:5 NASB

The Subtle deception.......This is a warning instead of a promise to the believer. I will NOT erase has turned into I "could" erase.

The subtle deception is, so many in the church have heard nothing but OSAS doctrine all their lives that they can't see the condition for inheriting the promise...overcoming. Worse yet, they can't see what the Bible plainly says will happen to those who believe, but who do not continue to believe, and who do not overcome, and fail to endure to the very end. Now that's deception. An error of interpretation is one thing. Reading plain words of scripture and not seeing them is quite another.

Only bible doctrine will protect the believer from these subtle attacks.

Only the plain words of scripture will protect the believer from deception. Like these plain words:

"23 Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful...

26 For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longerremains a sacrifice for sins, 27 but a terrifying expectation of judgment and THE FURY OF A FIREWHICH WILL CONSUME THE ADVERSARIES. 28 Anyone who has set aside the Law of Mosesdies without mercy on the testimony of two or three witnesses. 29 How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, "VENGEANCE IS MINE, I WILL REPAY." And again, "THE LORD WILL JUDGE HIS PEOPLE." " (Hebrews 10:23,26-30 NASB emphasis in original)

But if one chooses to go with the added interpretations of less detailed scriptures over what is plainly written in our Bibles there really isn't much hope for that person ever seeing the truth of the plain words....in this life, anyway. On the Day of Judgment, it will be clear to everyone. Non-OSASer's, who chose the path of overcoming and did not take false comfort in a 'you don't really have to overcome' message can in no way be disappointed on that day. But those who did take false comfort in that message and did not overcome...well, the Bible really does plainly say what will happen to them.

The bottom line is, the non-OSAS who heeds the warning of scripture above can't be disappointed by enduring to the very end if OSAS is true. But the OSASer? He's gambling his eternity with what he believes if he's wrong. It's funny that the non-OSASer is the one who is accused of the treacherous work of evil for telling others about enduring in faith in Christ. Amazing.

 

[JLB]

I agree again:

Romans 8:10-17 (LEB)
But if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, [told once]

but the Spirit is life because of righteousness. [told twice]

And if the Spirit of the one who raised Jesus from the dead lives in you, the one who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also make alive your mortal bodies through his Spirit who lives in you. [told thrice]

For you have not received a spirit of slavery leading to fear again, [told four times]

but you have received the Spirit of adoption, by whom we cry out, “Abba! Father!” [told five times]

The Spirit himself confirms to our spirit that we are children of God, [told six times]

and if children, also heirs
[told seven times]

—heirs of God and fellow heirs with Christ, [told eight times]

If indeed we suffer together with him so that we may also be glorified together with him. [told nine times]

​

There are nine verses of scripture here.

What is your point in these nine verses?

What are we told in these verses nine different times?


"If anyone worships the beast and his image, and receives his mark on his forehead or on his hand, he himself shall also drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out full strength into the cup of His indignation. He shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name."

This starts with and ends with the same warning!


Three verses with the same warning mentioned twice in the same breath.

It is repeated for emphasis.

The literal warning is being emphasized.


JLB

 

[chessman]

What is your point in these nine verses?

What are we told in these verses nine different times?

The literal warning is being emphasized.


JLB

Christ is in you so ... that we may also be glorified together with him.​

That literal truth is being emphasized, nine times.

Anti-OSAS seems to de-emphasize the glorification of Christ. (Edit: Obadiah)